Cutting II

[Ripplemagne]

Apparently, we can't discuss hypotheticals if it parallels someone else's life. So, remember, here, kiddies, no using metaphors or hypotheticals to make your points and get them across.

This is a continuation of this (http://www.virtualteen.org/forums/showthread.php?t=53777) thread, but, here, we will take care not to burst anyone's bubble.

I had some more I was going to add to the other thread, but I have to censor myself. X_x

I ask that if you are entering this thread with your personal life exposed that you please leave. This is a discussion/debate; if you feel you can't control your emotions, stop reading now.

Remember. Whenever someone says "end of discussion" or anything of that sort in a debate, it is admission to personal defeat. Any person of engaging intellect knows that there is never an end to discussion. In order to continue developing as human beings, talking is key.

Anyway, what do you think about cutting? Is there justification for it? If so, what are they? Is it warranted for anyone to cut? Is it okay to presume that some or all are attention whores because of it?

In response to a few points made in the other thread before it was locked that fit this discussion.

People have different tolerance levels.

Or people have different desperation levels. And by desperation, I mean desperate for attention. You can make two things with a negative: a positive and a negative. People make their own demons.

And as for the justification in cutting? I would tell you my reason but you would just bully me and say I didn't ask for your life story you attention whore. So thank you for that.

You seem to be putting words in my mouth. Is that the greatest way to start off a debate?

But no, we're not looking for life stories here. We're looking for empirical reasons to justify cutting and if there's any circumstances where it's warranted.

No i dont think that because everyone is different and thats something we cant change, attention or no attention

So, I guess some people have lungs and some have gills, right? Sweetie, there may be differences between us, but there are far more similarities.

[2D]

You seem to be putting words in my mouth. Is that the greatest way to start off a debate?

But no, we're not looking for life stories here. We're looking for empirical reasons to justify cutting and if there's any circumstances where it's warranted.

How about you hear voices. Hypothetically of course. And they tell you to cut, and kill yourself. Good reason?

[Ripplemagne]

I think you should just drop this.

I think you should leave the thread.

How about you hear voices. Hypothetically of course. And they tell you to cut, and kill yourself. Good reason?

Depends. Why would you listen to said voices?

[BlackenedSilver]

I had this prepared to post in the other thread just before it got lock so didn't get to post :P. This seems more like an actual debate rather than carrying on an unfinished argument for a different thread.

I don't think all cutters are attention seekers, being a cutter myself I spent money and worked hard to hide my cuts it's only when things seeped through that I was found out or when I slipped up somehow. Some are attention seekers though, I know many people at school that used to walk around cutting things into their arms and just showing them to the world. One girl actually cut deep into her arm and then put ink in the cut and showed it around the class. There is justification for cutting as well, though sometimes in doing this you are actually convincing people that there are good reasons to cut it's one of the reasons I hate justifying myself, like has been said before different things affect different people in different ways, Because everyone is unique. Someone may go through one thing, and not cut but others can go through the same and feel the need to. Maybe for a reason eg: they dont have anything else to support on or other factors.

[2D]

I think you should leave the thread.



Depends. Why would you listen to said voices?

Oh I'm sorry. When I said voices. I meant actual people. Ones that were close to me. Friends you might say.

And I also hear these voices. in my head. And it's hard to not become or believe something that is screamed in your head 24/7.

[Ripplemagne]

I think you should drop this too. and NO im not gonna leave this thread so don't even tell me to.

I can report you for going off topic and attempting to derail a legitimate thread. Would that help?

I don't think all cutters are attention seekers, being a cutter myself I spent money and worked hard to hide my cuts it's only when things seeped through that I was found out or when I slipped up somehow. Some are attention seekers though, I know many people at school that used to walk around cutting things into their arms and just showing them to the world. One girl actually cut deep into her arm and then put ink in the cut and showed it around the class. There is justification for cutting as well, though sometimes in doing this you are actually convincing people that there are good reasons to cut it's one of the reasons I hate justifying myself, like has been said before different things affect different people in different ways, Because everyone is unique. Someone may go through one thing, lets say bullying and not cut but others can go through the same and feel the need to. Maybe for a reason eg: they dont have anything else to support on or other factors.

How does cutting change that? How is cutting doing anything productive to end said problems?

Being that you told me just now, how can you argue that you try to hide it?

Oh.. my god. Well done you are just about to win the award for the guy with the most posts to be banned.
you don't just kill the overkill you've got.... afterkill!

Please leave. I know you are deliberately trying to send this thread off topic, so that gets locked, but think about your peers who want insight on this matter. Are you going to rob them of a chance to think? That's pretty selfish of you. Taking a vendetta so far as to rob people of a chance to learn.

Oh I'm sorry. When I said voices. I meant actual people. Ones that were close to me. Friends you might say.

Why would you listen to them, then?

And I also hear these voices. in my head. And it's hard to not become or believe something that is screamed in your head 24/7.

I have not experienced schizophrenia, so I can't comment on that. However, I'm still going to ask: Why give in?

[Requin]

Okay, if you don't have an opinion contributing to the topic, please don't post.

[Harley Quinn]

Being that you told me just now, how can you argue that you try to hide it?

Many invest in armbands and go to extreme lenghts to cover up what they have done, cutting is a way out and helps realease all the static that plays with your head.

[DarkWingedAngel]

I do have an opinion, and my opinion is that I think he should just drop this topic.

now for on topicness

NOT ALL CUTTERS ARE DOING IT FOR SHOW AND ATTENTION.
that is all

[The Batman]

If you have a problem report the thread and move on don't try and make it worse you aren't helping just contributing to the problem.

Desi what Joe said required no response at all.

[2D]

I have not experienced schizophrenia, so I can't comment on that. However, I'm still going to ask: Why give in?

Exactly. You haven't been through this. It's hard struggling. I can't do anything very well with screaming going on in my head. That no one else can hear. That's why I give in. I cut, so I won't shoot myself. And it's obvious to see that not all who cut do it for attention.

[Ripplemagne]

Many invest in armbands and go to extreme lenghts to cover up what they have done, cutting is a way out and helps realease all the static that plays with your head.

I was referring, specifically, to her.

I do have an opinion, and my opinion is that I think he should just drop this topic.

now for on topicness

NOT ALL CUTTERS ARE DOING IT FOR SHOW AND ATTENTION.
that is all

Requin and I both asked you politely to stop posting off topic. I was kind enough not to report your PM or your flame baiting. Eventually, my kindness will wear out.

Exactly. You haven't been through this. It's hard struggling. I can't do anything very well with screaming going on in my head. That no one else can hear. That's why I give in. I cut, so I won't shoot myself. And it's obvious to see that not all who cut do it for attention.

You may have a case. Others don't. Do you take meds?

[2D]

You may have a case. Others don't. Do you take meds?

Never have. No one knows except the people on VT. I don't wanna get sent to a psych ward place. So I never said anything.

[AutumnDae]

Anyway, what do you think about cutting? Is there justification for it? If so, what are they? Is it warranted for anyone to cut? Is it okay to presume that some or all are attention whores because of it?


