U.S.'s (and world's course)

[Antares]

Hey guys,

Well I really don't feel like making a really big intro post but I really would like to see this becoming a really thorough debate/convo.

So basically I would like to know what you guys think is contributing to the depletion of the economy, war, global warming, Myanmar, etc. All of the crap that is happening in the U.S. I really don't want to be biased against other nationalities so I would also like other members to politely state their opinions in our...weird world. I really think that this would be interesting to read so does anyone have any opinions on how our world is...going down...or at least IMO I think it is. Some of you think we are doing fine so if so post that here. :D

[iJack]

I really have no opinion, i have to concentrate on my studies and living under the rock named childhood

[*Dissident*]

It only goes down if we let it.

[Oblivion]

I believe that mainly this happened when people got tricked, voted for bush, then he sent us to war, causing more fear, and more economic crashes. His actions caused a ridiculously large influence on the world and that is part of it. Global warming.. Well... Its just the problem of america, when something is old, throw it out, buy a new one. Myanmar... Haven't been following that as much, it kind of scares me to think some countries are run by armies who don't let support come in when people are dying

[Antares]

Well, was it really Bush who caused all of this?

There are many factors but is he really the one to blame or just the easy one to blame?

[iJack]

Well, was it really Bush who caused all of this?

There are many factors but is he really the one to blame or just the easy one to blame?

easy one

[Oblivion]

Well there are thousands of factors, but i believe the main factor is bush.

[*Dissident*]

I mean, Bush didnt cause Myanmar, and he didnt do all this shit by himself. He has a whole building or three full of people to help him bullshit america and the world.

[Antares]

True dat. Maybe he feels that he has to perform for his party or something. Although, if he would have listened to his country he would be in a better place.

[Oblivion]

No No No i mean about the war and economy bush was the main factor.

Myanmar was a natural disaster, global warming started before bush... ALONG time ago

[kolte]

That is such a deep a varied argument. I don't know where to start and where to finish. The United States has so many problems. Even though you may disagree, which I'm sure you will, I think a great deal of our problems extend from capitalism.

Capitalism leads to over consumption, over production, excess waste.

Our government is mismanaged because our representatives are more concerned with there own pet projects.

Our food industry is built to make money, and so quality is generally ignored. Our processed food is mainly made up of commodity #2 corn and vitamin supplements, our meat raised on giant feed lots. Why pay a lot of money for a varied diet when you can make it out of cheap corn?

Terrorists aren't near as nasty as we make them out to be. Most of the terror attacks happening now are in retaliation to the United States and Europe occupying and infiltrating where our western ways are not wanted or needed. Muslims aren't the enemy, and neither are there religious radicals. There culture and traditions are not anyones business but there own. Free Palestine, but whatever right? >>

We chop down all the trees, rape the land of its natural resources, pollute the water, cover the ground in concrete and tar and burn everything in sight. We transform mighty biospheres into constricted, divided, and fenced in plots. Then we are amazed that the environment cant function properly, and deny that our way of life is harmful to anything, or else don't care because it doesn't effect us yet.

Every body is out to hustle and to make money. Its all about the empire they can create and the wealth they can appropriate. And the T.V. drives it into us day and night. Be rich! Then you can buy all this crap! And we through ourselves into debt acting like were rich. Because of course, once your poor you don't mean anything to society. You are looked upon with contempt, and pity.

The economy is shutting down because of energy prices, a slumping housing market (people can't afford to pay there loans off with the coast of living and low pay), Low moral amongst consumers.

I could go all day. All night too. Maybe all week. No longer then a week though. And plus I would have to take breaks. And I'd need to be paid. And If it takes more then 40 hours then I want time and a half. It better be under the table too because I don't want to fill out a W2.

[Oblivion]

i wish i had the finger strength to write that kolte. I agree completely :) Awesome post

[kolte]

I rock climb ;)

[Antares]

Lol,

Anyways I totally agree with what you said.

What I find interesting is that WAGES ARE NOT INCREASING. A weird point that was brought to me is that soon gas will be the same price as peoples wages per hour!!
So basically if you work for one hour that is a gallon of gas! We are getting all of these increased things such as an increase in food, gas, anything prices but people are not getting paid more! It makes no sense!

We need our government to step in and do something about it. Except the problem that may result from that is businesses may go bankrupt, etc. and then that will lead to even more problems

[Random_oso06]

Well, was it really Bush who caused all of this?

There are many factors but is he really the one to blame or just the easy one to blame?

many people say yes and i agree because the real reason that they went to war was because to the oil company and bush isand so would bush with the oil company if catch my drift what do all people want they want money and if you imagin if the oil company got that oil they would be rich but i know that thegovernment wouldn't agree with that so that when he made the lie that the reason that there going to war was b/c they had explosives but when they looked for it they couldn't find anyand thats what proves my point

[0=]

We need to start using the land properly and producing food organically. We also need to put more funding into nuclear fusion projects, such as ITER and DEMO, as fusion is truly the only viable alternative if we're to continue using energy at an increasing rate. We also need to stop fighting each other over oil, which goes hand in hand with developing alternatives such as fusion. In the short term we could use solar panels and construct a global electrical grid, as fusion requires time, not just money. If the entire planet were linked in a grid, like the internet, we would always have available solar power. Combine this with newer battery technology and the problem can be solved. Of course this international collaboration is not going to happen, so we're likely screwed.

[Underground_Network]

At the moment, prices are going up and salaries are staying stagnant... The U.S. economy has always been on the verge of being screwed, and now it is past the "verge", it is now officially screwed... With Bush as president don't expect much, but we have to be aware, that even though I hate Bush with a passion, he isn't the only reason the world is in hell right now, and the world will continue to deteriorate as we progress [if you can call it that as, as we "progress" we won't be making any "progress"]... I hate to say this, but the future looks bleak, at least for the United States... What sucks is that, at one point the United States helped everybody out [or at least made it look that way], but when they did that, they also corrupted a bunch of Third World countries' minds and nowadays [even though it is just human nature, not the fault of the U.S.], everyone wants to be rich, everyone wants to be famous, everyone wants to be #1 [though I would never want to be #1 or #2]. People are willing to do anything for it. They're willing to kill for power and wealth. They don't care who gets hurt in the process. It's funny how the wealthy seem to be able to do whatever they want, live carefree, when they're the one's who deserve to suffer, and how the poor have to struggle throughout their lives, when they're the ones who really don't deserve to be suffering... But anyways, the U.S. really sucks, because right now oil and energy are so fucking important, that the U.S. is willing overlook GENOCIDE. "Oh, you're killing millions of your own people and funding it illegally? Oh, well, how about we help you fund it legally by giving you money for your oil? Sound good? Okay." <- Now that's not exactly how it "went"/"goes" down, but that's how I interpret it... The world is so fucked up right now, and there's no fixing it right now, because there are no "incredible" leaders out there. There are some good leaders out there, I'll admit it, but no one good enough to help fix the world. There's too much prejudice, too much hate. People are going to grow up living with all this prejudice and hate, and they're going to begin to prejudge and to hate, and thus our generation could bring upon us World War III, or even something bigger, much bigger....

[Antares]

Wow that was right what I was thinking. I think our future does look bleak. I think we will all die in a nuclear war in 50 years :)

Sounds fun huh?!

[Underground_Network]

I don't even think that what ever happens in our future will be considered "war"... They'll probably come up with some new term for it... And there are so many possible ways for us to "meet our maker" so to speak... I still like the idea that we're headed into an unstable part of the galaxy and that we're all going to be crushed...

[Maverick]

The reason why prices are going up yet wages aren't increasing is because the value of our money, the dollar, is decreasing. Gas and food prices are going up because the dollar is going down. When the dollar loses its value more dollars are needed to make up the difference of the lost value. Whenever you hear on the news that the dollar reached a new record low against the Euro, those are the consequences.

When you have a government and central bank that prints money to finance wars and deficits its going to dilute the value of our money because more dollars are in circulation. Raising taxes is a very unpopular move with the politicians so instead they go to our central bank for a "loan" which is nothing more than printed money and as a result prices go up and our wages don't go as far as they used to. As of right now you are witnessing the loss of our purchasing power.

