Parental consent for abortion

[Jess]

should a girl be required to get her parents' permission to get an abortion?


I don't think she should. In the end, it's her choice and after all, it's her body. maybe her parents could try to persuade her not to do an abortion, if they don't like it, but they SHOULD respect her choice

[ShyGuyInChicago]

should a girl be required to get her parents' permission to get an abortion?


I don't think she should. In the end, it's her choice and after all, it's her body. maybe her parents could try to persuade her not to do an abortion, if they don't like it, but they SHOULD respect her choice

I think at the very least her parents need to know. But then if they do know it could put her danger from them.

[Jess]

Yes, they should know but if they are abusive...well maybe not

[Sith Lord 13]

Minors need parental consent for any other surgical procedure. I don't see why abortions deserve an exemption.

[Atonement]

Minors need parental consent for any other surgical procedure. I don't see why abortions deserve an exemption.

I definitely agree.

With the kind of laws we have, abortion is a medical procedure like anyother (more controversial and private maybe, but still). So I don't understand why this can be done without consent. I believe its the patients body and can do as they feel, however why the double standard?

[Obscene Eyedeas]

All this parents need to know and give permission and stuff is ludicrous imo. parents shouldn't have a say in such an aspect that could forever ruin their child's lives. everyone has their own opinions and ideas, sometimes a parent will make a decision best for them and not their kid. why give this prejudice a chance to ruin someone's life

[ShatteredWings]

Minors need parental consent for any other surgical procedure. I don't see why abortions deserve an exemption.

I wasn't aware of this.
As parents can't have full access to your medical records after the age of 13, which is how free clinics can provide medical treatment to minors without informing their parents, why do they need to know?

[DarkHorses]

If you're a minor, your parents have the right to know. I wouldn't be able to keep something like this from my mom, even if I wanted to. When you're a minor your parents DO have a say in your life, and in my opinion when you're a minor a decision such as an abortion shouldn't be made on your own. You need support from other people who will help you make your decision.

[Perseus]

I definitely agree.

With the kind of laws we have, abortion is a medical procedure like anyother (more controversial and private maybe, but still). So I don't understand why this can be done without consent. I believe its the patients body and can do as they feel, however why the double standard?

So the person should be forced to give birth because their parents' don't want their child to have an abortion? That's stupid. The girl's life would be ruined because of her parents' intervention.

[Jess]

what if your parents are abusive? Would you want them to know? :S

[CuriousDestruction]

Do i think the girl should tell the parents? 90% of the time yes. Would i require them to know? hell no. I've seen how bad that can get. the fact is, parents have no right to decide whether their kid gets an abortion.

[Jenna.]

All this parents need to know and give permission and stuff is ludicrous imo. parents shouldn't have a say in such an aspect that could forever ruin their child's lives. everyone has their own opinions and ideas, sometimes a parent will make a decision best for them and not their kid. why give this prejudice a chance to ruin someone's life

This. I don't think you should need parental consent for abortions. As was said in the quote, it's your body and sometimes you need to do what's best for YOU, without your parents intervening and choosing for you. A girl shouldn't have to have a baby she doesn't want, just because her parents think abortions are "wrong."

[Church]

I think if shes a minor yea.

[Jess]

I think if shes a minor yea.

but she should still be able to have the abortion if she wants to. it's her choice...

[Church]

How would you feel if your daughter was pregnant and she was like "Nvm gonna go get it killed."

[dead]

How would you feel if your daughter was pregnant and she was like "Nvm gonna go get it killed."

Yes because thats how it always happens. :rolleyes:

[Sage]

How would you feel if your daughter was pregnant and she was like "Nvm gonna go get it killed."

I would be delighted because I hate babies and I'd rather not be a grandfather at such a young age.

[The Joker]

How would you feel if your daughter was pregnant and she was like "Nvm gonna go get it killed."

How would you feel if you/your daughter did not have the money/ability to support a child?

