Gay Marriage opinions?

[Damien2014]

Gay Marriage
Hello All, I would like to see everyones opinion on Gay Marriage..
I support it so feel free to reply XD
here is a video of men kissing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kx2cSA5MRk8

[Harry Smith]

I don't understand how anyone can oppose gay marriage-it's about equal rights

[Yonkers]

abcd

[Miserabilia]

I can't see anything wrong with it.

[PurpleLips]

i really dont know why anyone would not be ok with it...

[Lovelife090994]

While I can understand why many support it, I wish they'd understand that not all who do not support it are the same. I am not a supporter of gay marriage but I'm not an enemy to it either. I know many people know that not everyone supports it but many that don't get get into the group that strongly rebels against it with hatred. While I do not support it, I wouldn't go as far as stopping it either even if I was able to protest it. Sadly gay marriage is one of the subjects where you are either with it all of the way or are a hater if you are against it.

[Ethe14]

I don't see why not to support, for those who don't support it it's not affecting them.

[Stryker125]

I don't see any good reasons why gays shouldn't be able to get married.

[ColinB]

i dont get what the problem is.....marry who you love....

[Amsey]

I don't see why its banned certain places... all marriage is is a piece of paper and a set of rings... who cares if its 2 men/2 women or a man and women :what:

[Harry Smith]

While I can understand why many support it, I wish they'd understand that not all who do not support it are the same. I am not a supporter of gay marriage but I'm not an enemy to it either. I know many people know that not everyone supports it but many that don't get get into the group that strongly rebels against it with hatred. While I do not support it, I wouldn't go as far as stopping it either even if I was able to protest it. Sadly gay marriage is one of the subjects where you are either with it all of the way or are a hater if you are against it.

If you don't support gay marriage then your an enemy of equality. Why don't you support people having equal rights under law? It's simple as that

[phuckphace]

marriage is a heterosexual institution that's based around the concept of the nuclear family, that's the way it's always been. don't really see the point of the whole "me too!" scramble for gay marriage myself. most of the gay people who get married are only doing it for attention and as a big "fuck you" to those big mean oppressive Xtians

[BillyTheKid96]

I'm for gay marriage. I think two people of the same sex should have as much right to get married as two people of the opposite sex do!

[Daniella98]

I support it. I just think two persons who loves eachother should be accepted. I dont have any thoughts on religion on this matter. Im atheist

[Tarannosaurus]

marriage is a heterosexual institution that's based around the concept of the nuclear family, that's the way it's always been. don't really see the point of the whole "me too!" scramble for gay marriage myself. most of the gay people who get married are only doing it for attention and as a big "fuck you" to those big mean oppressive Xtians

That's funny because all of the gay couples I know or know of did it to express the love they have for each other, and because they wanted a way to show their commitment. Marriage isn't for everybody, it's not for me, but I really don't think it's fair that only certain people have the privilege of making that commitment. Marriage isn't really about children, it's about love. When my parents got married my mother was thought to have been infertile. If marriage is about protecting nuclear families or whatever, does that mean they shouldn't have been allowed to get married?

[Lovelife090994]

If you don't support gay marriage then your an enemy of equality. Why don't you support people having equal rights under law? It's simple as that

Here's the thing, a homosexual can do all he things a heterosexual man or woman can do unless you take into account countries that are very hard on homosexuality. The only right I see is one that is not written, "Any man or woman can marry someone of the same birth gender and receive equal benefits of marriage as any heterosexual couple regardless."
What I hate, is how so many of the LGBT have this idea that if you are not for gay marriage you are, "a bigot", "homophobic", or "a Christian zealot". So the LGBT wants equality, well can we have more equal "fair" treatment to thos both opposed and supporting?

[Harry Smith]

. So the LGBT wants equality, well can we have more equal "fair" treatment to thos both opposed and supporting?

Yes we want equality on the law-if you oppose gay marriage you oppse equal rights. By your own logic those in favour of slavery should be given equal rights to oppose it. You seem to complain that people label gay marriage opponents as extreme-it's pretty extreme to deny someone there fundamental rights isn't.

I feel so bad for you-it must of been terrible being called a religious zealot-I hope you make a swift recovery.

But I'll ask again-why shouldn't gay and straight people be equal?

a homosexual can do all he things a heterosexual man or woman can do

Bullshit, Bullshit, Bullshit. Even in the UK there are millions of limits placed on gays that simply aren't on straight people e.g adoption. So don't pretend like everything is okay-I'm sick of straight people acting like the moment you shit out a civil union everything is great.

[Lovelife090994]

Yes we want equality on the law-if you oppose gay marriage you oppse equal rights. By your own logic those in favour of slavery should be given equal rights to oppose it. You seem to complain that people label gay marriage opponents as extreme-it's pretty extreme to deny someone there fundamental rights isn't.

I feel so bad for you-it must of been terrible being called a religious zealot-I hope you make a swift recovery.

But I'll ask again-why shouldn't gay and straight people be equal?


Bullshit, Bullshit, Bullshit. Even in the UK there are millions of limits placed on gays that simply aren't on straight people e.g adoption. So don't pretend like everything is okay-I'm sick of straight people acting like the moment you shit out a civil union everything is great.

Hey, don't get mad at me. You do hve rights else you wouldn't be online now.

[Harry Smith]

. You do hve rights else you wouldn't be online now.

That's legally wrong. I still can't get married in the UK where as Straight couples can...

[Lovelife090994]

That's legally wrong. I still can't get married in the UK where as Straight couples can...

Do you have any idea how few people gay or straight actually marry and how few marriages even last. If you want to get married, go ahead. But you can't force an entire country to change its laws. I have nothing to do with why the UK restricts homosexual marriage but I have a clue why.

[Harry Smith]

Do you have any idea how few people gay or straight actually marry and how few marriages even last. If you want to get married, go ahead. But you can't force an entire country to change its laws. I have nothing to do with why the UK restricts gay marriage but I have a clue why.

Yes you can and we have. From the 29th of March Gay marriage is being allowed in the UK-I just have to wait 24 more days for that to happen.

how few people gay

It doesn't matter how many-it matters that they have the opportunity. Everyone should have equal rights-it's just the same as the 1960's when the white racists in the South said you shouldn't give blacks the vote because they didn't want it

[Lovelife090994]

Yes you can and we have. From the 29th of March Gay marriage is being allowed in the UK-I just have to wait 24 more days for that to happen.



It doesn't matter how many-it matters that they have the opportunity. Everyone should have equal rights-it's just the same as the 1960's when the white racists in the South said you shouldn't give blacks the vote because they didn't want it

Race and sexuality are not like. A white homosexual then would have had more rights than a black homosexual then especially since then sexuality was more private and no one knew what you were. I take it you have a fiance?

[Miserabilia]

Race and sexuality are not like. A white homosexual then would have had more rights than a black homosexual then especially since then sexuality was more private and no one knew what you were. I take it you have a fiance?

Race and sexuality are not like. A white homosexual then would have had more rights than a black homosexual then
Yes, because of racism. How is it relevant? The point is that all that matters is equality for everyone

[sqishy]

I do not have anything against it, if I did I'd be against myself.
I see this might turn into another debate...

[Karkat]

marriage is a heterosexual institution that's based around the concept of the nuclear family, that's the way it's always been. don't really see the point of the whole "me too!" scramble for gay marriage myself. most of the gay people who get married are only doing it for attention and as a big "fuck you" to those big mean oppressive Xtians

Because they're gay! They can't possibly love each other, right?

I'm planning on getting married to my boyfriend regardless of whether or not we can have kids. I'm not doing it for attention, I'm not doing it for any other reason than that I love him, and I want to be with him for the rest of my life. We make a good team. It's not as if gay people don't have emotions and feelings too.

That's funny because all of the gay couples I know or know of did it to express the love they have for each other, and because they wanted a way to show their commitment. Marriage isn't for everybody, it's not for me, but I really don't think it's fair that only certain people have the privilege of making that commitment. Marriage isn't really about children, it's about love. When my parents got married my mother was thought to have been infertile. If marriage is about protecting nuclear families or whatever, does that mean they shouldn't have been allowed to get married?

Exactly.

Do you have any idea how few people gay or straight actually marry and how few marriages even last. If you want to get married, go ahead. But you can't force an entire country to change its laws. I have nothing to do with why the UK restricts homosexual marriage but I have a clue why.

...Ok, you say that you're not 'opposed' to it, but your posts seem to read entirely differently. I don't see why they SHOULDN'T be allowed to marry- something you haven't been able to explain so far.

I mean, if your defense is as petty as "a country shouldn't have to change their laws for you" er, slavery. Slavery happened. The US changed its laws because it was being oppressive and unfair. They realized that they made a mistake, and they took into consideration the feelings of their former slaves. Because they realized that they were fucking human beings too.

Oh sure, race is different from sexuality. Yes. You cannot change the color of your skin whereas you can force yourself into a mutually unhappy relationship with someone of the opposite sex or die alone. I see.

The point isn't that gay people are some different 'category' like white or black people, men or women. So apparently that makes them attention seeking radicals, right? Because they want a right that heterosexual people take for granted and misuse. That's such a terrible thing, to want a basic right when the guy next door doesn't even give two shits about his privilege.

I don't have a bone to pick if you're passive about gay marriage. I don't care if you do not dress up in rainbows and rally for a cause that doesn't affect you personally. I just don't understand the need to falsely label yourself as not supporting them, but not "opposing" them either when it's actually pretty obvious where you really stand.

Why lie?

[sweet_girl24au]

Gay Marriage
Hello All, I would like to see everyones opinion on Gay Marriage..
I support it so feel free to reply XD
here is a video of men kissing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kx2cSA5MRk8

Honstly, why should the law stop people who love each other getting married

[Lovelife090994]

Because they're gay! They can't possibly love each other, right?

I'm planning on getting married to my boyfriend regardless of whether or not we can have kids. I'm not doing it for attention, I'm not doing it for any other reason than that I love him, and I want to be with him for the rest of my life. We make a good team. It's not as if gay people don't have emotions and feelings too.



Exactly.



...Ok, you say that you're not 'opposed' to it, but your posts seem to read entirely differently. I don't see why they SHOULDN'T be allowed to marry- something you haven't been able to explain so far.

