That's why I'm an atheist

[MattHolyman41]

Well, as a result of not-so-lucky coincidence I have to study at a religious school, where I am just because of languages. I don't like it... It's like brain washing... Every week I have to sit and listen to the things I don't like.

I don't want to offend anyone who believes in God, but why should I believe and pray for some big "something", called God, who has obviously triple personality, has come to Earth, died bleeding on a crucifix, went to a 3-day trip to hell, then came back on Earth, created a religion, and then flew away, leaving us to hope that he'll come back someday... ??????

If He is the creator of everything then who created him? :D

Well... I think that Jesus did really exist... and he was a smart guy. He knew how talk to people. He knew that the only way how to gather nations, invaded by vast Roman Empire to stand against their tormentors... although he tried to do it in peaceful way. So he created a religion, through which he could make people behave in the right way and obey some rules.


If he hadn't done this, people would have most likely eaten each other or rushed into an armed uprising, thus being decimated by powerful Romans. Then his peaceful mission began to bother some people and he knew they're gonna try to get rid of him. So afterwards he was crucified. People knew he was special and remembered him as a good person, so they added another chapter into a huge fairytale in which they mentioned his good acts, which made him look "godlike".

This is just one of those things that make me think that religions were made only to handle stupid people. So if someone didn't respect the rules he was punished or at least told that he's gonna burn in Hell for that.

And those so called "souls"... I was often told:"Only through Christ you will achieve eternal life..." Um... what is eternal life? Is it that your gonna fly out of your dead body as a ghost and teleport into a cloudy, shiny dimension called Heaven, where you'll be treated in good way and you'll drink coconut juice with strawberries every day? And if you don't get "eternal life" your soul will teleport into Hell (located probably underground) where you will roast for eternity and Satan will doggystyle you into ass.

Okay... whatever you think, I think that your inner being is your consciousness, the little pulses between neurons in your brain (which we have pretty big thanks to evolution).And all your personality is based on those tiny little DNA chains. And if you die... then you'll die... your brain just stops working... like an old computer. You will become just a pile of decaying flesh and bones. Well, some people may see a white tunnel, but that's probably just a hallucination, caused by your brain shutting down.

So I guess I'm not afraid of death (that's not concerning the way I die. I don't wanna die by horrific death :D). Why should I be afraid of death? I've been "dead" for billions of years long before I was born.

There's another interesting thing called suggestion. It's very powerful, because if you, for example, honestly wish to cure from some sickness, your body will react that way and you will get better. Well somehow that's working on other things... for example if you really wish for something to happen... there's still some 0.00000001% chance that it would happen, but anyways I call this a coincidence, which is in my opinion not caused by praying to some deity.

Even as a little kid I was interested in science of universe... It feels much better for me to believe that the entire 30billion light years (and far more) wide universe just created itself in the Big Bang in the never-ending cycle of natural birth and death. I find it much more logical not to consider life in space as God's creation. It's been proved that in rare chemical consistence of elements and good conditions, such as temperature, oxygen and water, carbon-hydrogen molecules begin to create chains of molecules, giving birth to life as organic matter itself.

I know life is very rare thing in cosmos. But even if there was so tiny chance that not only percentage could show it, the universe is so damn huge that this little tiny chance is multiplied by how many planets there are out there. So I strongly believe that there are loads of alien life out there. Although it's mostly just some organic slug deep in toxic puddles on some wasteland planet.

I think this huge opinion of mine will demonstrate how sure I am about things.
So I guess that's all I can tell you about my beliefs. I would like to ask you to reply to this post telling what you think about my opinion. And if you think it's not like that, then try to give me some facts to persuade me :D.

[ThatDude93]

Well, as a result of not-so-lucky coincidence I have to study at a religious school, where I am just because of languages. I don't like it... It's like brain washing... Every week I have to sit and listen to the things I don't like.

I don't want to offend anyone who believes in God, but why should I believe and pray for some big "something", called God, who has obviously triple personality, has come to Earth, died bleeding on a crucifix, went to a 3-day trip to hell, then came back on Earth, created a religion, and then flew away, leaving us to hope that he'll come back someday... ??????

If He is the creator of everything then who created him? :D

Well... I think that Jesus did really exist... and he was a smart guy. He knew how talk to people. He knew that the only way how to gather nations, invaded by vast Roman Empire to stand against their tormentors... although he tried to do it in peaceful way. So he created a religion, through which he could make people behave in the right way and obey some rules.


If he hadn't done this, people would have most likely eaten each other or rushed into an armed uprising, thus being decimated by powerful Romans. Then his peaceful mission began to bother some people and he knew they're gonna try to get rid of him. So afterwards he was crucified. People knew he was special and remembered him as a good person, so they added another chapter into a huge fairytale in which they mentioned his good acts, which made him look "godlike".

This is just one of those things that make me think that religions were made only to handle stupid people. So if someone didn't respect the rules he was punished or at least told that he's gonna burn in Hell for that.

And those so called "souls"... I was often told:"Only through Christ you will achieve eternal life..." Um... what is eternal life? Is it that your gonna fly out of your dead body as a ghost and teleport into a cloudy, shiny dimension called Heaven, where you'll be treated in good way and you'll drink coconut juice with strawberries every day? And if you don't get "eternal life" your soul will teleport into Hell (located probably underground) where you will roast for eternity and Satan will doggystyle you into ass.

Okay... whatever you think, I think that your inner being is your consciousness, the little pulses between neurons in your brain (which we have pretty big thanks to evolution).And all your personality is based on those tiny little DNA chains. And if you die... then you'll die... your brain just stops working... like an old computer. You will become just a pile of decaying flesh and bones. Well, some people may see a white tunnel, but that's probably just a hallucination, caused by your brain shutting down.

So I guess I'm not afraid of death (that's not concerning the way I die. I don't wanna die by horrific death :D). Why should I be afraid of death? I've been "dead" for billions of years long before I was born.

There's another interesting thing called suggestion. It's very powerful, because if you, for example, honestly wish to cure from some sickness, your body will react that way and you will get better. Well somehow that's working on other things... for example if you really wish for something to happen... there's still some 0.00000001% chance that it would happen, but anyways I call this a coincidence, which is in my opinion not caused by praying to some deity.

Even as a little kid I was interested in science of universe... It feels much better for me to believe that the entire 30billion light years (and far more) wide universe just created itself in the Big Bang in the never-ending cycle of natural birth and death. I find it much more logical not to consider life in space as God's creation. It's been proved that in rare chemical consistence of elements and good conditions, such as temperature, oxygen and water, carbon-hydrogen molecules begin to create chains of molecules, giving birth to life as organic matter itself.

I know life is very rare thing in cosmos. But even if there was so tiny chance that not only percentage could show it, the universe is so damn huge that this little tiny chance is multiplied by how many planets there are out there. So I strongly believe that there are loads of alien life out there. Although it's mostly just some organic slug deep in toxic puddles on some wasteland planet.

I think this huge opinion of mine will demonstrate how sure I am about things.
So I guess that's all I can tell you about my beliefs. I would like to ask you to reply to this post telling what you think about my opinion. And if you think it's not like that, then try to give me some facts to persuade me :D.


Well mainly what I have to say is....I don't believe something can come from nothing...so I don't see how there can just be nothing...then..BANG...sutff starts to form...It just makes more sense to me that there was a creator there to start it all. I love science and stuff too...but that just makes more sense to me.

As far as alien life...I think there has to be some sort of life out there...why have all those planets and other galaxies...with nothing on there but rocks and such....

Evolution....my belief on that is that the Earth is as old as science is telling us.....there is nothing out there saying that that is wrong.....nothing in the bible says that those "days" were the same as our modern day...who's to say they weren't thousands af years.....it also never said that the Universe created was Earth like it is now. I believe that God and the "powers of nature" are all the same....in other words...that rare thing you said where something can come from nothing....that is probably how God did it....

That is my opinion on your opinion :)

[Jove]

Well mainly what I have to say is....I don't believe something can come from nothing...so I don't see how there can just be nothing...then..BANG...sutff starts to form...It just makes more sense to me that there was a creator there to start it all. I love science and stuff too...but that just makes more sense to me.

As far as alien life...I think there has to be some sort of life out there...why have all those planets and other galaxies...with nothing on there but rocks and such....

Evolution....my belief on that is that the Earth is as old as science is telling us.....there is nothing out there saying that that is wrong.....nothing in the bible says that those "days" were the same as our modern day...who's to say they weren't thousands af years.....it also never said that the Universe created was Earth like it is now. I believe that God and the "powers of nature" are all the same....in other words...that rare thing you said where something can come from nothing....that is probably how God did it....

That is my opinion on your opinion :)

That leaves way too many plotholes in the creation of the universe.

[Sage]

It just makes more sense to me that there was a creator there to start it all.

