Democratic China?

[JakeRS]

Would you like democratic China?
I love EVERYTHING about china,except for...guess what...they're government and i think that most of people agree with me when i say that they should be a democracy...

[Iron Man]

What makes a democracy better than a communist republic? You never stated why you don`t like their form of government. Also, it is their, not they`re.

[Sage]

What makes a democracy better than a communist republic?

Choice.

[scuba steve]

A democratic China could also put the world at a somewhat more comfortable position with China due to their rapid econmoical growth and military expenditure. Not that i'm implying they're going to be invading anytime soon, just that if they ever felt like flexing their muscles economicaly or physically in certain areas.

[Iron Man]

Choice.

I know. I was trying to make a point because he only said that everyone would agree with him, and didn`t specify his reasoning. I must have worded it wrong.

[Perseus]

A democratic China could also put the world at a somewhat more comfortable position with China due to their rapid econmoical growth and military expenditure. Not that i'm implying they're going to be invading anytime soon, just that if they ever felt like flexing their muscles economicaly or physically in certain areas.

Actually, it would not put the world at comfort because, if you were to look at history, it takes them years to change their government, mainly because there's usually a war. It would probably negatively affect the world since a major economic powerhouse has gone down. I forgot what my AP World teacher told us, but it made a lot of sense. The only reason they would change their government would be through, like always, a mandate of heaven (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandate_of_Heaven). That's why they censor thing such as revolutions in other countries, because they think the people will think its time for a new government in their country, through a mandate of heaven.

[JakeRS]

What makes a democracy better than a communist republic? You never stated why you don`t like their form of government. Also, it is their, not they`re.

I come from a former communist country so i know why i dont like communism,for instance there were elections but the votes would afterward be thrown into garbage,there is no freedom of speech,for instance look at this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_websites_blocked_in_the_People%27s_Republic_of_China
and that is why no one likes communist countries...and i am not a native english speaker so sorry for the their miss type :)

[Iron Man]

I come from a former communist country so i know why i dont like communism,for instance there were elections but the votes would afterward be thrown into garbage,there is no freedom of speech,for instance look at this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_websites_blocked_in_the_People%27s_Republic_of_China
and that is why no one likes communist countries...and i am not a native english speaker so sorry for the their miss type :)

Well, one of the biggest reasons that the U.S. hates communism is because it threatened their greed (AKA, the American Dream). Also, just curious. What country did you come from?

[scuba steve]

Actually, it would not put the world at comfort because, if you were to look at history, it takes them years to change their government, mainly because there's usually a war. It would probably negatively affect the world since a major economic powerhouse has gone down. I forgot what my AP World teacher told us, but it made a lot of sense. The only reason they would change their government would be through, like always, a mandate of heaven (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandate_of_Heaven). That's why they censor thing such as revolutions in other countries, because they think the people will think its time for a new government in their country, through a mandate of heaven.

This is true, but to take such business away from China would also be a good thing for the global market. No longer would there be more or less a monopoly in the market of mass producer of products etc. but would give more business to the likes of Mexico, India and smaller countries like Pakistan. I would also personally suspect that the majority of the population would welcome the change since it would allow them access to more thing like media entertainment: being allowed to use every aspect of the internet for example. I understand what your saying some form of rebellion would deffinately pursue but overall I believe it would be for the better. Having a superpower status military that is watched by independent media would also be commendable, even though some secrets are still maintained.

Let's not forget that a Democratic China could also see an end to their lets say aggresive influence over the likes of Nepal and Tibet, allowing them complete independence to grow on their own. Chinese Taipaei would also see much less aggression from the state.

[JakeRS]

Well, one of the biggest reasons that the U.S. hates communism is because it threatened their greed (AKA, the American Dream). Also, just curious. What country did you come from?

Serbia,it was part of Yugoslavia,other countries that were also part of Yu were Croatia,Slovenia,Fyrom,Montenegro,Bosnia and Herzegovina...Interesting fact is that W.Churchill wanted to bring back the king b4 the communism entered,if it was like that i would probably be living in EU in a country like those in western Europe,but no! Stupid commies had to come and destroy our country and the respect of our country,but atleast all of ex yu countries are back on the road,Slovenia is in EU and has a high living standard,bigger than baltic countries which are also in EU,Croatia,Fyrom and from December 2010 Montenegro,are candidates for membership in EU and if everything goes by plan Serbia is also becoming a candidate in November this year,sorry for a long essay but i like to tell other people about my country so if you have some questions feel free to ask.

[Perseus]

This is true, but to take such business away from China would also be a good thing for the global market. No longer would there be more or less a monopoly in the market of mass producer of products etc. but would give more business to the likes of Mexico, India and smaller countries like Pakistan. I would also personally suspect that the majority of the population would welcome the change since it would allow them access to more thing like media entertainment: being allowed to use every aspect of the internet for example. I understand what your saying some form of rebellion would deffinately pursue but overall I believe it would be for the better. Having a superpower status military that is watched by independent media would also be commendable, even though some secrets are still maintained.

Let's not forget that a Democratic China could also see an end to their lets say aggresive influence over the likes of Nepal and Tibet, allowing them complete independence to grow on their own. Chinese Taipaei would also see much less aggression from the state.
The prices would rise for everything, which is not needed when the world is in a recession. I don't want to sound like a heartless bastard, but China revolting right now would not be a good idea because it'd fuck up everything. The people of China do need better lives, but I don't think it should come when the economy isn't stable. It'd just ruin everything for a lot of people.

[scuba steve]

The prices would rise for everything, which is not needed when the world is in a recession. I don't want to sound like a heartless bastard, but China revolting right now would not be a good idea because it'd fuck up everything. The people of China do need better lives, but I don't think it should come when the economy isn't stable. It'd just ruin everything for a lot of people.