I mean, if your defense is as petty as "a country shouldn't have to change their laws for you" er, slavery. Slavery happened. The US changed its laws because it was being oppressive and unfair. They realized that they made a mistake, and they took into consideration the feelings of their former slaves. Because they realized that they were fucking human beings too.

Oh sure, race is different from sexuality. Yes. You cannot change the color of your skin whereas you can force yourself into a mutually unhappy relationship with someone of the opposite sex or die alone. I see.

The point isn't that gay people are some different 'category' like white or black people, men or women. So apparently that makes them attention seeking radicals, right? Because they want a right that heterosexual people take for granted and misuse. That's such a terrible thing, to want a basic right when the guy next door doesn't even give two shits about his privilege.

I don't have a bone to pick if you're passive about gay marriage. I don't care if you do not dress up in rainbows and rally for a cause that doesn't affect you personally. I just don't understand the need to falsely label yourself as not supporting them, but not "opposing" them either when it's actually pretty obvious where you really stand.

Why lie?


I am not lying I just can't seem to ccome to suppport a gay marriage. I am kind of passive to it but I have my reasons.

[Karkat]

I am not lying I just can't seem to ccome to suppport a gay marriage. I am kind of passive to it but I have my reasons.

That's not what I get out of it at all. If that's really the way you feel, I respect that, but it's not what it comes of to me as.

It's one thing to not root for laws being passed, it's another to back countries up or defend them- that's not very passive.

[Lovelife090994]

That's not what I get out of it at all. If that's really the way you feel, I respect that, but it's not what it comes of to me as.

It's one thing to not root for laws being passed, it's another to back countries up or defend them- that's not very passive.

I'm doing neither. I neither rally for nor protest against gay marriage. I jst don't support it because in my humble opinion marriage is between a man and a woman. Plus, I am just one person with an opinion and one many other share. But why be angry with me? I guess passive isn't the word either.

[Karkat]

I'm doing neither. I neither rally for nor protest against gay marriage. I jst don't support it because in my humble opinion marriage is between a man and a woman. Plus, I am just one person with an opinion and one many other share. But why be angry with me? I guess passive isn't the word either.

I never said I was angry with you, I just said it's not exactly passive.

[Lovelife090994]

I never said I was angry with you, I just said it's not exactly passive.

Then what would be considered passive to you on this issue? Not passive per se in general.

[Karkat]

Then what would be considered passive to you on this issue? Not passive per se in general.

Well, literally not caring one way or the other on the issue. In fact, not even really getting involved in it.

I mean, for instance, I'm neutral on most political topics (as in non-social justice topics) I don't get into arguments about them, and if my political stance is required, I say that I'm neutral. (Which I am.)

Like I said, I wouldn't consider defending a country's actions for or against something very passive- you're taking an active stance. Passivity is nearly synonymous with apathy. You don't get involved, and you generally don't care.

[Lovelife090994]

Well, literally not caring one way or the other on the issue. In fact, not even really getting involved in it.

I mean, for instance, I'm neutral on most political topics (as in non-social justice topics) I don't get into arguments about them, and if my political stance is required, I say that I'm neutral. (Which I am.)

Like I said, I wouldn't consider defending a country's actions for or against something very passive- you're taking an active stance. Passivity is nearly synonymous with apathy. You don't get involved, and you generally don't care.

How am I taking a stance? I haven't voted on this issue. I just said my personal opinion and what I do with it.

[Aajj333]

I think its none of the u.s. Government'ｓ business about anything having to do with marriage because there is separation of church and state.

[Karkat]

How am I taking a stance? I haven't voted on this issue. I just said my personal opinion and what I do with it.

Whatever you say, I'm not going to argue with you on how you feel about it, I'm just saying that it didn't seem to me like you were being very passive. That's all.

[Lovelife090994]

Whatever you say, I'm not going to argue with you on how you feel about it, I'm just saying that it didn't seem to me like you were being very passive. That's all.

I don't get why it's a problem what I feel but okay then. Good night.

[Dalcourt]

I totally support gay marriage. It's a question of giving everyone equal rights. Even if I wouldn't marry myself as I don't see the point of it, I understand that marriage is an important concept for many people and so all those people should have the right to marry. Everything else would just be not right.

[ninja789]

support :)

[Zenos]

Yes you can and we have. From the 29th of March Gay marriage is being allowed in the UK-I just have to wait 24 more days for that to happen.



It doesn't matter how many-it matters that they have the opportunity. Everyone should have equal rights-it's just the same as the 1960's when the white racists in the South said you shouldn't give blacks the vote because they didn't want it

Oh yeh blame the white Southerners why because we them there racists bastards!

Please dude you don't even know why most but not all blacks did vote heres why!


The 24th Amendment banning poll taxes in federal elections, which had kept many African Americans from voting, was passed in 1964!The Voting Rights Act was passed in 1965 which finally eliminated the remainder of voting barriers like literacy tests, state poll taxes, and grandfather clauses.

It's kind hard to vote regardless of race if you don't have the cash to spare to pay a poll tax among other things that had been in place since the founding of the USA!

[Karkat]

Oh yeh blame the white Southerners why because we them there racists bastards!

Please dude you don't even know why most but not all blacks did vote heres why!


The 24th Amendment banning poll taxes in federal elections, which had kept many African Americans from voting, was passed in 1964!The Voting Rights Act was passed in 1965 which finally eliminated the remainder of voting barriers like literacy tests, state poll taxes, and grandfather clauses.

It's kind hard to vote regardless of race if you don't have the cash to spare to pay a poll tax among other things that had been in place since the founding of the USA!

That's not even close to what he was saying, and frankly, it's a little off topic.

Do you...Even know anything about how the South was to people of color back then?

Watch/read The Secret Life Of Bees. (Actually wow I need to read that again, that's a really good book anyways. Read it anyways.) Or something along those lines. Might help you to understand a little more of what he was getting at.

Now, instead of black people, think of the cast of movies like this as being LGBT. Because that's how some are treated even today.

It's not as bad as it was like, even ten years ago, but it's still tough. And the laws are not on our side. (Especially transgender/transsexuals or people in same sex relationships. I, as a bigender person in a heterosexual relationship from a biological standpoint am actually pretty privileged. I'm thankful for the rights I do have.)

[Etcetera]

If you don't support gay marriage then you're an enemy of equality.
No.

What I hate, is how so many of the LGBT have this idea that if you are not for gay marriage you are, "a bigot", "homophobic", or "a Christian zealot". So the LGBT wants equality, well can we have more equal "fair" treatment to thos both opposed and supporting?
Exactly. Disagreement is NOT intolerance or hatred, it's disagreement.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm probably going to get slammed for this, but I'm not responding to anything said against me so it doesn't even matter. The OP asked for any and everyone's opinion, and I'm giving mine.
I don't agree with homosexual marriage. I don't agree with people raising their kids "genderless," letting them decide what they are. You are born with a penis or a vagina, and that's it. If you are born with a penis then you are a male. If you are born with a vagina then you are a female. You can have a sex change or whatever, but that doesn't change that you were destined to be what you were born as.
Even before I became Christian, I still didn't agree with homosexuality for many reasons.
I'm sorry, but a female and a female cannot make a baby together, nor can a male and a male make a baby together and you can't change that. If it was meant to be, then they would be able to, but they can't and it's not.
It's not the same as people back in whatever years being racist. It's just not. You can't compare the two, because they just are incomparable. Now, that's not saying that there are not people who are truly homophobic, but just because someone says that they don't agree with homosexuality DOES NOT make them homophobic.
Homophobia: noun. an extreme and irrational aversion to homosexuality and homosexual people.
People slam christians and religious people in general and they just assume that all of us are homophobic, just because some are truly homophobic but that's not the case at all. The Westboro church is complete idiots, and I'm being honest. There's a difference in going to places with signs saying "God hates fags" vs. saying that you don't agree with it because of your beliefs.
I'm so freaking sick and tired of being slammed and labeled as homophobic when I'm not. It's ridiculous, and seriously, if you can't handle someone disagreeing with you without labeling them as hating you then that's pitiful and you need some serious help.

I do feel like homosexuals are treated horribly by some people though, and that does bother me. But there are a lot of people in this society that are treated horribly, and the LGBT are only part of that list. I think all of the groups on that list need to be defended, not just the LGBT community. It's starting to make me really mad. Some of my best friends are bisexual or homosexual, and they are really great people. I clearly don't hate them if they are my best friends, so why would I be homophobic? Why would a homophobic person pick and choose which people of the LGBT community that they hate? They wouldn't, that's stupid.

If you want equality, try treating these people equally as well, and fighting for equality for them too:
people with birth defects
the disabled
people born with dwarfism or something else that isnt necessarily a disability
people bullied/harassed for what job their parents have
people with special needs and their families
chronically ill people - along with invisible illnesses
people of different races/ethnicities
people with speech impediments
mentally/psychologically/emotionally unstable people
people of different religions and beliefs
people of different shapes, sizes, heights, and weights
people in foster care or adopted or families who adopt
rape victims
people in different financial situations
***The list can go on and on and on and on and on. You cannot just limit this to just the LGBT community, because the truth is, a lot of people in this world are hurting, a lot of people are being harassed, and a lot of people are treated wrongly every single freaking day.
It's not different, so don't tell me it is.

These are true about me:
I have several disabilities - many of them invisible
I am chronically ill
I am a victim of abuse, rape and molestation by my own father
I am adopted
My new father is a pastor and my mom is a youth pastor
I am overweight because of the 15 medicines I have to take every day
I have a speech impediment
I am mentally, psychologically and emotionally unstable
I am what many would consider "emo"
I am a christian
My family is definitely one that would not be considered rich.
And you know what? I am harassed, bullied and tormented all the time for crap I can't help. But does this matter? No, because I am not a part of the LGBT community. Instead, I am labeled as being homophobic and am slammed all the time for something that I am not. I have been assaulted to the point of being hospitalized, I have had things thrown at me including a chair. But does it matter? Nope. Because I'm not homosexual, so nobody cares.
This is long but I really don't care.

[Zenos]

I don't understand how anyone can oppose gay marriage-it's about equal rights

easy their fundamentalist wack jobs or they just don't agree with it! In either case their wack jobs man!

[Karkat]

No.