I think that it's not good for people to do, and it's a vicious cycle that some try to break, only to be sucked back in again. However, others are able to break free and move on.

Justification? I'm not really sure. I know most people that do it are battling demons within themselves, they're having problems, and whatnot, and I understand that some people don't understand how to release their anger, sadness, whatever through other ways, but I really don't think it's right for them to cut themselves/harm themselves in any way.

I don't think that all cutters are attention seekers. Some definitely are, I can tell you that. A girl I know likes to cut herself, then show it off to people, saying "Last night was so hard, I needed release" Obvious attention seeker. But others do it quietly, not letting anyone know. And they do it for personal reasons, to feel relief from their other pains or whatever. I think that the people that ARE doing it to get attention are sick and wrong, because then the people that really are trying to stop or get help, or doing it for other reasons are overlooked.

[DarkWingedAngel]

Requin and I both asked you politely to stop posting off topic. I was kind enough not to report your PM or your flame baiting. Eventually, my kindness will wear out.



oh I get it
I was off topic even tho I gave a valid point. If you even read my post that is.

anyways

I'm gonna just leave this

[Ripplemagne]

Never have. No one knows except the people on VT. I don't wanna get sent to a psych ward place. So I never said anything.

If that's your prerogative. But don't you think that having such a problem may pose a risk to others in the future?

oh I get it
I was off topic even tho I gave a valid point. If you even read my post that is.

anyways

I'm gonna just leave this

You pretty much just want to be heard even though you have nothing to say. "LOL DROP IT" is not valid. And has nothing to do with debating this topic. But yes, please leave. You're dirtying my epic.

However, others are able to break free and move on.

So, it's okay when you can quit at any time? Do you think the same is okay for cigarettes, alcohol, drugs, steroids, et cetera? I'm not trying to attack you. I'm just asking questions.

[2D]

If that's your prerogative. But don't you think that having such a problem may pose a risk to others in the future?

I don't see how it would.

[DarkWingedAngel]

I do have an opinion, and my opinion is that I think he should just drop this topic.

now for on topicness

NOT ALL CUTTERS ARE DOING IT FOR SHOW AND ATTENTION.
that is all
yes im quoting my own post because you didn't see it properly
read what is bold and then tell me that i was off topic.

[Ripplemagne]

rofl.

I understand why Darth Vader is attacking me so vehemently now. XD!

I don't see how it would.

Well, if you can take orders from these voices to hurt yourself, why wouldn't it grow more intense to include others?

yes im quoting my own post because you didn't see it properly
read what is bold and then tell me that i was off topic.

A headline is not the same as a valid point. rofl.

[AutumnDae]

So, it's okay when you can quit at any time? Do you think the same is okay for cigarettes, alcohol, drugs, steroids, et cetera? I'm not trying to attack you. I'm just asking questions.

I never said that it was okay. Please don't put words into my mouth, or fingers rather. Thanks. :)

What I meant was that some people are able to break free from the cycle after many attempts and much willpower, most people go through relapses, some one or two, but many a number of them before they are finally *cured* (Cured isn't the word I want, but I can't seem to think of a better one at the moment.) And do I think what is the same is okay for cigarettes, and on.

And, I didn't think you were attacking me. Asking questions is fine. :)

[Ripplemagne]

I never said that it was okay. Please don't put words into my mouth, or fingers rather. Thanks.

See the question marks? That means I was asking you a question.

What I meant was that some people are able to break free from the cycle after many attempts and much willpower, most people go through relapses, some one or two, but many a number of them before they are finally *cured* (Cured isn't the word I want, but I can't seem to think of a better one at the moment.) And do I think what is the same is okay for cigarettes, and on.

So, as long as we know we can stop at any time, it's okay to do these things?

And, I didn't think you were attacking me. Asking questions is fine.

I have to make sure. The ears around here are so delicate. :3

[2D]

Well, if you can take orders from these voices to hurt yourself, why wouldn't it grow more intense to include others?

I guess so. But I can control it. Sort of. Like block them out when I really need to. So in time they might stop. I just really don't wanna be stuck in a mental place. I'm going to college. I can't just stop.

[Ripplemagne]

I guess so. But I can control it. Sort of. Like block them out when I really need to. So in time they might stop. I just really don't wanna be stuck in a mental place. I'm going to college. I can't just stop.

You just said it was unrelenting, which is why you gave into it. If you can control it, why not control it to not cut? If you could do that, I might be okay with the idea of you not getting evaluated.

[AutumnDae]

See the question marks? That means I was asking you a question.



So, as long as we know we can stop at any time, it's okay to do these things?



I have to make sure. The ears around here are so delicate. :3

By saying the "So...." it looks like you are assuming that by what I'm saying.

And no, it's not okay to do things that will harm your body, regardless if you think you can stop at any time. When addicts become addicted, they go into denial, they think they aren't addicted, that they can stop any time they want. Maybe cutters think that way as well, I don't know. They might think "Okay, just this once, then I'm done." but then that one time turns into more and more, and suddenly it's an addiction that can't be broken.

[Ripplemagne]

By saying the "So...." it looks like you are assuming that by what I'm saying.

Not at all. It's textual aethestics. Sounds better. :P

And no, it's not okay to do things that will harm your body, regardless if you think you can stop at any time. When addicts become addicted, they go into denial, they think they aren't addicted, that they can stop any time they want. Maybe cutters think that way as well, I don't know. They might think "Okay, just this once, then I'm done." but then that one time turns into more and more, and suddenly it's an addiction that can't be broken.

Glad we see eye to eye. :P

[AutumnDae]

Not at all. It's textual aethestics. Sounds better. :P

Glad we see eye to eye. :P


Okay, sure.

And I honestly don't think we see eye to eye, but if you want to think that, go ahead.

[2D]

You just said it was unrelenting, which is why you gave into it. If you can control it, why not control it to not cut? If you could do that, I might be okay with the idea of you not getting evaluated.

I'll say this again. You haven't gone through this. So you don't know how hard it is. And what are you gonna make me get evaluated or something?

[Ripplemagne]

Okay, sure.

And I honestly don't think we see eye to eye, but if you want to think that, go ahead.

Why not?

I'll say this again. You haven't gone through this. So you don't know how hard it is. And what are you gonna make me get evaluated or something?

So, then, explain it to me. Can you control it or not?

[AutumnDae]

Why not?

From what I am gathering from what you are saying, it seems like you think all cutters are attention seeking, and I do not.

And, if I may ask you a question, I'll ask this. When someone has a bad childhood (Whether is be abuse, bullying, mental illness, whatever) and they start self harming, what separates a "traumatic childhood" from a "normal one"? I'm aware that all children go through experiences that can hurt them (Almost every child is bullied at one point or another), but where is the line drawn?

[Ripplemagne]

From what I am gathering from what you are saying, it seems like you think all cutters are attention seeking, and I do not.

Wrong. I never said that. In fact, I said to Motormouth that he may have a case.

And, if I may ask you a question, I'll ask this. When someone has a bad childhood (Whether is be abuse, bullying, mental illness, whatever) and they start self harming, what separates a "traumatic childhood" from a "normal one"? I'm aware that all children go through experiences that can hurt them (Almost every child is bullied at one point or another), but where is the line drawn?

