Gay college student throws himself off of a bridge

[Perseus]

Rz2sri8NjiE&feature=sub

I read an article about it thirty minutes ago, but I don't feel like going and finding it, so this should suffice. :P




This is absolutely terrible, though.

[nick]

Here's a report I read earlier of this:-
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Two classmates who secretly filmed their fellow student having sex with a man leading to his suicide have been charged with invasion of privacy.

Tyler Clementi, 18, jumped from the George Washington Bridge into the Hudson River, which separates New York and New Jersey, USA a day after Dharun Ravi and Molly Wei streamed live footage over the internet of him having sex with a man.

Mr Clementi, a first-year student at Rutgers University, New Jersey, and a talented violinist, updated his Facebook page minutes earlier, telling his friends: “Jumping off the gw bridge sorry.”

Mr Ravi has been charged and bailed. Ms Wei has been released. It is alleged that on September 19, after giving Mr Clementi private use of their room, Mr Ravi activated his computer’s webcam before going to Ms Wei’s room nearby.

The pair are alleged to have accessed the camera’s live feed and shared it with Mr Ravi’s online friends, using instant messaging software.

At the time Mr Ravi said on Twitter: “Roommate asked for the room till midnight. I went into molly’s room and turned on my webcam. I saw him making out with a dude. Yay.” It is alleged that Mr Ravi tried to repeat the process two days later and advertised the video feed on his Twitter page. Mr Clementi killed himself the following day.

A lawyer for Mr Clementi’s family said they were “heartbroken beyond words”.

Steven Goldstein, from the gay rights group Garden State Equality, said his death was a “hate crime”.


Source (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/8035214/Student-sex-clip-suicide-leads-to-charges.html)

------------------------------------------
Pretty sick sort of trick to pull if you ask me.

[Amnesiac]

That's disappointing, and kind of disturbing. However, his suicide does seem to be a bit of an overreaction, but then again I don't know the depth of the situation.

Also, inb4 Westboro Baptist Church protests his funeral.

[NeverTooLate]

This is the 4th or 3rd suicide by a gay teen this week, that i heard of :\ poor kids...

[Perseus]

That's disappointing, and kind of disturbing. However, his suicide does seem to be a bit of an overreaction, but then again I don't know the depth of the situation.

Also, inb4 Westboro Baptist Church protests his funeral.

He was recorded having gay sex while he was in the closet; the fact that he was recorded is bad in itself, even if he was out the closet. It's not an overreaction. If he didn't have homophobic roommates and such, he'd be alive.

[Amnesiac]

He was recorded having gay sex while he was in the closet; the fact that he was recorded is bad in itself, even if he was out the closet. It's not an overreaction. If he didn't have homophobic roommates and such, he'd be alive.

I don't know, he could've taken legal action or something a little less drastic in my opinion. It's still a horrible story though, and I can see why he did it.

[CaptainObvious]

It's not an overreaction.

While I deeply sympathize with his plight and understand the spirit behind what you're saying, I should point out that in my opinion suicide is an overreaction to everything other than the knowledge that you will live the rest of your life in terrible constant pain until you die naturally (i.e. terminal disease cases).

[Perseus]

While I deeply sympathize with his plight and understand the spirit behind what you're saying, I should point out that in my opinion suicide is an overreaction to everything other than the knowledge that you will live the rest of your life in terrible constant pain until you die naturally (i.e. terminal disease cases).

I wasn't talking about his suicide as an overreaction, I was talking about the media issue.

[Amnesiac]

I wasn't talking about his suicide as an overreaction, I was talking about the media issue.

Well, I was talking about his suicide being an overreaction on his part.

[Perseus]

Well, I was talking about his suicide being an overreaction on his part.

God, I am a fucking retard sometimes. asjdasjdashdkjahskjdhaskldhaskjdhkjfhdshd

[Amnesiac]

God, I am fucking retard sometimes. asjdasjdashdkjahskjdhaskldhaskjdhkjfhdshd

*retarded

Don't worry, it happens to all of us.

