My anti-religion argument (not meant to be offensive, feel free to prove me wrong)

[Apparitions]

OK I copied and pasted this from a post on Facebook that I posted on an Anti-religion group's discussion board
*Warning this might be a bit long*
OK, I'm an Atheist and here's why I think Religious people are blind sheep: Religious people only believe in God and bring up those quotes (I changed this) from the Bible because of one thing: religion cannot be disproved by Atheists. I know it has been said before but there is no way for us Atheists to disprove the existence of a 'God' or multiple 'Gods'. We can only argue and explain why we think there is not Supreme Being. Of course, we can reverse this and say there is no way to disprove the theory that there is no God(s) Instead I find this argument is more effective: The claim of the existence of a God cannot be disproved. But what if I was to take an example of the religion of the Flying Spaghetti Monster amongst many of these fake religions and say that it exists. Can you disprove that? I'd like to see you try. If you can say this for the belief in a man sitting on a cloud in the sky somewhere that sends us to hell or heaven then why can't I claim that the FSM exists and is among us like God is supposed to be according to the various religions that people believe in? I mean, The Church of The FSM even has a holy book and 10 commandments (they prefer to call them the 10 we'd really rather you didn't s)! Can you disprove it then religious people? Where is your proof that it doesn't exist. Of course, the 'religion' is stupid but the fact still remains that Atheists and other religious people can't disprove it. Do you understand the situation Atheists have now, religious people? So just bringing up the tired old argument that 'there is more proof in a God than there is that there isn't a God' is annoying(I changed it so people would shut up) as proof has to be 100% concrete evidence in something. Your so-called 'proof' is not 100% concrete. It is not proof, it is just a theory. Also there is no use quoting Bible text to Atheists in the same way that there is no use using a teapot made from chocolate. Nothing will happen. What do you think is going to happen? Do you want us to jump from our chairs and say "OMG this is the proof I needed that there is a God! Now I'm going to waste my Sunday morning in a religious place being bullshitted to by an old Priest (or other leader of worship) about some God and start singing happy-clappy songs with my religious brothers and shit about Moses and Jesus and stuff! Thank you <insert name of religious person who gave them the Bible reference here> for showing me Revelations 3:1-14! Somehow I don't think so. BTW I don't really know what happens at Revelations 3:1-14. I'm sure it is a very entertaining fictional story that can give some enjoyment from such great fiction. Anyway please try to prove me wrong. But remember what proof is before you do. Also don't quote any Bible/Qur’an/Torah/all the other books references to me for the reason I said above. Have fun!

Like I said, feel free to prove me wrong :)

EDIT: If you think it could be paragraphed better could a mod please edit it? Thanks. I got rid of the Irish paedo bit as it could be offensive and I know that there is already a topic on religion but I wanted my argument to have its own thread.

[Kahn]

If you want to rip out some of the last things people have that is theirs, then you are sick. The way you put this is, you think that an Athiest is higher than a religious person in , intelligence, morale, and soul. Which is sad really because an Athiest is the one who believes in not going to any where holy when death finally comes to them.

And the reason people "bring up preachy quotes from the bible", is not to attack Athiests and make sure they cannot disprove god, but it is of they're teachings and they're beliefs.

In the middle ages, famine, disease, and depression raged across Europe. In fact they're was also corruption in some church too. Anyway, the feudal system forced religion on communities and that is why you see a strong influence of religion on most countries in Europe. The reason the community accepted religion so much was because of the lack of life they had, and if they went to a good afterlife it would be worth the first life. They were desperate, devoted they're lives to the church and obviously felt good and well and were content with they're decision.

Some of the worlds greatest leaders were influenced by religion. Some of the United States Fathers (Men who signed the Constitution and fought for America) were Free mason. To be a Free mason it means too believe in a higher being. Now if they weren't Free mason, do you think the course of this country could've changed. Religion like I said has influenced some of the greatest minds on Earth.

Now I am Agnostic but I thought I should defend religion in this debate because you completely insulted and were rude to peoples beliefs.

[Death]

If you want to rip out some of the last things people have that is theirs, then you are sick.