Everyone experiences trauma. It's part of life. We all have problems, we all have sorrows. How you deal with it is what makes you who you are. There are people who experience hardships far more devastating than what our whiny American/European teenagers think sets them apart.

I blame cheesy romance novels.

[AutumnDae]

Everyone experiences trauma. It's part of life. We all have problems, we all have sorrows. How you deal with it is what makes you who you are. There are people who experience hardships far more devastating than what our whiny American/European teenagers think sets them apart.

I blame cheesy romance novels.

That I'm asking is, where is the line drawn between "normal traumas" and ones that could push a person into depression, self harm, or whatever?

[Ripplemagne]

That I'm asking is, where is the line drawn between "normal traumas" and ones that could push a person into depression, self harm, or whatever?

Depression doesn't = self-harm. Recognize that.

I have Clinical Depression and I've never cut myself. There's nothing that implicitly defines how someone becomes depressed. What I've learned over the years, however, is that I have the choice to be depressed or not.

I've been diagnosed with something that I can control. I've learned that emotions can be tamed if you train yourself to do so. So, I don't believe that cutting is subconscious or that it's not predetermined. One chooses to cut just as they choose to be depressed; the only difference is that the latter bit is more difficult to control.

Self harm can be a psychological issue, which is no doubt where the phenomenon has stemmed from. But it's infrequent. It seems, today, every other teenager is a cutter and it is my belief that the majority of it is copycat of actual psychological issues because it's an outlet and a means of garnering attention.

The problem, here, is that an attention whore is not going to admit to being one. No cutter claims to be an attention whore. Even the ones that go around showing everyone their cuts. So, it becomes difficult to distinguish who is who and as the attention whores far outweigh legitimate cases, treatment for people with actual problems are limited.

Unfortunately, people who encourage this type of behavior of coddle those who do it further exacerbate the problem by perpetuating the notion that it's okay and reinforcing the fact that they'll garner attention for it.

[AutumnDae]

Depression doesn't = self-harm. Recognize that.

I have Clinical Depression and I've never cut myself. There's nothing that implicitly defines how someone becomes depressed. What I've learned over the years, however, is that I have the choice to be depressed or not.

I've been diagnosed with something that I can control. I've learned that emotions can be tamed if you train yourself to do so. So, I don't believe that cutting is subconscious or that it's not predetermined. One chooses to cut just as they choose to be depressed; the only difference is that the latter bit is more difficult to control.

Self harm can be a psychological issue, which is no doubt where the phenomenon has stemmed from. But it's infrequent. It seems, today, every other teenager is a cutter and it is my belief that the majority of it is copycat of actual psychological issues because it's an outlet and a means of garnering attention.

The problem, here, is that an attention whore is not going to admit to being one. No cutter claims to be an attention whore. Even the ones that go around showing everyone their cuts. So, it becomes difficult to distinguish who is who and as the attention whores far outweigh legitimate cases, treatment for people with actual problems are limited.

Unfortunately, people who encourage this type of behavior of coddle those who do it further exacerbate the problem by perpetuating the notion that it's okay and reinforcing the fact that they'll garner attention for it.

I never said that Depression=Self harm. I said that a trauma could push a person into depression OR self harm. Maybe both. (Although I do think that most people that self harm are depressed, but not all depressed people self harm.)

Anyways, I really don't think that people choose to be depressed. My best friend, who has been placed on Anti-Depressants, did NOT wake up one day and say "Today is a good day to become depressed!" His body is unable to regulate the serotonin (Spelling?) levels in his body, and he becomes depressed as a result. So, did you wake up one day and decide to become depressed?

And, I come back to the point that not all cutters are seeking attention. Some people are trying to find relief from something in their life, something that they are avoiding.

[Ripplemagne]

I never said that Depression=Self harm. I said that a trauma could push a person into depression OR self harm. Maybe both. (Although I do think that most people that self harm are depressed, but not all depressed people self harm.)

Trauma can push you to be depressed. But so can not getting the last candy from the candy bowl. Negative feelings can be provoked by anything. It's up to the person to filter it.

Anyways, I really don't think that people choose to be depressed. My best friend, who has been placed on Anti-Depressants, did NOT wake up one day and say "Today is a good day to become depressed!" His body is unable to regulate the serotonin (Spelling?) levels in his body, and he becomes depressed as a result. So, did you wake up one day and decide to become depressed?

It doesn't work that way. Depressed people know when depression is sinking in. What I've learned is that if you say "no" and actually fight with your mind, you can quell it. It's a matter of taming your own mind and taking control.

I'm very familiar with depression. You don't need to explain it to me. I did years of therapy, went on medication and diligently analyzed it.

So, no, you don't wake up and say "Hey! I wanna be depressed!" It's a matter of it sinking in and you letting it or not. And many do choose to perpetuate it. Sometimes, when depression sinks in, people look for ways to make it worse.

And, I come back to the point that not all cutters are seeking attention. Some people are trying to find relief from something in their life, something that they are avoiding.

Wrong. I never said that. In fact, I said to Motormouth that he may have a case.

[AutumnDae]

Trauma can push you to be depressed. But so can not getting the last candy from the candy bowl. Negative feelings can be provoked by anything. It's up to the person to filter it.

It doesn't work that way. Depressed people know when depression is sinking in. What I've learned is that if you say "no" and actually fight with your mind, you can quell it. It's a matter of taming your own mind and taking control.

I'm very familiar with depression. You don't need to explain it to me. I did years of therapy, went on medication and diligently analyzed it.

So, no, you don't wake up and say "Hey! I wanna be depressed!" It's a matter of it sinking in and you letting it or not. And many do choose to perpetuate it. Sometimes, when depression sinks in, people look for ways to make it worse.

Wasn't explaining it to you in particular, maybe someone else planning on posting wouldn't know what I meant.

Not ALL depressed people are able to pull themselves out! It may work for some, but others it may not! Most people don't "let" it sink in, it just does. When I get "depressed" (Feeling down would be the more correct term) It's not like I can just pick myself up and put a smile back on my face. It's more of a mindset, suddenly everything seems bad, and makes me even more upset. And I can guarantee that more people feel the same as I do. And no, I don't look for ways to make it worse. Most don't. And I'm going to guess that the people that do look for ways to make it worse arre the attention seekers.

[Kaleidoscope Eyes]

Wow, Chris has a way of pissing people off without even trying to.

Just to try and keep this from escalating to where it has to be locked, let me clarify what I think is going on:

This is a debate. Meaning, it's not an argument intended to insult anyone. When he says, "Are you saying that...?" he's literally asking you that question to clarify your post. Not putting anyone down or trying to make you look like you're saying things you're not. It's not a jab at you personally, it's not saying that you're "wrong". He wants a response so we can get at what people really think on the topic. I hate when these threads just become a big argument about who's insulting who, and who needs to get out of this thread, and so on and so forth. Let's NOT assume that Chris is trying to piss everyone off, and have a constructive debate for once, please? This is why I normally stay out of ROTW. Not because I never have an opinion but because it frustrates me how no one can talk about anything even mildy controversial without fighting about it. Normally the fight isn't even over the topic it's about the way someone is typing. Come on people. We can do this.