[Perseus]

*retarded

Don't worry, it happens to all of us.

Don't correct me. :P I forgot my "a" in my rage fit. :P

[The Batman]

I doubt he killed himself because he was recorded having sex. If it was that embarrassing he'd just leave the school. I think there's more to this then just what we see but since someone has to be blamed for it the kids that recorded him are getting jailtime(even though they deserve it).

[DarkHorses]

I feel bad for the kid, but I wish he would have taken more time to think about his actions and realize suicide wasn't the best option. It's easy to blame the people who did this to him for his death, but in my opinion he made the choice to kill himself, when he could have chosen better.

[Sage]

*retarded

I love the irony in people avoiding the word 'gay' in the derogatory sense but still using words like 'retarded' in the same manner.

[Fruit_Tart.]

ohhh... poor boy. :( things like this people should be aware of. damn pigs should spend time in jail or something.

[Perseus]

I love the irony in people avoiding the word 'gay' in the derogatory sense but still using words like 'retarded' in the same manner.

Too bad I don't avoid them, Sage.

[Magus]

I feel bad for the kid, but I wish he would have taken more time to think about his actions and realize suicide wasn't the best option. It's easy to blame the people who did this to him for his death, but in my opinion he made the choice to kill himself, when he could have chosen better.

It is the same way I feel. He could have, but it wasn't in his hand, he was devastated to know that he was recorded having sex, and you know, he wanted to keep his sexuality hidden, too.

So, it was all pressure. He did what he could, and we cannot do anything about it. Well, we learn from our and other people's mistakes.

[Sage]

Too bad I don't avoid them, Sage.

Note how it isn't a post of yours that I quoted.

[Jess]

that's so sad :(

[Sith Lord 13]

I don't see this as a crime worthy of jail time. The suicide was an unforeseeable consequence, and not the other students' faults. Invasion of privacy is bad, but it merits community service and/or a fine. The suicide is tragic, but not a crime.

[Alex_.-]

i LOVE philly D!!!!! :D

and yea this is bullshit, the poor guy :(

it's sad that we live in a world where difference is so unaccepted, people feel that dying is the better option to being gay

i hope something terrible happens to his "friend" ....cuz somehow i doubt he'll feel truely remorseful for what he did (yes i am a bad person)

:p

[Asylum]

poor boy.. i feel really bad for him :(

[OnceMoreWithFeeling]

That is horrible, its a shame what happened.

[Perseus]

I don't see this as a crime worthy of jail time. The suicide was an unforeseeable consequence, and not the other students' faults. Invasion of privacy is bad, but it merits community service and/or a fine. The suicide is tragic, but not a crime.

Why not? The guy's invasion of privacy caused the dude to commit suicide, not because he invaded his privacy, but because he broad casted it on the internet live for everyone to see, which is weird because why would straight guys want to watch gay sex? But that's not the point.

[Amnesiac]

I love the irony in people avoiding the word 'gay' in the derogatory sense but still using words like 'retarded' in the same manner.

Well, you know my position on words and being offended at them. I don't strive to be politically correct on the Internet.

[Sith Lord 13]

Why not? The guy's invasion of privacy caused the dude to commit suicide, not because he invaded his privacy, but because he broad casted it on the internet live for everyone to see, which is weird because why would straight guys want to watch gay sex? But that's not the point.

Because it was in no way foreseeable. Might have a good case for a wrongful death suit, but no one is criminally responsible for that poor kid's death.

[Perseus]

Because it was in no way foreseeable. Might have a good case for a wrongful death suit, but no one is criminally responsible for that poor kid's death.

How so was it not foreseeable? Yesterday I saw(I didn't read it) an article saying that he talked to teachers before he jumped off the bridge.

[nick]

I don't see this as a crime worthy of jail time. The suicide was an unforeseeable consequence, and not the other students' faults. Invasion of privacy is bad, but it merits community service and/or a fine. The suicide is tragic, but not a crime.
Broadcasting anyone having sex, whatever their sexuality, live over the internet is more than a minor invasion of privacy, its about the worst case imagineable. A fine doesnt seem nearly enough to me. I can understand how the guy may have felt he could never go out in public again, ashamed of everyone pointing at him and laughing, talking behind his back. It was an awful thing to do and I dont doubt that it led to his death. Prison seems reasonable to me.

