Why Do We Wish To Succeed?

[The Trendy Wolf]

Why do we try so hard to succeed in our lives, especially in trying to get a good job by doing well in school? By succeeding in school, we often get money, respect, and perhaps a higher chance of changing the world, depending on what job you receive. All of those motivational factors seem so appealing, yet so selfish for the most part. You still have the ability to change the world and gain some form of profit and/or respect even if you don't succeed in school, for example, by writing a book or becoming popular online. I suppose that to a certain age it helps us to become more responsible, but at some point many of us begin to hate going to school and learning the things that we will never even use in most of our desired careers.

For these reasons, I must ask you all, why do we try so hard to succeed besides selfish motivations? I question why we must endure all the stress and difficulties that come with school when so many of us, if not all, could learn all that we want to through the internet, and it would be on our own terms as well.

Learning on our own would be a much richer experience rather than memorizing the material that we are taught in school. We truly don't need jobs to change the world, and I think that's enough motivation for me to consider an alternative way of learning. We could learn so much more from reliable sources online in one day than we could in a week of school.

Money doesn't even matter to me anymore, but it's basically required in society, plus, I think it causes most of the world's problems. Perhaps I'm simply not thinking rationally, or maybe I'm just asking the question that I haven't heard anyone ask before.

I'm not saying that school is bad, and I know that it teaches us responsibility, planning, and other important skills, but other than that, why do we truly need it beyond our basic skills? Especially in today's educational system, many of us receive so much extra help that we've come to rely on it, such as test/quiz retakes, after school help, parents or tutors, and we're constantly having to keep up with our peers. However, if we had control of our own learning and taking interest in subjects that we enjoy, then we could go at our own pace, and we most likely wouldn't develop a hatred of the forced learning that takes place in our schools in the first place.

Another example of how schools make many students selfish is the grading system. Attaining and retaining grades is a motivation to do our schoolwork, and the fact that we practically must threaten students with the thought of getting a bad grade, and thus having a bad GPA for college just so that we can make them learn occasionally important material is absolutely ridiculous. Learning should be something that we all want to do, despite it taking away from our free time.

Maybe I'm just venting, or I may have a valid argument. I could just be not thinking clearly enough to see the obvious flaws in my claims, or I may be speaking the truth about all of this. I'm simply wondering if I'm missing the obvious importance of these selfish motivations.

Either way, I would really appreciate your thoughts on this.

[Gwen]

Well your points are false or wrong, since they're your opinion.

Well we cannot just go against the government or the way life works in your country. You either go through school, get a job and earn money or you lose out on all opportunities. People want to travel, drive fast cars, wear nice clothes, own a fine house. The way society works and has bought us up to believe is that money is the source to get all these goods things.

You say money doesn't mean anything to anymore. Money is paying for the internet you use. It funds your basic life necessities (No matter if you like it or not that cannot be ignored).

Grades are there to show you where you need to make improvements, if you get an A in Maths you are obviously good at it. If you get a D in English you are being told to improve as you are not up to the standard that everyone else is up to.

I do agree on how shit the system seems that you need to do well on tests and get a piece of paper that can get you a good job, and without that paper you must grind for that money.

People want to succeed because in the short life they have, they'd rather it be comfortable and to have a full belly and be able to shower every night. These can be seen as selfish but these are things that is seen as stupid to refuse. That's my opinion.

[The Trendy Wolf]

Well your points are false or wrong, since they're your opinion.

Well we cannot just go against the government or the way life works in your country. You either go through school, get a job and earn money or you lose out on all opportunities. People want to travel, drive fast cars, wear nice clothes, own a fine house. The way society works and has bought us up to believe is that money is the source to get all these goods things.

You say money doesn't mean anything to anymore. Money is paying for the internet you use. It funds your basic life necessities (No matter if you like it or not that cannot be ignored).

Grades are there to show you where you need to make improvements, if you get an A in Maths you are obviously good at it. If you get a D in English you are being told to improve as you are not up to the standard that everyone else is up to.

I do agree on how shit the system seems that you need to do well on tests and get a piece of paper that can get you a good job, and without that paper you must grind for that money.

People want to succeed because in the short life they have, they'd rather it be comfortable and to have a full belly and be able to shower every night. These can be seen as selfish but these are things that is seen as stupid to refuse. That's my opinion.

But what I'm saying is that if money wasn't a lost cause, and we learned on our own accord, then we would learn so much more and we would likely come to love learning much more than we do today.