[Ripplemagne]

Not ALL depressed people are able to pull themselves out! It may work for some, but others it may not! Most people don't "let" it sink in, it just does. When I get "depressed" (Feeling down would be the more correct term) It's not like I can just pick myself up and put a smile back on my face. It's more of a mindset, suddenly everything seems bad, and makes me even more upset. And I can guarantee that more people feel the same as I do. And no, I don't look for ways to make it worse. Most don't. And I'm going to guess that the people that do look for ways to make it worse arre the attention seekers.

Why are you explaining it to me? I know what it feels like. I've been diagnosed with a rather strong case of Clinical Depression. I never said it was easy and it seems impossible on the surface, but when you acknowledge it, it's very much possible.

And what you don't understand is that depression perpetuates. People look to make it worse without realizing it. Looking at yourself in the mirror while you're crying? It's a way of building it. Thinking about more bad things? Bingo. Putting yourself down more? Onoez. There's an endless stream of little things like this that are subconscious and afflict the person.

So, yes, people perpetuate their own depression. Once again, people make their own demons. If I can do it, why can't you? Don't tell me I have a stronger will or something of the sort. I'm not magix (this statement is false because I'm awesome), so if I can do it, why can't anyone else?

Wow, Chris has a way of pissing people off without even trying to.

Just to try and keep this from escalating to where it has to be locked, let me clarify what I think is going on:

This is a debate. Meaning, it's not an argument intended to insult anyone. When he says, "Are you saying that...?" he's literally asking you that question to clarify your post. Not putting anyone down or trying to make you look like you're saying things you're not. It's not a jab at you personally, it's not saying that you're "wrong". He wants a response so we can get at what people really think on the topic. I hate when these threads just become a big argument about who's insulting who, and who needs to get out of this thread, and so on and so forth. Let's NOT assume that Chris is trying to piss everyone off, and have a constructive debate for once, please? This is why I normally stay out of ROTW. Not because I never have an opinion but because it frustrates me how no one can talk about anything even mildy controversial without fighting about it. Normally the fight isn't even over the topic it's about the way someone is typing. Come on people. We can do this.

<3 Jessi mah bessi.

[theOperaGhost]

I have a question for all you people who are in support of cutting basically. Can you justify why you do it? Can you justifiably say anything positive, good, helpful, etc...comes from it?

Now to sidetrack to another set of questions. Do you think you deserve our sympathy? Generally, you are searching for pity, or else you are drowning in self pity, do you really think you deserve that pity? What is so bad about your life that you need anyone's pity? You're bullied? Big fucking deal, so is nearly everyone else. You're parents are divorced? So? The divorce rate is really quite high. Just ask yourself these questions: Do you have a safe place to live? Do you have enough food to survive? Do you have things you don't need, only want? Do you have clean clothes to wear? If you answer yes to these questions, QUIT BITCHING ABOUT HOW HORRIBLE YOUR LIFE IS!

[2D]

So, then, explain it to me. Can you control it or not?

As of now. If I have to. Yes.

[AutumnDae]

Why are you explaining it to me? I know what it feels like. I've been diagnosed with a rather strong case of Clinical Depression. I never said it was easy and it seems impossible on the surface, but when you acknowledge it, it's very much possible.

And what you don't understand is that depression perpetuates. People look to make it worse without realizing it. Looking at yourself in the mirror while you're crying? It's a way of building it. Thinking about more bad things? Bingo. Putting yourself down more? Onoez. There's an endless stream of little things like this that are subconscious and afflict the person.

So, yes, people perpetuate their own depression. Once again, people make their own demons. If I can do it, why can't you? Don't tell me I have a stronger will or something of the sort. I'm not magix (this statement is false because I'm awesome), so if I can do it, why can't anyone else?

Once again, I'm not explaining it to you personally, more to other people that are reading the thread.

But anyways, if you are upset with people that get into depression and can't get out, why not offer your help? I myself personally do not know how to pull myself out very well. Why not go into the forum and offer some help? Then less people would be complaining about it.

And maybe people can't pull themselves out because they don't know how. Sure, some things may seem like a good idea at the time, but when put into action to help pull yourself up, they fail.

I have a question for all you people who are in support of cutting basically. Can you justify why you do it? Can you justifiably say anything positive, good, helpful, etc...comes from it?

Now to sidetrack to another set of questions. Do you think you deserve our sympathy? Generally, you are searching for pity, or else you are drowning in self pity, do you really think you deserve that pity? What is so bad about your life that you need anyone's pity? You're bullied? Big fucking deal, so is nearly everyone else. You're parents are divorced? So? The divorce rate is really quite high. Just ask yourself these questions: Do you have a safe place to live? Do you have enough food to survive? Do you have things you don't need, only want? Do you have clean clothes to wear? If you answer yes to these questions, QUIT BITCHING ABOUT HOW HORRIBLE YOUR LIFE IS!

I'm not sure if you were directing the first question to me, and I probably mispoke somewhere in here, or not made myself clear. I am NOT supporting cutting. I have a sense of why people do it, but I don't agree with it one bit. And I don't think anything positive coming out of it, I only see negative.

And as to the second bit: Exactly my thoughts pretty much. So many people are like "my life sucks" yadda yadda yadda, and I admit it, sometimes I even think that. But then I have to take a step back and look at things. I've got problems, but I've got supportive parents, a couple good friends that love me, a warm house to live in, food on my table. My life ain't half bad. If you aren't happy with your life, then you need to do something to change it. You don't have friends? Make some. You're failing school? Study. Stop sitting around feeling sorry for yourself and take some action.

[ShatteredWings]

Just ask yourself these questions: Do you have a safe place to live? Do you have enough food to survive? Do you have things you don't need, only want? Do you have clean clothes to wear? If you answer yes to these questions, QUIT BITCHING ABOUT HOW HORRIBLE YOUR LIFE IS!
And if the answer to any of those questions is 'no'?

[The Batman]

I have a question for all you people who are in support of cutting basically. Can you justify why you do it? Can you justifiably say anything positive, good, helpful, etc...comes from it?
I'm what you might call a hypocrite I see no problem with cutting myself but when others do it I absolutely hate it. There are times where I do feel as if it's the wrong thing to do but other times I feel great from it then usually guilty when I post in the s/h calendar and people start to ask about it. The last thing I want is pity from anyone and usually when I make threads they are just venting or ranting and I hardly ever reply back since usually I'm feeling better after making the thread.
Now to sidetrack to another set of questions. Do you think you deserve our sympathy? Generally, you are searching for pity, or else you are drowning in self pity, do you really think you deserve that pity? What is so bad about your life that you need anyone's pity? You're bullied? Big fucking deal, so is nearly everyone else. You're parents are divorced? So? The divorce rate is really quite high. Just ask yourself these questions: Do you have a safe place to live? Do you have enough food to survive? Do you have things you don't need, only want? Do you have clean clothes to wear? If you answer yes to these questions, QUIT BITCHING ABOUT HOW HORRIBLE YOUR LIFE IS!
There are a lot more things to take into account Jared. Like the mental health of the person, rather thery are getting any kind of abuse, how long it's been going on, and rather or not they have any kind of support. There's a lot more to it then just what you listed.