Exactly. Disagreement is NOT intolerance or hatred, it's disagreement.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm probably going to get slammed for this, but I'm not responding to anything said against me so it doesn't even matter. The OP asked for any and everyone's opinion, and I'm giving mine.
I don't agree with homosexual marriage. I don't agree with people raising their kids "genderless," letting them decide what they are. You are born with a penis or a vagina, and that's it. If you are born with a penis then you are a male. If you are born with a vagina then you are a female. You can have a sex change or whatever, but that doesn't change that you were destined to be what you were born as.
Even before I became Christian, I still didn't agree with homosexuality for many reasons.
I'm sorry, but a female and a female cannot make a baby together, nor can a male and a male make a baby together and you can't change that. If it was meant to be, then they would be able to, but they can't and it's not.
It's not the same as people back in whatever years being racist. It's just not. You can't compare the two, because they just are incomparable. Now, that's not saying that there are not people who are truly homophobic, but just because someone says that they don't agree with homosexuality DOES NOT make them homophobic.
Homophobia: noun. an extreme and irrational aversion to homosexuality and homosexual people.
People slam christians and religious people in general and they just assume that all of us are homophobic, just because some are truly homophobic but that's not the case at all. The Westboro church is complete idiots, and I'm being honest. There's a difference in going to places with signs saying "God hates fags" vs. saying that you don't agree with it because of your beliefs.
I'm so freaking sick and tired of being slammed and labeled as homophobic when I'm not. It's ridiculous, and seriously, if you can't handle someone disagreeing with you without labeling them as hating you then that's pitiful and you need some serious help.

I do feel like homosexuals are treated horribly by some people though, and that does bother me. But there are a lot of people in this society that are treated horribly, and the LGBT are only part of that list. I think all of the groups on that list need to be defended, not just the LGBT community. It's starting to make me really mad. Some of my best friends are bisexual or homosexual, and they are really great people. I clearly don't hate them if they are my best friends, so why would I be homophobic? Why would a homophobic person pick and choose which people of the LGBT community that they hate? They wouldn't, that's stupid.

If you want equality, try treating these people equally as well, and fighting for equality for them too:
people with birth defects
the disabled
people born with dwarfism or something else that isnt necessarily a disability
people bullied/harassed for what job their parents have
people with special needs and their families
chronically ill people - along with invisible illnesses
people of different races/ethnicities
people with speech impediments
mentally/psychologically/emotionally unstable people
people of different religions and beliefs
people of different shapes, sizes, heights, and weights
people in foster care or adopted or families who adopt
rape victims
people in different financial situations
***The list can go on and on and on and on and on. You cannot just limit this to just the LGBT community, because the truth is, a lot of people in this world are hurting, a lot of people are being harassed, and a lot of people are treated wrongly every single freaking day.
It's not different, so don't tell me it is.

These are true about me:
I have several disabilities - many of them invisible
I am chronically ill
I am a victim of abuse, rape and molestation by my own father
I am adopted
My new father is a pastor and my mom is a youth pastor
I am overweight because of the 15 medicines I have to take every day
I have a speech impediment
I am mentally, psychologically and emotionally unstable
I am what many would consider "emo"
I am a christian
My family is definitely one that would not be considered rich.
And you know what? I am harassed, bullied and tormented all the time for crap I can't help. But does this matter? No, because I am not a part of the LGBT community. Instead, I am labeled as being homophobic and am slammed all the time for something that I am not. I have been assaulted to the point of being hospitalized, I have had things thrown at me including a chair. But does it matter? Nope. Because I'm not homosexual, so nobody cares.
This is long but I really don't care.

I respect your opinion, and I agree with what you've said about other groups needing consideration just as much (if not more, really) than LGBT.

I just wanted to point out that the bit about "who you're destined to be" is a little offensive, both to non-Christians, and trans* people. And even some Christians, really. Not all Christians believe in destiny.

I understand that it's you're opinion, it's just the sort of a comment that is probably going to rub someone the wrong way. I'm not going to lie, I'm a little offended by it.

I don't think you were trying to come off as offensive, I just thought I might point that out in the event that someone decides to er, not take it so well.

I agree that those who do not agree with homosexuality or transitioning/etc, are not necessarily homophobic or transphobic, but it is VERY easy to let something that started as disagreement or misunderstanding slip into ignorance, hate, etc.

Saying that you are in disagreement with something is not a free ticket to saying whatever you want on the matter- as it is you already have the negative bias, and are excluded from whatever it is by definition. I'm not accusing you of this, I'm just saying that it tends to happen.

I think the best bit of advice on this comes from my dad:
"You don't have to be gay, but don't look down on them. They're a human being too." (Paraphrased.)

And not supporting something is ok. I don't support the government, but I'm not anarchist. I realize that it has a place, and anarchy is just fucking idiotic. However, I don't agree with the way this country's run, blah blah blah. I'm neutral in politics, so I don't get into it, but I certainly don't support it.

Supporting oppression, however, is not ok. Supporting bills that take away rights from fellow human beings is not ok. Saying that gay marriage shouldn't happen because of how YOU personally feel is not ok. You, your religion, your views, they do not own the country, they do not run the country. That gay person who is trying to get married has views of his own, they are not lesser than yours, they are not greater than yours.

Aside from that, church and state need separation. Not only is it unconstitutional for it to be there (In America, of course), but it's unethical- no one religion is greater than the other by its people. Christians should not be empowered while Hindus and Muslims are oppressed. Theists should not be empowered while atheists are oppressed. We are not born knowing our religion. We are not born knowing our god. We are not born knowing anything. We all start out the same, even if our paths go separate ways.

So yes, it is ok and not homophobic (etc) to not support something, but active opposition is not ok either. While it may not be 'homophobic' by definition, it is oppressive and hateful by definition.

[Lovelife090994]

I respect your opinion, and I agree with what you've said about other groups needing consideration just as much (if not more, really) than LGBT.

I just wanted to point out that the bit about "who you're destined to be" is a little offensive, both to non-Christians, and trans* people. And even some Christians, really. Not all Christians believe in destiny.

I understand that it's you're opinion, it's just the sort of a comment that is probably going to rub someone the wrong way. I'm not going to lie, I'm a little offended by it.

I don't think you were trying to come off as offensive, I just thought I might point that out in the event that someone decides to er, not take it so well.

I agree that those who do not agree with homosexuality or transitioning/etc, are not necessarily homophobic or transphobic, but it is VERY easy to let something that started as disagreement or misunderstanding slip into ignorance, hate, etc.

Saying that you are in disagreement with something is not a free ticket to saying whatever you want on the matter- as it is you already have the negative bias, and are excluded from whatever it is by definition. I'm not accusing you of this, I'm just saying that it tends to happen.

I think the best bit of advice on this comes from my dad:
"You don't have to be gay, but don't look down on them. They're a human being too." (Paraphrased.)

And not supporting something is ok. I don't support the government, but I'm not anarchist. I realize that it has a place, and anarchy is just fucking idiotic. However, I don't agree with the way this country's run, blah blah blah. I'm neutral in politics, so I don't get into it, but I certainly don't support it.

Supporting oppression, however, is not ok. Supporting bills that take away rights from fellow human beings is not ok. Saying that gay marriage shouldn't happen because of how YOU personally feel is not ok. You, your religion, your views, they do not own the country, they do not run the country. That gay person who is trying to get married has views of his own, they are not lesser than yours, they are not greater than yours.

Aside from that, church and state need separation. Not only is it unconstitutional for it to be there (In America, of course), but it's unethical- no one religion is greater than the other by its people. Christians should not be empowered while Hindus and Muslims are oppressed. Theists should not be empowered while atheists are oppressed. We are not born knowing our religion. We are not born knowing our god. We are not born knowing anything. We all start out the same, even if our paths go separate ways.

So yes, it is ok and not homophobic (etc) to not support something, but active opposition is not ok either. While it may not be 'homophobic' by definition, it is oppressive and hateful by definition.

I agreed with mostly all of this until you called his disagreement with homosexuality oppressive and hateful by definition.

[Karkat]

I agreed with mostly all of this until you called his disagreement with homosexuality oppressive and hateful by definition.

So yes, it is ok and not homophobic (etc) to not support something, but active opposition is not ok either. While it may not be 'homophobic' by definition, it is oppressive and hateful by definition.

You entirely read that part wrong.

If you actively support bills and laws that are oppressive to gays- or anyone, for that matter, THAT is hateful and oppressive.

That's not simple disagreement or passivity. That's active opposition. There's a huge difference.

Active opposition of equal rights is by definition hateful and oppressive.

Besides, I never said that was what they were doing.

Edit: Also, I think you misgendered Etcetera.

[Lovelife090994]

You entirely read that part wrong.

If you actively support bills and laws that are oppressive to gays- or anyone, for that matter, THAT is hateful and oppressive.

That's not simple disagreement or passivity. That's active opposition. There's a huge difference.

Active opposition of equal rights is by definition hateful and oppressive.

Besides, I never said that was what they were doing.

Edit: Also, I think you misgendered Etcetera.

Fine then, I seem to have misread her gender bearing but that was not meant to insult, simply an error on my part.

[PinkFloyd]

It would be like me telling someone to not eat chocolate cake because my imaginary friend wrote in a book once that he doesn't think people should eat chocolate cake.

I'm sorry if that came out as offensive. I'm not trying to bash on anyone's religion by any means.

[Harry Smith]

It would be like me telling someone to not eat chocolate cake because my imaginary friend wrote in a book once that he doesn't think people should eat chocolate cake.

I'm sorry if that came out as offensive. I'm not trying to bash on anyone's religion by any means.

Sometimes I actually miss being able to give rep

[PinkFloyd]

Sometimes I actually miss being able to give rep

Not trying to get too off topic here, but yeah. same here. :D

[Cygnus]

I'm sorry, but we are not taking fighting to a personal level here, please refrain from claiming someone is something or accusing them of being another thing or anything else that might bring up a fight.

[Karkat]

Fine then, I seem to have misread her gender bearing but that was not meant to insult, simply an error on my part.

I didn't think you were, just wanted to point that out.

Some people don't really mind being misgendered (me, I could not care less what you call me- though it's not exactly misgendering technically, as I am bigender/trigender.)

But it can offend some people/hurt their feelings. (Which, to my knowledge Etcetera is cis, right? Trans* usually get more upset over misgendering because they feel like you're not taking who they are as a person seriously.)

[CassnovA]

the problem is people believing marriage is something solely religious, which a gay marriage would in turn go against their religious beliefs, when in reality it is not. there are many legal benefits to marriage and for that reason over many others it should be something possible for everyone.