I honestly don't care about money anymore, but that's not saying that I don't need it to acquire the necessities in our nations/society.

Besides, do all of us really use our grades to see what we need improvements on? Many of us often say to ourselves, "Why do I even need to learn this?" Also, getting an 'A' in a subject doesn't necessarily mean that you are good at it, nor can a grade tell you whether you like a subject or not.

[Gwen]

But what I'm saying is that if money wasn't a lost cause, and we learned on our own accord, then we would learn so much more and we would likely come to love learning much more than we do today.

I honestly don't care about money anymore, but that's not saying that I don't need it to acquire the necessities in our nations/society.

Besides, do all of us really use our grades to see what we need improvements on? Many of us often say to ourselves, "Why do I even need to learn this?"

Well people don't work for free. Nobody is going to keep the internet running if there is nothing to gain. Not everybody will work towards knowledge and loving, because it doesn't benefit them as the old society would. Who the hell is making sports cars if they don't cost anything like normal cars that require less work to make? Only the dedicated would continue and everything else would fail.

We could still eat and drink and make our own clothes but I'm not going to figure out how to produce electricity or how to work a power grid. I'm sure as hell people who work collecting garbage or sewage wouldn't work there if they didn't need money anymore.

If I'm getting a D in English (Grammar and spelling which I'm using right now) I'm going to have an issue communicating with people or I'll look like a dumb shit who never learnt how to spell or use "and" or "or". If people got to choose what their core subjects are, could you imagine how many people would fail in maths and give up, then can't count past 20?

You think why do I need to learn this? To have basic intelligence so you aren't someone who has no basic knowledge and who's only use is to waste food and air.

[The Trendy Wolf]

Well people don't work for free. Nobody is going to keep the internet running if there is nothing to gain. Not everybody will work towards knowledge and loving, because it doesn't benefit them as the old society would. Who the hell is making sports cars if they don't cost anything like normal cars that require less work to make? Only the dedicated would continue and everything else would fail.

We could still eat and drink and make our own clothes but I'm not going to figure out how to produce electricity or how to work a power grid. I'm sure as hell people who work collecting garbage or sewage wouldn't work there if they didn't need money anymore.

If I'm getting a D in English (Grammar and spelling which I'm using right now) I'm going to have an issue communicating with people or I'll look like a dumb shit who never learnt how to spell or use "and" or "or". If people got to choose what their core subjects are, could you imagine how many people would fail in maths and give up, then can't count past 20?

You think why do I need to learn this? To have basic intelligence so you aren't someone who has no basic knowledge and who's only use is to waste food and air.

Grades are merely a letter, and cannot reflect the person that you are because homework, tests, quizzes, classwork, etc. are all taken into account, and those who are depressed or too busy will almost always get lower grades no matter how intelligent they are. Besides, people aren't born with a particular view of learning, whether it be math, science, English, or history, so the way that we learn is clearly flawed in that it makes kids not like learning, most likely because it is forced upon them.

[Cygnus]

Well this is more of a thread about learning rather than actually wishing to succeed. Responding exactly to what you said, and not about the question the thread asks, why do we learn all of this stuff in school? Because of general knowledge and general culture, one might not notice, but having general knowledge is quite important, you never know when that might come in handy, plus it might help you interact with people as well. Same with general culture. Sure, one can learn what one wants and JUST that, however I think its great to have general knowledge.

[Gwen]

Grades are merely a letter, and cannot reflect the person that you are because homework, tests, quizzes, classwork, etc. are all taken into account, and those who are depressed or too busy will almost always get lower grades no matter how intelligent they are. Besides, people aren't born with a particular view of learning, whether it be math, science, English, or history, so the way that we learn is clearly flawed in that it makes kids not like learning, most likely because it is forced upon them.

In a lot of cases if they aren't forced they won't try or go to school. So we get the same problem, they all stop at with a Grade 6/10 education. I know everything I need to, why would I need to do more work? People need to be forced to do this and be made to improve or they won't succeed. Do you know how many kids get cocky at Grade 5 because "How much they know"? They don't know anything yet and neither would most people if they had the choice to not go to school at all. It is also a way to teach people about improvement. School and grades remind you if you don't put effort into it you don't get good marks in return, same with any job. It reminds you that you can always improve in whatever they do. And don't make it seem as though it is totally unfair most schools would take into account illness or if your having a bad time and give you extensions or help you study. Those guidance councilors and tutors aren't paid for no goddamn reason.