[Lilith]

I have a question for all you people who are in support of cutting basically. Can you justify why you do it? Can you justifiably say anything positive, good, helpful, etc...comes from it?

Now to sidetrack to another set of questions. Do you think you deserve our sympathy? Generally, you are searching for pity, or else you are drowning in self pity, do you really think you deserve that pity? What is so bad about your life that you need anyone's pity? You're bullied? Big fucking deal, so is nearly everyone else. You're parents are divorced? So? The divorce rate is really quite high. Just ask yourself these questions: Do you have a safe place to live? Do you have enough food to survive? Do you have things you don't need, only want? Do you have clean clothes to wear? If you answer yes to these questions, QUIT BITCHING ABOUT HOW HORRIBLE YOUR LIFE IS!

I'm just going to hop into this discussion and put in my opinions.

I'm not a supporter of cutting. It is in fact unhealthy, both mentally and physically. We should all know now that bloodletting is outdated medically and cutting yourself on purpose can cause infection & blither blather... (Yes, I know blither blather isn't acceptable in substitute of real medical terms in a real debate but this is a forum). Mentally it becomes an obsessive behavior and can stunt your life and growing experience about how to cope with events that would be depressing. A lot of people are predisposed to such obsessive and masochistic behavior though, which makes falling into such a harmful pattern much easier than the majority of other and more mentally stable people. In most cases, self harm is linked with a lot of other mental diseases.

About Operaghostiesw/e post- I'm genuinely interested in what formed your opinion. It sounds like you think all cutters are purposely mutilating them self simply for attention and I can attest that, if so, it's not true. It might surprise you, but regular cutters have a deeply rooted psyche problems and their wiring works differently from yours. Though there are a vast amount of people out there who like to 'show off' their cuts and complain about how horrible their home life is, well those people shouldn't even be involved with the debate. People who show off their cuts like they're trophies have no real problems, except they need attention because they're either vain or need to soothe their own ego by getting that kick that someone else, most likely a friend or family member gets wound up seeing what they've 'had to resort to' (those poor babies) and comforts them. Course there are attention-seeking personailty disorders, so I could be wrong in saying those OTHER poeple have no real problems.

[Ripplemagne]

And if the answer to any of those questions is 'no'?

Then they wouldn't be on the computer, posting on an internet forum, would they?

As of now. If I have to. Yes.

You don't seem too sure to me.

But anyways, if you are upset with people that get into depression and can't get out, why not offer your help? I myself personally do not know how to pull myself out very well. Why not go into the forum and offer some help? Then less people would be complaining about it.

And maybe people can't pull themselves out because they don't know how. Sure, some things may seem like a good idea at the time, but when put into action to help pull yourself up, they fail.

Who says that I don't offer my aid?

[AutumnDae]

Who says that I don't offer my aid?

I do, actually. I haven't seen you posting in the Depression Forum much, or the Self Harm. I don't stalk your posts or anything, but I am pretty observant, I see where people post most. And if you are posting there offering your help, and I'm missing it, then obviously, it's not too often.

[Ripplemagne]

I do, actually. I haven't seen you posting in the Depression Forum much, or the Self Harm. I don't stalk your posts or anything, but I am pretty observant, I see where people post most. And if you are posting there offering your help, and I'm missing it, then obviously, it's not too often.

I don't on VT. VT = the whole world?

[AutumnDae]

I don't on VT. VT = the whole world?

No, but I was talking about offering advice on here. If you don't like the fact that people are complaining about it on here, then either a.) Ignore them b.) Offer them help or c.) Don't come on here.

[Ripplemagne]

No, but I was talking about offering advice on here. If you don't like the fact that people are complaining about it on here, then either a.) Ignore them b.) Offer them help or c.) Don't come on here.

And what is it that I do?

[2D]

You don't seem too sure to me.

I'm as sure as a person can be that's hearing things. Hahaha

[deadpie]

I have a question for all you people who are in support of cutting basically. Can you justify why you do it? Can you justifiably say anything positive, good, helpful, etc...comes from it?

Now to sidetrack to another set of questions. Do you think you deserve our sympathy? Generally, you are searching for pity, or else you are drowning in self pity, do you really think you deserve that pity? What is so bad about your life that you need anyone's pity? You're bullied? Big fucking deal, so is nearly everyone else. You're parents are divorced? So? The divorce rate is really quite high. Just ask yourself these questions: Do you have a safe place to live? Do you have enough food to survive? Do you have things you don't need, only want? Do you have clean clothes to wear? If you answer yes to these questions, QUIT BITCHING ABOUT HOW HORRIBLE YOUR LIFE IS!

I will agree on the bullying and divorce stuff. I can't stand people whining about that stuff.
But for the other questions, you can't just say, if you have a roof, clean clothes, and some food means you've got a damn amazing life. You don't have to compare everything to some kids in africa starving and dying.


In my opinion, i can't say cutting is bad. I had babysitters who forced me to do it to myself and encouraged me to do it when i felt bad when i was six years old. I remember i would have to cut myself for their amusement for them to let me eat food. So in the lifestyle i grew up, i seriously won't believe in anyone who says it's wrong. I have to do it everytime i feel like shit because i know it's the only way to escape. I've tried other coping mechanisms and none work like cutting did.
Cutting is not the greatest way to fix problems, but it's better then suicide.

It helps me know i'm in control of my body, and i wasn't when i was young. So cutting has helped me.

[AutumnDae]

And what is it that I do?

What do you mean, what is it that you do? I was giving you options of things to do, I don't know what you're doing right now, probably ignoring them or something.

[Camazotz]

Before I get sucked into the debate, I want to state my opinion and stay out of the way. It's obvious this debate is heated and I'd rather not deal with the emotions going on.

In short, not all cutters seek attention. They feel relief in harming themselves; however, this does not excuse their behavior. As we all know, cutting is harmful to the body and mind. It may make your feelings temporarily better, but the feeling will eventually wear out and you'll feel like crap again. This will lead to more and more cutting, kind of like an addiction.

Everyone experiences depression. It's how you handle it that matters. And the fact is, we should all know better than to cut ourselves. In reality, our life isn't all that bad. Appreciate the things you do have and you'll feel a tiny bit better.

[Atonement]

Easy answers to common conceptions:

Are there people that self harm for attention?

Yes.

Is depression controllable?

Yes, but it is not a choice. You can choose to try to control it, but you cannot choose to be depressed or be happy. I can't just sit here and say, oh, I'm going to be happy now. Clinical depression is a medical illness, not a choice.

Furthermore, I think that cutting is something that is very hard to understand for someone who hasn't been in that position. No one should ever cut and it is never okay, but it is understandable. I don't justify what people do, but I sympathize and relate. As for the attention whore part, as I touched, not all are attention whores, some are, and some talk about it so that they don't live in fear anymore. I talk about it for help. I talk about my self harm so that I can help move past a hell I've lived in. I talk about it and am open about it because I don't this its something that should be hidden. It is something to not be proud of, but not something to be pushed under the rug.