This is ROTW, remember. Besides, people don't have a religion in a physical sense.

The way you put this is, you think that an Athiest is higher than a religious person in , intelligence, morale, and soul.

Actually, an atheist will not believe in a 'soul', unless I'm very much mistaken.

And the reason people "bring up preachy quotes from the bible", is not to attack Athiests and make sure they cannot disprove god, but it is of they're teachings and they're beliefs.

And they can't keep them to themselves?

The reason the community accepted religion so much was because of the lack of life they had, and if they went to a good afterlife it would be worth the first life. They were desperate, devoted they're lives to the church and obviously felt good and well and were content with they're decision.

So they welcomed religion, not because they could see any evidencee for it, but simply because it was like a painkiller? Makes sense I suppose.

I spit on what you said,

Well that's certainly nice to do in a debate. I won't 'spit' on your words however, because I know better.

[Sapphire]

Your assertion that atheists are better in a moral sense than those who follow a religion is grossly misguided.

Mother Teresa was religious and one of the most morally upstanding human beings of recent times.
Ghandi had strong morals, he taught these morals and he practiced them. Another example of a morally upstanding human being who followed a religion.
Martin Luther King was another such person.

All three of these people were prominent religious figures and had strong senses of morality.
If atheists are so superior to religious people, where are the atheists who have managed to outshine these three?

[Kahn]

This is ROTW, remember. Besides, people don't have a religion in a physical sense.
I agree with you on this part, but it is an important part to people's ideals and mind and it kind of creates a certain personality or adds to they're personality.

Actually, an atheist will not believe in a 'soul', unless I'm very much mistaken.

Sounded like it to me.

And they can't keep them to themselves?

Why should they? Is there a law? Because I am certain in the Bill of Rights it states that people have the freedom of religion.

So they welcomed religion, not because they could see any evidencee for it, but simply because it was like a painkiller? Makes sense I suppose.

Hm..? I don't get this please explain.

Well that's certainly nice to do in a debate. I won't 'spit' on your words however, because I know better.

I will revise.

[Death]

I agree with you on this part, but it is an important part to people's ideals and mind and it kind of creates a certain personality or adds to they're personality.

Suppose that's true enough.

Sounded like it to me.

But why would an atheist believe in something which you can't prove exists? Surely that's why they don't believe in God?

Why should they? Is there a law? Because I am certain in the Bill of Rights it states that people have the freedom of religion.

Well, I suppose it depends on how they're doing it. If they are sharing their beliefs with friends or in a church, I see you point but what I dissaprove of are what I'd call street preachers. Had I have wanted religion thrust upon me, I would have gone to church.

Hm..? I don't get this please explain.

What I mean is that the way you said it made is sound like the people believed in God only because it gave them comfort and made losing relatives less upsetting.

[Sapphire]

What I mean is that the way you said it made is sound like the people believed in God only because it gave them comfort and made losing relatives less upsetting.
In the past, religion served clear purposes and one of these would have been to give the people a sense of security as they are, by nature, scared of the unknown.

[Kahn]

What I mean is that the way you said it made is sound like the people believed in God only because it gave them comfort and made losing relatives less upsetting.

That is what I am saying. Many people believe in a higher place because it is comforting, and actually some people even look forward to an After life. Many Egyptian Pharos started building they're stairway to heaven (Pyramids) as they took the throne so they had a safe (Not really) and permanent spot at which they will be undisturbed.

But why would an atheist believe in something which you can't prove exists? Surely that's why they don't believe in God?

I guess you've got me in checkmate there.

Well, I suppose it depends on how they're doing it. If they are sharing their beliefs with friends or in a church, I see you point but what I dissaprove of are what I'd call street preachers. Had I have wanted religion thrust upon me, I would have gone to church.

Choose to listen if you must but as I said. Freedom of Religion. They have the power to do what they want. You have the power to do what you want.