[The Trendy Wolf]

In a lot of cases if they aren't forced they won't try or go to school. So we get the same problem, they all stop at with a Grade 6/10 education. I know everything I need to, why would I need to do more work? People need to be forced to do this and be made to improve or they won't succeed. Do you know how many kids get cocky at Grade 5 because "How much they know"? They don't know anything yet and neither would most people if they had the choice to not go to school at all. It is also a way to teach people about improvement. School and grades remind you if you don't put effort into it you don't get good marks in return, same with any job. It reminds you that you can always improve in whatever they do. And don't make it seem as though it is totally unfair most schools would take into account illness or if your having a bad time and give you extensions or help you study. Those guidance councilors and tutors aren't paid for no goddamn reason.

That is not entirely true. If we benefit from learning new things, then we will naturally want to continue learning and gaining knowledge. Today, school and learning is forced upon us, which is normally seen as bad in society. Therefore, we usually associate learning new things with being bad. If we never experience the forced learning, then we won't ever develop that assumption that most or all learning is a hassle.

[Gwen]

That is not entirely true. If we benefit from learning new things, then we will naturally want to continue learning and gaining knowledge. Today, school and learning is forced upon us, which is normally seen as bad in society. Therefore, we usually associate learning new things with being bad. If we never experience the forced learning, then we won't ever develop that assumption that most or all learning is a hassle.

I have no idea where you come from, but I know 80% of my school wouldn't continue learning past the basics. They come to school get C's and never think about what they learnt. What your saying doesn't seem to have relevance with how most people act. How many people will try to learn neuroscience, if they never learnt science. How many brilliant people will not be able to flourish if they don't know anything about the world. How many people would decide to learn about WWI? war enthusiasts maybe, but the average person won't just go "Well, I feel like WWI is something I need to learn all about as it is something that is very important in history!".

We have a curriculum made that shows what we need to learn to have a good understanding of all topics and we don't just leave out something important because we don't feel the need to learn about it. I'd hate living with other human beings if I was one of the few people who could do long division. :|

[The Trendy Wolf]

I have no idea where you come from, but I know 80% of my school wouldn't continue learning past the basics. They come to school get C's and never think about what they learnt. What your saying doesn't seem to have relevance with how most people act. How many people will try to learn neuroscience, if they never learnt science. How many brilliant people will not be able to flourish if they don't know anything about the world. How many people would decide to learn about WWI? war enthusiasts maybe, but the average person won't just go "Well, I feel like WWI is something I need to learn all about as it is something that is very important in history!".

We have a curriculum made that shows what we need to learn to have a good understanding of all topics and we don't just leave out something important because we don't feel the need to learn about it. I'd hate living with other human beings if I was one of the few people who could do long division. :|

What I am trying to say is that if learning is forced on people, then they will develop a tendency to dislike learning in general, as living beings instinctively act based on their past experiences and their own interpretations of events and memories. These lessons need to be included in life when they are really relevant, and learning shouldn't be contained into an eight hour school day, five days a week, and homework practically every night.

[Gwen]

What I am trying to say is that if learning is forced on people, then they will develop a tendency to dislike learning in general, as living beings instinctively act based on their past experiences and their own interpretations of events and memories. These lessons need to be included in life when they are really relevant, and learning shouldn't be contained into an eight hour school day, five days a week, and homework practically every night.

But for all that you argue. People still go past grade 10 and go into college of their own choice. And you can't tell me that education like this is bad for people. There are other countries and schools that do it diffrently. But you've been privildged to get a proper education in a school that is consistent and teaches things that you'll need to branch off into harder topics and give you basic knowledge that can help through your whole life. People dislike school, but they keep going to school. Because it's good for them. It's like eating vegetables, not everyone likes them but almost everyone eats 'em.

[Lovelife090994]

Why do we try so hard to succeed in our lives, especially in trying to get a good job by doing well in school? By succeeding in school, we often get money, respect, and perhaps a higher chance of changing the world, depending on what job you receive. All of those motivational factors seem so appealing, yet so selfish for the most part. You still have the ability to change the world and gain some form of profit and/or respect even if you don't succeed in school, for example, by writing a book or becoming popular online. I suppose that to a certain age it helps us to become more responsible, but at some point many of us begin to hate going to school and learning the things that we will never even use in most of our desired careers.

For these reasons, I must ask you all, why do we try so hard to succeed besides selfish motivations? I question why we must endure all the stress and difficulties that come with school when so many of us, if not all, could learn all that we want to through the internet, and it would be on our own terms as well.

