jesus

Yay! I found more. You've inspired me to do some good religious study!

The Livy Roman History was compiled between 59BC and 17 AD and included 20 manuscripts on that timeperiod. It includes Jesus.

There are several other Roman Histories that paralell the Biblical histories.

Show me proof. Show the qoutes you speak of. Lets see exactly what they said about Jesus.

I dare you to present some evidence that he ever lived other than rumors and common camp fire stories.

Show me the page and paragrah numbers. Surely this would not be a problem if your statements are true.

Lets turn the tables.

You show me proof that these documents and these historians do not mention Jesus. Have fun reading Livy's writings. They are kinda long (more than 120 books). Look through Seneca's works, and even take a look at the authors that have writen only a few years after the resurection (they are still primary sources of the day, the most reliable type of history) Josephus was born in Jerusalem only four years after the resurection, and he was commissioned by Rome to write a history of the Jews in the area, and he writes much stuff about Jesus. I'll give you a place to start: Antiquities, Book 18, ch. 3. But I've given you more than enough.

You first said there were no documents outside the Bible that mention Jesus. I found many. You then said that there were no documents from the time of Christ, I found some. You've put rediculous rules on what constitutes proof, but I can still bring some to the table. Going back 2000 years for anything is a tough task for any historian, but it has been done, and Jesus was there.

It's time for you to do more work than use your speculation as "proof". As we have seen, you were wrong twice because you used speculation.

Well both of you are getting confused about two types of books, your text book gets it information from other books that then get their information from first source books. Many religious writings are first source books, being generally written by the same people that form the religion. But historically there is no reason to say Jesus did not live, but the question you are really asking is not did Jesus live, but was Jesus the Son of God. Once you have brought the conversation out to this branch it stops being one of fact and becomes one of faith. This is something you cannot fairly argue.

Quite true. I'm glad that you agree that Jesus exsisted historically.

And it is a big faith question on if he is indeed the son of God.

Well, I would be happy to be blessed, and even though you may not want it, a blessing is aways a good thing, So God Bless you, every day!

Have you ever thought about why everyone (or at least everyone) in the bible was white? What if the bible was written by an African in the Congo? Would it be different? And what if jesus was a woman, what if he was an African woman?

Well, Jesus was born a male, and born in Israel. He only briefly was in Africa. If an African wrote parts of the Bible, they would have to wait for God to inspire them somehow about Christ, or some other divine vision. However, no one from Africa did write the Bible.

Also, no where does it say that everyone in the Bible was white- there were lots of races

Well I don't know much about races in the bible, but what you said about Africans writing the bible made me think. The reason why they didn't think about jesus was maybe because Africans did not need your god to inspire them, they were looking on your gods. To them, your god was false and theirs were true. It all depends on who you are and how you look at it. The Africans didn't need your god because they had their own gods.

Well, I'm glad that Africa has a very good missionary program. There are lots of people converting every day. I'm glad to know that millions of souls are being saved, while missionaries work to make conditions better, and save lives as well as souls.

That's what I hate about Africa, it's missionaries taking away the African beliefs and traditions. I'm sorry, but I'm offended when it comes to people interrupting others to change their lives about religion. You never know what happens after you die until you die, and I really don't believe changing religion will help.
Africans don't need to be saved, neither do non-christians.

Well, lots of people, when converted, feel such a power. A power of God that touches them, and writes their name in the book of life. I've never met a Christian that had such a converson who later turned their back on God.

I'm glad that missionaries are giving the opportunity of Christianity to everyone. Everyone has the ability to be forgiven of all sins, and spend eternity with the Father.

And what is wrong with getting rid of some of the old African beliefs? It is those beliefs that have ruined the African people. In Parts of Africa, 1 in 5 people in the population has AIDS. One particular ritual says that if you have AIDS and have sex with a virgin, you will be ridden of the disease. But we know what happens to that virgin- she'll get AIDS too, and no one is cured. We know their pagan rituals have done nothing but put their people in a devistating world.

Communities that have become Christian are cleaner, AIDS is down, people live longer, gain more economic freedom, and best of all, they have something to live for.

Christians dont feel (the touch of God) in my opinion its the unity of the group that changes thier lives, the feeling that they are part of sumthing bigger than themselves and there is also a sense of security that comes with this. I also hav a question do christians lie awake at night worrying if they are gonna get in2 heaven or not ?

Well, you are making an assumption there about how Christians feel, when you aren't one. We do feel the touch of God. Yes, we love the unity between Christians, but there are countless stories of people being separated from their Christian family by war or ostracism, and they latch on to their relationship with God, and that is what pulls them through their troublesome time.

And no, I don't lie awake at night worrying about heaven. I already know I'm going there, so why should I worry?

I'm so sorry to offend anyone, but has anyone thought of the world as not relating to religion? Like a world that is just there, a life that is just there?
I'm not talking about AID in Africa, I'm talking about their pagan traditions. How would YOU like it, if people from another country came into yours and tried to "fix" it, taking away your beliefs, traditions and values? I can tell why there is so much revolt in Africa...
What Africa needs is an accurate security system, and anotehr one for growing food and crops, a stable educational plan, and things like that which make civilizations grow into much bigger and better things. Why take away the identity of the Africans???

Missionaries do try to create a stable education plan, and plans for growing crops, and plans for security.

You can't blame the bad stuff in Africa on a revolt against Christianity. The biggest revolts are in Islamic and Pagan areas of Africa.

Christians work to stop this, and to build up the economy and independance of Africans. Any places they work with end up healthier, with more money, and more of a purpose.

Originally Posted by Dfsg

Also- there was a reference to the burning bush. How would Moses be Schizophrenic? He put his hand in the bush, and he didn't burn. Does his "schizophrenia" control the burning properties of fire? I think not- that takes the devine.

Well, as you can tell, I'm a very faithful Christian, and you'll never take that away from me!

Because if the fire was a hallucination of course his hand wouldn't get burnt, the fire wasn't real in the first place.

So later his Schizophrenia created two stone tablets on Mount Sinai, where he survived for weeks on end without water or food.

And his Schizophrenia parted the Red Sea in front of all the Hebrews and a large Egyptian army.

And his Schizophrenia made manna appear in the desert, which was the only food the Hebrews ate.

And his Schizophrenia shrowded the mountain for while he was in the presence of God.

And his Schizophrenia created a large clowd and a large pillar of fire that guided the Hebrews through the Desert.

Unless all the Hebrews were schizophrenic and having the same schizophrenic episodes, Moses couldn't have had all his visions and stuff just because of Schizophrenia. It was devine.

I'm ashamed that missionaries try to fix everything in Africa... And yeah there's a lot more revolt in Africa, revolt of every kind. I am so mad, because I meet these people who think God is the answer to everything, and then try to "save" people with "their" religion. I think knowledge can save you, just pure knowledge. And no, not "religious" knowledge, I'm talking about the knowledge that makes you just know about the life around you, why you're here, and what you've came here to do. If christianity helps you, then go for it. In some cases I don't think christianity is the right thing.

Alright, your idea is that Knowledge is what saves you. So now you are completely right, and you try to impose your ideas on everyone else and you are a wonderful person. However, Christianity, which has fixed problems, tries to impose it's ideas, and it's a terrible thing. Sounds hypocritical.

You can't doubt that no group has tried to better Africa more than the Christian Church.