Class, does it matter?

[Tristin.]

So today is Modern Studies, we arrived at the topic of claa and how it has influenced society for many years.
This brought me to wondering, in 2011 do you think class is still promonant in society and do you think it matters?

With me and virtualy everybody at my school coming from the traditional sence of "upper class:rich, occasionaly stuck up and occasionaly in a "Bubble"", our discussion was very one sided.
So i though i should out it to VT in order to get a wider view on the topic

I personaly think class is still an important factor in society, keeping old traditions alive, promoting etiquette and giving people a thing to strive for.

I also believe it partially matters. In a person, i would look for somebody from my background, but if i met somebody from a less fortunate or more fortunate circustance, i wouldnt think about their class, more of the person.

[Fact]

I also believe it partially matters. In a person, i would look for somebody from my background, but if i met somebody from a less fortunate or more fortunate circustance, i wouldnt think about their class, more of the person.

↑ I agree with this, so why bother with a rigid class system? It's already built into people's brains, depending on what day it is, with regards to someone's class.

You said it gives people something to strive for... I personally think people do enough striving in their lives without having the label "working class: poor" slapped across their forehead. And vice versa - someone who just marries in to money and then doesn't have to work a day in their lives from then on shouldn't be "upper class" because of that (I'm aware it doesn't exactly work that way, but that's what it turns into).

Still, as I previously said a class system makes little difference. IMO because people will always judge and having a class system simply makes that more acceptable.

Also, there's the issue of the government and reintroducing class, because it just gives them another sticking point to deny people of support that they may otherwise have received and need.

[Mrs.KermitTheFrogx]

i think i would be more attracted to somebody from a similer background
as we would probly have more in common
but im not stuck up to the point i wont talk to anyone who isnt higher class x

[embers]

How do you think people of a 'lower class' would feel, having a 'label' for themselves like that? Especially since people will look down on them simply because they are less fortunate.

Yes, class matters a lot. And within the UK it's the conservative + asskisser (by that, I mean of course Nick Clegg's bunch of disgraceful rats) government that will be responsible for further emphasis on class.

[Tristin.]

How do you think people of a 'lower class' would feel, having a 'label' for themselves like that? Especially since people will look down on them simply because they are less fortunate.

Yes, class matters a lot. And within the UK it's the conservative + asskisser (by that, I mean of course Nick Clegg's bunch of disgraceful rats) government that will be responsible for further emphasis on class.

The identity of the UK has been forged through class though? Do you think it is important though? or still promentant?

[nick]

I dont think class matters, but that values and standards do. There are good people and shitty people in all walks of life, but if you have the right standards, the will to treat other people well and not just trample all over them, then nothing else matters.

[Mrs.KermitTheFrogx]

embers :;
whos 'labelling' them ?
noobody said that
hes simply saying in the modern day does he think class is as importance as it used to be ...
i think it matters to my (VERY OLD FASHIONED) family more than it does to me x

[embers]

The identity of the UK has been forged through class though? Do you think it is important though? or still promentant?

Erm, I can't say, I've only been here for about two years. But class plays a huge, huge role in social groups, even in such a peaceful town as the one I live in: the perfect example is that the general consensus is that within the town, the 'chavs' and rougher, rowdier lads come from Southdown/Batford and the more well off live further north, e.g Kinsbourne Green. To some extent it is true, and there you have it - class.

Then you get groups that seem to be based on class, with some exceptions. Class is important, as much as I don't want it to be.

embers :;
whos 'labelling' them ?
noobody said that
hes simply saying in the modern day does he think class is as importance as it used to be ...
i think it matters to my (VERY OLD FASHIONED) family more than it does to me x

What I'm saying is that the working class are sometimes if not mostly confined to their own social groups and the upper class to their own simply because of this division created by the better off. It is very much still in place, but applies more to adults than it does to kids these days, as I think we should be growing out of it.

But then again, we could well be confined to our own classes still in the future. My group of friends is mainly middle class lads, for example. For some reason, we seem to mingle better with people that have the same class label as us, whether we consciously recognise it or not.

[Tristin.]

you brought up a good point, unconciously staying with-in our class backgrounds. I admit i have looked down at people in the past, yet not knowingly doing so. i think that as long as the poorer have a pre-conceved idea of the rich and vice-versa, class will be scrutenised.

[embers]

We've all looked down on people in the past. It's natural. It comes in the same package as individuality and difference.

[Continuum]

We've all looked down on people in the past. It's natural. It comes in the same package as individuality and difference.

And so is envy for the people who enjoy more privileges than them. People'll feel bad if they're branded in a way that, they're always below somebody else.

[The Dark Lord]

Yes, class matters a lot. And within the UK it's the conservative + asskisser (by that, I mean of course Nick Clegg's bunch of disgraceful rats) government that will be responsible for further emphasis on class.

Shut Up, Nick Clegg had no alternative. The "disgraceful rats" have implamented more important and fairer policies.

[nick]

We've all looked down on people in the past.
Well your comment made me think of this, which will explain it perfectly to our overseas friends...

1mYY1QGK0jQ

[embers]

Shut Up, Nick Clegg had no alternative. The "disgraceful rats" have implamented more important and fairer policies.