Would you rather have something that is not alive yet not come into fruition, or have someone born and have permanent damage from not being raised properly?

There has been a correlation between abortion and crime rates dropping. A lot of people have abortions because they are poor, and would rather not have their child live in the ghetto. About 15-20 years after Roe versus Wade, there was a sudden drop in crime rate that could not be explained. In the book Freakonomics, the authors believe the crime rate dropped due to abortion. Why?

Around the age of 15-20 years, that is when a person is likely to start a criminal career. It is very common in the ghetto for their to be criminals (understandable, because the area has tons of issues, including poverty, racism, etc.). Because of Roe versus Wade, a lot of potential criminals were not born.

[Church]

Saying abortion rates being higher explains lower crime rates is plain stupid, so I guess since theirs less pirates thats the reason there is more global warming? Or less school prayer makes crime rates higher? Cause both of those are examples people have used (first one as a joke of course). Also if I had a daughter who was going to have a child and didnt have money to support it I would help support it.

[The Joker]

Saying abortion rates being higher explains lower crime rates is plain stupid, so I guess since theirs less pirates thats the reason there is more global warming? Or less school prayer makes crime rates higher? Cause both of those are examples people have used (first one as a joke of course). Also if I had a daughter who was going to have a child and didnt have money to support it I would help support it.

It makes perfect sense. Did you even read it? All these people who would've been raised in a bad environment would not have been born.

What if you didn't have the money yourself, to support the child?

[Church]

Its not right to deprive a child of its life due to its environment it will be born in. If thats the case no child should be born in war zones etc. And no children in most of Africa.

Also I wouldn't let my daughter get a abortion and if she got one regardless I would disown her, call me old fashioned but killing a baby is pretty messed up even if it hasn't been born yet. Also why would I be poor? I'm not going to set myself up for failure etc.

[The Joker]

Its not right to deprive a child of its life due to its environment it will be born in. If thats the case no child should be born in war zones etc. And no children in most of Africa.

Also I wouldn't let my daughter get a abortion and if she got one regardless I would disown her, call me old fashioned but killing a baby is pretty messed up even if it hasn't been born yet. Also why would I be poor? I'm not going to set myself up for failure etc.

So you would prefer a child to grow up and rob banks, instead of an unborn fetus never coming into the world? Yes, I don't think children should be born in war zones, but in many of those areas, they do not have the medical ability or the money to perform these operations.

Wow, because your daughter would be smart enough to make her own decisions, and have an opinion different to yours, you would disown her. You being poor would be an example. What do you mean set yourself up for failure? Do you honestly think that people are poor on purpose? If being poor was so easily preventable like you're making it sound, NO ONE would be poor.

[Church]

You cant assume a baby is going to grow up and be something. Using that basis for abortion is retarded.

And 'set yourself up for failure' is a term we use alot in ROTC which basically means you dont take all the means possible to assure the best outcome. For example I'd get a stable job, have money in the bank to fall back on etc. Make safe investments that help increase wealth. Etc etc.

[The Joker]

You cant assume a baby is going to grow up and be something. Using that basis for abortion is retarded.

And 'set yourself up for failure' is a term we use alot in ROTC which basically means you dont take all the means possible to assure the best outcome. For example I'd get a stable job, have money in the bank to fall back on etc. Make safe investments that help increase wealth. Etc etc.

Why can't I? If a baby is put into an environment where crime and poverty run rampant, they are likely to follow in those footsteps.

What if it is not possible to get a stable job? What if you are fired from said job? What if you aren't knowledgeable in investments? What if you have a disability that prevents you from working at all? WHAT IF WHAT IF WHAT IF.

[Church]

I'm joining the military, thats a fairly stable job. And I dont plan on having a child so the what if my daughter thing isnt very relevant to me.