[Apparitions]

I don't think I directly said that Atheists are better in a moral sense. If so then I regret this as this is not the point I was trying to put across. What I was meaning to say is that some religious people always bring up the argument that there is more proof that there is a God than there is that there isn't one and I think they say that it cannot be disproved that there is a God. I was saying that as an example I could join the Church of the FSM (I used it as it makes me laugh ;)) and say that you cannot disprove that there is no God called the Flying Spaghetti monster. This is my real point, not anything that is supposed to make me look 'sick' or whatever. And as for someone's point that many good people are religious I agree with this a lot and add that there are many religious people of a better moral sense as Sapphire called it than Atheists and Agnostics. But I also think that there are bad people that are religious. This is a fact of humanity, it make us unique that we can have contrasts like these in different groups of people. Of course, there are many Atheists and Agnostics that are good and well respected people (Thomas Jefferson and Dawkins are a couple of examples) and have a what could be seen as a better moral sense than religious people. On the other side of the coin there are many bad Atheists, Stalin (I think) being an example. There would be with 6 billion people on this planet. So if you thought that because of what I said I am sick then I apologise but say that that was nothing like what I intended to be thought of. Anyway, can people ignore those bits and focus on my main point please?

BTW I've never posted things this long before. I don't like posting long stuff as it hurts my eyes...

[Death]

That is what I am saying. Many people believe in a higher place because it is comforting, and actually some people even look forward to an After life. Many Egyptian Pharos started building they're stairway to heaven (Pyramids) as they took the throne so they had a safe (Not really) and permanent spot at which they will be undisturbed.

I suppose that's fair enough, but personally, I'd want proof, which this would lack.

Choose to listen if you must but as I said. Freedom of Religion. They have the power to do what they want. You have the power to do what you want.

I agree that people should have freedom of religion, but if people started telling people what to believe in the streets, all sorts of arguments could start and that would be chaos. I don't mind religious people, and you should have the right to be religious or anti-religious, but I would mind it if someone tried to force me to become religious, just like they would probably mind if I tried to force them to become an atheist. Obviously, I believe that debate is different to forcing.

[Sage]

Science needs faith just as much as religion needs evidence.

[Apparitions]

Just so you people know I found the bit where I said the 'sick' thing and got rid of it. I shouldn't have implied that as it is not true. I didn't realise that I directly said it as I didn't mean to. So sorry if you were offended :(. I feel like an idiot now for not seeing that.

[Sapphire]

You need faith to follow a religion because it can't be proved or disproved.
Is simply having faith stupid or blind? No.
Is maintaining your faith in the face of undeniable and contradictory evidence stupid or blind? Yes.

To write off all religious people as stupid/blind on the pure basis that they have faith is, in fact, stupid and blind.

[Apparitions]

You need faith to follow a religion because it can't be proved or disproved.
Is simply having faith stupid or blind? No.
Is maintaining your faith in the face of undeniable and contradictory evidence stupid or blind? Yes.

To write off all religious people as stupid/blind on the pure basis that they have faith is, in fact, stupid and blind.
I said sorry! What more do you want me to do, covert back to Christianity and repent or something?

[Sapphire]

I said sorry! What more do you want me to do, covert back to Christianity and repent or something?
No, I don't want you to convert to any religion.

But your point is still that it is stupid to believe in something if you don't have proof (whether you explicitly say the word "stupid" or not).
The other point you are trying to make in your post is redundant because you are asking people to prove something (the existence of a God/number of Gods) that can't be proved or disproved.

[Kahn]

What more do you want me to do, covert back to Christianity and repent or something?

May be a joke... I still find it rude.

[Jean Poutine]

Who cares seriously?

If some guy believes in a silly man in the sky that birthed a baby in the womb of a virgin woman, what exactly does it mean to you? Why do you care?

Not only is religion completely useless to debate because in the end it's a personal choice and nothing else, but it's also a dick move to try to deprieve believers from something that gives them comfort in the unknown.

While I'm at it I'm going to swipe your lucky pair of boxers and pretend I did it in the name of science.

[Kahn]

Who cares seriously?

If some guy believes in a silly man in the sky that birthed a baby in the womb of a virgin woman, what exactly does it mean to you? Why do you care?