If one can claim that God does not require a beginning, then it's only fair to claim that the universe does not require a beginning. They're equally valid, whether beyond our comprehension or not.

[Jove]

If one can claim that God does not require a beginning, then it's only fair to claim that the universe does not require a beginning. They're equally valid, whether beyond our comprehension or not.

Proclaiming things as facts that we can't prove just because the other side does it is not valid. We don't know. We probably will never know. Therefore it's an area we know nothing about and that's it. You cannot make assumptions "just because"

[Antares]

To the jwb guy, you our level of technology doesn't allow us to research far enough to see when the universe was formed, the reason why there is no center.
Like im getting confused just thinking about it...basically the point is, I am sure there are many many answers out there, we just aren't developed enough to find them out.

So creationism...still holds some blanks while science...makes progress but it is a slower progress but eventually things will be proven and new theories will ridse.

[Hyper]

I'm sorry but you just made me *facepalm* with this paragraph:
'' I don't want to offend anyone who believes in God, but why should I believe and pray for some big "something", called God, who has obviously triple personality, has come to Earth, died bleeding on a crucifix, went to a 3-day trip to hell, then came back on Earth, created a religion, and then flew away, leaving us to hope that he'll come back someday... ?????? ''

If you go to a religious school and have taken it as a personal choice not to share their views.. At least clean out your ears and find out wtf those views, beliefs really are.

[ThatDude93]

I understand there are things we will never know. The creation of the world is something we will never know.....I believe faith is filling up the blanks in what we don't know. Faith is having hope that what I believe in is true. I believe in what I believe in because to me, it makes sense. It makes more sense than the theories of science. Is there any way to prove it....no...but I have faith.

[Jove]

I understand there are things we will never know. The creation of the world is something we will never know.....I believe faith is filling up the blanks in what we don't know. Faith is having hope that what I believe in is true. I believe in what I believe in because to me, it makes sense. It makes more sense than the theories of science. Is there any way to prove it....no...but I have faith.

How can you so arbitrarily decide what is and what is not true based on "faith".

[ThatDude93]

I never said I am positive it is true...but like i said...I have faith in it....it could be false.....we have no way of knowing....but like I said I have faith because that is just what I believe in...it makes sense to me

[Sage]

I believe faith is filling up the blanks in what we don't know.

I'd rather have the answer than an answer. (Though that's probably a bit honest, I don't care either way.)

[ThatDude93]

well your not gonna get "the absolute truth", when there is no way of knowing. Science doesn't give you "the answer" either....lol

[Jove]

well your not gonna get "the absolute truth", when there is no way of knowing. Science doesn't give you "the answer" either....lol

The difference is that scientists work every day in order to find the answer. The LHC for example is critical in our understanding of the Big Bang.

[ThatDude93]

Well the scientists can work all they want, and I thank them fo rthere work. Science is one of my favorite subjects But who is to say that God couldn't have caused the big bang?

[Kahn]

There was something before us obviously or else there would be no way that we would exist. I mean the big bang theory. Something must have happened before us. There had to be some sort of Universe something, I don't know what but something.

Anyways as for God and Jesus. We will never know for sure. Like you said there is always that one chance and if you have ever read the bible there is plausible evidence that suggests Jesus actually did some of the stuff that is recorded. Did you read the bible? I did out of pure interest.

Anyway. Jesus was in face real. He did not do this though to stomp on the Roman Empire. He did it because it was his ideal. He was the most influential person in history by far. No one can compare. After his death, 2000 some years later he is still influencing people with his teachings.

I know that you are not trying to say, "Lets take away religion because it's ignorant" or anything but that will never happen. Religion gives people hope, which gives people something to live for. We just need to get over it and go with the flow.

In my opinion there is no point to being Atheist but at the same time no point in organized religion. We should take his teachings and individually learn what we want from them. If some people like you perhaps decide not to use them, then thats fine. But some people will use them in everyday life. Just what people take from his words is what counts.

There is no reason for Atheism. Sorry dude.

[deadpie]

It's called the big bang theory for reason. It's always theories after theories. But religion is just all succumbed down to faith, not science. It's how much you could put your hospitality into the philosophy of a religion. And it's weird of me saying that because I'm an atheist, but I'm just saying. Even though i don't know what the hell I'm saying now again.

[Jove]

Well the scientists can work all they want, and I thank them fo rthere work. Science is one of my favorite subjects But who is to say that God couldn't have caused the big bang?

surely you aren't giving more credibility to the side that doesn't constantly refine it's understanding of the world and isn't based on something other than a book.