Not necessarily, it could be argued that goods could become cheaper for certain items as workers currently in different countries are being paid and working to the same standards as the typical Chinese factory worker. If China's manufacturing was to be reduced due to civil war (well not civil war, but from riots) etc. then it could be seen as a free market compared to a Chinese monopoly as different countries compete with each other to gain the contracts from developed countries, this would be complete with the likes of government subsidies.

[Perseus]

Not necessarily, it could be argued that goods could become cheaper for certain items as workers currently in different countries are being paid and working to the same standards as the typical Chinese factory worker. If China's manufacturing was to be reduced due to civil war (well not civil war, but from riots) etc. then it could be seen as a free market compared to a Chinese monopoly as different countries compete with each other to gain the contracts from developed countries, this would be complete with the likes of government subsidies.

China doesn't hold a monopoly on this, though. Things are made in Vietnam, etc. too, and it would most likely be a war, not just a riot. And if the same standards move to a different country, how does that make anything better? That's just as bad. For the workers' conditions to be better, prices would have to rise. (For things from China)

[scuba steve]

China doesn't hold a monopoly on this, though. Things are made in Vietnam, etc. too, and it would most likely be a war, not just a riot. And if the same standards move to a different country, how does that make anything better? That's just as bad. For the workers' conditions to be better, prices would have to rise. (For things from China)

China does hold a monopoly in this market. A monopoly is simply a company or in this case a country that holds more than 25% of market share compared to other competitors holding a dominant position in this case over mass production. Conflict may be seen from Government alligned citizens but those backing a democratic country would prevail IMO.

How would this get better. Well really, it wouldn't apart from the fact that more business is being directed at devolping countries that need it Pakistan for example, who can use this to benfit their own national economy. You could argue that eventually if this market was to become a free market (meaning many equally rivalled competitors) increased competition could be seen in order to gain contracts from contractors, this could be through corporate image tactics meaning that companies will increase the the likes of their working conditions as well as their wages. Although this could also be seen through companies decreasing working conditions to such an extent in order to make goods cheaper.

[embers]

China turning democratic is as likely as Pakistan turning secular.

But I do agree, communism is an idea that has only ever worked in theory. I mean, I don't agree with the commonly stereotyped patriotic American/Brit putting down communism and communist countries for the wrong reason, but countries nowadays are nowhere near equipped enough to have a communist government. And seeing what's happening in China, I do wish something would happen about it. But not now, of all times.

[Iceman]

I think it's fine as it is. It's never going to go to war with any of the U.S allies, so no need to fear over that aspect.

Though I have a deep hatred of these stickers:


http://www.engineeringamerica.org/images/madeinchina.gif

[Perseus]

I think it's fine as it is.
Due to their communism, people have awful living conditions and a plethora of things are censored. Things are definitely not fine. It's an oppressive regime.

[embers]

Due to their communism, people have awful living conditions and a plethora of things are censored. Things are definitely not fine. It's an oppressive regime.

And people don't have awful living conditions elsewhere? Why focus on China, the harder of countries in which to bring about change, when easier yet still significant issues can be solved (or attempted to be, anyway) first?

[Iceman]

It's not proven that if it is switched to a democracy people will suddenly have houses.

[Perseus]

And people don't have awful living conditions elsewhere? Why focus on China, the harder of countries in which to bring about change, when easier yet still significant issues can be solved (or attempted to be, anyway) first?
This debate is about China. Not about anywhere else.
It's not proven that if it is switched to a democracy people will suddenly have houses.

Never said it would. Things would change, though, since it wouldn't be oppressive, unless they got a dictator under the guise of president.

[Iceman]

If people magicaly got higher wages, say the wages here in the U.S., do you think that companies would find the need to get things made in china anymore. No, they would make them in the U.S. for the same price without the shipping across the ocean. That would completely crumble China's economy, much like a Chips-Ahoy.

[embers]

This debate is about China. Not about anywhere else.

Fuck. I have no excuse for overlooking that.

[Perseus]

If people magicaly got higher wages, say the wages here in the U.S., do you think that companies would find the need to get things made in china anymore. No, they would make them in the U.S. for the same price without the shipping across the ocean. That would completely crumble China's economy, much like a Chips-Ahoy.

Exactly why their shouldn't be any change right now. It wouldn't just affect their economy, but the world's economy, too.

[Iceman]

So they never will be.

[scuba steve]

So they never will be.

It has to change at some stage. Examples of this could be investigations which have been taken not so long ago under suspicion that China was holding their currency back, keeping it weak so they could continue to export their goods for cheap prices to the likes of the USD.

[The Dark Lord]

China will eventually become democratic because as their economy continues to grow, the number of well educated, middle class people will increase and these people will demand more democratic rights. Ultimately the CPC's economic policies will be their undoing.

[Iceman]

China will eventually become democratic because as their economy continues to grow, the number of well educated, middle class people will increase and these people will demand more democratic rights. Ultimately the CPC's economic policies will be their undoing.

And then their economy goes bye-bye.

[The Dark Lord]

And then their economy goes bye-bye.

Democracy doesn't mean a fucked up economy.

[Cosmic]

I'm not voting, because I would argue two things; one, we can not determine absolutely whether a democracy would prove best for that country, two, I do not class most Western civilisations as true democratic states, and as such, should China move into that way of politics, I would argue that that holds little improvement.

Most ideally, I would perhaps argue for an anarcho-communist progression for them, which seems to hold the most value in terms of equality, morality, and social cohesion. I would also argue that given their political propaganda, this would be an easier transition for them (mainly due to similar ideals, but without the power struggle).