the propaganda war

[tovaris]

Note that we are witnesing the colapse of ukrain, and think about the news...
But the point being that we are seing a real propaganda war going on in the rest of the world, one side strictly againced russia (mind you this is all being done by the ukranian people themselves not some forereighn army invading) while the other side is on the side of protesters yet is not to eger for them to join the federation...
But why does our society alowe to be sucked into this? I mean the entire europe almost is breavin with the notion that putin is the bad guy in this story while noone knows the whole story yes he is a bad guy, who can rule mind you, but no as bad in this particular story as the propaganda of one sode portraies him-nor is he the pecekeeper of the other side...

[Gamma Male]

Do you live in the Ukraine? How do you know Russian agents aren't attempting to rile up Ukraineins?
I'm not taking sides, since I honestly don't know who to believe. Of course I have absolutely no trust in major media or the American government, but there are way too many crazies on those independent internet news sources to trust them either.

[Stronk Serb]

The clashes between EU/USA and Russia caused this essentially. Their efforts for putting Ukraine in one's sphere of influence have lead to this. Russians showed a big middle finger to the west by annexing Crimea, but the rest of Ukraine will suffer now.

[Left Now]

RIP Ukraine I say.

[Harry Smith]

Ironic how the Marxists on the board are supporting Putin, old habits die hard. Putin wants to annex the entire of the Ukrainian, and he's used illegal methods to do that. He sent in Russian special forces without any insignia, I very much doubt that a couple of Crimean farmers managed to get their hands on Kevlar, ak-74's and amoured cars.

Putin has one goal-to destroy the state of Ukraine

[Vlerchan]

Russia was allowed to place up to 25,000 troops in Crimea. He didn't actually do anything illegal in that. Until the point that he annexed Crimea and breached Ukraine's territorial-integrity he hadn't done anything illegal. I'm still supporting Eastern succession. It's going to be so much simpler to assimilate a stable Ukraine into the EU - not that I really want to assimilate the Ukraine in the first place.

[Left Now]

I do not care too much about the matter of Ukraine,because it is not related to us at all;but I support how Russia annexed Crimea,like the time I supported UK for keeping Falkland Isles through the same way.

[Harry Smith]

Russia was allowed to place up to 25,000 troops in Crimea. He didn't actually do anything illegal in that. Until the point that he annexed Crimea and breached Ukraine's territorial-integrity he hadn't done anything illegal. I'm still supporting Eastern succession. It's going to be so much simpler to assimilate a stable Ukraine into the EU - not that I really want to assimilate the Ukraine in the first place.

I know Putin had the right to have his troops there but every single law in warfare says that he they must openly display their insignia, the problem was that Putin sent in his special forces, pretending to be 'freedom fighters' who then captured key buildings to make it appear as some sort of uprising

I do not care too much about the matter of Ukraine,because it is not related to us at all;but I support how Russia annexed Crimea,like the time I supported UK for keeping Falkland Isles through the same way.

The falkland islands and Crimea are completely different. The russians gave the Crimea to Ukraine in 1954, the UK had the Falkland islands invaded in 1983. That's two completely different situations

[Left Now]

The falkland islands and Crimea are completely different. The russians gave the Crimea to Ukraine in 1954, the UK had the Falkland islands invaded in 1983. That's two completely different situations

Oh they can be same in a way anyway.Both people in Crimea and Falkland Isles before that participated in a so-called election after all to decide which side they want to be with in the argument.

[Harry Smith]

Oh they can be same in a way anyway.Both people in Crimea and Falkland Isles before that participated in a so-called election after all to decide which side they want to be with in the argument.

Not really. The Falkland islands were under British control for over 200 years. Your point would be correct if Argentina controlled the island for 50 years but they only controlled if for about 6 months.

[Left Now]

Not really. The Falkland islands were under British control for over 200 years. Your point would be correct if Argentina controlled the island for 50 years but they only controlled if for about 6 months.

I'm talking about the election not duration my friend.About election part,they were the same.Crimea is rightfully Russia's now,even if Ukrainians claim that it is legally theirs.


Anyway,I believe this crisis won't end until both western and Russian sides put their insanity aside and discuss this problem with each others like mature people,not like 6 year-old children;and it means that both side shall stop this propaganda war which they have started against each others.

[Harry Smith]

I'm talking about the election not duration my friend.About election part,they were the same.Crimea is rightfully Russia's now,even if Ukrainians claim that it is legally theirs.


Anyway,I believe this crisis won't end until both western and Russian sides put their insanity aside and discuss this problem with each others like mature people,not like 6 year-old children;and it means that both side shall stop this propaganda war which they have started against each others.

