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Dante
November 11th, 2006, 11:57 AM
California Students Ban Pledge of Allegiance
Leaders Do Not Want to Recite Loyalty to God or Government

LOS ANGELES (Nov. 11) - Student leaders at a California college have touched off a furor by banning the Pledge of Allegiance at their meetings, saying they see no reason to publicly swear loyalty to God and the U.S. government.


The move by Orange Coast College student trustees, the latest clash over patriotism and religion in American schools, has infuriated some of their classmates -- prompting one young woman to loudly recite the pledge in front of the board on Wednesday night in defiance of the rule.

"America is the one thing I'm passionate about and I can't let them take that away from me," 18-year-old political science major Christine Zoldos told Reuters.

"The fact that they have enough power to ban one of the most valued traditions in America is just horrible," Zoldos said, adding she would attend every board meeting to salute the flag.

The move was led by three recently elected student trustees, who ran for office wearing revolutionary-style berets and said they do not believe in publicly swearing an oath to the American flag and government at their school. One student trustee voted against the measure, which does not apply to other student groups or campus meetings.

The ban follows a 2002 ruling by a federal appeals court in San Francisco that said forcing school children to recite the pledge was unconstitutional because of the phrase "under God." The U.S. Supreme Court struck down the ruling on procedural grounds but left the door open for another challenge.

"That ('under God') part is sort of offensive to me," student trustee Jason Ball, who proposed the ban, told Reuters. "I am an atheist and a socialist, and if you know your history, you know that 'under God' was inserted during the McCarthy era and was directly designed to destroy my ideology."

Ball said the ban largely came about because the trustees didn't want to publicly vow loyalty to the American government before their meetings. "Loyalty ought to be something the government earns through performance, not through reciting a pledge," he said.

Martha Parham, a spokeswoman for the Coast Community College District, said her office had no standing on the student board and took no position on the flag salute ban.

"If their personal belief is that they don't want to say the Pledge of Allegiance, the district certainly isn't going to dictate what they do," she said.

More than 28,000 students attend the community college, located in conservative Orange County, California, south of Los Angeles.

Sophomore Chris Belanger, one of several students who attended the meeting to support keeping the pledge, waved an American flag and accused the board of "radical views and anti-Americanism."


11/10/06 07:34 EST


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0=
November 11th, 2006, 04:24 PM
Lol, anti-american? No. I don't pledge allegiance to my government, if and when the corruption ends, I will.

Phantom
November 11th, 2006, 05:09 PM
Lol, anti-american? No. I don't pledge allegiance to my government, if and when the corruption ends, I will.Your not to the government.
Its to the flag, your country, its principles, liberty, justice, democracy, everything the US stands for.
Its not fucking pledging allegiance to George Bush.
Yes it is unpatriotic to not respect your country which you clearly don't do.
Kinda like Micheal Moore who hates his country so much even though it allows him to make millions of slandering it.

Popo freedom and rights are NOT free. People like you make it seem that these things are givens and are not needed to be protected.
We have more rights than any other country. We have one of the highest standards of living. The best technology. And some of the smartest people.
Most major advances of mankind have come thanks to Americans. And yet you have an avatar making it seem like we are all dumb fucks that can't screw in a light bulb, yet if it wasn't for Edison who was American you wouldn't even have electricity.
O yeah and read my sig.

mr. self destruct
November 12th, 2006, 01:27 AM
come on, i can understand how they feel, but to go as far as banning it outright sounds really silly.

Melchi0r
November 12th, 2006, 08:36 AM
Lol!!

People are either over-patriotic and force everyone to accept their views or they could be anti-patriotic.... and still force their views on everyone.

*Dissident*
November 22nd, 2006, 12:36 PM
Your not to the government.
Its to the flag, your country, its principles, liberty, justice, democracy, everything the US stands for.
Its not fucking pledging allegiance to George Bush.
Yes it is unpatriotic to not respect your country which you clearly don't do.
Kinda like Micheal Moore who hates his country so much even though it allows him to make millions of slandering it.