And to many people are uses excuses to 'justify' abortion because in reality they dont want a child cause its to much of an inconvenience for them, I know some people cant take care of a baby cause of mental problems, health based etc. But if there isnt a good reason why not just have the baby and give it to adoption where it may have a better life rather than deny it life?

[The Joker]

I'm joining the military, thats a fairly stable job. And I dont plan on having a child so the what if my daughter thing isnt very relevant to me.

And to many people are uses excuses to 'justify' abortion because in reality they dont want a child cause its to much of an inconvenience for them, I know some people cant take care of a baby cause of mental problems, health based etc. But if there isnt a good reason why not just have the baby and give it to adoption where it may have a better life rather than deny it life?

It's an example. It might not apply to you, but it could apply to lots of other people.

What if the person was raped? Wouldn't that be VERY tramautic, having to give birth to a baby that was conceived in such a violent way?

[Church]

That would be one of the case by case circumstances that would be acceptable, just cause your stupid and didnt wear a condom isnt grounds for an abortion.

[The Joker]

Well, that's what I think too. You shouldn't just be able to get an abortion at the snap of a finger, you should actually be asked to give a reason.

[Church]

Thats why I think parental consent needs to step in, I'm sure theres a bunch of girls who got a abortion in their teen or early adult life and now regret it. A parent would have more knowledge and at that point in life would still know what would be best for you in the end.

[The Joker]

I really don't think that any teen girl should be a mother. If they don't want to get an abortion, that's fine, but if they do, there should be NOTHING stopping them from doing so.

[Church]

Well now it doesn't seem either one of are right or wrong, now its a matter of opinion. I'm conservative so this is the way I think.

[The Joker]

Well, can you explain your way of thinking? I can see you have given in.

[Church]

I havent given in to anything I just dont want a argument. But my logic is everyone deserves a chance at life, seems sort of a common sense thing to me.

[The Joker]

You don't want an argument? Then why did you post in ROTW?

[Perseus]

That would be one of the case by case circumstances that would be acceptable, just cause your stupid and didnt wear a condom isnt grounds for an abortion.
It's still "killing the fetus". What does it matter, mister abortion is wrong?
Well now it doesn't seem either one of are right or wrong, now its a matter of opinion. I'm conservative so this is the way I think.

So, you follow what every one in your party says? Way to think for yourself, dude. Just keep letting Fox News control your life.

[Jess]

How would you feel if your daughter was pregnant and she was like "Nvm gonna go get it killed."

I wouldn't want her to have the child if she was a minor, she should get an abortion if she really wants to

[PJay]

i haven't made my mind up about this. just because it is logical doesn't mean it is right / human. On the other hand i eat meat and i really like animals, so if i thought about that too much it might make me make a different decision, so maybe sometimes you have to use logic.
Dunno, but it was interesting reading TheJoker and LongJohn go at it.

we have a problem in the uk according to some program i saw where a lot of girls just get preggers so the government gives them a flat and stuff as a single mum. that doesn't seem right they should sponge like that, but what do you do, make the mums have abortions even if they don't want to? Really difficult subject imho.

[Jenna.]

I really don't think that any teen girl should be a mother. If they don't want to get an abortion, that's fine, but if they do, there should be NOTHING stopping them from doing so.

Agreed. No teenage girl is mature enough yet to be able to handle being a mother. I know for a fact I would get an abortion if I got pregnant now, and I shouldn't need my parent's consent to get one. They don't know what's best for me in this case, they would make the decision based on what they believe. (And they think that abortions are wrong, so where would that get me? Exactly.) It should be up to the girl that is pregnant.

[Rainstorm]

I havent given in to anything I just dont want a argument. But my logic is everyone deserves a chance at life, seems sort of a common sense thing to me.

Wait. So, you post in a Debate Forum where arguments happen, and don't want an argument? Uh....

So, putting the child in even more harms way by raising it below poverty, where crime will most likely influence their life is better then not putting the child through that suffering? Doesn't seem like common sense to me.