It's still completely different, I don't know how I can make it any clearier. Russia gained Crimea after a vote and an uprising.

Argentina gained the falklands after a foreign invasion because they're wasn't an uprising or a vote.

All politics is propaganda, and the problem with this debate is that it can't be fixed by diplomacy

[Left Now]

It's still completely different, I don't know how I can make it any clearier. Russia gained Crimea after a vote and an uprising.

Argentina gained the falklands after a foreign invasion because they're wasn't an uprising or a vote.

All politics is propaganda, and the problem with this debate is that it can't be fixed by diplomacy

But it has to be solved at all...But anyway divines know how :P

[Stronk Serb]

Ironic how the Marxists on the board are supporting Putin, old habits die hard. Putin wants to annex the entire of the Ukrainian, and he's used illegal methods to do that. He sent in Russian special forces without any insignia, I very much doubt that a couple of Crimean farmers managed to get their hands on Kevlar, ak-74's and amoured cars.

Putin has one goal-to destroy the state of Ukraine

I don't support him. I plan on burning the Russian flag the chetniks put nearby. I say sanction them to space or intervene. Tell Putin that if he continues with his bullshit, he will have the Ukrainian flag waving over the Kremlin.

[Left Now]

As I once said this in the past,we do not care about the concerns of Ukraine too much here,unless it affects our economy.The main thing which we care about right now is to see which is going to have the upper hand in these arguments.Also,we still have Syria's case on in the area.

[Capto]

Do you live in the Ukraine? How do you know Russian agents aren't attempting to rile up Ukraineins?


Of course they are.

[tovaris]

Do you live in the Ukraine? How do you know Russian agents aren't attempting to rile up Ukraineins?
i
i dont and even the people i know who do ore have family there dont know that...

Ironic how the Marxists on the board are supporting Putin, old habits die hard. Putin wants to annex the entire of the Ukrainian, and he's used illegal methods to do that. He sent in Russian special forces without any insignia, I very much doubt that a couple of Crimean farmers managed to get their hands on Kevlar, ak-74's and amoured cars.

Putin has one goal-to destroy the state of Ukraine

Firstly i eint marxist and nether is Comerad! And noone is suporting putin here, if anything he is who cant die.

Secondly, keep in mind that Russias standpoint for the rest of Ukrain is that it should become a federation not be anexed...

I dont know about the kevlar, a gift from the metal birds maybe ;) but in that part of the world (russia) a lot of people have guns.

I know Putin had the right to have his troops there but every single law in warfare says that he they must openly display their insignia, the problem was that Putin sent in his special forces, pretending to be 'freedom fighters' who then captured key buildings to make it appear as some sort of uprising




this is a wery popular clabe, but how can we know how much is propaganda and hom much true?
I mean it could even be the case tat ukrain is seing some open insignia fighting going on right now but nether side wants to admit it...

In the case of Krim(Crimea) keep in mind that the Kazahs joined in and even called for international help from example theyr czetnik (četniki) friends...

I don't support him. I plan on burning the Russian flag the chetniks put nearby. I say sanction them to space or intervene. Tell Putin that if he continues with his bullshit, he will have the Ukrainian flag waving over the Kremlin.

how are we moral if we sanction putin but not the us for same sort of crimes?

[Vlerchan]

irstly i eint marxist and nether is Comerad!
What are yous then?

I always throught yous were both Marxist.

[Stronk Serb]

i dont and even the people i know who do ore have family there dont know that...



Firstly i eint marxist and nether is Comerad! And noone is suporting putin here, if anything he is who cant die.

Secondly, keep in mind that Russias standpoint for the rest of Ukrain is that it should become a federation not be anexed...

I dont know about the kevlar, a gift from the metal birds maybe ;) but in that part of the world (russia) a lot of people have guns.



this is a wery popular clabe, but how can we know how much is propaganda and hom much true?
I mean it could even be the case tat ukrain is seing some open insignia fighting going on right now but nether side wants to admit it...

In the case of Krim(Crimea) keep in mind that the Kazahs joined in and even called for international help from example theyr czetnik (četniki) friends...



how are we moral if we sanction putin but not the us for same sort of crimes?

Only of China sanctions the USA, they would collapse, along with China because China is sucking money off the US. But yeah, both should be sanctioned at least.

[freecell]

USA NATO EU sux

[Miserabilia]

USA NATO EU sux

Could you elaborate or are you on an 11 letter maximum? :lol:

[Sir Suomi]

The EU won't do shit, as long as their sucking off Mother Russia's tits for oil.

What's going on right now is almost mirror image of the buildup to World War II, with Hitler annexing what he declared "German" territories from neighboring countries, and in the meantime, the rest of the world didn't do shit.