[Triceratops]

I view self-harm as a horrible, selfish and low coping mechanism. I don't believe self-harm is a mental illness, although it can become very severe and a serious psychological problem when someone genuinely shows an extremely addictive and obsessive behaviour towards it which I honestly don't think is the case for quite a few self-harmers on this forum who are just gagging for a hint of sympathy. Most genuine self-harmers are doing what they can to break the habit as they are disgusted and ashamed, and are simply embarrassed by their actions so they tend to go out of their way to hide their cuts and bruises as such, even myself.

I firmly believe that convincing a self-harmer that once they resist to these temptations they have annoyed and disappointed others around them and have indeed failed actually happens to be rather helpful because it gives them a sense that what they're doing is wrong, foolish and hurtful to others in the process. Drowning them with pity and full-fledged attention will just encourage them to maintain their bad ways as there is a slight awareness that they'll just continue to gain the unnecessary amounts of sympathy.

Attention whores sicken me to death and should just simply be ignored at all costs. Period.

[Ripplemagne]

What do you mean, what is it that you do? I was giving you options of things to do, I don't know what you're doing right now, probably ignoring them or something.

Just checking. It seemed that you were implying that I do something else.

Yes, but it is not a choice. You can choose to try to control it, but you cannot choose to be depressed or be happy. I can't just sit here and say, oh, I'm going to be happy now. Clinical depression is a medical illness, not a choice.

I think you missed the point...

[theOperaGhost]

Once again, I'm not explaining it to you personally, more to other people that are reading the thread.

But anyways, if you are upset with people that get into depression and can't get out, why not offer your help? I myself personally do not know how to pull myself out very well. Why not go into the forum and offer some help? Then less people would be complaining about it.

And maybe people can't pull themselves out because they don't know how. Sure, some things may seem like a good idea at the time, but when put into action to help pull yourself up, they fail.



I'm not sure if you were directing the first question to me, and I probably mispoke somewhere in here, or not made myself clear. I am NOT supporting cutting. I have a sense of why people do it, but I don't agree with it one bit. And I don't think anything positive coming out of it, I only see negative.

And as to the second bit: Exactly my thoughts pretty much. So many people are like "my life sucks" yadda yadda yadda, and I admit it, sometimes I even think that. But then I have to take a step back and look at things. I've got problems, but I've got supportive parents, a couple good friends that love me, a warm house to live in, food on my table. My life ain't half bad. If you aren't happy with your life, then you need to do something to change it. You don't have friends? Make some. You're failing school? Study. Stop sitting around feeling sorry for yourself and take some action.

My post wasn't directed at anyone in particular.

And if the answer to any of those questions is 'no'?

If the answer to any of those questions is "no," seek help. Professional help.

I'm what you might call a hypocrite I see no problem with cutting myself but when others do it I absolutely hate it. There are times where I do feel as if it's the wrong thing to do but other times I feel great from it then usually guilty when I post in the s/h calendar and people start to ask about it. The last thing I want is pity from anyone and usually when I make threads they are just venting or ranting and I hardly ever reply back since usually I'm feeling better after making the thread.

There are a lot more things to take into account Jared. Like the mental health of the person, rather thery are getting any kind of abuse, how long it's been going on, and rather or not they have any kind of support. There's a lot more to it then just what you listed.

I know there is a lot more to take into account, but those type of things need professional help, not self harm, to aid in life.

I'm just going to hop into this discussion and put in my opinions.

I'm not a supporter of cutting. It is in fact unhealthy, both mentally and physically. We should all know now that bloodletting is outdated medically and cutting yourself on purpose can cause infection & blither blather... (Yes, I know blither blather isn't acceptable in substitute of real medical terms in a real debate but this is a forum). Mentally it becomes an obsessive behavior and can stunt your life and growing experience about how to cope with events that would be depressing. A lot of people are predisposed to such obsessive and masochistic behavior though, which makes falling into such a harmful pattern much easier than the majority of other and more mentally stable people. In most cases, self harm is linked with a lot of other mental diseases.

About Operaghostiesw/e post- I'm genuinely interested in what formed your opinion. It sounds like you think all cutters are purposely mutilating them self simply for attention and I can attest that, if so, it's not true. It might surprise you, but regular cutters have a deeply rooted psyche problems and their wiring works differently from yours. Though there are a vast amount of people out there who like to 'show off' their cuts and complain about how horrible their home life is, well those people shouldn't even be involved with the debate. People who show off their cuts like they're trophies have no real problems, except they need attention because they're either vain or need to soothe their own ego by getting that kick that someone else, most likely a friend or family member gets wound up seeing what they've 'had to resort to' (those poor babies) and comforts them. Course there are attention-seeking personailty disorders, so I could be wrong in saying those OTHER poeple have no real problems.

I don't believe EVERYONE who cuts does it for attention, I do believe that a majority of them do though. It's possible that I just can't see any other reason to cut unless you are seeking attention (either consciously or subconsciously). I don't see how anyone can put themselves through pain other than to gain attention. Call me ignorant or whatever you want, but that is how I see it.

I will agree on the bullying and divorce stuff. I can't stand people whining about that stuff.
But for the other questions, you can't just say, if you have a roof, clean clothes, and some food means you've got a damn amazing life. You don't have to compare everything to some kids in africa starving and dying.


In my opinion, i can't say cutting is bad. I had babysitters who forced me to do it to myself and encouraged me to do it when i felt bad when i was six years old. I remember i would have to cut myself for their amusement for them to let me eat food. So in the lifestyle i grew up, i seriously won't believe in anyone who says it's wrong. I have to do it everytime i feel like shit because i know it's the only way to escape. I've tried other coping mechanisms and none work like cutting did.
Cutting is not the greatest way to fix problems, but it's better then suicide.

It helps me know i'm in control of my body, and i wasn't when i was young. So cutting has helped me.

I never said your life was amazing if you had all those things. My life hasn't been amazing. I've dealt with more death than I ever really wanted to. I grew up being ignored or teased or hated by everyone in school. I am however saying that if you have those things, you're life is not terrible. You might have things to bitch about, but overall, suck it up, because things aren't that bad.

Your babysitter is possibly the dumbest bitch I've ever heard of. I'd charge that cunt with child abuse.

[Antares]

Okay heres the deal-io.

One, props to mr. ripp for continuing this thread and not letting important schtuff die ;)

Two, what I might say below may offend some but its the bloody truth and we all have to fucking deal with it. Including YOU (reader).

Cutting is stupid!!
Why? Because...although it may have some false...point that is magically inserted into some peoples head by others, it doesn't do shit! It puts people in a cycle of harm, dispair, and even more depression.
Point is, don't start. Because its like a fucking drug. Its addicting and people can't control themselves.
Also, it gets so bad to the point where they get depressed because they do it...yet they don't want to stop...yet they don't want people to know...yet they want to talk to people...yet...yea. You get the point.