[Lovelife090994]

I didn't think you were, just wanted to point that out.

Some people don't really mind being misgendered (me, I could not care less what you call me- though it's not exactly misgendering technically, as I am bigender/trigender.)

But it can offend some people/hurt their feelings. (Which, to my knowledge Etcetera is cis, right? Trans* usually get more upset over misgendering because they feel like you're not taking who they are as a person seriously.)

Cis? Bigender? I have never been misgendered in real life or online, honsetly it would go over my head. A girl named Arielle on Youtube got Hell over her saying how not all transgenders want bottom surgery. They called her more names than I can say here.

[Karkat]

Cis? Bigender? I have never been misgendered in real life or online, honsetly it would go over my head. A girl named Arielle on Youtube got Hell over her saying how not all transgenders want bottom surgery. They called her more names than I can say here.

Cisgender= identify with the parts/sex/gender you were born with. Bigender= feeling like you're two (or more) genders, agender/nonbinary/gender neutral, male, female, etc. Most popularly it's feeling like you're both a man and a woman. Some have personalities for each of their genders, some have one personality, and their genders work around that. (Me.) Unlike transgender, sex reassignment/transitioning isn't a thing as many bigender people want. Some do, as I've found, though I'm curious as to how they plan to go about it, because to my knowledge even gay transpeople aren't considered seriously that much for hormones/therapy/etc.

And that's true, not all transgenders want sex reassignment. I'm not trans per se, but I wouldn't want it, for a few reasons. Some just don't spend that much energy worrying about it, because it's costly. (7k-50+k, depending on birth sex. Plus breast augmentation/surgery, plus hormones and therapy.)

I'd imagine she got chewed out by fellow transpeople? I hate it when people think that "you're gay, you want this. If you don't want this, you're an abomination to gays/not really gay.etc." and so on. Like... Come on.

[Lovelife090994]

Cisgender= identify with the parts/sex/gender you were born with. Bigender= feeling like you're two (or more) genders, agender/nonbinary/gender neutral, male, female, etc. Most popularly it's feeling like you're both a man and a woman. Some have personalities for each of their genders, some have one personality, and their genders work around that. (Me.) Unlike transgender, sex reassignment/transitioning isn't a thing as many bigender people want. Some do, as I've found, though I'm curious as to how they plan to go about it, because to my knowledge even gay transpeople aren't considered seriously that much for hormones/therapy/etc.

And that's true, not all transgenders want sex reassignment. I'm not trans per se, but I wouldn't want it, for a few reasons. Some just don't spend that much energy worrying about it, because it's costly. (7k-50+k, depending on birth sex. Plus breast augmentation/surgery, plus hormones and therapy.)

I'd imagine she got chewed out by fellow transpeople? I hate it when people think that "you're gay, you want this. If you don't want this, you're an abomination to gays/not really gay.etc." and so on. Like... Come on.

My gender is male, I accept that, but I feel like I have parts of me that are feminine. However for now and later since I never explored it nor would have been allowed I wouldn't know where to go about it. I have no real style since I don't feel like I'm truly me. No, it's not my religion in the way, or me, more so my lack of know-how and lack of motivation. But this is off topic, I can tell you more later, but only if you would hear it. I guess even amongst gays and transpeople if you aren't this or that way then you challenge the norm. I thought cisgender was when you didn't identify with your gender. I was actually insulted for wanting to date cisgendered people. I guess I'm nowhere near pansexual then. I know what I am not, I don't know what I am. I hate that.

[Kevin Bacon]

Marriage is about love, not gender.

[Karkat]

My gender is male, I accept that, but I feel like I have parts of me that are feminine. However for now and later since I never explored it nor would have been allowed I wouldn't know where to go about it. I have no real style since I don't feel like I'm truly me. No, it's not my religion in the way, or me, more so my lack of know-how and lack of motivation. But this is off topic, I can tell you more later, but only if you would hear it. I guess even amongst gays and transpeople if you aren't this or that way then you challenge the norm. I thought cisgender was when you didn't identify with your gender. I was actually insulted for wanting to date cisgendered people. I guess I'm nowhere near pansexual then. I know what I am not, I don't know what I am. I hate that.

I agree it's getting off topic, just wanted to let you know that I am open to talking about it, so long as it can be kept civil.

Ah, no, that'd be trans*. Namely transgender or nonbinary. Cisgender is kind of the default. Some of us feel like we're not cisgender, so we'd be trans*.

[cgtlks]

Whomever is against gay marriage well fu** you gay/lesbian couples have every right to dedicate their life to each other and deserve to be happy just because it's 2 people of the same sex doesn't mean that lessons their rights or makes them different ...it's the 21st century people vet over it

[Luminous]

I support it. I don't understand why anyone wouldn't, but those who don't support gay marriage but aren't hateful about it I respect. I would never marry a woman just as a cry for attention, rather because I love her and want to spend the rest of my life with her, just like with a man and woman who fall in love. I'm not one for pride parades, I mean I am proud (I suppose) of who I am, but but brunettes don't have parades for being proud of their brown hair. People who are extremely tall don't have parades for being very tall. It's just another trait we humans cannot control. Gay marriage should be legal imho, but it shouldn't have to be such a big deal either. I know that's a huge leap to go from caring to being completely neutral, but I believe our world may be able to have that ideal life one day. A life where you don't have to come out because nobody assumes you're straight. A life where being different is not different. Kind of went off track here. Whoopsies.

[Miserabilia]

Sometimes I actually miss being able to give rep
looks like your account got
http://cdn2-b.examiner.com/sites/default/files/styles/image_content_width/hash/1c/fa/1cfa40999081075fb127d287d4be8cff.jpg?itok=db-KBXfX
I wonder what happened.

I support it. I don't understand why anyone wouldn't, but those who don't support gay marriage but aren't hateful about it I respect. I would never marry a woman just as a cry for attention, rather because I love her and want to spend the rest of my life with her, just like with a man and woman who fall in love. I'm not one for pride parades, I mean I am proud (I suppose) of who I am, but but brunettes don't have parades for being proud of their brown hair. People who are extremely tall don't have parades for being very tall. It's just another trait we humans cannot control. Gay marriage should be legal imho, but it shouldn't have to be such a big deal either. I know that's a huge leap to go from caring to being completely neutral, but I believe our world may be able to have that ideal life one day. A life where you don't have to come out because nobody assumes you're straight. A life where being different is not different. Kind of went off track here. Whoopsies.

I aggree 100 %.

[Gamma Male]

America isn't a theocracy. And marriage is about love and commitment, not children. If it were about children infertile couples and elderly couples wouldn't be able to marry. And as for the whole "but marriage has just always been between a man and woman!/its in the state constitution/why should we try to change it now? Its tradition!" bullshit, those same arguments can be used to support slavery. Conservatives can try to deny it all they want, but at the end of the day if they don't support gay marriage, it's because of their own personal religious beliefs. And denying someone freedoms because of your own personal religious beliefs is wrong, and not how America works.

[dontfiguremeout]

I accept gay people, but I'm not too much about supporting it. That's just my opinion. I accept them, like I have nothing against them, just I don't really support it a whole bunch.

[backjruton]

I personally just have a problem with the concept of marriage altogether. Yes it may be a sign that you trust eachother but I saw a post on another site (http://sexwithinmarriage.com/2012/10/my-husband-admitted-to-masturbating-how-do-i-get-over-the-hurt/) about a wife complaining that her husband had been masturbating. I wouldn't stop just because I got married, it's my body and I can do what I want with it (except for piercings which my mum doesn't want me to get and I REALLY WANT snakebites :P they would rather me be tattooed :what:) and I would rather just pleasure myself than help pleasure someone else too, having sex is an idea that really doesn't appeal to me too much.

Other people can get married, not my problem, I support the other people. But personally it's not a position I'd like to be in as I think I have commitment and serious trusting problems also :whoops:

[Dannibabi]

I think if people love each other, why should anyone else care? And if they want to get married then they should be allowed to. If someone doesn't like gay couples or gay marriage then that person shouldn't do it. But you can't force other people to not be with who they love. Love is love.

[Vlerchan]

Out of interest:

What do the social-liberals here think of the restrictions on marriage between close family members. I'm specifically referring to the individuals who come out with stuff like: "Love is love", etc.

[Bmble_B]

I think that everyone has the right to love whoever they want. Who are we to stop them? Thats like me getting mad at someone for liking pineapples while I dont :P

[Miserabilia]

I accept gay people, but I'm not too much about supporting it. That's just my opinion. I accept them, like I have nothing against them, just I don't really support it a whole bunch.

What do you mean?
Do you oppose to it?
Because if you oppose to it, you don't really accept it,
unless you mean you are just neutral on it.

[Harry Smith]

Out of interest:

What do the social-liberals here think of the restrictions on marriage between close family members. I'm specifically referring to the individuals who come out with stuff like: "Love is love", etc.

Close family members- I assume that's brother-sister, mother-son etc. That's not a type of marriage that I support because it's breed through abuse largely. I mean the situation arises by an adult abusing their power over there child and thus using marriage to justify an unhealthy relationship. I mean if a child marries there mother are they their husband or their son? At least with gay marriage its still pretty linear. On the aspect of children I'd argue that whilst marriage isn't built on children a lot of gay couples and future couples would want to adopt, surrogate or IVF, the problem is that family members wouldn't be able to do this because the child would be born out of incest.

Gay marraige isn't something that's going to rip down the foundations of society and send us to hell-it's simply two adults committing to each other to join together in a union.

I understand it's easy when everyone is saying 'love is love' to assume that gay marriage will lead to incest and bestiality but I'm off the belief that gay marriage doesn't break the foundations of marriage or society-it strengthens them

[Gamma Male]

I accept gay people, but I'm not too much about supporting it. That's just my opinion. I accept them, like I have nothing against them, just I don't really support it a whole bunch.

So, you accept gay people and have nothing against them, you just don't think they should be allowed to marry who they love.
DOUBLE THINK!

[crazyBoyjJ]

I dont support Gay Marige!!! It wad designed for man and woman. Thats just facts two women and two men cant have a child together. Homosexuality is wrong and a sin. Those people just look for attention. Soon u guys wil make prostitution and murdering people legal. You people need help!!!

[abc983055235235231a]

I dont support Gay Marige!!! It wad designed for man and woman. Thats just facts two women and two men cant have a child together. Homosexuality is wrong and a sin. Those people just look for attention. Soon u guys wil make prostitution and murdering people legal. You people need help!!!

When marriage was "designed for a man and a woman" it was also designed for an adult man (over the age of 20) and girls around the age of 11 years old. Moreover, they were all arranged marriages. If that is the "traditional marriage" you wish to revert to.... well... okay then.

Marriage was actually around a long time before it was institutionalized by the church. To say that it was "designed for a man and woman" is to ignore thousands of years of human history prior to the existence of the church.

If the issue is that gay couples cannot have children, well then straight people who are infertile should not be allowed to get married either.

And umm.. prostitution is actually legal in lots of places, and there have been absolutely no problems associated with it's legalization, so....

And.... umm... it's actually logically impossible for murder to be legal. Murder is "unlawful killing". If it was legal it would be "lawful unlawful killing", which doesn't make sense....

[Gamma Male]

I dont support Gay Marige!!! It wad designed for man and woman.1Thats just facts two women and two men cant have a child togeth2r.[Homosexuality is wrong and a sin.3Those people just look for attention.4Soon u guys wil make prostitution and murdering people legal.5You people need help!!!

1 Yeah, it was. And now we're trying to change it because we feel it is unfair and discriminatory.
2Neither can elderly couples or infertile couples. Do you want to stop them from getting married?
3 Why is it wrong if it's not hurting anyone? Because it's a sin? Well, guess what. America isn't a theocracy. We don't discriminate against people because of personal religious beliefs.
4 Prove it.
5 This is an entirely baseless claim. Homosexuality has absolutely nothing to do with prostitution or murder.(Although for the record I do believe prostitution should be legal.

[crazyBoyjJ]

When marriage was "designed for a man and a woman" it was also designed for an adult man (over the age of 20) and girls around the age of 11 years old. Moreover, they were all arranged marriages. If that is the "traditional marriage" you wish to revert to.... well... okay then.

Marriage was actually around a long time before it was institutionalized by the church. To say that it was "designed for a man and woman" is to ignore thousands of years of human history prior to the existence of the church.

If the issue is that gay couples cannot have children, well then straight people who are infertile should not be allowed to get married either.

And umm.. prostitution is actually legal in lots of places, and there have been absolutely no problems associated with it's legalization, so....

And.... umm... it's actually logically impossible for murder to be legal. Murder is "unlawful killing". If it was legal it would be "lawful unlawful killing", which doesn't make sense....


And ummm.... whatever, or who ever the hell u are, ur not quite making much sense.
. Go read a freaquing book or some shit instead of giving out ur redundant information
I dont have time to argue with assholes like u. Oh btw its not the man or woman's fault they are infertile. They can.still be married and adopt children.

[Harry Smith]

I dont support Gay Marige!!! It wad designed for man and woman. Thats just facts two women and two men cant have a child together. Homosexuality is wrong and a sin. Those people just look for attention. Soon u guys wil make prostitution and murdering people legal. You people need help!!!

Yep-gay marriage will lead to the world falling apart!

I'll go through your points quickly-if marriage is designed for children why do we let elderly/infertile people marry? Secondly-you do know that gays can still have children right-our sperm works.

So your God says it's a sin-my god says that heterosexuality is a sin. We've reached a problem?

[crazyBoyjJ]

1 Yeah, it was. And now we're trying to change it because we feel it is unfair and discriminatory.
2Neither can elderly couples or infertile couples. Do you want to stop them from getting married?
3 Why is it wrong if it's not hurting anyone? Because it's a sin? Well, guess what. America isn't a theocracy. We don't discriminate against people because of personal religious beliefs.
4 Prove it.
5 This is an entirely baseless claim. Homosexuality has absolutely nothing to do with prostitution or murder.(Although for the record I do believe prostitution should be legal.

A next piece of Junk i dont have time to waste my breath on. Go find a real life!!

[Vlerchan]

I'm laughing because despite being (violently) against homosexuality he declares himself bi-curious in his signature. Also (crazyBoyjJ), homosexuality is not a choice - nobody chooses to be homosexual.

I'll get to your response tommorow, Harry: I'll have time then. It's cool that you're back, though.

[crazyBoyjJ]

Yep-gay marriage will lead to the world falling apart!

I'll go through your points quickly-if marriage is designed for children why do we let elderly/infertile people marry? Secondly-you do know that gays can still have children right-our sperm works.

So your God says it's a sin-my god says that heterosexuality is a sin. We've reached a problem?


Um what the hell does this have to do with elderly people having children. Um thats different. Oh and yes u have sperm but can u put it in a man's anusand get him pregnant. Um let me think NO!!!

[Harry Smith]

Um what the hell does this have to do with elderly people having children. Um thats different. Oh and yes u have sperm but can u put it in a man's anusand get him pregnant. Um let me think NO!!!

Why is it always about Anal sex? Straight people seem to think that us gays are constantly having anal intercourse when trust me there are many other types of sexual gratification.

I can however place my sperm, put it a test tube, get a little spoon, put my partners sperm in test tube, place it in a women and have a baby. You don't need sex to have a child anymore.

Um, do you think elderly people should marry?

[Dannibabi]

I dont support Gay Marige!!! It wad designed for man and woman. Thats just facts two women and two men cant have a child together. Homosexuality is wrong and a sin. Those people just look for attention. Soon u guys wil make prostitution and murdering people legal. You people need help!!!

I'm just going to quote your own signature: "straight (curious)" Little hypocritical?

[crazyBoyjJ]

Why is it always about Anal sex? Straight people seem to think that us gays are constantly having anal intercourse when trust me there are many other types of sexual gratification.

I can however place my sperm, put it a test tube, get a little spoon, put my partners sperm in test tube, place it in a women and have a baby. You don't need sex to have a child anymore.

Um, do you think elderly people should marry?

The point is u need a WOMAN and yes elderly can be married if their hetrosexual.

[Quick_Sylver]

Mamma Mia.

I don't support gay marriage.
I am queer as fuck(Pan, Trans, Poly).

Gay marriage has become such a "hot topic" that so many people don't give a fuck about the gay kids in the rural areas, or the queer kids who get beat up in the bathroom because they're forced to use the one that matches their anatomy - not their gender presentation. Gay marriage has become such an overshadowing topic that people are dying, by their hand, or by others, and no one gives a fuck because "Oh! Gays can get married! Everything's Fucking Dandy!"

So fuck Gay marriage, and those who support it on the basis of "Adults should have the choice" and turn around and say kids can't decide, as they have in the cases of children who's parents allow them to be themselves so they stop self destructive behaviours, fuck you too.

And don't forget how cissexist gay marriage is. "Same sex marriage between two people" translates to "Two people with penis' got married." or "Two people with vaginas got married". So, for intersex people(those naturally born with a blended "sex" or hormonal fluctuations) and trans people who are in the process of transition, it's ignored.

So yeah. If you're gay, and this is all you care about, fine. But this isn't what I care about, and there's a LOT bigger issues with the portrayal and appearance of the GSM(gender and sexuality minorities) and the whole community that needs to be dealt with, than making it legal for you to get married. So no, I don't support gay marriage, because I'm sick of being told to shut up and wait my turn when I'm harassed on a daily basis and can be fired in fucking Canada for being trans - and my boss has asked me to warn her if I bring my girlfriend in, so she can let me know if we'll be safe in that situation.

To the person who was making statements about they don't support because they get shit on: I'm really sorry the world is like that, and you're not alone. It's a similar issue, yes, and I'm really sorry people are like that. You issues don't matter anymore than anyone else's, and no one else's issues matter more than yours. Stay strong, alright?

[Harry Smith]

The point is u need a WOMAN and yes elderly can be married if their hetrosexual.

But surely the elderly children can't have kids? And you said the whole point of marriage is to have kids right?


Mamma Mia.

I don't support gay marriage.
I am queer as fuck(Pan, Trans, Poly).

Gay marriage has become such a "hot topic" that so many people don't give a fuck about the gay kids in the rural areas, or the queer kids who get beat up in the bathroom because they're forced to use the one that matches their anatomy - not their gender presentation. Gay marriage has become such an overshadowing topic that people are dying, by their hand, or by others, and no one gives a fuck because "Oh! Gays can get married! Everything's Fucking Dandy!"

So fuck Gay marriage, and those who support it on the basis of "Adults should have the choice" and turn around and say kids can't decide, as they have in the cases of children who's parents allow them to be themselves so they stop self destructive behaviours, fuck you too.

And don't forget how cissexist gay marriage is. "Same sex marriage between two people" translates to "Two people with penis' got married." or "Two people with vaginas got married". So, for intersex people(those naturally born with a blended "sex" or hormonal fluctuations) and trans people who are in the process of transition, it's ignored.

So yeah. If you're gay, and this is all you care about, fine. But this isn't what I care about, and there's a LOT bigger issues with the portrayal and appearance of the GSM(gender and sexuality minorities) and the whole community that needs to be dealt with, than making it legal for you to get married. So no, I don't support gay marriage, because I'm sick of being told to shut up and wait my turn when I'm harassed on a daily basis and can be fired in fucking Canada for being trans - and my boss has asked me to warn her if I bring my girlfriend in, so she can let me know if we'll be safe in that situation.

To the person who was making statements about they don't support because they get shit on: I'm really sorry the world is like that, and you're not alone. It's a similar issue, yes, and I'm really sorry people are like that. You issues don't matter anymore than anyone else's, and no one else's issues matter more than yours. Stay strong, alright?

That doesn't trump gay marriage-but your logic we shouldn't pass poverty reduction laws because poverty will happen anyway, we shouldn't reduce CO2 because climate change is happening. Do you get what I'm saying?

You can't oppose something just because there are worse issues in the world-we need to try and change the wrongs-gay marriage limitations being one of them and I think that we can work to achieve progress for all members of the LGBTQ community. I agree that gay marriage has led to people thinking that everything is fine and dandy because honestly it isn't

You shouldn't oppose gay marriage out of spite

[abc983055235235231a]

And ummm.... whatever, or who ever the hell u are, ur not quite making much sense.
. Go read a freaquing book or some shit instead of giving out ur redundant information
I dont have time to argue with assholes like u. Oh btw its not the man or woman's fault they are infertile. They can.still be married and adopt children.