[Sith Lord 13]

How so was it not foreseeable? Yesterday I saw(I didn't read it) an article saying that he talked to teachers before he jumped off the bridge.

I meant foreseeable by the students who broadcasted the sex romp.

Broadcasting anyone having sex, whatever their sexuality, live over the internet is more than a minor invasion of privacy, its about the worst case imagineable. A fine doesnt seem nearly enough to me. I can understand how the guy may have felt he could never go out in public again, ashamed of everyone pointing at him and laughing, talking behind his back. It was an awful thing to do and I dont doubt that it led to his death. Prison seems reasonable to me.

If that were true, every person who ever leaked a celebrity sex tape should be jailed. No, invasion of privacy is bad, but not worthy of jail. And they hold no criminal liability for the death.

[Perseus]

I meant foreseeable by the students who broadcasted the sex romp.





Not by the people who did it because they did it. If they foresaw that happening, then I doubt they'd want to broadcast him having sex. It is their fault that Tyler died. He wouldn't have killed himself if he wasn't broadcasted having sex because he was gay. They are a direct cause to his death. Is a person who hires a hitman not at fault since they didn't kill them their self?

[Sith Lord 13]

Not by the people who did it because they did it. If they foresaw that happening, then I doubt they'd want to broadcast him having sex. It is their fault that Tyler died. He wouldn't have killed himself if he wasn't broadcasted having sex because he was gay. They are a direct cause to his death. Is a person who hires a hitman not at fault since they didn't kill them their self?

I'm gonna point out the key fact you brought to light yourself:

Not by the people who did it because they did it. If they foresaw that happening, then I doubt they'd want to broadcast him having sex.

Criminal liability would require a reasonable person to see the death as a noticeable possibility.

Also, how do you know he wouldn't have killed himself otherwise? Can you prove it, without a shadow of a reasonable doubt, that were it not for that he would have committed suicide? No. Some other, legal, act may have driven him to suicide. One person is not responsible for the unintended actions of another. Under New Jersey state law, as I understand it due to cursory search, the individuals may be subject to a $30,000 fine, but no jail time. I could also see them facing a wrongful death suit, where the burden of proof and responsibility is much lower. But I see no way that one could, legally, bill this as murder.

[phily08]

Its sad how we treat people because their differant.Truly sad.:mad::(

[Perseus]

Criminal liability would require a reasonable person to see the death as a noticeable possibility.

Also, how do you know he wouldn't have killed himself otherwise? Can you prove it, without a shadow of a reasonable doubt, that were it not for that he would have committed suicide? No. Some other, legal, act may have driven him to suicide. One person is not responsible for the unintended actions of another. Under New Jersey state law, as I understand it due to cursory search, the individuals may be subject to a $30,000 fine, but no jail time. I could also see them facing a wrongful death suit, where the burden of proof and responsibility is much lower. But I see no way that one could, legally, bill this as murder.
You are absolutely correct, but there is no way of knowing. They are still a direct correlation since the actions they caused corresponded to him being underneath a bridge.

[trackstar9.875]

Everyone has a different thought about this: Did he go too far, Did he need mental help?

I think this was a kid..that FINALLY became comfortable enough to have sex with someone...and his "feeble-minded" dumb ass roommate decided to make a spectacle of it...and to completely humiliate him, and the kid was just overwhelmed with embarassment about something...

THAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN KEPT PRIVATE!!

Here's a thought: Let's "parade" his roommates encounters all over the Net, and see how he likes it. Let him NOT ONLY serve time -- like 25 years, but show his sexual trysts to everybody.

DESPICABLE!!