Are they attention whores? Yes. LET ME EXPLAIN Why? Because they come on this forum for 'help' initially...but in my OWN opinion it ends up glorifying self harm. How? Because you have a friggin calendar with people posting every time they s/h and then people go aww, talk to me, whatever whatever, when 2 weeks later they post the same shit. Its an endless cycle (it seems).
I personally think a lot of people that self harm are stubborn and their mind is clouded by their depression and the fact that they thinkt hey can't help themselves when they can and they just havent discovered it.

If your life sucks, go do something that releases certonin. That includes eating and excersising. That would sure help the people that s/h due to their body image.

So yea.
Wow.
I apologize if I hurt some of you but thats just somethign...I wanted to get out there.
Just want to disclaim that there are special cases.

So yea.
dont hate me. my own opinion (okay thats enough disclaiming for this post)

EDIT: I think a lot of depressed people just want attention, love, and care.
So it would be logical to use s/h to get that.

Dont you think.
I mean, I don't want to deem myself as a Psychologist or "Dr. Sam" (dummy) but I think that s/h is used as an instrument for getting the above and fufilling the false thought that they aren't getting their needs met

[deadpie]

I don't think there is any discussion here. You could say cutting is good or bad to someone, they're probably still gonna do it.


but overall, suck it up, because things aren't that bad.

Your babysitter is possibly the dumbest bitch I've ever heard of. I'd charge that cunt with child abuse.
Things arent that bad? Dude, you obviously weren't a sex slave for your childhood and having to do deal with post traummatic stress disorder (Just saying). And the my two babysitters riley and cassie are locked up for a long time.

Cutting is stupid!!
Why? Because...although it may have some false...point that is magically inserted into some peoples head by others, it doesn't do shit! It puts people in a cycle of harm, dispair, and even more depression

Lets leave all this to the "Experts" who know everything about self harm! Unless your speaking from experience, making you a hypocrital person.


For me, cutting is all about control of body. Maybe the rest of you use it for a totally different reason.

Some people that harm themselves do it because they feel like they deserve it, like they did something wrong and they have to punish themself.

[theOperaGhost]

I don't think there is any discussion here. You could say cutting is good or bad to someone, they're probably still gonna do it.



Things arent that bad? Dude, you obviously weren't a sex slave for your childhood and having to do deal with post traummatic stress disorder (Just saying). And the my two babysitters riley and cassie are locked up for a long time.

If you will notice by reading one of my posts either here or in "aaron's story" I said "live in a SAFE home." You obviously didn't answer "yes" to that question, because it doesn't exactly sound like you live in a safe environment. I bet a majority of the people who do self harm DO actually live in a SAFE environment though. However, I will still state that cutting is no way to cope with PTSD. Get professional help, because you're only making things worse for yourself by harming yourself.

I am glad to hear those two fucking cunts are locked up for a long time though! They deserve it...dumb bitches.

[RaeNose]

It's interesting, because cutting is what you'd consider to be a maladaptive behavior. There are many theories that are said to lead to cutting and depression such as chemical imbalances of the brain, traumatic experiences, even reinforcement from others. For those who do cut, they'll say it's the only choice they have. Is it? No. To be frank it does suck, but it is like a drug and sometimes it gets to the point where one has to reach out because, without help from people, they will not be able to overcome it. This could have been why the hypothectical video was originally made. They can't control themselves, it's not a positive situation to be in and they know they should stop, but they can't. It's one of the most addictive things one can get into. I know, I am a cutter.
For those who don't understand it or never have done it, they probably won't understand. Ever. It's the brutal, but honest truth. People will say it's stupid, and a lot of cutters will say it's stupid too. But they honestly cannot control it. They may have controlled it before, but it ends up out of their hands and onto their body, like a wild fire slowly consuming them.

[Atonement]

I think you missed the point...

Feel free to elaborate.

[deadpie]

For those who do cut, they'll say it's the only choice they have. Is it? No. To be frank it does suck, but it is like a drug and sometimes it gets to the point where one has to reach out because, without help from people, they will not be able to overcome it. This could have been why the hypothectical video was originally made. They can't control themselves, it's not a positive situation to be in and they know they should stop, but they can't. It's one of the most addictive things one can get into. I know, I am a cutter.
For those who don't understand it or never have done it, they probably won't understand. Ever. It's the brutal, but honest truth. People will say it's stupid, and a lot of cutters will say it's stupid too. But they honestly cannot control it. They may have controlled it before, but it ends up out of their hands and onto their body, like a wild fire slowly consuming them.
I'm gonna have to agree with you. And cutting is pretty much like a drug. It gets out of hand. And the more you do it the more you feel the other coping mechanisms you use to have dissapear.
Cutting brings a whole cycle in motion, and you get lots of mixed feelings about it, and in the end, you have to just do it again.
And your totally right that people that have never done it wouldn't understand it. I DO NOT mean everyone that hasn't self harmed themselves should go and slit their skin.
For the attention seeking idea, i think its kind of attention whoring when people do it on their wrist and don't cover it up or end up covering it up but making it so obvious. I prefer doin it on my upper legs and stomach. I did it on my wrist from time to time but i would just put some of this "Special stuff" i have to make it look like nothing happened. But it seems like anyone i know who's just cut their wrists seems to have nothing really wrong and seems like they're looking for some type of attention.

I promise you, attention is not what you want from self harming. People will see, make fun of you for it, tease you, ask you questions, you'll get sent to the councolour, they tell your parents, and it makes too much drama. So don't try getting attention.

[RaeNose]

See, I'm going to have to disagree. If you need help, you're going to need to bring it to someone's attention. I have personally never met someone who intentionally shows off their scars. I just stopped wearing long sleeves because I was sick of hiding it. And, I had stopped cutting my arms, so they were only scars. Although, I'm glad we can find something to agree on. :)
Generally people don't want to be discovered when they self harm, because of all the ridicule and pain associated with it. They don't want to be locked away like they're some type of freak.

[Antares]

Okay, let me rewind here because this seems to be becoming a war between the s/hers and the non s/hers which is not really gonna be a healthy debate.

Lets me lay down some things quit. No, I have never attempted to harm my body because I was depressed or needed to "cope". No, I don't plan on it. So I guess I am not an "expert"........the way you view it. However the people that are "experts" thats not exactly the best thing to be since if you are on this site it is safe to assume that you think s/h is bad and you are trying to seek help somehow.

Now.

Lets leave all this to the "Experts" who know everything about self harm! Unless your speaking from experience, making you a hypocrital person.


For me, cutting is all about control of body. Maybe the rest of you use it for a totally different reason.

Some people that harm themselves do it because they feel like they deserve it, like they did something wrong and they have to punish themself.Okay, so we have established that you're the "expert", great.
But can you please explain to me what you mean by "control of the body"...how are you controllign your body when youre deciding to go against your natural instinct and harming yourself????

Wheres the self control you're insinuating here??? I don't think it is there. Which leads me to believe that your reasons or motives or logic for s/h are either not properly stated or is just not true.

As for your other comment. I agree, some people do s/h for that and I did state in my last post that there are "special cases" or other reasons or whatever.