....I will try to be clearer and less asshole-y

(1) Marriage was around long before it was "defined" by the church
(1.1) Marriage, when it was institutionalized by the church, was arranged marriage between male adults and female children. This is a historical fact. Look it up.
(1.2) If you want the "traditional marriage" that was institutionalized by the church you want arranged marriages between male adults and female children.

(2) People who are infertile do not choose to be infertile.
(2.1) People who are gay do not choose to be gay. Again, this is a scientific fact.
(2.2) If people who are gay should not be allowed get married because they cannot procreate, people who are infertile should not be allowed to get married.
(2.3) Gay people can adopt children too.

(3) I think that calling me an asshole sort of makes you the real asshole here..... .... ...... ... .. ..

[abc983055235235231a]

Mamma Mia.

I don't support gay marriage.
I am queer as fuck(Pan, Trans, Poly).

Gay marriage has become such a "hot topic" that so many people don't give a fuck about the gay kids in the rural areas, or the queer kids who get beat up in the bathroom because they're forced to use the one that matches their anatomy - not their gender presentation. Gay marriage has become such an overshadowing topic that people are dying, by their hand, or by others, and no one gives a fuck because "Oh! Gays can get married! Everything's Fucking Dandy!"

So fuck Gay marriage, and those who support it on the basis of "Adults should have the choice" and turn around and say kids can't decide, as they have in the cases of children who's parents allow them to be themselves so they stop self destructive behaviours, fuck you too.

And don't forget how cissexist gay marriage is. "Same sex marriage between two people" translates to "Two people with penis' got married." or "Two people with vaginas got married". So, for intersex people(those naturally born with a blended "sex" or hormonal fluctuations) and trans people who are in the process of transition, it's ignored.

So yeah. If you're gay, and this is all you care about, fine. But this isn't what I care about, and there's a LOT bigger issues with the portrayal and appearance of the GSM(gender and sexuality minorities) and the whole community that needs to be dealt with, than making it legal for you to get married. So no, I don't support gay marriage, because I'm sick of being told to shut up and wait my turn when I'm harassed on a daily basis and can be fired in fucking Canada for being trans - and my boss has asked me to warn her if I bring my girlfriend in, so she can let me know if we'll be safe in that situation.

To the person who was making statements about they don't support because they get shit on: I'm really sorry the world is like that, and you're not alone. It's a similar issue, yes, and I'm really sorry people are like that. You issues don't matter anymore than anyone else's, and no one else's issues matter more than yours. Stay strong, alright?

There's something called intersectionality which you should look up.

[Quick_Sylver]

That doesn't trump gay marriage-but your logic we shouldn't pass poverty reduction laws because poverty will happen anyway, we shouldn't reduce CO2 because climate change is happening. Do you get what I'm saying?

You can't oppose something just because there are worse issues in the world-we need to try and change the wrongs-gay marriage limitations being one of them and I think that we can work to achieve progress for all members of the LGBTQ community.

You shouldn't oppose gay marriage out of spite

Off Topic: Just saying, your tone could really use work if you want to "convince" people to support your cause. It's pretty dismissive, especially on a thread asked for opinions. And applying laws such as environmentalism to an argument already based in "Nature vs Nurture" topics, is kind of really just adding fire to a bonfire of rage without facts.

I never said it trumps gay marriage.

Maybe if I rephrase it you'll get it better: Stop caring what adults do and do something to protect the children - legitimately. Stop expecting children to want the things of adults - because the 14 year old kid questioning their gender I spend hours texting encouragement to live cares about the fact that someone can get married - and actually help the kids. Do you know how many kids question their sexuality and have absolutely none of the needed readings? That the library has to special order books on gender and sexuality for me to lend other kids because they can't be seen asking for it - especially when they're a pastor's child.

The thing is this: Gay marriage happens, and then what? Where are the other laws protecting people in the States? Where are the other laws protecting against discrimination? Where are the laws protecting non-conforming children period - instead of just saying "kids will be kids" and laughing it off.

I live in Canada. It's LEGAL here. So opposing it, no one gives much of a crap about. There is a four day camp available in three places in my country that teach youth between 14-24 that it's alright to be yourself. In my province, Alberta, I had to fight and shove bolded laws under my principal's nose just to get a support group for queer kids started, because he worried he'd be bashed by one of the multiple churches in my 5,000 population town. There are a total of three married same sex couples in my area who daily are seen scrubbing graffitti and shitty words off their porches because they went out for dinner.

When people stop talking about this idea that gay marriage is a thing, the legislation for kid protection is ignored. And that sends yet another message that kids don't matter - especially kids in any form of minority - physical, emotional, physiological or mental.

There's something called intersectionality which you should look up.

That's kind of my point. Everyone gives a fuck about gay marriage, and no one gives a damn about the trans kid who got threatened for using the right bathroom for his sex, on the basis of "if you're REALLY a dude, you should use the mens...".

[Gamma Male]

A next piece of Junk i dont have time to waste my breath on. Go find a real life!!

If you're not going to respond to any of my counter arguments why did you even bother posting your opinion? It seems kind of hypocritical to state your views on an issue, and then when somebody tries to counter them in a calm, organized manner you don't give them the same respect. If you don't "have time" to debate something or defend your viewpoints, don't post in a forum intended for debating.

[abc983055235235231a]

Off Topic: Just saying, your tone could really use work if you want to "convince" people to support your cause. It's pretty dismissive, especially on a thread asked for opinions. And applying laws such as environmentalism to an argument already based in "Nature vs Nurture" topics, is kind of really just adding fire to a bonfire of rage without facts.

I never said it trumps gay marriage.

Maybe if I rephrase it you'll get it better: Stop caring what adults do and do something to protect the children - legitimately. Stop expecting children to want the things of adults - because the 14 year old kid questioning their gender I spend hours texting encouragement to live cares about the fact that someone can get married - and actually help the kids. Do you know how many kids question their sexuality and have absolutely none of the needed readings? That the library has to special order books on gender and sexuality for me to lend other kids because they can't be seen asking for it - especially when they're a pastor's child.

The thing is this: Gay marriage happens, and then what? Where are the other laws protecting people in the States? Where are the other laws protecting against discrimination? Where are the laws protecting non-conforming children period - instead of just saying "kids will be kids" and laughing it off.

I live in Canada. It's LEGAL here. So opposing it, no one gives much of a crap about. There is a four day camp available in three places in my country that teach youth between 14-24 that it's alright to be yourself. In my province, Alberta, I had to fight and shove bolded laws under my principal's nose just to get a support group for queer kids started, because he worried he'd be bashed by one of the multiple churches in my 5,000 population town. There are a total of three married same sex couples in my area who daily are seen scrubbing graffitti and shitty words off their porches because they went out for dinner.

When people stop talking about this idea that gay marriage is a thing, the legislation for kid protection is ignored. And that sends yet another message that kids don't matter - especially kids in any form of minority - physical, emotional, physiological or mental.



That's kind of my point. Everyone gives a fuck about gay marriage, and no one gives a damn about the trans kid who got threatened for using the right bathroom for his sex, on the basis of "if you're REALLY a dude, you should use the mens...".

....actually yes... the queer community does care about that. It's not something which has infiltrated the mainstream like gay marriage has but if you are going to use that as a reason to oppose gay marriage, you have really missed the whole point of intersectionality, and you are doing a huge disservice to all queer people.

[Harry Smith]

Off Topic: Just saying, your tone could really use work if you want to "convince" people to support your cause. It's pretty dismissive, especially on a thread asked for opinions. And applying laws such as environmentalism to an argument already based in "Nature vs Nurture" topics, is kind of really just adding fire to a bonfire of rage without facts.

I never said it trumps gay marriage.

Maybe if I rephrase it you'll get it better: Stop caring what adults do and do something to protect the children - legitimately. Stop expecting children to want the things of adults - because the 14 year old kid questioning their gender I spend hours texting encouragement to live cares about the fact that someone can get married - and actually help the kids. Do you know how many kids question their sexuality and have absolutely none of the needed readings? That the library has to special order books on gender and sexuality for me to lend other kids because they can't be seen asking for it - especially when they're a pastor's child.

The thing is this: Gay marriage happens, and then what? Where are the other laws protecting people in the States? Where are the other laws protecting against discrimination? Where are the laws protecting non-conforming children period - instead of just saying "kids will be kids" and laughing it off.

I live in Canada. It's LEGAL here. So opposing it, no one gives much of a crap about. There is a four day camp available in three places in my country that teach youth between 14-24 that it's alright to be yourself. In my province, Alberta, I had to fight and shove bolded laws under my principal's nose just to get a support group for queer kids started, because he worried he'd be bashed by one of the multiple churches in my 5,000 population town. There are a total of three married same sex couples in my area who daily are seen scrubbing graffitti and shitty words off their porches because they went out for dinner.

When people stop talking about this idea that gay marriage is a thing, the legislation for kid protection is ignored. And that sends yet another message that kids don't matter - especially kids in any form of minority - physical, emotional, physiological or mental.



That's kind of my point. Everyone gives a fuck about gay marriage, and no one gives a damn about the trans kid who got threatened for using the right bathroom for his sex, on the basis of "if you're REALLY a dude, you should use the mens...".

I'll make the same point I made before about environmentalism which was valid I think.

If you have a problem-you solve it. We didn't have equal marriage laws-we solved it. I think that's a good thing for the entire gay community.

But I also think that we need to tackle the other problems that you address in your point such as the lack of education. For example in Britain we managed to pass the 2010 equality bill and the 2013 marriage act. That's en example of how you can make two changes that help the LGBTQ community in two ways.

As I said before you shouldn't oppose gay marriage just because it doesn't solve all our problems. That's like being opposed to painkillers because they don't cure cancer

[Gamma Male]

Off Topic: Just saying, your tone could really use work if you want to "convince" people to support your cause. It's pretty dismissive, especially on a thread asked for opinions. And applying laws such as environmentalism to an argument already based in "Nature vs Nurture" topics, is kind of really just adding fire to a bonfire of rage without facts.

I never said it trumps gay marriage.

Maybe if I rephrase it you'll get it better: Stop caring what adults do and do something to protect the children - legitimately. Stop expecting children to want the things of adults - because the 14 year old kid questioning their gender I spend hours texting encouragement to live cares about the fact that someone can get married - and actually help the kids. Do you know how many kids question their sexuality and have absolutely none of the needed readings? That the library has to special order books on gender and sexuality for me to lend other kids because they can't be seen asking for it - especially when they're a pastor's child.