[TheBigUnit]

The clashes between EU/USA and Russia caused this essentially. Their efforts for putting Ukraine in one's sphere of influence have lead to this. Russians showed a big middle finger to the west by annexing Crimea, but the rest of Ukraine will suffer now.

this ^^

Additionally Mr. Putin is a very interesting man, someone who could stay in power for so long and is so influential in his sphere

[tovaris]

The EU won't do shit, as long as their sucking off Mother Russia's tits for oil.

What's going on right now is almost mirror image of the buildup to World War II, with Hitler annexing what he declared "German" territories from neighboring countries, and in the meantime, the rest of the world didn't do shit.

it also has an ery feelof the american actions in the arab world...

And mind you, they had a referendu, to join russia they werent forcefuly anxed... ;)

this ^^

Additionally Mr. Putin is a very interesting man, someone who could stay in power for so long and is so influential in his sphere

there is a joke going around that he is an alian wearing a human suit, and that there is a secret amandmand to the geneva convention that sais that if he is on a battle feeld he is nor alowd to use bulets cut that would not befare for the enamy ;)

[Sir Suomi]

it also has an ery feelof the american actions in the arab world...

And mind you, they had a referendu, to join russia they werent forcefuly anxed... ;)





Sure, and Russia sent in troops to help sure they voted for the right option, right?

[Harry Smith]

The EU won't do shit, as long as their sucking off Mother Russia's tits for oil.

What's going on right now is almost mirror image of the buildup to World War II, with Hitler annexing what he declared "German" territories from neighboring countries, and in the meantime, the rest of the world didn't do shit.

Who would ever start a war for oil? That just seems stupid. I suppose the EU will have to raise the white flag and wait for the valiant Americans to come and rescue us again. Considering we've racked up debt fighting two wars for US business we're not really in much of a state to invade Russia.

It's ironic that you seem to condemn Russia/Hitler for annexing neighboring countries, because the US has a rather long history of doing the exact same

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_territorial_acquisitions

[Sir Suomi]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_territorial_acquisitions

As a British citizen, are you really going to criticize America for grabbing territories?

[Harry Smith]

As a British citizen, are you really going to criticize America for grabbing territories?

I'm not, but I wasn't criticizing Russia for doing it was I? Nice deflection there

[Sir Suomi]

I'm not, but I wasn't criticizing Russia for doing it was I? Nice deflection there

Maybe if you'd look at a history book you'd see what I mean when I compare Putin's land grabs to Hitler's.

And on the subject of Middle-Eastern countries, at least we're not annexing them into the United States, now are we?

[Harry Smith]

Maybe if you'd look at a history book you'd see what I mean when I compare Putin's land grabs to Hitler's.

And on the subject of Middle-Eastern countries, at least we're not annexing them into the United States, now are we?

If you look at the History books you'd see the US did the exact same thing. To be honest there's a little bit of the land seizing Hitler in every country

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gibraltar

No, you're just taking their wealth, sending drones after newly wed couples, raping women, outsourcing warfare to the highest bidder, breaking the Geneva convention and supporting a corrupt apartheid regime. Sounds great

[Sir Suomi]

If you look at the History books you'd see the US did the exact same thing. To be honest there's a little bit of the land seizing Hitler in every country

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gibraltar

No, you're just taking their wealth, sending drones after newly wed couples, raping women, outsourcing warfare to the highest bidder, breaking the Geneva convention and supporting a corrupt apartheid regime. Sounds great

i. My point here is that the United States is currently not going for a land grab.

ii. And we're getting our civilians killed on our own land, our soldiers in some goddamn desert, and being hated nationally for engaging a war. People die in war. It's a fact, and if you can't wrap your head around that, well then have fun maintaining your place as a major power.

[Harry Smith]

i. My point here is that the United States is currently not going for a land grab.

ii. And we're getting our civilians killed on our own land, our soldiers in some goddamn desert, and being hated nationally for engaging a war. People die in war. It's a fact, and if you can't wrap your head around that, well then have fun maintaining your place as a major power.

1) No, America is much smarter than it. It simply tops the leader, and puts in a puppet.

2)Ha, please we haven't been a major power since 1945. People die in war, but even more people die if you go looking for war. What 3,000 died 10 years, how many was it in Iraq again-oh yeah 100,000. They're in the desert because you sent them there-they didn't just teleport there. If you go looking for death as the US does then death is all you'll find-you want to know what country is the biggest warmonger in the world-it's the US

Korea
Vietnam
Cuba
Iraq
Iraq again
Panama
Afghanistan
Grenada
Iran
Democratic republic of Congo
Honduras
Somali

And that's in the last 50 years