Not only is religion completely useless to debate because in the end it's a personal choice and nothing else, but it's also a dick move to try to deprieve believers from something that gives them comfort in the unknown.

While I'm at it I'm going to swipe your lucky pair of boxers and pretend I did it in the name of science.

End of discussion.

[Rutherford The Brave]

I'm not going to agree with you but I will add something. My family for generations has believed in the gods of the cherokee nation. Yet, they aren't exactly gods. None of them have supremacy over anything, they don't reign over everyone, they aren't all mighty. But rather, guiding spirits. I don't need someone to make happy all the time, but it's nice to pray to something that makes me feel happy.

[Nerdsaver]

In my opinion everyone should just live their lives and do what they wan't. We can keep things keeping us away from what we want in this life. I don't know if god is real or any religions, but if not I wasted my whole life watching what I do just because somebody told me too. If it is im screwed.. so what im trying to say is just live a good wholesome life and stop worrying so much :).

[Apparitions]

OK, the last thing I will say is this is what I feel sums up my feelings about religion. It is used in quite a famous advertising campaign in the UK. There is probably no God now stop worrying and enjoy your life. This is exactly what I will do. I just voiced my opinion, without the need to be backed up by US amendments. Religious people do this as well. I'm sure that if you are religious you will also enjoy your life because of your beliefs. End of topic.

EDIT: I just realised what I was saying is similar to what Nerdsaver was saying. My bad :whoops:.

[Death]

Science needs faith

And it has it, along with evidence.

just as much as religion needs evidence.

And it does not have it; only faith.

In my opinion everyone should just live their lives and do what they wan't. We can keep things keeping us away from what we want in this life. I don't know if god is real or any religions, but if not I wasted my whole life watching what I do just because somebody told me too. If it is im screwed.. so what im trying to say is just live a good wholesome life and stop worrying so much :).

True enough, but not all religious people (and, although a lot rarer in comparison to theists, atheists) can do that, although it would be good if they could.

[Sapphire]

How did I manage not to see those adverts? Lol.

[Sage]

And it has it, along with evidence.

How does science need faith?

[Kahn]

Because without faith, Science would have nothing to prove, and therefore people wouldn't need it if Science had nothing to prove... I think?

[Rutherford The Brave]

Because without faith, Science would have nothing to prove, and therefore people wouldn't need it if Science had nothing to prove... I think?

No....Not at all.

[Kahn]

That was a guess.. I lost.

[Rutherford The Brave]

That was a guess.. I lost.

Well here's the thing. Most avid religious enthusiasts say that without faith there would be no science like you. But science is not just for the counter of religion its for how we came to be and such.

[Kahn]

Well I know. And I am Agnostic. I was taking an educated guess but failed.

[Bougainvillea]

I was kind of getting the vibe that Adam wasn't speaking in religious faith. But oh well.

[Kahn]

I wasn't. But thank you ;)

[Death]

How does science need faith?

Said by you before:

Science needs faith

[The Batman]

He wasn't saying that science needed faith he was making a point that it doesn't need it just like religion doesn't need evidence(going by what i gather from his words)

[Sage]

He wasn't saying that science needed faith he was making a point that it doesn't need it just like religion doesn't need evidence(going by what i gather from his words)

Yes, thank you Thomas for not completely misinterpreting what I said (And no, this is not sarcasm.)

[Death]

He wasn't saying that science needed faith he was making a point that it doesn't need it just like religion doesn't need evidence(going by what i gather from his words)

Don't you mean she?

Yes, thank you Thomas for not completely misinterpreting what I said (And no, this is not sarcasm.)

Are you saying that I've completely misinterpereted everything? I mean seriously, you were not clear. Regardless, why does religion not require evidence? I'm sorry, but as far as I'm concerned, that's merely an excuse made by religious people in order to get people to believe in anything they tell them regardless of how far fetched that it might be.

[The Batman]

Trust me I mean he.

Also I believe that religion does need a bit of evidence backing up some of it's claims but when it all boils down it's faith that keeps them believing.