[Church]

You don't want an argument? Then why did you post in ROTW?

Well by argument I meant a personal one, one that really doesnt have to do with topic.

And I dont follow everything my party or Fox News says. My ideals I like fall under a conservative party.

Also if its "just killing a fetus" why should girls care if they have a miscarriage or get punched in stomach or something, apparently to you guys its just a bunch of cells or something.

[Rainstorm]

Well by argument I meant a personal one, one that really doesnt have to do with topic.

And I dont follow everything my party or Fox News says. My ideals I like fall under a conservative party.

Also if its "just killing a fetus" why should girls care if they have a miscarriage or get punched in stomach or something, apparently to you guys its just a bunch of cells or something.

They didn't CHOOSE to have the miscarriage. There's a difference.

[Church]

I know but people would consider that a dead baby not a bunch of dead cells etc, so why is that the case with abortion?

[Rainstorm]

I know but people would consider that a dead baby not a bunch of dead cells etc, so why is that the case with abortion?

An abortion takes place soon after a pregnancy begings, as late term ones would hurt the mom. The cells had yet to form a baby.



A miscarriage usually occurs while the baby is forming, due to complications. The cells had already begin to form the baby. It is usyally not a choice.

[Church]

You cant as a person say when a baby is a living life form cause even cells are living life forms.

[Rainstorm]

You cant as a person say when a baby is a living life form cause even cells are living life forms.

You can. When food, drink and air has begun to be given to the baby, when it developes a body, it's a child. Until then, its just cells. Millions die daily. Oh well.

[Church]

Right now your just a giant cluster fuck of cells. Cells are life to. I dont know how people cant think abortion is wrong like my mind just cant wrap around it.

[Rainstorm]

Right now your just a giant cluster fuck of cells. Cells are life to. I dont know how people cant think abortion is wrong like my mind just cant wrap around it.

When a hair falls out, that is hundreds of cells. Dead. Bye. And know what? No one cares, because a new hair WILL form with new cells.

Same with abortion. Maybe the girl wants to focus on school so she can provide for kids in the future. She goes to get an abortion.Those cells? Dead. And guess what? They were just like the hair. Cells. Formed nada yet. In a few years, the girl will be set and let the cells form a child. And they will. They wont just all die and not return.

[Church]

Abortion is just an easy fix for a problem, she should try her best to support it not just try to get rid of it. And if she cant really take care of it instead of kill it off why not put it up for adoption?

[Rainstorm]

Abortion is just an easy fix for a problem, she should try her best to support it not just try to get rid of it. And if she cant really take care of it instead of kill it off why not put it up for adoption?

The cells HADN'T formed a baby yet! They are sitting there. No baby. Nothing but cells. It's not like your killing a baby that has formed.

And adoption isnt all nicd and dandy either.

[Church]

I will never understand democrats.

[Amnesiac]

Abortion is just an easy fix for a problem, she should try her best to support it not just try to get rid of it. And if she cant really take care of it instead of kill it off why not put it up for adoption?

Why put another person into debt and possibly homelessness? Why put another child up for adoption?

I'm not saying women should abort whenever they feel like it, but if it's early in the pregnancy and the mother knows the life of this child won't be stable or healthy, why not abort? Remember what Bill Clinton said about abortion: safe, legal and RARE.

[Rainstorm]

I will never understand democrats.

This just shows you can't come up with a rebuttle.

[Church]

Thats the issue its not rare, people are gonna abuse to get an easy fix.

[Rainstorm]

Thats the issue its not rare, people are gonna abuse to get an easy fix.

Proof?

[Church]

I dont got any charts at my disposal but it will always happen where people will use the system for the wrong reasons, for example wealth fare is to help people through hard times, yet a lot of people rather not have a job so they stay on it.

[Rainstorm]

I dont got any charts at my disposal but it will always happen where people will use the system for the wrong reasons, for example wealth fare is to help people through hard times, yet a lot of people rather not have a job so they stay on it.