So what do you mean by control of body please


EDIT: Also, I agree mostly with Raenose's post. Umm, however...
there is a point where I think the people that choose not to s/h or whatever and the people that do s/h split.
That is this part:
To be frank it does suck, but it is like a drug and sometimes it gets to the point where one has to reach out because, without help from people, they will not be able to overcome it.Personally, thats where I started to deviate from my agreements with you.
Yes, it sucks. yes its like a drug. But as you stated in the sentence before, it is NOT the only way to "cope" and you can't overcome anything when you are self harming.
Like I said. Its a cycle. You are addicted. Its like a drug.
A meth head will keep coming back and coming back and always end up at point 1.
So umm, there is no reaching out...I mean...I can't speak for everyone but it seems like the people but sometimes they are scared to reach out or dont do it properly or dont do it at all.

i know my point is becoming clouded but umm...yea. thats where the beliefs separate in my opinion

I say get to the root of the problem with whatever way possible.
Obviously there are more healthy ways to "cope" than causing yourself physical pain to mask other pains.

[Triceratops]

Are they attention whores? Yes. LET ME EXPLAIN Why? Because they come on this forum for 'help' initially...but in my OWN opinion it ends up glorifying self harm. How? Because you have a friggin calendar with people posting every time they s/h and then people go aww, talk to me, whatever whatever, when 2 weeks later they post the same shit. Its an endless cycle (it seems).

I have to agree with most of what you're saying. This part especially.
That's why I hate that self-harm calendar, and I've given up on it.
When someone posts "OMFG GUYS I'M GONNA CAVE NOW SRSLY I WANT TO DIE LYK NOW." it's more than obvious attention-seeking. Not everyone is fishing for sympathy in that thread, but these days I'd say roughly around 75% of them probably are.

It gives people the initial impression that each and every other self-harmer is just like that, when they aren't.

[Atonement]

John, the control is actually quite logical if you have experienced it.

Before SH: People feel numb. They might not be able to feel anything but they know they should. They have no way to recognize they pain they should be feeling.

Why SH?: People SH, often, because of this pain. The emotional pain cannot be expressed properly so they turn to physical pain to express the pain. It is a brutal way, yes, but it gets the emotional pain which is ten times worse than the physical pain.

[mrmcdonaldduck]

this thread needs to be closed, its too controversial.

[Triceratops]

this thread needs to be closed, its too controversial.

This is a debate forum, what do you expect?

[The Batman]

this thread needs to be closed, its too controversial.
There is a report button for a reason. This thread is fine.

[AutumnDae]

I have to agree with most of what you're saying. This part especially.
That's why I hate that self-harm calendar, and I've given up on it.
When someone posts "OMFG GUYS I'M GONNA CAVE NOW SRSLY I WANT TO DIE LYK NOW." it's more than obvious attention-seeking. Not everyone is fishing for sympathy in that thread, but these days I'd say roughly around 75% of them probably are.

It gives people the initial impression that each and every other self-harmer is just like that, when they aren't.

Sameeeeeee feelings.

That Self Harm calender should be deleted in my opinion. But when someone posts what Marcie stated, they are definitely seeking attention, no doubt. It's fine if you want to talk to someone about self harming, but you should do so in private, not by seeking so much attention by the whole population. That's what we have Counselor's for! Hey! I'm a counselor! People looking to talk can PM me! Or ChokeChain! That's what we are here for!

And I understand that people want sympathy, but they are definitely doing it in the wrong way. If you feel just like ranting about SH, and you're not looking for attention, a blog would get a lot less replies, and it would get things off your chest.

[Antares]

I totally agree with Pandora. (i guess youre marcie, big username change :P threw me off lmao)

No, this thread doesn't need to be closed. This is what this forum is for.

Now I have said that when people are depressed, whatever, etc. they want attention. Thats not necessarily a bad thing at all. You want the love, care, etc that you are missing. It just comes to a point where the attention that is being received is all wrong and the way that youre getting it is wrong.

But the reason I responded was because of Addis post.

Umm, from the people that I have talked with about this, they said they felt numb AFTER they cut. It made sense that way but I don't understnad why it would be before like you said.
There are alternatives to cutting your self to express emotional pain. I think that without the influence of others doing it we would have less people doing this and that would be good.

[INFERNO]

This is quite an interesting read. I do think that some individuals who do self-harm do it for attention but others do not do it for attention. Some people who are depressed do engage in self-harm but others who are depressed don't engage in it. My opinions below are not for online declarations of self-harm and such (see the part where I say it is further below).

As for my views on self-harm, I see it as quite maladaptive. The best way I can summarize my view on it is that it's a short-term gain, long-term pain. The act of self-harm can release endorphins, enkelphins, etc..., however, this isn't about the biological mechanisms that lead to a pleasure after self-harming and then a drop in the pleasure after some additional time passes.

However, I see it as maladaptive for some other reasons. First, self-harming leaves marks no matter where you do it or how deep you do it. Obviously for those who do it a fair amount, it would be deeper and probably in more locations on the body. The reason why I use this argument for explaining one reason why I view it as maladaptive is that after one has cut, then the mark left on the skin doesn't instantly vanish. The marks are a reminder of what has occurred and they can make the individual feel worse about themselves, thereby leading to a rather vicious cycle.

Another reason why it is maladaptive, after one has cut, as mentioned there are marks left behind. Cutting isn't something accepted by the general population and so the cutter generally wishes to conceal their marks. Now they have to worry about someone seeing the cuts and as it is something that is more recognized, especially by the younger (but also possibly by the older) crowds, people are well aware of what the marks mean. The cutter doesn't wish for others to know and this contributes to the long-term pain mentioned above; after the cut, they have to worry about whether others will see it and so forth. They have to change their routines yet not let the reason for the change be obvious. This creates more stress on the person and they are then also reminded of a possible relief for the stress: self-harming.

I view cutting as being a cry for help but the person isn't willing to go out and get help so the only alternative left is themselves. When someone does cutting on the wrists or on some other very visible part of their body, I view it as a cry for help; there are so many other places where one could cut yet they choose one of the most visible areas. I also view it as the person may contemplate suicide but not be able to carry out the deed.

This is the part for online declarations of self-harming

My views on this are pretty simple, when someone says that they are going to cut, I view it as a plea for others to help them. In other words, it's a bait, they know that on VT forums cutting isn't going to be encouraged (and probably the same on most other forums and websites) so they know that people are going to respond and try to coax them out of it. In that case, I do believe that when someone claims they're going to self-harm (and this goes for non-online situations), it's an act to get attention. This is not to say though that actually going out and about to do the actual deed is to get attention.

For online declarations of self-harm, I see no other reason other than to get attention. Perhaps the person wants help or perhaps they want something else, regardless, it's an act of attention. Sadly though, it's not always certain (unless you know the person well enough) that the person really won't do much harm to themselves.

Some people have also mentioned self-harm calenders. This goes with what I was saying of a method to get attention. Why? Because you knowingly post it for others to see rather than making it private for only you to see. It's also safe to assume that people are going to want to help you because you're admitting you're not well and that you're beating yourself up (literally) to express yourself and to get some relief.