[Sapphire]

Are you saying that I've completely misinterpereted everything? I mean seriously, you were not clear. Regardless, why does religion not require evidence? I'm sorry, but as far as I'm concerned, that's merely an excuse made by religious people in order to get people to believe in anything they tell them regardless of how far fetched that it might be.
Deschain was saying that science has no need for faith and that religion has no need for evidence.

Is that really so hard to see?

[Death]

Deschain was saying that science has no need for faith and that religion has no need for evidence.

Is that really so hard to see?

No, I merely disagree. I can see what he's saying thankyou very much.

Trust me I mean he.

Erm, okay, it's just that he's got the pink female symbol - not the blue male one.

Also I believe that religion does need a bit of evidence backing up some of it's claims but when it all boils down it's faith that keeps them believing.

With this, I agree.

[Triceratops]

And it does not have it; only faith.

I find the religious individual has their own evidence of whether God exists or not. I believe it's down to the one person to see for themselves, I wholeheartedly believe I have experienced the presence of God many times.

It would take more for someone to try and convince me that God doesn't exist with scientific evidence, as I said before I've already felt God's presence. Tbh, it would be impossible for anyone to disprove God's existence to me.

Overall, I believe you can't disprove faith or prove faith to anyone else because it's up to you to find out for yourself.

EDIT: If you think all religious people are "blind sheep" then you have a lot to freaking learn, pig-ignorant morons. Some of the wisest and smartest people of today are religious. As a matter of fact, I could name dozens of Atheists from the top of my head who fit in the "blind sheep" criteria perfectly. No sides are perfect either.

[The Joker]

Do you know his disrespectful that is to me? It's not like I go around and preach to everybody. It is KNOWN the Flying Spaghetti Monster was made up to make fun fo people who believe in God.

Maybe we believe in God because we need something to hold on to when our lifes are empty. Something to believe in, to trust. I know this is true for me. Does it matter the age of the Priest, or what we talk about in church? If you don't like it, don't go. Simple as that.

[deadpie]

Mother Teresa was religious and one of the most morally upstanding human beings of recent times.
Ghandi had strong morals, he taught these morals and he practiced them.

Ghandi was a rascist against africans and mother teresa was obsessed with hurt and pain of people.

[MacMilker]

all right all right people. lets tune it down a notch, death stop arguing with adam, and adam stop being so damn sexy ;)

[Rutherford The Brave]

all right all right people. lets tune it down a notch, death stop arguing with adam, and adam stop being so damn sexy ;)

Let's not spam so this debate can continue

I would like to see something that says that Ghandi was racists Please.

[The Batman]

Let's both of you not backseat mod and just report the post.

[Sapphire]

No, I merely disagree. I can see what he's saying thankyou very much.
I asked because you had seemed very confused in the following post.

Science needs faithAnd it has it, along with evidence.
just as much as religion needs evidence.
And it does not have it; only faith.
And the next post indicates that prior to posting it you hadn't been clear on where he was coming from.
Are you saying that I've completely misinterpereted everything? I mean seriously, you were not clear.

Ghandi was a rascist against africansAnd your evidence is...? mother teresa was obsessed with hurt and pain of people.She was dedicated to easing their hurt and pain...what's your point?

[Apparitions]

Do you know his disrespectful that is to me? It's not like I go around and preach to everybody. It is KNOWN the Flying Spaghetti Monster was made up to make fun fo people who believe in God.

Maybe we believe in God because we need something to hold on to when our lifes are empty. Something to believe in, to trust. I know this is true for me. Does it matter the age of the Priest, or what we talk about in church? If you don't like it, don't go. Simple as that.
I do not feel anything bad towards Christians like you. It's the ones that DO preach, DO try and force their beliefs into my life. I used the FSM example to show how I could turn something around. I know it is for this purpose and I don't exactly agree with making fun of people's beliefs, just disputing them.