[welcome_to_chaos]

This is horrible and although they didnt know what the were doing at the time this is a donsiquence for posting the video and i think that they should accept the responsibility for what they did

[Sith Lord 13]

You are absolutely correct, but there is no way of knowing. They are still a direct correlation since the actions they caused corresponded to him being underneath a bridge.

Correlation does not equal causation. It's about solid proof in criminal court.

They may or may not hold criminal liability for invasion of privacy and pornography charges though.

[Suicune]

This is horrible and although they didnt know what they were doing at the time

Rubbish.
You cannot say they were unaware of what they were doing. They talked about it on Twitter, Facebook, and streamed it. With all intention of humiliation.

[Sith Lord 13]

Rubbish.
You cannot say they were unaware of what they were doing. They talked about it on Twitter, Facebook, and streamed it. With all intention of humiliation.

They did not, and could not be expected to, see the ultimate suicide of their friend which this act most likely contributed to. Porn and invasion of privacy charges depends on the specifics of the event and the actual statutes themselves, but I don't believe there is, or should be, any way they can be charged for murder.

[PJay]

I must admit was going to have a rant st doth lord but now one read the argument through o see the point. Yes the room mate is guilty, no question . But you have to be clear what exactly are they guilty of. It was definitely a malicious act imho and I hope justice is done. To me it isn't surprising the guy killed himself, and I wonder if a jury would feel the same. I think there is a pretty solid cause and effect link there tbh but that is why it needs to be considered by a jury.

Sent from my HTC Wildfire using Tapatalk

[Sith Lord 13]

I must admit was going to have a rant st doth lord but now one read the argument through o see the point. Yes the room mate is guilty, no question . But you have to be clear what exactly are they guilty of. It was definitely a malicious act imho and I hope justice is done. To me it isn't surprising the guy killed himself, and I wonder if a jury would feel the same. I think there is a pretty solid cause and effect link there tbh but that is why it needs to be considered by a jury.

Sent from my HTC Wildfire using Tapatalk

The issue is not even if they caused it (which couldn't be proven to a proper legal standing) but if it was a reasonably foreseeable outcome. I don't believe a reasonable human being would equate broadcasting a person's activities with putting a gun to their head and pulling the trigger.

[PJay]

I disagree that there is no link at all. There are laws for slander and so on because it is predictable that you will piss someone off even though they are physically fine. To me this is like any emotional abuse , you can prove it has a real effect on ppl.
This is why a jury is needed, because then we get a fairer idea of whether 'most ppl' could have predicted what would happen, or perhaps it might be enough to get them agree that some bad shit was going to happen.


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[Sith Lord 13]

I disagree that there is no link at all. There are laws for slander and so on because it is predictable that you will piss someone off even though they are physically fine. To me this is like any emotional abuse , you can prove it has a real effect on ppl.
This is why a jury is needed, because then we get a fairer idea of whether 'most ppl' could have predicted what would happen, or perhaps it might be enough to get them agree that some bad shit was going to happen.


Sent from my HTC Wildfire using Tapatalk

There is no link provable beyond a shadow of a reasonable doubt. Slander is covered under tort law usually, and, as I said, the family of the victim most likely has a rather good wrongful death suit on their hands. Again, they may or may not be criminals under pornography and invasion of privacy laws, but I know of no statute that would allow them to be held responsible for murder.

[PJay]

I personally don't see this could be murder either, but you'd have to be pretty naive to think the two things are not connected, and I think it would be a shame if that wasn't recognised in this case. That was all I was arguing with I think, cos I think it was obvious this was going to do harm and prob quite a lot of harm, to the victim.


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[Sith Lord 13]

I personally don't see this could be murder either, but you'd have to be pretty naive to think the two things are not connected, and I think it would be a shame if that wasn't recognised in this case. That was all I was arguing with I think, cos I think it was obvious this was going to do harm and prob quite a lot of harm, to the victim.


Sent from my HTC Wildfire using Tapatalk

Honestly, I wouldn't. I'd think it's a sick and cruel practical joke, but true harm to the point of bodily injury, no. And there's a difference between ethical and legal responsibility for something.

[myskias]

so sad :'(