The thing is this: Gay marriage happens, and then what? Where are the other laws protecting people in the States? Where are the other laws protecting against discrimination? Where are the laws protecting non-conforming children period - instead of just saying "kids will be kids" and laughing it off.

I live in Canada. It's LEGAL here. So opposing it, no one gives much of a crap about. There is a four day camp available in three places in my country that teach youth between 14-24 that it's alright to be yourself. In my province, Alberta, I had to fight and shove bolded laws under my principal's nose just to get a support group for queer kids started, because he worried he'd be bashed by one of the multiple churches in my 5,000 population town. There are a total of three married same sex couples in my area who daily are seen scrubbing graffitti and shitty words off their porches because they went out for dinner.

When people stop talking about this idea that gay marriage is a thing, the legislation for kid protection is ignored. And that sends yet another message that kids don't matter - especially kids in any form of minority - physical, emotional, physiological or mental.



That's kind of my point. Everyone gives a fuck about gay marriage, and no one gives a damn about the trans kid who got threatened for using the right bathroom for his sex, on the basis of "if you're REALLY a dude, you should use the mens...".

I agree that anti-discrimination laws(especially for children) are more important than gay marriage, but still don't see why you don't simply support and fight for both. What you're basically saying is Because legalized gay marriage gives the impression that everything is okay and we can stop fighting for equal rights, I don't support it. But this doesn't make any sense. If gays and gender minorities are ever going to stop being discriminated against, we need gay marriage to be legal so it can become normalized in the eyes of the public and people will stop thinking LGBT people should be discriminated against. You're acting as if abolishing discrimination against sexual/gender minorities and gay marriage are mutually exclusive, but in reality they go hand in hand.

[crazyBoyjJ]

I think u Gay's and gay supprters are just arguing to prove ur point
But at the end of the day u and us all no what u guys r doing is a sin
so ur finding all escuses like discrimination and shit... i made my point already so i dont have to argue with u guys. Oh and btw i said im curious as to know the sexual life of my fellow gender. As my self have never experienced anything sexual with a girl or guy. This does not make me sexually attracted or physically attracted to men. Ok we will all be judged at the end. So buzz off

[Gamma Male]

I think u Gay's and gay supprters are just arguing to prove ur point
But at the end of the day u and us all no what u guys r doing is a sin
so ur finding all escuses like discrimination and shit... i made my point already so i dont have to argue with u guys. Oh and btw i said im curious as to know the sexual life of my fellow gender. As my self have never experienced anything sexual with a girl or guy. This does not make me sexually attracted or physically attracted to men. Ok we will all be judged at the end. So buzz off

If you don't want people with differing opinions to respond to your posts, GET OFF THE DAMNED INTERNET!
And how many times do I have to say this?
America.
Is.
Not.
A.
Theocracy.
I don't care if you think it's a sin, that doesn't give you a right to deny people the right to marry who they love.

[abc983055235235231a]

I think u Gay's and gay supprters are just arguing to prove ur point
But at the end of the day u and us all no what u guys r doing is a sin
so ur finding all escuses like discrimination and shit... i made my point already so i dont have to argue with u guys. Oh and btw i said im curious as to know the sexual life of my fellow gender. As my self have never experienced anything sexual with a girl or guy. This does not make me sexually attracted or physically attracted to men. Ok we will all be judged at the end. So buzz off

...no, the fight for equality is not about "proving a point". It is about protecting people from discrimination (at the hands of people like yourself).
Ultimately, being gay isn't a sin. It's as simple as that. People who teach that being gay is a sin are simply mutilating religious theology in order to promote a certain political agenda.

[Quick_Sylver]

....actually yes... the queer community does care about that. It's not something which has infiltrated the mainstream like gay marriage has but if you are going to use that as a reason to oppose gay marriage, you have really missed the whole point of intersectionality, and you are doing a huge disservice to all queer people.

Because all queer people want gay marriage. For sure. Definitely. And because I don't support it, I've actively protested it being a thing. Yes, indeed! Do note everything but the first and this sentence are sarcasm.

In seriousness - Why would I support something that it's been made clear by many gay members of this community, I shouldn't have a voice on because I'm trans and have a sexuality that isn't based upon whether or not their sex is the same as mine? Why would I when anyone who dares say otherwise is instantly homophobic? Why would I when it seems like a cult following that if you don't agree with gay marriage, you're anti gay marriage?

If it was a lot less of a binarist view point, I'd probably budge more. In the beginning, I was like Yay! Good. Now, it's becoming really common to hear this place and that place has signed it into law, so it's like, Okay... and now where's the next movement? Where are the intersectional people who will start trying for the rest? You're right, it hasn't infiltrated the mainstream - and unless people START saying other things are more important than it, no one's gonna do jackshit about it.

I'll make the same point I made before about environmentalism which was valid I think.

If you have a problem-you solve it. We didn't have equal marriage laws-we solved it. I think that's a good thing for the entire gay community.

But I also think that we need to tackle the other problems that you address in your point such as the lack of education. For example in Britain we managed to pass the 2010 equality bill and the 2013 marriage act. That's en example of how you can make two changes that help the LGBTQ community in two ways.

As I said before you shouldn't oppose gay marriage just because it doesn't solve all our problems. That's like being opposed to painkillers because they don't cure cancer

Are you intentionally picking comparisons meant for inflaming anger?

I oppose gay marriage because that's all anyone is talking about or giving a shit about, and that's it. You can say I "shouldnt" all you like, but I do. That's got nothing to do with metaphors and comparisons that are not related to the topic.

To use your "If you've a problem, solve it." logic: My problem is a lack of representation, a lack of information, ignorance and a hell of a lot more welcoming atmosphere from so called "safe spaces", let alone places that are supposedly trans* friendly that turn around and say you can't be trans* if you're at all gender diverse - so my options to solve it are to fight for it, to downplay other issues so mine get heard, and hopefully people will listen.

I agree that anti-discrimination laws(especially for children) are more important than gay marriage, but still don't see why you don't simply support and fight for both. What you're basically saying is Because legalized gay marriage gives the impression that everything is okay and we can stop fighting for equal rights, I don't support it. But this doesn't make any sense. If gays and gender minorities are ever going to stop being discriminated against, we need gay marriage to be legal so it can become normalized in the eyes of the public and people will stop thinking LGBT people should be discriminated against. You're acting as if abolishing discrimination against sexual/gender minorities and gay marriage are mutually exclusive, but in reality they go hand in hand.

One of the reasons I don't fight for it is that where I am, it's legal. Can't really afford to go to other countries and try and save the world.

Why do we need gay marriage legal to be normalized/accepted members of society? Why can't we be ourselves without the sexuality mattering? How does fitting into an American style stereotype based around reproduction in an overpopulated world normalize being gay?

How aren't they mutually exclusive? How many people turn around and say I'm for Gay Marriage - but oh god no, children can't decide their sexuality or gender at 13 or god forbid younger? How dare a family raise a child genderless - and then have it publicized? How many people actually know anything other than gay marriage and that's only because Macklemore is such a great saviour of the gay community(note: sarcasm.)?

Really, how many people are legitimately for trans rights to have the same rights as cis people? How many times have GAY PEOPLE turned around and shit on trans people?

And I bring up this point again: Same sex marriage is based on two penises' getting married, and two vaginas' getting married; a cissexist statement that nullifies and would negate any amount of efforts made by a transgender individual trying to get married as a heterosexual or otherwise - on the basis of sex.

[abc983055235235231a]

Because all queer people want gay marriage. For sure. Definitely. And because I don't support it, I've actively protested it being a thing. Yes, indeed! Do note everything but the first and this sentence are sarcasm.

In seriousness - Why would I support something that it's been made clear by many gay members of this community, I shouldn't have a voice on because I'm trans and have a sexuality that isn't based upon whether or not their sex is the same as mine? Why would I when anyone who dares say otherwise is instantly homophobic? Why would I when it seems like a cult following that if you don't agree with gay marriage, you're anti gay marriage?

If it was a lot less of a binarist view point, I'd probably budge more. In the beginning, I was like Yay! Good. Now, it's becoming really common to hear this place and that place has signed it into law, so it's like, Okay... and now where's the next movement? Where are the intersectional people who will start trying for the rest? You're right, it hasn't infiltrated the mainstream - and unless people START saying other things are more important than it, no one's gonna do jackshit about it.


You are the first homophobic trans* person I have met.

[Harry Smith]

so my options to solve it are to fight for it, to downplay other issues so mine get heard, and hopefully people will listen.



It's not about 'my issue is the best-lets do that' The government can work on both forms, schools can work on both forms. We can tackle more than one issues at once. You've came onto a gay marriage thread to oppose gay marriage because it gets too much attention. That sounds like a bad strategy to get support/understanding from people

I oppose gay marriage because that's all anyone is talking about

Should I oppose cancer research because that's all anyone talks about? Same logic

[Gamma Male]

Because all queer people want gay marriage. For sure. Definitely. And because I don't support it, I've actively protested it being a thing. Yes, indeed! Do note everything but the first and this sentence are sarcasm.

In seriousness - Why would I support something that it's been made clear by many gay members of this community, I shouldn't have a voice on because I'm trans and have a sexuality that isn't based upon whether or not their sex is the same as mine? Why would I when anyone who dares say otherwise is instantly homophobic? Why would I when it seems like a cult following that if you don't agree with gay marriage, you're anti gay marriage?

If it was a lot less of a binarist view point, I'd probably budge more. In the beginning, I was like Yay! Good. Now, it's becoming really common to hear this place and that place has signed it into law, so it's like, Okay... and now where's the next movement? Where are the intersectional people who will start trying for the rest? You're right, it hasn't infiltrated the mainstream - and unless people START saying other things are more important than it, no one's gonna do jackshit about it.



Are you intentionally picking comparisons meant for inflaming anger?

I oppose gay marriage because that's all anyone is talking about or giving a shit about, and that's it. You can say I "shouldnt" all you like, but I do. That's got nothing to do with metaphors and comparisons that are not related to the topic.