It's called the big bang theory for reason. It's always theories after theories..

I hope you realise what the definition of a theory is in a scientific context.

[Mental]

Well the scientists can work all they want, and I thank them fo rthere work. Science is one of my favorite subjects But who is to say that God couldn't have caused the big bang?
Which "God" would we be talking about, here? The Judeo-Christian God? The Islamic God (Allah)? Zeus? One of the other hundreds of God's?

Being agnostic, I don't completely discard the idea of a creator, whether it's some kind of being or force, but why would anyone be convinced that the creator is their God, when there's literally thousands of different beliefs in who God is?

[Jove]

Which "God" would we be talking about, here? The Judeo-Christian God? The Islamic God (Allah)? Zeus? One of the other hundreds of God's?

Being agnostic, I don't completely discard the idea of a creator, whether it's some kind of being or force, but why would anyone be convinced that the creator is their God, when there's literally thousands of different beliefs in who God is?

That's another thing that I've noticed aswell, It seems that all the gods can't agree on who created what :P

[TheTruth]

O i love this topic :)

Personnally i don't believe in God, however i do believe in something, dont know what it is. Could be hope as in looking up to the sky and saying thank you for getting something i never thought i'd get or whether it's just something to cast the blame on i.e. looking up to the sky and saying Damn you because something went wrong. Suppose it's just a way of me talking to myself.

As for alien life and evolution, I believe there is life out there. If the scientific theory of the Big Bang is correct then surely the Big Bang could happen elsewhere in the universe, Or maybe we were created by another form of life. Like test subjects where they create a tiny organism put it on a planet and see what happens i.e. us. Or the whole universe could be an illusion, a lie and what scientists see through a telescope is false.

There are millions and millions of possible explanations to humans but i think religions were created through opinions. For example lets say there was a man who gave himself the title 'Jesus' who then made a set of rules for people to follow. But someone decided to change these and so another religion was created based on the same idea of a higher power. Do you see what i'm saying? lol! Religions are just an idea to give people hope and cloud their judgement on reality. Like blinding them.

[MattHolyman41]

I'm sorry but you just made me *facepalm* with this paragraph:
'' I don't want to offend anyone who believes in God, but why should I believe and pray for some big "something", called God, who has obviously triple personality, has come to Earth, died bleeding on a crucifix, went to a 3-day trip to hell, then came back on Earth, created a religion, and then flew away, leaving us to hope that he'll come back someday... ?????? ''

If you go to a religious school and have taken it as a personal choice not to share their views.. At least clean out your ears and find out wtf those views, beliefs really are.

Well, it was not my choice to go on that school. I wouldn't go there because of my beliefs. My parents forced me to. I hate it!

I didn't mean to say that universe was created in my way. It's just that there are so many theories... There might have been a deity or it might have been just one of endless cycles of so called pulsating universe which means: Big Bang, Universe, Collapse and then all over again for billions and billions of years. Well, this whole creation theory is beyond our understanding. And it's quite true that our science is just too underdeveloped to see further. I just don't think about that because we might never know what has truly happened.

What I don't really like is that people claim that the entire Bible truly happened. Those people, mentioned in the Bible, might have existed, some of that might have been true. But I can't believe that God created Adam and then Eve from his rib, that Moses magically opened path through the Red Sea for Isreaeli nation, that Jesus could walk on water and that he was ressurected (He was very important indeed, he created a true religion, that lasted 2000 years. But all this stuff about waterwalking, magic and ressurection is just a fairytale, which was added there to impress people.)

And what I really really hate are those people, who brainwash everyone and twist and corrupt the former teachings of Jesus. If there was only one christian religion... but there's plenty of them... everyone makes the Bible in their own way! What the hell is that supposed to be?! These guys teach other people sick things. They make children so sickly addicted to it... as you can see in this video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2STDH14aJVk&feature=related

[INFERNO]

Well the scientists can work all they want, and I thank them fo rthere work. Science is one of my favorite subjects But who is to say that God couldn't have caused the big bang?

You can say that god, regardless of which one, caused the big bang, however, that's not technically science, it's theistic science (i.e. theistic evolution). Science and religion have different paradigms, in other words, different means to obtain information and they're not equivalent. When they're not equivalent, it results in what is said from one doesn't have much meaning in the other no matter how much you may think it does.