Oh, sorry, I apologise to all the rats I may have offended with that comparison. The Lib Dems are worse.

No, the Lib Dems had put more important and fairer policies in their manifesto, yes. But as to implementing them... hell no. Look at the most famous of them all, the fact that Nick Clegg DIDN'T go against the bill to raise tuition fees to up to £9000, when it was a point he emphasised over and over again.

"We didn't win outright," he said on the BBC. So he said he couldn't do anything about it. But fact is he's not trying to.

As for how it links in with class, it's going to be all the rich kids going to uni. At least now he's trying to offer free funding for a year in university for 'poorer kids'. But being the old Cleggy I know, I doubt that's going to happen. And it's only because of the students raising their voices that he's shat himself and is trying to correct his stupid mistake. After all, he was the reason that royal couple's car got so badly vandalised.

[The Dark Lord]

Oh, sorry, I apologise to all the rats I may have offended with that comparison. The Lib Dems are worse.

No they are not, if you believe that then you'll not need to worry about paying for tutition fees.

No, the Lib Dems had put more important and fairer policies in their manifesto, yes. But as to implementing them... hell no. Look at the most famous of them all, the fact that Nick Clegg DIDN'T go against the bill to raise tuition fees to up to £9000, when it was a point he emphasised over and over again.

Erm, people earning <£10,000 are being taken out of the tax system, there is a referndum on electoral reform, there will be a fully elected House of Lords, I don't agree with his policies, but to say that he isn't implementing them is wrong.

"We didn't win outright," he said on the BBC. So he said he couldn't do anything about it. But fact is he's not trying to.

What should he have done? Rigged the election to give the Liberals a majority?

As for how it links in with class, it's going to be all the rich kids going to uni. At least now he's trying to offer free funding for a year in university for 'poorer kids'. But being the old Cleggy I know, I doubt that's going to happen. And it's only because of the students raising their voices that he's shat himself and is trying to correct his stupid mistake. After all, he was the reason that royal couple's car got so badly vandalised.

No he isn't. It isn't Nick Clegg's fault that some students couldn't control themselves. You don't know "old Cleggy" and it was David Willetts (the Universities Minister) who made that promise, not "old Cleggy". Finally how did he shite himself? He was brave enough to go into Coalition with the Tories, he is brave enough to make the difficult decisions that Labour refused to do and I'm sure he will be brave enough to see it through to the end.

Just a final point about tutition fees: Labour and the Tories signed a non-agression pledge regarding higher education, suggesting that Labour would have done that exact same thing. Also it was Labour who introduced tutition fees.

[Zazu]

It all fucking boils down to money. Something which I laugh at and detest.

I therefore hate the idea of class, the idea of one group of people being better than another based on their assets / bloodline. We're all human beings. We're all bags of flesh, blood, DNA and sentience. Just because someone else might have more magic numbers appear when they check their bank balance or might have more bits of paper / pieces of metal in their pocket which 'puts' them in a 'different class' to another means nothing to me.

[Mrs.KermitTheFrogx]

It all fucking boils down to money. Something which I laugh at and detest.

I therefore hate the idea of class, the idea of one group of people being better than another based on their assets / bloodline. We're all human beings. We're all bags of flesh, blood, DNA and sentience. Just because someone else might have more magic numbers appear when they check their bank balance or might have more bits of paper / pieces of metal in their pocket which 'puts' them in a 'different class' to another means nothing to me.

so fucking true :) x

[Korashk]

Classes are pretty much necessary for society to function.

[Zazu]

Classes are pretty much necessary for society to function.

Why?

[Korashk]

Why?
In a society there are a myriad of different jobs that essentially have to get done or things go to shit. Most of these jobs are those in the unskilled labor department. I'm talking sanitation, cleaners, office grunts, service jobs, etc., These are not jobs that the typical person wants to do, but need to get done. These are jobs typically occupied by individuals occupying the "lower class." They do these jobs because they basically have to, not because they want to.

The inverse is also true. Jobs typically held by the middle to higher class are skilled labor jobs. Doctors, business owners, ect., these jobs can not be done by someone who doesn't know how to do them. People who hold these jobs do so (at least in part) because they do not want to do jobs involving unskilled labor. To learn how to do these jobs these people get trained to do them and in return expect to receive compensation that is proportional to the effort and work the put into getting this training.

Without class you do not have this division that allows all/most of the jobs society requires to function, done. You either have a lot of unskilled laborers that CAN'T do skilled labor, or a lot of skilled laborers that WON'T do unskilled labor.

[RAWWR]

Looking at it from a sociological perspective, I would say class matters but nowhere near as much as it used to.
Jobs such as electrician and plumber-which are generally classed as lower class jobs-but pay middle class wages-Are making the boundaries of the social classes less prominent. therefore causing society as a whole to become more of a community, and less of a heirachy.
(I sound so clever in this post ;) )

[goat]

Didn't you make a remark in a post about the riots over tuition? I believe you said the rights of lower classes should only be to work and reproduce. I believe we already have your view on class.

[Tristin.]

if this was aimed at me, then i already stated, from my background my views on class are narrowed, hence i put it to the people of VT to see what they put, my own views i put at the begining of this thread also