I have hope which I hold on to. I hope I will have a successful life. I hope I will have an unpainful death. I hope I will see my dead granddad sometime in the future. I hope that if there is a god then (s)he will be a forgiving one and will forgive me for turning away from them. I hope if there isn't a god then the afterlife will be good, whatever it is. I don't need religion to have this hope, others do. Personally I'm planning on praying on my deathbed, just in case. After thinking about this and hearing my mum say that she is Catholic because she wants to see her dad when she dies :((this really made me think about things) I have started to have doubts about everything. Someone said to me that there is no good and evil without religion and that without it you have nothing to hope for when you die. I wish that I could think this but I can't at the moment. Maybe in the future but not yet.

[Apparitions]

I find the religious individual has their own evidence of whether God exists or not. I believe it's down to the one person to see for themselves, I wholeheartedly believe I have experienced the presence of God many times.

It would take more for someone to try and convince me that God doesn't exist with scientific evidence, as I said before I've already felt God's presence. Tbh, it would be impossible for anyone to disprove God's existence to me.

Overall, I believe you can't disprove faith or prove faith to anyone else because it's up to you to find out for yourself.

EDIT: If you think all religious people are "blind sheep" then you have a lot to freaking learn, pig-ignorant morons. Some of the wisest and smartest people of today are religious. As a matter of fact, I could name dozens of Atheists from the top of my head who fit in the "blind sheep" criteria perfectly. No sides are perfect either.
I did take back what I said, something that people seem to forget on this thread. I never said any side is perfect, I pointed out both have flaws with the people who follow each 'side'. You can check if you want.

[trouble]

ok. i disagree on the priest thing........they are not old guys bullshitting(excuse the language) it takes guts to be sworn into cilabacy..... by the way im catholic......priests are the ppl in this world with the highest education . so they know what they are saying. ;(

[Rutherford The Brave]

ok. i disagree on the priest thing........they are not old guys bullshitting(excuse the language) it takes guts to be sworn into cilabacy..... by the way im catholic......priests are the ppl in this world with the highest education . so they know what they are saying. ;(

Wait what? Priests by far are NOT the people with the highest education in the world. If they did have that kind of ability they'd spend less time molesting young boys, and more time trying to find the answers to the questions that serious christians have been asking. (No offense to anyone about the whole priest thing. But it's true they do but not all molest young boys.)

[Sapphire]

Wait what? Priests by far are NOT the people with the highest education in the world. If they did have that kind of ability they'd spend less time molesting young boys, and more time trying to find the answers to the questions that serious christians have been asking. (No offense to anyone about the whole priest thing. But it's true they do but not all molest young boys.)
Child molestation has nothing to do with levels of education.
You get people of both high levels of education and of low levels of education who molest children.

[Rutherford The Brave]

Child molestation has nothing to do with levels of education.
You get people of both high levels of education and of low levels of education who molest children.

I should of specified Carole. Excuse me, if they were to hold that ability they would know not to do something like this. They would be able to say, this will be bad for me I shouldn't do this. But desire outweighs their minds.

[Sapphire]

I should of specified Carole. Excuse me, if they were to hold that ability they would know not to do something like this. They would be able to say, this will be bad for me I shouldn't do this. But desire outweighs their minds.
That's to do with self control and the strength of their inner moral values more than intelligence.

Intelligence is connected with the likelihood of them being caught, not with the likelihood of them committing the crime.
http://cjb.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/35/6/683

[Rutherford The Brave]

That's to do with self control and the strength of their inner moral values more than intelligence.

Intelligence is connected with the likelihood of them being caught, not with the likelihood of them committing the crime.
http://cjb.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/35/6/683

Oh, I see. Still however, I do not see them as the smartest. They are the smartest in their profession, but as far as worldwide knowledge they can't compare to others.

[Sapphire]

Oh, I see. Still however, I do not see them as the smartest. They are the smartest in their profession, but as far as worldwide knowledge they can't compare to others.
Of course, there are smarter people in the world. No one should dispute that.

Personally, I simply had a problem with you linking intelligence with child molestation.

[Rutherford The Brave]

Of course, there are smarter people in the world. No one should dispute that.

Personally, I simply had a problem with you linking intelligence with child molestation.

I see, I mis-spoke but I never really meant to do so.