That is an if. There are ways to enforce this.

[Church]

Actually it may as well be a fact that someones gonna abuse the system, it always happens. People find loopholes etc.

Also it would be hard to enforce unless you actually looked at income etc to determine if it is a justified abortion and then people would probably complain about civil liberties or something.

[Amnesiac]

Actually it may as well be a fact that someones gonna abuse the system, it always happens. People find loopholes etc.

Every system gets abused by people. You say wee shouldn't allow regulated abortion because it'll be abused. Following that logic, that means we shouldn't allow any system to exist, because all of them will be abused.

People aren't perfect, that's why abortion exists in the first place.

[Rainstorm]

Actually it may as well be a fact that someones gonna abuse the system, it always happens. People find loopholes etc.

Also it would be hard to enforce unless you actually looked at income etc to determine if it is a justified abortion and then people would probably complain about civil liberties or something.

There will be someone like that. However, good honest people need it.

Enforcement? Parent approval, signature, And accompany you, with ID to prove they are the LEGAL parent/guardian.

If parents let children abuse the system, that goes to entireother debates

[Church]

Well I dont think abortion should be legal cept on a case by case basis. Not walk in get it done and leave like getting a tattoo.

Also that goes back to the topic of this debate Silent, if its regulated to a point where theres a good reason then its fine, but just cause you dont want to have a child cause its an inconvenience its bs

[dead]

How does all of this pertain to this thread? This as in the last page or two.

[Church]

The entire topic was suppose to be bout getitng parental permission to have a abortion and you listed that under part of regulations.

[Sith Lord 13]

I wasn't aware of this.
As parents can't have full access to your medical records after the age of 13, which is how free clinics can provide medical treatment to minors without informing their parents, why do they need to know?

It's for major medical procedures.

An abortion takes place soon after a pregnancy begings, as late term ones would hurt the mom. The cells had yet to form a baby.

You can seek an abortion during the ninth month.

I'm not saying women should abort whenever they feel like it, but if it's early in the pregnancy and the mother knows the life of this child won't be stable or healthy, why not abort? Remember what Bill Clinton said about abortion: safe, legal and RARE.

Who's to determine rare? Honestly, with the advent of Plan B contraceptive I feel the situations where an abortion are called for are so rare as to be almost non-existent. Perhaps a qualified medical ethics review board could be established to evaluate the few cases that may call for an abortion. (Also note, by definition of abortion, I'm referring to a situation where, if there is no doctor's interference, there is no reason to think the fetus will not develop completely. Ectopic pregnancy and other situations where the fetus is clearly non-viable would not be included.)

[Rainstorm]

You can seek an abortion during the ninth month.


Yes, I know you can. However, it is not nearly as common, and most of those abortions are saved for serious medical complications.

[Perseus]

Well by argument I meant a personal one, one that really doesnt have to do with topic.

And I dont follow everything my party or Fox News says. My ideals I like fall under a conservative party.

Also if its "just killing a fetus" why should girls care if they have a miscarriage or get punched in stomach or something, apparently to you guys its just a bunch of cells or something.

Maybe because they wanted to have a baby? C'mon now, don't be asinine. And a fetus is a bunch of cells. When abortions happen there isn't even a brain present. It has no life yet.

And you didn't answer my other question; oh, I will never understand republicans.

[Amnesiac]

Who's to determine rare? Honestly, with the advent of Plan B contraceptive I feel the situations where an abortion are called for are so rare as to be almost non-existent. Perhaps a qualified medical ethics review board could be established to evaluate the few cases that may call for an abortion. (Also note, by definition of abortion, I'm referring to a situation where, if there is no doctor's interference, there is no reason to think the fetus will not develop completely. Ectopic pregnancy and other situations where the fetus is clearly non-viable would not be included.)