The other problem is that it ends up distorting the beliefs of both science and religion. Suppose the god is the god in Christianity because it seems to be a common one to use. Is there any evidence in the bible or scriptures saying that god did the big bang? No, it says he made the universe and you know the rest of the story. Does science say a being of some form caused the big bang? No. As a result, when you twist one for this, you twist the other and so the result is some mess. The problem occurs when you try to return to religion or science as a means to provide evidence for your mess. Doesn't work.

You can have faith in theistic science all you want, however, the bottom line is, you cant use evidence from science or religion to support your view, at least not in a way that makes the mess even messier.

well your not gonna get "the absolute truth", when there is no way of knowing. Science doesn't give you "the answer" either....lol

True, science won't give a "true answer", however, it accepts it can be wrong and reformulates its views based on new studies, technological abilities, etc... . Religion cant do so; it's basically a statement saying "X god did this because of this". Perhaps it is correct, perhaps it isn't. Science though works to constantly refine itself. Is it possible it's wrong? Of course. Does it have evidence to support what it says in a way that does not involve inference on subjective literature and having personal experiences? Certainly.

[Whisper]

M theory

[INFERNO]

M theory

What and how does M-theory relate to in this debate? :confused:

[Whisper]

It relates a great deal to the big bang, what caused it, why, etc....

[ThatDude93]

Which "God" would we be talking about, here? The Judeo-Christian God? The Islamic God (Allah)? Zeus? One of the other hundreds of God's?

Being agnostic, I don't completely discard the idea of a creator, whether it's some kind of being or force, but why would anyone be convinced that the creator is their God, when there's literally thousands of different beliefs in who God is?

I believe all the "Gods and Goddesses" are the Judeo-Christian God...just viewed differently.




True, science won't give a "true answer", however, it accepts it can be wrong and reformulates its views based on new studies, technological abilities, etc... . Religion cant do so; it's basically a statement saying "X god did this because of this". Perhaps it is correct, perhaps it isn't. Science though works to constantly refine itself. Is it possible it's wrong? Of course. Does it have evidence to support what it says in a way that does not involve inference on subjective literature and having personal experiences? Certainly.

Nothing will give a true absolute answer....yes religion says "something did sometimes because of something"...but so does science...and yeah science could be right...but they are theories....even if they are right that doesn't prove there is no God....Science can never prove there is no God..it can't prove there is a God either...as I hve said it is a matter of faith.

[ThatDude93]

urgh...double posted again

[xdeviancex]

I'm sorry, but atheism is not going to reach many people on here. From personal experience, when I was a christian in my early teenage years, I was very ignorant to any claims against my own beliefs. I was a closet atheist though.

Christians are christians because:
1. Their fear of burning for a eternity in hell.
2. Everyone has a crevice inside their mentality, that is empty without a belief, nobody can accept they'll die alone, so they fill that crevice with false hope.

Didya know, that 45% of Americans classify themselves as creationists? That's absurd, people are too cooped up on religious delusions, while theres expansive amounts of evidence of evolution all around them. Ignorance at it's finest.

As my own testimony, I was brought up in a Christian family, and I was a proud Christian for the longest time. Up until 15, I became more and more agnostic, I just believed in God for the sake of my soul. The soul is a popular european-founded delusion, it's apart of our culture that there is a "soul". I was scared for myself. I prayed for the God that was never there. And eventually at 16, I declared myself as Agnostic officially. 16 through 17 I became more atheistic and became more of a humanitarian. I did whatever for the sake of humanity, not in the arrogance of my "after-life". Now, I'm a Buddhist. I may believe in reincarnation despite it sounding like a contradiction to everything I just mentioned. But it is actually a theory that is supported in some ways with evidence throughout quantum physics. Modern Buddhism is very atheistic, it has no omnipotent being that reigns upon the physical realm and our personal lives. I love my life, and I'm finally free and happily without a false God who never answered my pleas. Wish my family would understand that. It's not pessimism, it's being realistic.

[FTLOLZ]

Well The idea of adam and eve is insane. God makes man and woman. E.G. Father, son, daughter.
A&E eat the bad fruit.
Children do something they're not supposed too.
Punishment.
KICKED OUT OF THE GARDEN, GIVEN SUFFERING AND NO ONE ELSE CAN COME BACK TO THE GARDEN EITHER!????
That's like saying that because your child did something bad, your next child will have to pay for it as well...?
Yeah sorry bit of a rant there just kinda wanted to make a point

[CaptainObvious]

Let's let old threads lie.

:locked: