Why are there so many fascists and nazis on here?

[sunnieseason]

I'm so confused and annoyed by this, but why are there so many fascists, communists, nazis, or other totalitarians on this board?

[Vermilion]

Everyone has there own opinion/ view by saying your annoyed by it that's intolerant. Don't you think so ? I like fascism but I'm not ain't gay, Jewish or any other religion Or immigration. I expect everyone. My political view doesn't change my feelings for others. I don't judge people for there choices I judge them by the way they act.

[Microcosm]

Heil Hitler!

Just kidding. But yeah I don't think it's a big deal.

[kev99]

I find strange to place communists in the same line as nazis and fascists. Sure, supporters of Stalin or Mao could definitely be, but communism and stalinism or maoism are definitely very different things.

And yeah, I find that disturbing. fascism of nazism only bought war and destruction on a large scale. How can people nowadays still defend such ideas goes beyond me.

[MrSchaef]

Im 96 percent german but im not a nazi ;)

[phuckphace]

ayy lmao there's like 2 or 3 fascists and a couple nationalists and no Nazis that I'm aware of

then again by OP's definition anyone who supports a government that does anything besides "enforce contracts" (i.e. everybody) is a totalitarian statist :lol3:

monitoring this thread for joocy Millennialisms

[Uranus]

Heil Hitler!

Just kidding. But yeah I don't think it's a big deal.

Lol I was about to say the same thing :D


-------

Same, I don't think it's a big deal. If they do annoy you, you can block those who do. That way you don't have to read their posts. But honestly it's not a big deal

[ImCoolBeans]

Grand total of.... 6? Maybe?
Yup, everyone is a nazi.

[Vermilion]

Please anyone ! Is not saying she gets annoyed by them showing intolerance ?

[Body odah Man]

I'm so confused and annoyed by this, but why are there so many fascists, communists, nazis, or other totalitarians on this board?

Communism itself isn't a totalitarianism; Stalin and the Rusisans turned it into one. As for the rest of them, those are annoying yeah

[Vlerchan]

I just hate freedom /:

[Babs]

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/3N6P0Ru1Nbc/maxresdefault.jpg
Prepare yourself for the red tide. The truth is out there.

[Microcosm]

The sarcastic comments of this thread are astounding.

[Dreamer98]

Most of them are just fantasying , most of users live in countries with big freedom degree , so they don't have better business , and they don't know what is it like to live in some countries with some sick political system , and they're fantasying being dictators , etc ... Believe me , they're "dangerous" only on internet and keyboard . :)

[Lovelife090994]

I despise racism and hatred, but I doubt this board would keep true Nazis and Fascists or true KKKs.

[sunnieseason]

Everyone has there own opinion/ view by saying your annoyed by it that's intolerant. Don't you think so ? I like fascism but I'm not ain't gay, Jewish or any other religion Or immigration. I expect everyone. My political view doesn't change my feelings for others. I don't judge people for there choices I judge them by the way they act.

Nazis, Fascists, Communists, and socialists have way more in common with each other than the freedom club. Each one of those ideologies is an example of totalitarian collectivism. What really annoys me is that we had an entire century of history of the most disgusting evils ever done onto humanity. There's nothing cool about any of those ideologies.

Everyone is certainly entitled to their own opinions, however, when you are a collectivist you actually believe that governments should take direct action against those who don't agree with you. You may think it's just your opinion, but it effects everyone else around you.

[Babs]

Nazis, Fascists, Communists, and socialists have way more in common with each other than the freedom club.

What exactly do communism and socialism have in common with Nazis?

[Vlerchan]

however, when you are a collectivist you actually believe that governments should take direct action against those who don't agree with you.
If I take action against a attempting murderer then that's me taking direct action against someone who doesn't agree with me. Is that immoral?

You can also appeal to the NAP but this doesn't counter the logic here. That just demonstrates that you hold to a different set of presumptions surrounding ethics.

[Microcosm]

... Believe me , they're "dangerous" only on internet and keyboard . :)

So Hitler never held any power beyond his internet and keyboard? Ideas have a large impact on the world, especially when you can get the masses to buy into them. Trust me, it's a bigger deal than you seem to realize.

[Ridonks_CB]

I have not seen one Nazi on this website yet- Nvm hi Rainbow Dash

Jk jk :P

[sunnieseason]

If I take action against a attempting murderer then that's me taking direct action against someone who doesn't agree with me. Is that immoral?

You can also appeal to the NAP but this doesn't counter the logic here. That just demonstrates that you hold to a different set of presumptions surrounding ethics.

you're such a troll.

[Ridonks_CB]

you're such a troll.

I see your question itself pretty trollish tbh

[Babs]

you're such a troll.

I don't see how that's trolling.
But hey, you ask a dumb question, you're bound to get dumb answers.

[BlueFoot]

I'm so confused and annoyed by this, but why are there so many fascists, communists, nazis, or other totalitarians on this board?

I consider myself a proud industrial and progressive Communist, because if it is run right and with out corrupt idiots like Stalin then it is perfect, and no clue about the Fascists I hate fascism but thats just me and most the world. Why are you even bringing Communism down to the level of Fascism, Communists and Fascists hate and despise each other so I don't see how they correlate. Also supporting Stalin is not Communist, its Stalinist which is pretty much pure disgusting Fascism.

Nazis, Fascists, Communists, and socialists have way more in common with each other than the freedom club. Each one of those ideologies is an example of totalitarian collectivism. What really annoys me is that we had an entire century of history of the most disgusting evils ever done onto humanity. There's nothing cool about any of those ideologies.

Everyone is certainly entitled to their own opinions, however, when you are a collectivist you actually believe that governments should take direct action against those who don't agree with you. You may think it's just your opinion, but it effects everyone else around you.


And what really annoys me is how you are so closed minded and arrogant, true Socialists and Communists HATE Fascists. Also Communist isn't Totalitarianism it is a proletariat AKA every person forming government, not one person or a group of people running government, but everyone the working class as a whole.

I wish there was a Like button I would be spamming the Sh*t out of that thing

[Dreamer98]

So Hitler never held any power beyond his internet and keyboard? Ideas have a large impact on the world, especially when you can get the masses to buy into them. Trust me, it's a bigger deal than you seem to realize.


I didn't say that Hitler was dangerous on keyboard , you just generalized my text , it was about guys that're living in 21st century , and they don't have better business than to eat shit on internet with their crazy ideas and ideologies . :D
I know that that kind of crazy ideas can have big impact , but that kind of ideology can never succeed , never ever , as far there are normal humans on this World .

[SethfromMI]

ayy lmao there's like 2 or 3 fascists and a couple nationalists and no Nazis that I'm aware of

then again by OP's definition anyone who supports a government that does anything besides "enforce contracts" (i.e. everybody) is a totalitarian statist :lol3:

monitoring this thread for joocy Millennialisms

you win sir :D

[CosmicNoodle]

OMG people are allowed to have there own opinions?!?!?! Outrageous!



On a more serious note:

Redistribute wealth! All men must be equal! Praise Karl Marx!

[Zenos]

Long story short despite the intolreance of society toward people that hold unpopular beliefs and give lip service to tolerance all the while trying to shut up and crush such types and Nazis etc etc they have the right to free speech and should not be denied that right even if we do not agree with them!

[Capto]

lol free speech

[BlueFoot]

you win sir :D

Yup I'm mashing the imaginary like button

[Miserabilia]

there aren't. I see more left oriented people here than anything remotely fascist.

[Dalcourt]

I see a few communists but I never realized that there are many Nazis.
Anyway I don't feel like those forum members harm anyone on here so I think as they have the right to free speech as anyone else we should accept this.
You don't have to talk to them or read there posts if you don't want to.

[Babs]

I see a few communists but I never realized that there are many Nazis.

That's because they were all burned during last year's Nazi witch hunt. There aren't any left for this year's. :/ OP must be so disappointed.

[Syrum]

The reason why they are here are there are many ex-USSR countries involved here too. I mean, I'm from Russia. Many Russian teens want to see USSR again, because it was great. Also socialism, and communism are great ideas. I'm not one, but they're very good ideas. But, they don't work. None the less many people wish they would work, and this is why they support.

[BlueFoot]

The reason why they are here are there are many ex-USSR countries involved here too. I mean, I'm from Russia. Many Russian teens want to see USSR again, because it was great. Also socialism, and communism are great ideas. I'm not one, but they're very good ideas. But, they don't work. None the less many people wish they would work, and this is why they support.

I agree comrade, I would love to see the friendly USSR back to, all we can do is put our faith in Father Putin.

[randomuser123]

Down with the commies! Libertarianism for all!

On a serious note - the actual political philosphies do make sense to a degree on paper, they just don't really hold up irl due to human nature!

[Stronk Serb]

After the introduction of democracy, my country began it's moral, intellectual and economic downfall. I say no more, order needs to be restored. This doesn't mean I am a hardcore Nazi or fascist but I incorporated some of their ideas, along with socialist ideas. I couldnt care less if you are a Rwandi, Jew, American or Martian, but if you come to live here, you have to abide the laws, work and learn the official language. That's what would be expected from me if I went to live in some other country. Also I share Putin's stance on minorities, I also apply it on immigrants.

[randomuser123]

After the introduction of democracy, my country began it's moral, intellectual and economic downfall. I say no more, order needs to be restored. This doesn't mean I am a hardcore Nazi or fascist but I incorporated some of their ideas, along with socialist ideas. I couldnt care less if you are a Rwandi, Jew, American or Martian, but if you come to live here, you have to abide the laws, work and learn the official language. That's what would be expected from me if I went to live in some other country. Also I share Putin's stance on minorities, I also apply it on immigrants.
How can you measure a moral and intellectual downfall? Also, if you hadn't noticed, everyone's economies crashed in the last 100 years or so.

[Capto]

ayy serbian brain drain lomo

Also, if you hadn't noticed, everyone's economies crashed in the last 100 years or so.

did u kno that it also rained in the last 100 years or so

[BlueFoot]

How can you measure a moral and intellectual downfall? Also, if you hadn't noticed, everyone's economies crashed in the last 100 years or so.

What he means is in america the people have no say anymore, if they vote in someone the government don't like or want, the people within the government(tht are appointed by the president, not voted in) can have a private re-vote to get the other leader ex. that happened in the last election between Mitt Romney and Obama

[randomuser123]

ayy serbian brain drain lomo



did u kno that it also rained in the last 100 years or so
Precisely - there is little connection between the lack of communism and the fall of the economy!

[Stronk Serb]

How can you measure a moral and intellectual downfall? Also, if you hadn't noticed, everyone's economies crashed in the last 100 years or so.

What I mean is: people value intellect less, more and more women dress like prostitutes and men behave like pigs. Also our economy is getting rekt by the western puppets who are systematically destroying our production and agriculture, forcing us to depend on imports. We can grow some damn fine corn and beans but we import them from FUCKING MADAGASCAR. What sense does it make?

[Karkat]

What I mean is: people value intellect less, more and more women dress like prostitutes and men behave like pigs. Also our economy is getting rekt by the western puppets who are systematically destroying our production and agriculture, forcing us to depend on imports. We can grow some damn fine corn and beans but we import them from FUCKING MADAGASCAR. What sense does it make?

Actually, people have always valued ignorance, acted like pigs, dressed like "prostitutes" and imported things for the sake of gain.

Like, as far as we, as humans, function as a species- it hasn't REALLY changed that much for the past thousandish years. We just have more technology, really.

We can do things better and faster, but we'll still look at someone who's different and go "kill"

[Stronk Serb]

Actually, people have always valued ignorance, acted like pigs, dressed like "prostitutes" and imported things for the sake of gain.

Like, as far as we, as humans, function as a species- it hasn't REALLY changed that much for the past thousandish years. We just have more technology, really.

We can do things better and faster, but we'll still look at someone who's different and go "kill"

The thing is, with all the tarrifs on imports and the way the beans have to travel, it must be cheaper to grow it yourself, plus you can claim subsidies, but no, they have to import them from half a world away. Before you had decency and the family was a pillar of society. Take the family apart and the whole society comes down.

[Karkat]

The thing is, with all the tarrifs on imports and the way the beans have to travel, it must be cheaper to grow it yourself, plus you can claim subsidies, but no, they have to import them from half a world away. Before you had decency and the family was a pillar of society. Take the family apart and the whole society comes down.

You didn't live in those times... You barely lived beyond the 21st century.

Family was indeed more important, as far as we can tell, but people have always been selfish and illogical.

[Stronk Serb]

You didn't live in those times... You barely lived beyond the 21st century.

Family was indeed more important, as far as we can tell, but people have always been selfish and illogical.

Yes, now... I guess because we lost all our traditional values and gave in to decadence, that we are falling apart.

[Karkat]

Yes, now... I guess because we lost all our traditional values and gave in to decadence, that we are falling apart.

People have always been hedonists???

[Stronk Serb]

People have always been hedonists???

Not talking about hedonism, talking about pure decadent behaviour from which nothing good comes out. With hedonistic behaviour stuff canfunction properly, but when you cross the lineinto decadence, all hell breaks loose.

[Karkat]

Not talking about hedonism, talking about pure decadent behaviour from which nothing good comes out. With hedonistic behaviour stuff canfunction properly, but when you cross the lineinto decadence, all hell breaks loose.

he·don·ism
ˈhēdəˌnizəm,ˈhedənˌizəm/
noun
the pursuit of pleasure; sensual self-indulgence.
synonyms: self-indulgence, pleasure-seeking, self-gratification, lotus-eating, sybaritism; More
the ethical theory that pleasure (in the sense of the satisfaction of desires) is the highest good and proper aim of human life.

...Quoi?

[Stronk Serb]

...Quoi?

Ok, I expressed it badly. Hedonism is a part of it, but when you add no sense of obligation, no sense of remorse or pity and think you are the boss, and you get this. We have half of our population making it a living hell for everyone.

[Karkat]

Ok, I expressed it badly. Hedonism is a part of it, but when you add no sense of obligation, no sense of remorse or pity and think you are the boss, and you get this. We have half of our population making it a living hell for everyone.

...And it's always been that way.

[Stronk Serb]

...And it's always been that way.

Well, to be honest, we didn't get the feel of the ghettos (your kind) here until the late nineties. Stuff was under control at least.

[Karkat]

Well, to be honest, we didn't get the feel of the ghettos (your kind) here until the late nineties. Stuff was under control at least.

...I'm not sure how I'm meant to respond to that.

[Stronk Serb]

...I'm not sure how I'm meant to respond to that.

Our police did it's job at that time. Proclamation of demicracy destabilized the government and made breeding grounds in the police and administration.

[Vlerchan]

Also our economy is getting rekt by the western puppets who are systematically destroying our production and agriculture, forcing us to depend on imports.
The West is not forcing Serbians to depend on imports. Serbs just find that importing from elsewhere is cheaper and choose to import. This should be indication to shift investment to more efficient production - production that Serbia can also export to the West. This would result in the best results for all people.

We can grow some damn fine corn and beans but we import them from FUCKING MADAGASCAR. What sense does it make?
Madagascar makes finer corns and beans so people purchase from Madagascar.

Makes sense to me.

The thing is, with all the tarrifs on imports and the way the beans have to travel, it must be cheaper to grow it yourself, plus you can claim subsidies, but no, they have to import them from half a world.
If it was cheaper it wouldn't happen.

---

You're also outlining issues I'm doubtful are related to democratic governance.

[Capto]

malagasy beans are pretty bad kappa

[randomuser123]

People don't import stuff because they feel like it. They do it because what they can import is either cheaper, better or both. Trust me when I say that if we took you out of the globalised economy and market now, your life wouldn't be fun. You would have barely any modern technology since you couldn't import it and the stuff you did have would increase massively in price.

Your comment that you are losing "traditional values" is also ridiculous. Those values include the ritualistic punishment of gay people, the ban of any pork products or cotton clothes and sheer rule by fear. The world has moved on from its "values" from 5 centuries ago.

Furthermore, communism is proven not to work in terms of stability. It runs completely against human nature. Read "The Selfish Gene" by Richard Dawkins - it explains how we exist because of our selfish nature. Without the opportunity of major personal gain, what is the point in working hard and trying to further yourself and your family?

Would you be able to give us a couple of examples of stable and pleasant communist nations around the world? Stable means there is no rioting, people are not living in mud huts and they are free to leave and to communicate with the outside world.

[Vlerchan]

Furthermore, communism is proven not to work in terms of stability.
No. It just hasn't worked in the past.

Considering that all the attempts at a socialist state that have been attempted have revolved around a single model - and there's a number of suggested models - I'm not inclined to place much weight in the above.

Read "The Selfish Gene" by Richard Dawkins - it explains how we exist because of our selfish nature.
There is no reason that selfishness - as Dawkins intends it - is incompatible with communism.

Without the opportunity of major personal gain, what is the point in working hard and trying to further yourself and your family?
Is there a reason that major personal gain has to be considered in monetary terms? Or can we just agree it's a product of the conditioning of our capitalist societies.

But - of course - under state socialism there was wage differentiation.

[randomuser123]

No. It just hasn't worked in the past.

Considering that all the attempts at a socialist state that have been attempted have revolved around a single model - and there's a number of suggested models - I'm not inclined to place much weight in the above.


There is no reason that selfishness - as Dawkins intends it - is incompatible with communism.


Is there a reason that major personal gain has to be considered in monetary terms? Or can we just agree it's a product of the conditioning of our capitalist societies.

But - of course - under state socialism there was wage differentiation.

No-one said that personal gain had to be monetary. It is just that we have evolved to want gain in some way, whether it is emotional, physical or monetary. If we weren't innately selfish, we would not have evolved to become the dominant species that we are today.

Selfishness is very much incompatible with communism. It is natural to work harder and do better so we gain more. If we do not gain more from doing better, why bother trying? Obviously doing better helps (in a minute way) the country, but since you will not personally gain from it, selfishly it makes little sense to do it!

Obviously we can only speak about instances of communism that have happened before, but I ask you, why hasn't a good variant been tried yet?

[Plane And Simple]

Any more troll post or bashing after this post and this is getting locked and warnings/infractions will be issued.

[Vlerchan]

No-one said that personal gain had to be monetary. It is just that we have evolved to want gain in some way, whether it is emotional, physical or monetary. If we weren't innately selfish, we would not have evolved to become the dominant species that we are today.
Ok. Well even the most fictitious socialist states that liberals erect have opportunities for non-monetary gain.

Obviously we can only speak about instances of communism that have happened before, but I ask you, why hasn't a good variant been tried yet?
In short:

The Bolsheviks won the Russian civil war and established their brand of Marxist Leninism. The USSR stuck the funding like-minded communist groups (and crushing dissimilar ones) - and these were like minded because the extent of Stalin and his predecessors information control made his brand of Marxist-Leninism seem desirable. It didn't help that Luxembourg died in 1918 - or so - which diminished the base for an intellectual critique when one was possible.

You had deviations in post-1960s Yugoslavia which most people consider more humane. You had a brief bouts of non-Marxist (anarchist) communism in the Ukraine and Catalonia - but Marxist-Leninists and Fascists (with Marxist-Leninist help) crushed both uprising.

I could expand but I'm on a phone and I'm just about to head out - so if I need to I'll do it later.

---

I also have no issue with speaking about the instances of communism [that you're aware of that] happened before". But it's illogical to cast communism off because if these.

[Karkat]

Our police did it's job at that time. Proclamation of demicracy destabilized the government and made breeding grounds in the police and administration.

All government is flawed.

[Melkor]

Nazis, Fascists, Communists, and socialists have way more in common with each other than the freedom club.
Sorry to be a little mean but this sentence shows bigotry at its core. Socialism has completely different basics than fascism and Nazism and the other hand communism is a democratic centrist ideology which focuses on an oligarchy as a form of government even though it does not have to be totalitarian. I subscribe to Socialism and also a semi-democratic style of government but I am completely pro freedom.

[Stronk Serb]

All government is flawed.

Yes, but it depends in which area. I would rather sacrifice this false sense of freedom for safety and social stability than to have my throat cut by some crackhead.

[fairmaiden]

c'est la vie des Virtual Teen Forums? idk

[Zenos]

The reason why they are here are there are many ex-USSR countries involved here too. I mean, I'm from Russia. Many Russian teens want to see USSR again, because it was great. Also socialism, and communism are great ideas. I'm not one, but they're very good ideas. But, they don't work. None the less many people wish they would work, and this is why they support.



LOL None of use was alive back in the days of the USSR,so anyone wanting the old USSR back and thinking it was great that's a teen has ROMANTIC notions about it!

Yes, but it depends in which area. I would rather sacrifice this false sense of freedom for safety and social stability than to have my throat cut by some crackhead.

The problem in America is we have been lead to think we have to have someone else protect us,fact is we need to be able to protect ourselves when the police are not around.

[Syrum]

Uhhh... A lot of teens in Russia like the USSR. I would know

[Stronk Serb]

LOL None of use was alive back in the days of the USSR,so anyone wanting the old USSR back and thinking it was great that's a teen has ROMANTIC notions about it!



The problem in America is we have been lead to think we have to have someone else protect us,fact is we need to be able to protect ourselves when the police are not around.

It's the job of the police to protect. The government should focus on lowering crime. People should sleep well at night, not worry about robberies or burglaries.

[Zenos]

It's the job of the police to protect. The government should focus on lowering crime. People should sleep well at night, not worry about robberies or burglaries.



Wrong the Supreme Court has ruled that the police did not have a constitutional duty to protect a person from harm.

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/28/politics/justices-rule-police-do-not-have-a-constitutional-duty-to-protect-someone.html

Uhhh... A lot of teens in Russia like the USSR. I would know

That doesn't mean they realize what they are idolizing is a good form of government. Remember this people who did not experience a certain time in history tend to romantizice it!

[Stronk Serb]

Wrong the Supreme Court has ruled that the police did not have a constitutional duty to protect a person from harm.

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/28/politics/justices-rule-police-do-not-have-a-constitutional-duty-to-protect-someone.html

Then what the fuck is the police there for, what fucktard writes a constitution and completely misses to add that the representatives of the law need to protect the people from harm? The government should add it to the constitution.

[Zenos]

Then what the fuck is the police there for, what fucktard writes a constitution and completely misses to add that the representatives of the law need to protect the people from harm? The government should add it to the constitution.


Well that's the post-911 Supreme court's ruling! Welcome to the Police State .

Read George Orwells classic book 1984 and compare it to Modern America!

[Body odah Man]

LOL None of use was alive back in the days of the USSR,so anyone wanting the old USSR back and thinking it was great that's a teen has ROMANTIC notions about it!



The problem in America is we have been lead to think we have to have someone else protect us,fact is we need to be able to protect ourselves when the police are not around.

Exatly. The USSR (I've seen documentaries and heard statements of settlers in it) was TERRIBLE. Every day your life was in danger and you could get killed for the flimsiest of evidence. It's good it ended

[Stronk Serb]

Well that's the post-911 Supreme court's ruling! Welcome to the Police State .

Read George Orwells classic book 1984 and compare it to Modern America!

Been planning to read it after school is done. A police state would be good if it kept absolute order, where crime commited wouldn't happen that often and it wouldn't be that severe.

[Zenos]

Been planning to read it after school is done. A police state would be good if it kept absolute order, where crime commited wouldn't happen that often and it wouldn't be that severe.

Ohhhh yeh a police state would be good, oh yeh study up on Nazi Germany, the old U.S.S.R, Facist Italy, Militant Japan.Trust me History teaches over and over that a Police state is NOT so good for the people,unless they happen to be the ones in power and then their power is precarious at the most as there is always someone trying to get their position!

[Uniquemind]

Ohhhh yeh a police state would be good, oh yeh study up on Nazi Germany, the old U.S.S.R, Facist Italy, Militant Japan.Trust me History teaches over and over that a Police state is NOT so good for the people,unless they happen to be the ones in power and then their power is precarious at the most as there is always someone trying to get their position!

Even for the ones in power though, people age , and one moment they're in charge, the next moment they're being back-stabbed by the next generation coming up in power under a facist rule.


I would argue at least in America people are adopting slippery-slope fallacy thinking, and are incorrectly attributing calling people facists or nazi's to explain the thread's question.

You cannot call something that label if it hasn't gotten to that level of severity yet. Anything claiming otherwise is a fallacy and is invalid.

[Danny_boi 16]

Everyone can have their political opinion and express it in anyway they want. Although I dislike some opinions, it's important (to me) to hear all sides of an argument. I think that helps me understand the world better, and helps adapt my beliefs as life goes on.

[Sir Suomi]

That fact that your grouped those together has Hitler, Mussolini, Lenin, and Stalin rolling over in their graves.

By the way, Nationalism is objectively the most important thing a society should consider before even considering on what form of government they want. If you need an example simply look at the middle east.

[Zenos]

Even for the ones in power though, people age , and one moment they're in charge, the next moment they're being back-stabbed by the next generation coming up in power under a facist rule.


I would argue at least in America people are adopting slippery-slope fallacy thinking, and are incorrectly attributing calling people facists or nazi's to explain the thread's question.

You cannot call something that label if it hasn't gotten to that level of severity yet. Anything claiming otherwise is a fallacy and is invalid.

slippery-slope fallacy thinking is the in thing,it keeps them from accepting reality that America is not what it was in the 20th century!

And the thing is most teens are readily and blindly adopting that type of thinking and yet think they are not!

[Uniquemind]

slippery-slope fallacy thinking is the in thing,it keeps them from accepting reality that America is not what it was in the 20th century!

And the thing is most teens are readily and blindly adopting that type of thinking and yet think they are not!

You nailed my main message point.


Now I'll add what I'm trying to tell everybody.

Stop it!

[project_icarus]

Oh no, communism!

[Zenos]

You nailed my main message point.


Now I'll add what I'm trying to tell everybody.

Stop it!



I agree they should stop it!:metal:

[DriveAlive]

Id like to start by saying that nothing agrevates me more than someone calling Obama a communist. I hate when people throw labels around not to be factually accurate, but to discredit their opponents.

I am a strong supporter of democracy. I believe that America is the freest nation on the planet and this freedom has allowed the country to thrive. When I look at any form of government throughout history that has a strong totalitarian gov. or police state, all I see is oppression and control through fear. I live in fear of speed cameras now. There is no way I would live in a totalitarian state.

Furthermore, the problem with socialism/communism is that they go against the principles of capitalism. America has always been a world power because our capitalist economy has allowed for the maximum economic competition. While some here have claimed that this system has led to an economic crash and loss of manufacturing jobs, I believe that this has occured simply because the American economy is transitioning from industry-based to service-based and this transition is painful.

[Uniquemind]

Id like to start by saying that nothing agrevates me more than someone calling Obama a communist. I hate when people throw labels around not to be factually accurate, but to discredit their opponents.

I am a strong supporter of democracy. I believe that America is the freest nation on the planet and this freedom has allowed the country to thrive. When I look at any form of government throughout history that has a strong totalitarian gov. or police state, all I see is oppression and control through fear. I live in fear of speed cameras now. There is no way I would live in a totalitarian state.

Furthermore, the problem with socialism/communism is that they go against the principles of capitalism. America has always been a world power because our capitalist economy has allowed for the maximum economic competition. While some here have claimed that this system has led to an economic crash and loss of manufacturing jobs, I believe that this has occured simply because the American economy is transitioning from industry-based to service-based and this transition is painful.


The concept of speed cameras is a good one.

But the technology is slow and glitchy.

It isn't a federal thing it's a city/county thing.

Voters in my area banned the damned cameras because what was happening was that a car would speed through an intersection and the camera was too slow to take the picture and by the time the picture was taken, the picture ended up ticketing the vehicle BEHIND the guy that was the actual speeding offender.


In other cases the cameras were going heywire just snapping pictures left and right for whatever.

Police didn't like it after a while because of the over burden of work it produce and the complaints of ticket contesting they got.

[paletanner]

I'm so confused and annoyed by this, but why are there so many fascists, communists, nazis, or other totalitarians on this board?

cuz people are allowed to have opinions. even dumb opinions. that's freedom. :)

[Hindsight]

Nazis, Fascists, Communists, and socialists have way more in common with each other than the freedom club. Each one of those ideologies is an example of totalitarian collectivism. What really annoys me is that we had an entire century of history of the most disgusting evils ever done onto humanity. There's nothing cool about any of those ideologies.

I still don't see how one mixes up socialism and national socialism. It is like mixing up grapes and grapefruits.

[Judean Zealot]

What really annoys me is that we had an entire century of history of the most disgusting evils ever done onto humanity. There's nothing cool about any of those ideologies.
I'm not sure how Stalin or Hitler's atrocities disqualify Communism or Fascism as an ideal any more than Robespierre disqualified the principles of liberté, egalité, et fraternité.

[Human]

If people can't express their opinion in real life they're more likely to find a place to vent in the internet, anonymously

[Zenos]

Id like to start by saying that nothing agrevates me more than someone calling Obama a communist. I hate when people throw labels around not to be factually accurate, but to discredit their opponents.

I am a strong supporter of democracy. I believe that America is the freest nation on the planet and this freedom has allowed the country to thrive. When I look at any form of government throughout history that has a strong totalitarian gov. or police state, all I see is oppression and control through fear. I live in fear of speed cameras now. There is no way I would live in a totalitarian state.

Furthermore, the problem with socialism/communism is that they go against the principles of capitalism. America has always been a world power because our capitalist economy has allowed for the maximum economic competition. While some here have claimed that this system has led to an economic crash and loss of manufacturing jobs, I believe that this has occured simply because the American economy is transitioning from industry-based to service-based and this transition is painful.



Sir the Nation of the USA is a REPUBLIC,not a democracy,yet the government acts like a democracy and not a Republic!

[Microcosm]

Sir the Nation of the USA is a REPUBLIC,not a democracy,yet the government acts like a democracy and not a Republic!

Does it matter? You made a thread about this, but it really doesn't matter. The two seem related in a way(not the same, but related). Let's assume that America is obviously a republic and you're right. Then, what good have you accomplished? There is no point debating over trying to define and label a government.

It's pointless and off-topic.

[DoodleSnap]

Communism itself isn't a totalitarianism; Stalin and the Rusisans turned it into one. As for the rest of them, those are annoying yeah
Well, the idea of a unified state/people on all fronts requires a totalitarian iron rule. But that is another discussion for another day.
As to answer the OP's question:
Some people hold the belief that an absolute totalitarian society would be perfect. Some want that applied to their lives, others like the concepts of unification and sustenance. In proportion to other users, the people who register their beliefs as such (publicly) are probably very small, but catch your attention because of your pre-disposition against totalitarianists. People have different views, and it would be pure arrogance to suggest that one is objectively better than the other. The universe has no context, it simply is, and that is why you have to decide your context on deciding why you believe in one movement, but not another.

[Dune]

I'm so confused and annoyed by this, but why are there so many fascists, communists, nazis, or other totalitarians on this board?

I'm so confused and annoyed by this, but why are there so many left wing homosexual loving, equality supporting capitalist pigs on this forum? Mods, I believe it is time you handed your powers to the appropriate authority.

http://i62.tinypic.com/2hely8j.gif

[ndrwmxwll]

y r there so many fascists, natsocs on here (aka the internet)? same reason as hugboxes like 4chans pol: the modern super alienated colonizer psyche decoupled from any form of human community and accountability leads to anti-social ideology/philosophy/values/whatever/etc.
so alternatively sometimes its just the lack of basic human empathy. contrary to what many liberals tend to believe though, its not because of "ignorance" or teenage angst and naivety; evidently fascists are often a very sophisticated bunch -- ever read mussolini? or even nietzsche. its not a coincidence fascists have historically also had a social base in the intelligentsia (as in, not just a bunch small family-run italian business owners lol)

as for the commies, i think their presence is in part a reflection of a gradual replacement of genuine revolutionaries with good intentions who want to make peoples lives better by a kind of (ironically enough) "petty-bourgeois" countercultural contrarionism, used for offending ones parents and as part of an ironic hipster-politics

[Jean Poutine]

I'm not a fascist, neither am I a nazi. But I am a nationalist. In fact, at the risk of being called names, I'll just come straight out and say that I'm a Quebecois ethnic nationalist. I think group cohesion and cultural homogeneity is important for a harmonious and well-functioning society, no matter what shape it takes. Humans are more likely to accept to band together and work with people who have the same values and cultural outlook on the world as they do, and to accept greater responsibilities from a State that represents this fact. I don't think that's wrong, and yes, I don't think immigration is a good idea and I think quotas should be massively reduced. It doesn't mean that I'm a racist or that I hate every other ethnicity and wish them dead - I want us to remain what we are and to be proud of who we are. I celebrate our unique culture and vision of life and I think they are worth to be preserved as is, not diluted into a multicultural glob. Only in a distorted ideologue's view is that "racist" or "wrong".

Besides, I think anyone with eyes can see that multiculturalism is a failed experiment. Just reading news about Sweden makes me cringe.

I'm pretty sure the rise in authoritarian groups is due to more and more people being fed up with the endless glorification of human and individual rights while glossing over and not even paying lip service to their much less exciting counterparts : responsibilities.

Authoritarians see in their fellow citizens a bunch of hedonists with no direction in life fucking up their country, wasting human capital and rendering their institutions ineffectual. They seek to bring order over what they view as malfunctioning chaos. They aren't wrong but I'm not certain that's the way to do it. Reactionary politics are stronger and stronger these days and it is a clear sign that more and more people realize that something is going terribly wrong within the West.

However, I think that a well-educated (not in terms of years, but in terms of content - a return to old, traditional values and methods of pedagogy), culturally homogeneous population combined with its "de-infantilization" (the doling out of more responsibilities and stronger societal roles at a younger age) and a return to the glorification of duty along with the purge of some institutions that have no right to exist, like central banks, will do the trick. These conditions fulfilled, I don't see why democracy should cease to exist.

The right to choose one's representatives (or to participate directly in political affairs) is one taken for granted these days and with no responsibility attached to it. Turn your citizens into people able and willing to shoulder the burden that comes with such an important right and clearly, the quality of leaders and policies will improve. Unlike one other poster here, I fully believe that truly dumb people are rare, that it is our present system that made most that way and that almost everyone can reach an intellectual potential high enough to be trusted with policy matters, given a strong reason and strong guidance (which nationalism and classical pedagogy should provide), but there is a lot of baggage we have to get rid of to get to this point.

Here's a quote from "An Underground History of American Education", a book I'm currently going through :

In 1882, fifth graders read these authors in their Appleton School Reader: William Shakespeare, Henry Thoreau, George Washington, Sir Walter Scott, Mark Twain, Benjamin Franklin, Oliver Wendell Holmes, John Bunyan, Daniel Webster, Samuel Johnson, Lewis Carroll, Thomas Jefferson, Ralph Waldo Emerson, and others like them.

In 1995, a student teacher of fifth graders in Minneapolis wrote to the local newspaper, "I was told children are not to be expected to spell the following words correctly: back, big, call, came, can, day, did, dog, down, get, good, have, he, home, if, in, is, it, like, little, man, morning, mother, my, night, off, out, over, people, play, ran, said, saw, she, some, soon, their, them, there, time, two, too, up, us, very, water, we, went, where, when, will, would, etc. Is this nuts?"

This is the key to our malfunctioning system. Why should we expect anything but a disorganized, malfunctioning society if we raise our children to be dumb?

Give the young more credit. Children learn foreign languages extremely fast, for example. By dumbing down the curriculum and making grade schoolers read infantile books with pictures for babies, we are robbing them of their intellectually formative years and turning them into lifelong babies.

I was lucky to have a mother who cared. When she gave me my bath, we used to play a game where she'd name a verb, an aspect and a tense and I had to conjugate them in every person. I was 4 and conjugating verbs in mad shit like the "plus-que-parfait du subjonctif" tense that I covered in school just in grade 11, when pupils are deemed ready by the State to learn it, despite it just being a fucking verb tense. She also read to me constantly and spelled out every word she used in daily conversation for me if I asked. Later on she started teaching me to write and we'd write stories together where I wrote things and them drew them. I still have many of my "books". Consequently, I could read by 3, write by 4 (well, I didn't have the best handwriting at that age) and by the time I entered grade school, I had no use for a "Bescherelle" (a French book of conjugation tables) because I knew all the verb tenses and how to use them, and how to conjugate them.

My teachers used to call me the "walking dictionary". Hell, in grade 7, I was in class and the teacher used the word "plèbe" and asked us if we knew what it meant. After a bit of uneasy silence, I told him it came from the Latin "plebs" and defined it for him, drawing from the Roman historical link. His jaw dropped, but it's just a 5-letter word, and one that is easy to define at that. I was more surprised that no one knew what it meant than he was surprised that someone knew.

I don't even think I'm that smart. As I wrote, I think almost anyone can do that sort of stuff, if they're raised and educated correctly.

But more importantly, it gave me the lifelong love of reading that still defines me today. I'll read anything. Thus, my mind is free because I can read then understand any topic I care about. Heck, I learned English by reading then even perfected my accent by reading works on phonology.

This won't be the case of many in the current generation. They can read, but they cannot understand. This is called a "functional illiterate". One person in two in Quebec (and much of the West, I suspect) falls into this category.

Thus, as much as I understand the rise for authoritarian ideologies, I don't think it is the way. And yes, I've strayed off-topic. My appy-polly-logies. The end.

[Manboy321]

Because we live in an imperfect world

[simplired]

So Hitler never held any power beyond his internet and keyboard? Ideas have a large impact on the world, especially when you can get the masses to buy into them. Trust me, it's a bigger deal than you seem to realize.

Um, the Internet wasn't even around when Hitler was in power...so no, he never held any power with the internet and keyboard. His ideas might have spread on the Internet, but Hitler himself never had either.

[Microcosm]

Um, the Internet wasn't even around when Hitler was in power...so no, he never held any power with the internet and keyboard. His ideas might have spread on the Internet, but Hitler himself never had either.

It was an analogy.

I didn't literally mean that. Rather, I meant that it was as if he was saying the influence of opinion has no real power, and it entirely does.

[Sir Suomi]

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-EgJCVZ3kFTc/UY4YjNFna-I/AAAAAAAAPWo/_aGXQhF1kaQ/s1600/reich.jpg

[Stronk Serb]

Because you are wrong and we are right :P
I guess everybody has their vision of a perfect society.