To use your "If you've a problem, solve it." logic: My problem is a lack of representation, a lack of information, ignorance and a hell of a lot more welcoming atmosphere from so called "safe spaces", let alone places that are supposedly trans* friendly that turn around and say you can't be trans* if you're at all gender diverse - so my options to solve it are to fight for it, to downplay other issues so mine get heard, and hopefully people will listen.



One of the reasons I don't fight for it is that where I am, it's legal. Can't really afford to go to other countries and try and save the world.

Why do we need gay marriage legal to be normalized/accepted members of society? Why can't we be ourselves without the sexuality mattering? How does fitting into an American style stereotype based around reproduction in an overpopulated world normalize being gay?

How aren't they mutually exclusive? How many people turn around and say I'm for Gay Marriage - but oh god no, children can't decide their sexuality or gender at 13 or god forbid younger? How dare a family raise a child genderless - and then have it publicized? How many people actually know anything other than gay marriage and that's only because Macklemore is such a great saviour of the gay community(note: sarcasm.)?

Really, how many people are legitimately for trans rights to have the same rights as cis people? How many times have GAY PEOPLE turned around and shit on trans people?

And I bring up this point again: Same sex marriage is based on two penises' getting married, and two vaginas' getting married; a cissexist statement that nullifies and would negate any amount of efforts made by a transgender individual trying to get married as a heterosexual or otherwise - on the basis of sex.

I support trans rights and gay marraige. I don't think gender should even be a factor in marriage. I support gay marriage, and trans marriage, and lesbian marriage, and hermaphrodite marriage, and straight marriage, and marriage for all gender identifies. I also support anti-discrimination laws for all gender and sexual minorities. I don't see why you can't do the same.

[TheBigUnit]

I think if people love each other, why should anyone else care? And if they want to get married then they should be allowed to. If someone doesn't like gay couples or gay marriage then that person shouldn't do it. But you can't force other people to not be with who they love. Love is love.

*psst* dannis homophobic though


all kidding aside, yeahh i dont see what the matter is with gay marriage, the opposition is basically just old people with old views, go back to the 80s and you have the problem with interracial marriages and such

[tyrfr]

support

[TapDancer]

Look, as much as I don't agree with it, I can understand why people of a Christian (or other faith) are against Gay Marriage. Having said that, God "said marriage is between a man and a woman" But other people who aren't Christian can still get married? I know that Judaism and Islam have the same god, but Hindu people and Buddhist people can get married. I think it is important to remember that when we want to legalise gay marriage, we only want to do it on a legal basis. Us "Gays" don't want to get married in a Church (or at least one that doesn't support us). Marriage in a Church is a union before God that is also recognised legally. We aren't insisting for the same thing "under God", all we want is the same piece of paper that you sign during the ceremony.

I think u Gay's and gay supprters are just arguing to prove ur point
But at the end of the day u and us all no what u guys r doing is a sin
so ur finding all escuses like discrimination and shit... i made my point already so i dont have to argue with u guys. Oh and btw i said im curious as to know the sexual life of my fellow gender. As my self have never experienced anything sexual with a girl or guy. This does not make me sexually attracted or physically attracted to men. Ok we will all be judged at the end. So buzz off

It is discrimination. As I mentioned, we don't want to force churches or non-Gay-Marriage supporters, we just want the same rights. You can have your own opinions, that is more than fine and I respect that. And lets just say that the Christians have it right. So it might be a sin, but let me remind you that only God can judge and: 2 Thessalonians 1:6 "God is just".

Also, I questioned when it said in your sig about the whole curious thing, and I see you have explained it. But, going on your "Christian ethics" here, I would just like to remind you that sex was made for procreation and no more. That, and generally most Christians agree that one should enter into marriage first, before sex. You should think twice about exploring "the sexual life of your fellow gender". So, if you are going to denounce a group of people for their practises which you consider a "sin", then you should really look at yourself to make sure you aren't just as "sinful". No where in the Bible does it say that any one sin is worse than the other (to my knowledge) therefore, all sin is equal. This includes stealing, lying, cheating. Not to say others don't lie and stuff, but I would find it hard to believe that you have not sinned at least once, like all of us

One other note, I find it a tad offensive that you refer to Gay people as "Gays". We might identify as gay, but, that isn't just who we are. I am not a "Gay" I am a 17 year old student who likes Dancing and swimming. I am a whole bunch of things, gay being only one of those things. We are people to you know.

[ozteen]

totally opposed to it in any way shape or form... They are not gay, they are homosexual.

[Gamma Male]

totally opposed to it in any way shape or form... They are not gay, they are homosexual.

Why are you opposed to it?

[Bolwing]

The point is u need a WOMAN and yes elderly can be married if their hetrosexual.

That crazyBoyjJ. He's just trollin'. Leave the sad bastard be. :yawn:

As for gay marriage, it WILL NOT lead to humanity's extinction, incest, drought, or anything of the sort. If two pepole of the same sex want to get married, let them.

And don't give me any of that "b... but the Bible says that marriage is a sacred bond between a man and a woman" bullshit.

It's about as sacred as a goat's asshole. Some pepole get divorced three times (or more) during their lives, and no one seems to give a shit. And I'd like to remind you that an ideal biblical marriage involves one man and MULTIPLE women.

[ozteen]

Why are you opposed to it?
marriage is a union between a man and a woman, not two men or two women.

[Harry Smith]

marriage is a union between a man and a woman, not two men or two women.

By what definition? We've been changing our laws for the last 300 years-do you still think Slavery should be legal? Or that rape is okay?

Have you seen the divorce rates between men and women? 20th century marriage is hardly something to boast about

[Vlerchan]

Spoiler: I'm arguing that I think that marriage between close-relative shouldn't be banned. I've yet to see a valid argument beyond 'I think it's disgusting', which is strangely similar to arguments against homosexuality that were prevalent in the early- to mid-1900s and the US today, and 'but what about the children (?!)', which I've addressed below. Note: I do find incest disgusting - as I've been raised to view it as - but I'm yet to come-across an argument against it that I see as strong enough to turn me towards violently-suppressing this subset of the population.

EDIT: I'm totally cool to make an entirely new thread out of this. I realise that it's off-topic.

Close family members- I assume that's brother-sister, mother-son etc. That's not a type of marriage that I support because it's breed through abuse largely[1]. I mean the situation arises by an adult abusing their power over there child and thus using marriage to justify an unhealthy relationship[2]. I mean if a child marries there mother are they their husband or their son?[3] At least with gay marriage its still pretty linear. On the aspect of children I'd argue that whilst marriage isn't built on children[4] a lot of gay couples and future couples would want to adopt, surrogate or IVF, the problem is that family members wouldn't be able to do this because the child would be born out of incest[5].

[1]: This is true when you consider adult-child relationships. In adult-adult relationships it is usually wholly consensual. I'm obviously going to argue for adult-adult relationships here.

[2]: Expand please.

[3]: I find this largely irrelevant to the issue at hand.

[4]: This is the counter to the rest of the line but I'll address the rest of the line regardless.

[5]: You'd be surprised by how many generations of inter-family breeding it takes before the risk of mutations to become an issue. Regardless, I'm personally against illegalising inter-family breeding on the grounds of potential mutation just as I'm against sterilising/de-barring from sex individuals with heritable diseases (and the poor) - I like to be consistent.

Gay marraige isn't something that's going to rip down the foundations of society and send us to hell-it's simply two adults committing to each other to join together in a union[6].
[6]: And I never said it wasn't.

marriage is a union between a man and a woman, not two men or two women.

Yes. That is how it is currently legislated in certain (backwards) parts of the world - Ireland included.

And that is why we are arguing to change it.

[Remora]

I just don't understand why people are against it, i mean, seriously, what's the difference between two guys marrying and a guy and a girl marrying other than what gender they are?

[dontfiguremeout]

So, you accept gay people and have nothing against them, you just don't think they should be allowed to marry who they love.
DOUBLE THINK!

I accept them, I just don't support their views. They can do what they want, it's just I don't support it a whole bunch. I accept them.

[Etcetera]

I don't see the point in letting this thread go on. I really don't.

[Miserabilia]

I accept them, I just don't support their views. They can do what they want, it's just I don't support it a whole bunch. I accept them.

I think the word you are looking for is tolerate;
you tolerate homosexuals.

"the practice of deliberately allowing or permitting a thing of which one disapproves. One can meaningfully speak of tolerating, ie of allowing or permitting, only if one is in a position to disallow"."
- Tolerate

You do not accept them, because acceptence requires the "aggreeing" with something; if you do not aggree with something you do not accept.

[Harry Smith]

Spoiler: I'm arguing that I think that marriage between close-relative shouldn't be banned. I've yet to see a valid argument beyond 'I think it's disgusting', which is strangely similar to arguments against homosexuality that were prevalent in the early- to mid-1900s and the US today, and 'but what about the children (?!)', which I've addressed below. Note: I do find incest disgusting - as I've been raised to view it as - but I'm yet to come-across an argument against it that I see as strong enough to turn me towards violently-suppressing this subset of the population.

EDIT: I'm totally cool to make an entirely new thread out of this. I realise that it's off-topic.



[1]: This is true when you consider adult-child relationships. In adult-adult relationships it is usually wholly consensual. I'm obviously going to argue for adult-adult relationships here.

[2]: Expand please.

[3]: I find this largely irrelevant to the issue at hand.

[4]: This is the counter to the rest of the line but I'll address the rest of the line regardless.

[5]: You'd be surprised by how many generations of inter-family breeding it takes before the risk of mutations to become an issue. Regardless, I'm personally against illegalising inter-family breeding on the grounds of potential mutation just as I'm against sterilising/de-barring from sex individuals with heritable diseases (and the poor) - I like to be consistent.


[6]: And I never said it wasn't.



Yes. That is how it is currently legislated in certain (backwards) parts of the world - Ireland included.

And that is why we are arguing to change it.

Yes this is going to sound very hypocritical of me but I honestly believe that inter family marriage breaks down the foundation of a loving relationship-I mean if a brother and sister married in the eyes of a court/government/insurance company would they be brother and sister or husband and wife. That's the major issue is that it completely twists the family dynamic. Gay marriage does this to an extend but no way where as dramatically. I mean imagine telling your children that your dad is also your uncle. This also links to the idea of abuse as a father could rise his daughter as his daughter but change her ideas about a healthy sexual relationship as is often the case with incest

[britishboy]

What's interesting is that i feel gay relationships may become less taboo after gay marriage has been legalised, makes it seem more normal.