Gay panic defense

[James Dean]

What do you think of the gay panic defense?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gay_panic_defense

Basically, it allows for people who assault, or kill LGBT individuals protection as somehow that justified why they did what they did.

For example. If a son comes out to his dad as gay, the father kills the son. He has the gay panic defense and he could get less time in jail.

Another one, a transgender woman is with a guy, and she reveals that she's transsexual to him, and she is murdered, it's fine because it's gay panic defense.

One more example, a guy who is openly gay flirts with a straight guy and he gets uncomfortable and assaults him or worse. He's protected because of the gay panic defense.

As far as the United States is concerned, California is the only state to where this claim wouldn't get you that far, but it could still be used in some cases.

However everywhere else, the gay panic defense could still be used.

Do you think it's right or wrong?

[Judean Zealot]

For mild assault I can hear it, but beyond that it seems absurd.

[Joseph_II]

I think it is pretty darn stupid. Nobody who didn't have something against the LGBT+ community in the first place would use that.
I'd say it's similar beating someone you slept with because they didn't tell you they had a STD.

[SethfromMI]

I think it is pretty darn stupid. Nobody who didn't have something against the LGBT+ community in the first place would use that.
I'd say it's similar beating someone you slept with because they didn't tell you they had a STD.

Well to be fair, if I slept with someone who had an STD and they willingly kept it a secret I would beat them too

that being said the gay panic defense is ridiculous

[Deactivated]

The definition alone is enough to make me vomit. Killing anyone for their sexual orientation makes you scum, and any laws allowing you to justify it because of their orientation shouldn't be aloud in any way whatsoever.

And on the topic of STD's, being angry at someone for not telling you they have one can be easily justified. Such things can put your health at risk.

[Melodic]

I disagree with this completely. You shouldn't kill somebody for who they're interested in or who they are. That's like my mom killing me because I like pasta and she doesn't. It's stupid, and it surprises me that someone was so heartless to even think of this law.

[Miserabilia]

I think you've got it the wrong way around:

panic due to the pressure of uncontrollable perverse sexual cravings

I think this was actualy used as a defense for gay killers, as in somehow their sexuality drove them temporarily insane.

It's bullshit ofcourse, based on some kind of old fashioned freudian psychiatry. Not to mention almost all straight men experience "uncontrollable perverse sexual cravings" on a daily basis... Most women too, actualy.

[lliam]

Good to know.

So if I kill my maths teacher , because he gave me 4 instead 2, like expected, I say I suffered from Maths Panic Defense.


I think this was actualy used as a defense for gay killers, as in somehow their sexuality drove them temporarily insane.


yeah. bullshit in both versions.

[Perfectly Flawed]

It sounds ridiculous and has no scientific evidence to back it up. In other words it's not a real thing.

[lliam]

Anyway, everyone can use the argument to have acted on impulse. So why such bloody dumb excuses?

[Stronk Serb]

Well, if I was dating a transexual and not knowing that and it not notifying me of that, I would be fucking pissed to and possibly get violent.

[Dalcourt]

Anyway, everyone can use the argument to have acted on impulse. So why such bloody dumb excuses?

That's what I thought, too.

[Uniquemind]

Wow.


Well I think there should be legal recourse both civil and criminal charges in cases where someone is deceived into being with someone with an STD, or someone who led you to believe they were a certain physical gender and were not, I do not believe there should be a legal defense for killing them on these grounds.

[Desuetude]

Well, if I was dating a transexual and not knowing that and it not notifying me of that, I would be fucking pissed to and possibly get violent.
And because you get a bit angry that should give you the right to murder a person with little repercussions?

[Stronk Serb]

And because you get a bit angry that should give you the right to murder a person with little repercussions?

No, I wouldn't murder anyone for that. Relationshios are about honesty and if the other kept that big thing in it's pants a secret from me, I would be damn pissed and leave.

[Desuetude]

No, I wouldn't murder anyone for that. Relationshios are about honesty and if the other kept that big thing in it's pants a secret from me, I would be damn pissed and leave.
It's understable that you might be shocked and shock makes people behave and think irrationally so 'being pissed and leaving' seems like a fair reaction. This 'gay panic defense' shit doesn't talk about leaving though, but assaulting the person and claiming it as 'self defense' or some other bull. So I don't know if you're agreeing with the concept or not.

[Karkat]

Why not just let people kill anyone they don't like? Why not just make homicide legal and socially acceptable? Goddamn, this is the stupidest thing I've ever heard.

[Stronk Serb]

It's understable that you might be shocked and shock makes people behave and think irrationally so 'being pissed and leaving' seems like a fair reaction. This 'gay panic defense' shit doesn't talk about leaving though, but assaulting the person and claiming it as 'self defense' or some other bull. So I don't know if you're agreeing with the concept or not.

Not really. I won't punch or kill a gay guy for subtle advances toward me or if my child is gay.

[Judean Zealot]

The law doesn't say "it's alright to assault a gay because you're in a panic". The law is that the defense can use it to mitigate the sentence. There are a million 'temporary insanity' bullshit defenses like this, so why shouldn't this one exist?

[James Dean]

A recent gay panic defence case.

http://www.thenewcivilrightsmovement.com/ericrosswood/here_s_why_this_man_will_get_a_light_sentence_after_killing_his_gay_cousin

Guy murdered his gay cousin and is getting a reduced sentence.

[dxcxdzv]

'the fuck did I just read.

[Nightfall_]

I am honestly disgusted,
it doesn't matter what your sexuality or race or which gender you are. NO ONE should be beaten for it. it doesn't give the attacker any right to do what they do just because of homosexuality and being uncomfortable.

[Jean Poutine]

OP's post makes it sound much, much worse than it is.

The gay panic defence applies only when a straight person receives sexual advances from a non-straight person and is so frightened or offended by them that he injures or kills the other person.

Basically it is a mens rea negation that works in the same vein as an irresistible impulse or provocation defence. I would also like to point out that this defence, like most provocation defences, merely lessens the charges, it never brings acquittal.

Personally, I think that in rare cases, it can happen that some people become so blinded with a hodgepodge of emotions upon being sexually propositioned by an homosexual that they lose control of their actions. I can certainly see it happening in the case of a trans person. Most jurisdictions already admit that various situations, including threats, can bring on such a state of mind (or lack of it to be precise). Why can't it work in that case? Because the victim is LGBT?

A lack of mens rea is a lack of mens rea, no matter the source of it.

[hesaidhesaid]

Wait...this clause is LEGAL?! Give me an effing break. YOU GOTTA BE SERIOUS.
How do you back this with any form of physiological or mental reasoning? You'd have to be seriously disturbed to even THINK of this as an idea for backing your own case.

To those who use this as a reason, get yourself checked. To those who THINK this is a legitimate reason to back a case for murder (I wouldn't even call it manslaughter or anything below it), I'd check your definition of human rights. Shocking.

[James Dean]

Yeah this is exactly why I keep my sexual orientation to myself and I actually want to get out of the United States ASAP. Despite the new gay marriage law, that doesn't mean shit to me.