I agree, maybe a medical board could be appointed. Abortion is an ugly procedure, and I do not believe it is something to be taken advantage of. It should only be used when absolutely necessary: as a result of rape, or if the child will be born into conditions that are unfavorable for a child's development. There are very few situations, as you said, where abortion is necessary for reasons other than the chances of the fetus surviving are low.

[Sith Lord 13]

Yes, I know you can. However, it is not nearly as common, and most of those abortions are saved for serious medical complications.

No, they're used if the mother suddenly decides she just wants an abortion for any reason. No medical necessity required.

And a fetus is a bunch of cells.

So are you. So is every human being in any stage of life, from the first cellular division, until death. Does that mean it's OK to kill you or anyone else?

When abortions happen there isn't even a brain present.

Only sometimes true. An abortion can be given at any time, even when the fetus has reached the point at which they can survive outside the womb.

It has no life yet.

That's a highly contested point of disagreement, not fact. However, according to the English language:
the quality that distinguishes a vital and functional being from a dead body
a fetus is alive.

[Perseus]

No, they're used if the mother suddenly decides she just wants an abortion for any reason. No medical necessity required.



So are you. So is every human being in any stage of life, from the first cellular division, until death. Does that mean it's OK to kill you or anyone else?



Only sometimes true. An abortion can be given at any time, even when the fetus has reached the point at which they can survive outside the womb.



That's a highly contested point of disagreement, not fact. However, according to the English language:

a fetus is alive.

A fetus does not have a central nervous system when it is legally possible to get an abortion. I forgot all of what I was going to say, so this will do for now.

[Sith Lord 13]

A fetus does not have a central nervous system when it is legally possible to get an abortion. I forgot all of what I was going to say, so this will do for now.

Not true. You can get an abortion up until the baby is born.

[Perseus]

Not true. You can get an abortion up until the baby is born.

Not legally, though.

[Sith Lord 13]

Not legally, though.

Actually, yes legally, at least in the US.

[Perseus]

Actually, yes legally, at least in the US.

I'm pretty sure you are incorrect.

[dead]

I'm pretty sure you are incorrect.

It depends on the state, but most places have restrictions.

[jason93]

should a girl be required to get her parents' permission to get an abortion?


I don't think she should. In the end, it's her choice and after all, it's her body. maybe her parents could try to persuade her not to do an abortion, if they don't like it, but they SHOULD respect her choiceI think it her own body and a parent should not be able to force a daughter to have a baby.

If they do force her because of law, then I think the parent should be forced to be financial responsible for the baby until the baby grows to 18 year old.

[Sith Lord 13]

I'm pretty sure you are incorrect.

It depends on the state, but most places have restrictions.

Federally, it is legal to have an abortion at any point, just so long as it is not partial-birth.

In 38 states, there are currently restrictions on when abortions may be performed. In the rest, abortions may be performed until the day of birth.

Of those 38 states, not a single one has the limit at or before the development of a brain, neural network, nervous system, or the capacity to feel pain.

Source (http://www.guttmacher.org/statecenter/spibs/spib_PLTA.pdf)

[Perseus]

Federally, it is legal to have an abortion at any point, just so long as it is not partial-birth.

In 38 states, there are currently restrictions on when abortions may be performed. In the rest, abortions may be performed until the day of birth.

Of those 38 states, not a single one has the limit at or before the development of a brain, neural network, nervous system, or the capacity to feel pain.

Source (http://www.guttmacher.org/statecenter/spibs/spib_PLTA.pdf)

Well, Goddamn; that is just messed up.

[Paladino]

I dont think girls should need parental consent for abortion because its there body and there child and they have te right to decide what to do with it.

[Jess]

I think it her own body and a parent should not be able to force a daughter to have a baby.

If they do force her because of law, then I think the parent should be forced to be financial responsible for the baby until the baby grows to 18 year old.

yes you're right. they should be financially responsible...

[ShyGuyInChicago]

yes you're right. they should be financially responsible...

What if the girl gives the baby up for adoption?