Learning on our own would be a much richer experience rather than memorizing the material that we are taught in school. We truly don't need jobs to change the world, and I think that's enough motivation for me to consider an alternative way of learning. We could learn so much more from reliable sources online in one day than we could in a week of school.

Money doesn't even matter to me anymore, but it's basically required in society, plus, I think it causes most of the world's problems. Perhaps I'm simply not thinking rationally, or maybe I'm just asking the question that I haven't heard anyone ask before.

I'm not saying that school is bad, and I know that it teaches us responsibility, planning, and other important skills, but other than that, why do we truly need it beyond our basic skills? Especially in today's educational system, many of us receive so much extra help that we've come to rely on it, such as test/quiz retakes, after school help, parents or tutors, and we're constantly having to keep up with our peers. However, if we had control of our own learning and taking interest in subjects that we enjoy, then we could go at our own pace, and we most likely wouldn't develop a hatred of the forced learning that takes place in our schools in the first place.

Another example of how schools make many students selfish is the grading system. Attaining and retaining grades is a motivation to do our schoolwork, and the fact that we practically must threaten students with the thought of getting a bad grade, and thus having a bad GPA for college just so that we can make them learn occasionally important material is absolutely ridiculous. Learning should be something that we all want to do, despite it taking away from our free time.

Maybe I'm just venting, or I may have a valid argument. I could just be not thinking clearly enough to see the obvious flaws in my claims, or I may be speaking the truth about all of this. I'm simply wondering if I'm missing the obvious importance of these selfish motivations.

Either way, I would really appreciate your thoughts on this.

One can never truly learn all they need alone. You must be taught and corrected when wrong like with speech. If I wasn't taught how to utilize the English language for efficaciously I would not be able to converse with you at the moment. So, I understand your point of why bother, but I know that you must be able to learn more than basics. On your own it doesn't always work.
Grades do help. My grades were never high but they pushed me to do better. That is what success is, to do better and it is the goal of doing better to be more than what you were before.

[ksdnfkfr]

In my situation, because of my fairly severe autism and other neurological problems and learning disabilities, I could easily not keep going forward in my education. I am often told not to keep pushing myself so hard. I could just resign and live off disability and a couple of other sources of income. No one would blame me. They are astonished that I have taken things as far as I have already. But instead I keep striving to achieve. It is a matter of motivation. Of achieving a goal. Of expanding my understanding and abilities. Of growing intellectually. That does not come by itself. It comes through structure and discipline.

[darthearth]

I understand what the OP is saying. I think required classes should strictly be only that which is important to be a productive citizen, anything beyond that stifles the desire to learn. I think economics should be much more strongly encouraged over higher math and stuff like that. Knowing how central banks work is much more important than permutations and combinations. And just because we know more scientifically doesn't mean science should be taught less in-depthly. I say reduce the topics and improve comprehension of the important basics rather than include more topics with less understanding of each. Make sense? Stuff like that, less cramming more understanding! And personally I think tests should be more essays on concepts than regurgitation of facts. How about that? Oh, but that takes too long to grade. Yeah.

But what do people think of that?

[the_dude69]

Short answer. Dopamine and serotonin

[Canadian Dream]

First things first, why have school? In part because of points you mentioned, like responsibility, planning and what not. The thing is you don't really know what you want to do in the future to change the world, and if you didn't go to school well guess what my friend your dream job suddenly becomes much harder to get to. Most of us will learn to like school in college or university, since it will then be your choice what to study. I agree with you that memorizing stuff isn't really beneficial to some point, and I don't know about you guys in the U. S. but in Canada the system is changing so we will understand what we learn more than we memorize. So I actually don't agree that school is for selfish motivations. Also, we go to school to integrate in society, and let me tell you that you will learn to appreciate money a bit more eventually, because I don't think our world is going to go back to trading anymore. Then, not need jobs? I'm sorry, but I'm not even going to bother arguing with that. So overall, we strive to succeed because it is our way to integrate in society.

[Zenos]

Some people try hard because they have a since of destiny a since of something grand in life others to feel a since of accomplishment in an other wise hollow life

[AlexOnToast]

I guess it's just a Human Condition ...

[britishboy]

Why would you not want to succeed?

[ImCoolBeans]

In psychology the will or drive to succeed is called self actualization. It's the inherent drive in human beings to reach their goals, be their "best self", and act as a fully functioning member of society. Many well respected psychologists believe that all humans strive to reach self actualization throughout their lives -- it gives us meaning, drive, and determination -- things that most humans feel the need for to function well in their lives.