[nnnm]

Now, I feel that if you want to be religious go ahead. But it should not be the staple holding your life together. It should be a mere chapter in the book of your life. (Like my analogy)

[Apparitions]

ok. i disagree on the priest thing........they are not old guys bullshitting(excuse the language) it takes guts to be sworn into cilabacy..... by the way im catholic......priests are the ppl in this world with the highest education . so they know what they are saying. ;(
How do priests have the highest education? Just wondering...

[Giles]

How do priests have the highest education? Just wondering...
They don't, that's the point...

I have no problem with people having/believing in any religion, just as long as they stay clear of me.

I believe that they should celebrate/take part(whatever) in their religion in private, or with other that feel the same way. Church.

It's when they start preaching and asking for donations...etc. that it annoys me.
If I believed in their stupid (imo) religion then I would of already joined, I wouldn't of needed them to come and tell me about it.

I know that FSM is a joke, just to annoy religious people. But I believe in the reasoning behind that argument; who's to say that "back when Jesus was around" someone didn't do exactly the same...
And don't say the ridiculously unreliable Bible.

[The Batman]

I know that FSM is a joke, just to annoy religious people. But I believe in the reasoning behind that argument; who's to say that "back when Jesus was around" someone didn't do exactly the same...
And don't say the ridiculously unreliable Bible.

Probably because back then if you were to mock religion you would probably be dead.

[2D]

You can't disprove or prove anything either way. [/END]

[Schizothemia]

Your assertion that atheists are better in a moral sense than those who follow a religion is grossly misguided.

Mother Teresa was religious and one of the most morally upstanding human beings of recent times.
Ghandi had strong morals, he taught these morals and he practiced them. Another example of a morally upstanding human being who followed a religion.
Martin Luther King was another such person.

All three of these people were prominent religious figures and had strong senses of morality.
If atheists are so superior to religious people, where are the atheists who have managed to outshine these three?

I would like to point out that Thomas Jefferson was an Atheist, or at the very least a Deist, meaning he believed in a God of creation, however did not support many of the idea's reflected in the Bible.

Another person I would love to bring up is Albert Einstein. Any reference to God he made was made to represent nature as something we could never wholly understand.

I would like to think the father of our nation and Albert Einstein outshine Gandhi, Theresa and Dr.King.

[Kahn]

Richard is right on all notes. Well except that Thomas Jefferson was a Deist. He believed in a higher being. Being a Free Mason required it.

[Sage]

I would like to point out that Thomas Jefferson was an Atheist, or at the very least a Deist, meaning he believed in a God of creation, however did not support many of the idea's reflected in the Bible.

Another person I would love to bring up is Albert Einstein. Any reference to God he made was made to represent nature as something we could never wholly understand.

A shame that atheism wasn't the prime motivation of any of these people.

[Sapphire]

I would like to think the father of our nation and Albert Einstein outshine Gandhi, Theresa and Dr.King.
Tell me then, how do they outshine Gandhi, Mother Theresa and Martin Luther King in a moral sense?

[punkjake]

Well i think religion is some cases is good and bad.Me? Well I'm a Agnostic Catholic:D, I believe all ways go to heaven,even atheist :).Back to the subject Like some one said religion also does a lot of good,Like ML ,Mother Teresa,Gandhi,Buddha,and Jesus.These are the people who I want to be more like.But it also can be bad in many cases,like (I AM NOT SAYING MUSLIMS ARE BAD!!I REPEAT!I AM NOT SAYING MUSLIMS ARE BAD)When some Pakistanis,Augustinians and a few Egyptians plant bombs in a building and run a plane in to it then its bad.When extreme Christians go out in gay parades and threatening them,calling them queers is also very bad.So in many cases it's good and bad.

[Becky]

I think that People can believe whatever they want to believe and that I as do loads of other people out there do not believe in such a thing It just seem like something that is stupid to argue over becuase it's not like your going to nto talk to someone if they don't believe what you believe as you wouldn't not talk to someone it they didn't like cheese and I'm not comparing God(s) to cheese because I know that some people's lives are based on this and there faith can be inspiring as they don't have any solid proof but still trust in it and believe that they will have a better life ebcause of it