Whoever said capitalism is to blame is misunderstood. The principle of capitalism is savings. Our country has a very distorted economic system to where it runs on consumption and a negative savings rate. In order to correct that, we need to start saving and producing again.

Our whole banking system and currency is based off trust. Right now there's an illusion that there's wealth behind our money when there isn't and people around the world are beginning to notice and move their assets out of the dollar. When the trust becomes lost and confidence in the dollar drops, that's when the real pain will hit. The world won't forever continue to accept paper dollars when here at home the government continues to debase it.

[kolte]

Whoever said capitalism is to blame is misunderstood. The principle of capitalism is savings.

The principle of capitalism is private property, and investment. Those who own the private property invest in business practices in hopes of turning a profit. Profit is the only goal of our economy, and we will seek this profit regardless of the consequences.

The careless chase of profit is why the roads were paved, the trees felled, the waste dumped into rivers and piled into heaps to be buried. It is responsible for the neglect in environmental standards in regards to the transportation industry, the search for oil, the creation of herbicide, pesticide, artificial nitrogen, processed foods, urban immigration and the collapse of the family farm. The raising of fences, the invasion of countries and so on and so forth until you end up with todays world.

Capitalisms money hungry, hustler society is responsible for the current circumstances.

Our country has a very distorted economic system to where it runs on consumption and a negative savings rate. In order to correct that, we need to start saving and producing again.

But that doesn't solve the big picture. Its like putting tape over a hole to fix a leak. The hole is still there.

[Maverick]

The principle of capitalism is private property, and investment. Those who own the private property invest in business practices in hopes of turning a profit. Profit is the only goal of our economy, and we will seek this profit regardless of the consequences.
Yes, investment comes from the savings which I mentioned earlier. Profit is a goal of capitalistic economy but its not the only one.

You have such a grim view of business owners. You act as if making a profit is an evil thing because great things come from profit. Profit motivates people because we all like to be rewarded for the work we do and it doesn't mean everyone is going to go through unethical lengths to get it. A lot of businesses care about reputation and usually when there's a scandal of unethical practice and their customers are outraged, out of fear of losing profit they'll clean up their act. So it can also motivate people to do the right thing, sincerity or not, and not always the bad one.

The careless chase of profit is why the roads were paved, the trees felled, the waste dumped into rivers and piled into heaps to be buried. It is responsible for the neglect in environmental standards in regards to the transportation industry, the search for oil, the creation of herbicide, pesticide, artificial nitrogen, processed foods, urban immigration and the collapse of the family farm. The raising of fences, the invasion of countries and so on and so forth until you end up with todays world.No, the careless chase of profit isn't what caused that. Its innovation and the invention of new ideas that provided it. Sure capitalism enables such inventions to be possible, but throughout human history we have invented technology to make our lives better and easier. If you have a problem with that then you shouldn't be using the computer.

Capitalisms money hungry, hustler society is responsible for the current circumstances.
I refuse to believe capitalism and the free market have failed because we aren't living in such a system to discredit it. The free market hasn't failed, government has failed. Excessive regulation, excessive taxation, needless wars, having a military empire around the world, having a currency backed by nothing that gets printed like crazy, having a Congress spend trillions a year, and having an unscrupulus banking system is what got us into this mess.

Capitalism hasn't failed, bad government has.

[0=]

We were screwed as soon as coal and oil were discovered.

[iJack]

We were screwed as soon as coal and oil were discovered.

i second that!

[redcar]

We were screwed as soon as coal and oil were discovered.
Not really. It has always been the case through time and will always be the case. There is always something that people want and the market is in an oligopoly type situation, only a few sellers.

When the oil and coal goes a different commodity will take over and once again there will be a few who control it and will make massive profits.

[0=]

I'm talking more about the environment and the planet's ability to sustain our society.

[Antares]

I'm talking more about the environment and the planet's ability to sustain our society.
Yeah your right!
Its getting impossible. Well it is going to be impossible.

Throwing the fact out that the US is 4% (?) of the worlds population but we take up 20%(?????) of the worlds resources