Popo freedom and rights are NOT free. People like you make it seem that these things are givens and are not needed to be protected.
We have more rights than any other country. We have one of the highest standards of living. The best technology. And some of the smartest people.
Most major advances of mankind have come thanks to Americans. And yet you have an avatar making it seem like we are all dumb fucks that can't screw in a light bulb, yet if it wasn't for Edison who was American you wouldn't even have electricity.
O yeah and read my sig.


Phantom, we can have all of these things without the need for wars and patriotism and all that. Do you realize, that we would have about $300,000,000,000 extra dollars if not for the war in iraq? thats enough to give every person in this country $1000, and if you cut out the upper and middle class, you can give all the poor people in this country like $3000. or, you know, spend it on something beneficial to the human race besides killing.


I prefer to show Earthism, rather than patriotism. Patriotism is only beneficial to the US government. How does your patriotism help anyone but them? it doesnt help me, or anyone else, or even YOU. the rest of the world needs our "love" too. Like the millions of starving and dieing people in Africa. Imagine if they were given the same benefits as people in the United States? or what about the millions of Mexicans who are dirt poor coming to America to make a better life forthemselves, yet people like you and your patriotism want to drive them out for not paying Taxes. They wouldnt need to if we didnt spend $300,000,000,000 on the war in Iraq, and anothr $250,000,000,000 on the avoidable Katrina Catastrophe

Joshua D. Boggess
July 16th, 2012, 06:10 PM
Phantom, we can have all of these things without the need for wars and patriotism and all that. Do you realize, that we would have about $300,000,000,000 extra dollars if not for the war in iraq? thats enough to give every person in this country $1000, and if you cut out the upper and middle class, you can give all the poor people in this country like $3000. or, you know, spend it on something beneficial to the human race besides killing.


I prefer to show Earthism, rather than patriotism. Patriotism is only beneficial to the US government. How does your patriotism help anyone but them? it doesnt help me, or anyone else, or even YOU. the rest of the world needs our "love" too. Like the millions of starving and dieing people in Africa. Imagine if they were given the same benefits as people in the United States? or what about the millions of Mexicans who are dirt poor coming to America to make a better life forthemselves, yet people like you and your patriotism want to drive them out for not paying Taxes. They wouldnt need to if we didnt spend $300,000,000,000 on the war in Iraq, and anothr $250,000,000,000 on the avoidable Katrina Catastrophe

I think the numbers u show r interesting. Im very into cars and i know the US went deficit $726.3 billion in 2011, and a full $254.1 billion of that was from buying imported cars. In other words, the US could've cut the year 2011's deficit by roughly 35% had we not bought imported cars. I think too that working on limiting our buying of imported cars would be more beneficial to us because if the war ended alot of people would be left w/o jobs, which would be sad and although i agree the war needs to end, i dont think we're ready for that quite yet

Cognizant
July 16th, 2012, 06:13 PM
Good for them!

Joshua D. Boggess
July 16th, 2012, 06:15 PM
Your not to the government.
Its to the flag, your country, its principles, liberty, justice, democracy, everything the US stands for.
Its not fucking pledging allegiance to George Bush.
Yes it is unpatriotic to not respect your country which you clearly don't do.
Kinda like Micheal Moore who hates his country so much even though it allows him to make millions of slandering it.

Popo freedom and rights are NOT free. People like you make it seem that these things are givens and are not needed to be protected.
We have more rights than any other country. We have one of the highest standards of living. The best technology. And some of the smartest people.
Most major advances of mankind have come thanks to Americans. And yet you have an avatar making it seem like we are all dumb fucks that can't screw in a light bulb, yet if it wasn't for Edison who was American you wouldn't even have electricity.
O yeah and read my sig.

I agree that refusing to say the pledge is un-American, how could it not be? And you also raise a good point that i often find myself saying, and it is that we have the most rights and the least corrupt gov. and country on earth. its still pretty screwed, but its the least f-ed up of them

Electra Heart
July 16th, 2012, 06:25 PM
I agree that refusing to say the pledge is un-American, how could it not be? And you also raise a good point that i often find myself saying, and it is that we have the most rights and the least corrupt gov. and country on earth. its still pretty screwed, but its the least f-ed up of them

This thread is from '06, man :locked: