Catholic Religion

[Paige Elizabeth]

Hey guys! I just want your views of the Catholic Religion;


I'm personally not Catholic, but I attend a Catholic school and I've learned a lot about how their beliefs differ my beliefs.


Sooooo with that being said...


Do you find the Catholic church to be a joke or the only true religion?

[Kid0809]

I am catholic and am taught to believe it so I do but however I respect and tolerate all the other religions

[unknownuser]

It was what I was brought up with and what I chose to believe.

I may make assumptions and judgements about certain people or groups of people in my head (yeah, I know, bad... but no ones perfect), but never would do anything to harm them; physically or mentally.

You can go do your thing over there and I'll do mine over here, keep it to yourself. Then I'm fine with others and their beliefs.

[Cygnus]

I was born catholic and was catholic until 2011 when I became an atheist. I honestly do not mind catholicism, especially the current pope, he is awesome, and catholics are surprisingly flexible in some aspects, as long as they don't impose their religion on me I am fine with most religions.

[IAMWILL]

I am not Catholic, but went to Catholic high school and studied the religion and such.

I like a lot of what the church does, I have some issues with it here and there but I share a lot of the same views on moral/ethical issues. I also like how they base nearly all their teachings off Natural law (which is all that can be derived from reason and logic alone) and not the Bible, I'm not a fan of religions using the Bible as they're main teaching source, being that it is a mainly a historical text. I also admire the huge amount they contribute to society with hospitals, emergency aid/relief, etc.

Also, Pope Francis has been a great role model for the Church. He is much better at explaining church teachings than Benedict was (although may I remind everyone that he hasn't and almost certainly won't change the church's stance on any issues).

[kylem]

Protestant here and I believe. I don't think you have to go to church to believe or be told.

[Name1ess]

Hey guys! I just want your views of the Catholic Religion;


I'm personally not Catholic, but I attend a Catholic school and I've learned a lot about how their beliefs differ my beliefs.


Sooooo with that being said...


Do you find the Catholic church to be a joke or the only true religion?


I wouldn't go for either extreme. It is neither a joke nor as far as anyone can know true. You can and should believe whatever you like. There are some good aspects of it, as well as some very bad ones. You can believe whatever you want until you harm another or their rights. Your religous beliefs shouldnt interfere with anyone's life. My advice for you is analyze everything you hear in that school and do more research. Do not accept everything you hear. :)

Chris :)

[Pseudogeek]

I'm a Protestant and I don't really know much about Catholicism, but to me it seems alright.

[CharlieHorse]

Catholicism, like all other theist religions, are ridiculous in my books.
I'm a secular humanist / atheist.

[tovaris]

A useles institution that feeds of the mases.

[Syvelocin]

Catholics, so far, are my favourite Christians. Obviously, I'm not into theism, but I love them. I was raised Catholic and I literally know nothing about Catholicism other than they put me in a white dress and made me sing a lame song with obvious hand gestures in front of my parents. Then I was able to develop a taste for wine at the age of six and eat that Christmas wafer water-and-flour shit that we already ate at my mum's family reunion every year (the Polish part of my melting pot of random West European).

Anyway. The Catholics I know don't give a shit about my life choices. My mum engages in religious discussions without getting butt-hurt and the rest of my family has nothing to say/is completely supportive of my gay atheistic witch lifestyle. They're on my "cool" list. Especially since they don't do a prayer circle before every meal and repeatedly estrange the agnostic, pagan, and atheist (Dad, me, and my brother respectively) like my dad's side.

[Stronk Serb]

They have bad sides, especially the leadership, but individual priests are OK just like any other.

[Achillea]

I am a Catholic myself and I come from a mainly Catholic country, 84.2% it seems. To be honest you would expect that to be much higher, I certainly did! I thought it was something around 90%-98%!! There is a reason for that fall though, probably because of all the scandals and abuses committed by the evil "Priests". It seems many people have lost their faith in this once extremely powerful institution as a result, even losing their whole faith in God as Atheism is the second highest religious group[.
Because I live in a country where most people are Catholic, I think the priest are much more relaxed about forcing ideas down people throats at Mass. I hear that in America, priest would CONDEMN abortion an Condemn Sex and condemn gays etc. but here, no such thing as far as I have ever seen, just a reading or two from the Bible and then talking about how you can be a good, charitable, loving person. Its very sweet I think.
I think that the church used to have way too much power in Ireland, like serious power over everything. i.e speak badly about a priest of anything Catholic and you would get sent to a "Hospital" or an asylum. Contraception was illegal until very recently. Same with gay marriage. Same with divorce. Today, every school almost is a Catholic school. My school is a Catholic school as are most schools with any reputation. In some areas such as old English Protestant towns is the country there are probably some small Anglican Schools.
The reason for this is because when England took over Ireland, the Irish were firm Catholics an dafter King Henry and England went protestant, Ireland didn't follow and Catholicism became a sign of Irishness. That can be seen in Derry or London Derry in the North of Ireland where terrible fighting has always existed.
I have studied other sections of Christianity an to be honest, I have nothing against any of them. Transubstantiation or Consubstantiation ? It doesn't make a difference to me, as long as you carry out good acts.I personally like having a Pope, but that's because we have a good Pope at the moment. I wouldn't like to have to listen to one single minister or even worse, the Queen of England.....
In terms of History, I think that the Catholic church started off with great intentions but than due to various men became a shambles (Simony, Nepotism, Pluralism etc....) but I hope that it will keep on adjusting until it is perfected. It really needs to adopt female priests and marriage too though...
To put a long story short I do not think that it is a joke however, like all churches, it is not perfect. I hope that you are treated fairly at your school and not discriminated against!!;)

[darthearth]

I wouldn't call it a joke. It is definitely a religion. I believe Christians should go with the church they find most fulfilling to them. I have problems with infallible text dogma in general, both Catholic and Protestant. I see a lack of freedom to interpret the faith in Catholicism. It seems like they are the "my way or the highway" type. I take issue with the stubborn adherence to papal opinions throughout the ages, it chokes the growth and evolution of a living church. But some like the structure, I think that is a big appeal. However, some don't like it because of the structure. But the choking dogma is the main problem with the Catholic and Protestant church, it's a big reason why pew numbers are declining. People need to be more free to craft a more personal experience and faith.

[IAMWILL]

I wouldn't call it a joke. It is definitely a religion. I believe Christians should go with the church they find most fulfilling to them. I have problems with infallible text dogma in general, both Catholic and Protestant. I see a lack of freedom to interpret the faith in Catholicism. It seems like they are the "my way or the highway" type. I take issue with the stubborn adherence to papal opinions throughout the ages, it chokes the growth and evolution of a living church. But some like the structure, I think that is a big appeal. However, some don't like it because of the structure. But the choking dogma is the main problem with the Catholic and Protestant church, it's a big reason why pew numbers are declining. People need to be more free to craft a more personal experience and faith.
I've heard a lot of people say similar things to what you've said. Forgive me if i read your post wrong, but it seems like you're saying "if they change their teachings on a few issues I would support them more." One thing a lot of people don't understand is that very few teachings of the Catholic Church have changed in the last 2000 years because a large majority of their teachings are based on "Natural Law" (a fancy word for logic and reason) and not the Bible or other sacred texts. Papal infallibility only applies to interpretation of scripture, so the Pope and other high ranking religious officials actually don't even have the power to change most church teachings, including marriage/abortion.

[darthearth]

I've heard a lot of people say similar things to what you've said. Forgive me if i read your post wrong, but it seems like you're saying "if they change their teachings on a few issues I would support them more." One thing a lot of people don't understand is that very few teachings of the Catholic Church have changed in the last 2000 years because a large majority of their teachings are based on "Natural Law" (a fancy word for logic and reason) and not the Bible or other sacred texts. Papal infallibility only applies to interpretation of scripture, so the Pope and other high ranking religious officials actually don't even have the power to change most church teachings, including marriage/abortion.

Please list significant teachings you feel follow from "natural law" and not any scriptural text.

[The Trendy Wolf]

Do you find the Catholic church to be a joke or the only true religion?

Nobody should choose whether it is the correct way of thinking or not because it is all based on opinion. Disrespecting and criticizing others' beliefs is flat-out intolerance, and it leads to arguments or even violence. Religion is guidance in life, although I am an atheist myself, I respect the Catholic religion, and every religion or belief system for that matter, because I hold true to our basic right of believing in whatever we wish.

Thank You :D

I am a Catholic myself and I come from a mainly Catholic country, 84.2% it seems. To be honest you would expect that to be much higher, I certainly did! I thought it was something around 90%-98%!! There is a reason for that fall though, probably because of all the scandals and abuses committed by the evil "Priests". It seems many people have lost their faith in this once extremely powerful institution as a result, even losing their whole faith in God as Atheism is the second highest religious group[.
Because I live in a country where most people are Catholic, I think the priest are much more relaxed about forcing ideas down people throats at Mass. I hear that in America, priest would CONDEMN abortion an Condemn Sex and condemn gays etc. but here, no such thing as far as I have ever seen, just a reading or two from the Bible and then talking about how you can be a good, charitable, loving person. Its very sweet I think.
I think that the church used to have way too much power in Ireland, like serious power over everything. i.e speak badly about a priest of anything Catholic and you would get sent to a "Hospital" or an asylum. Contraception was illegal until very recently. Same with gay marriage. Same with divorce. Today, every school almost is a Catholic school. My school is a Catholic school as are most schools with any reputation. In some areas such as old English Protestant towns is the country there are probably some small Anglican Schools.
The reason for this is because when England took over Ireland, the Irish were firm Catholics an dafter King Henry and England went protestant, Ireland didn't follow and Catholicism became a sign of Irishness. That can be seen in Derry or London Derry in the North of Ireland where terrible fighting has always existed.
I have studied other sections of Christianity an to be honest, I have nothing against any of them. Transubstantiation or Consubstantiation ? It doesn't make a difference to me, as long as you carry out good acts.I personally like having a Pope, but that's because we have a good Pope at the moment. I wouldn't like to have to listen to one single minister or even worse, the Queen of England.....
In terms of History, I think that the Catholic church started off with great intentions but than due to various men became a shambles (Simony, Nepotism, Pluralism etc....) but I hope that it will keep on adjusting until it is perfected. It really needs to adopt female priests and marriage too though...
To put a long story short I do not think that it is a joke however, like all churches, it is not perfect. I hope that you are treated fairly at your school and not discriminated against!!;)

I don't believe that the majority of people who have "conformed" to Atheism have done so because of the actions of various priests. Many of them, including me, respect Catholicism, Protestantism (which I was first born into), or any other religion or belief system, have converted because they developed a logical way of explaining things to ourselves, and they no longer require guidance from a god of any kind as we all have the ability to command our own lives and decisions.

I would also like to state that much of what you hear about America is over-exaggerated by the media. I doubt that people of Catholicism would leave their religion simply because of a few incidents involving clergymen which have nothing to do with the religion's views or beliefs.

Catholicism, like all other theist religions, are ridiculous in my books.
I'm a secular humanist / atheist.

I find it hard to believe that you call yourself a humanist despite the fact that you call something such as this "ridiculous" in your opinion. It is better to act as if you are strengthening humanity with everything you do, and that you don't show intolerance towards anyone because it will certainly spark arguments or even violence, as it has been quite prevalent in history throughout.


-merged multiple posts. -Emerald Dream

[CharlieHorse]

I find it hard to believe that you call yourself a humanist despite the fact that you call something such as this "ridiculous" in your opinion. It is better to act as if you are strengthening humanity with everything you do, and that you don't show intolerance towards anyone because it will certainly spark arguments or even violence, as it has been quite prevalent in history throughout.

" /ATHEIST"
i decide on the situation whether or not you deserve tolerance based on a rational judgment of character.

[The Trendy Wolf]

" /ATHEIST"
i decide on the situation whether or not you deserve tolerance based on a rational judgment of character.

I cannot help but question the flaws with this form of judgement.

I don't like to view things as ridiculous unless it is absolutely terrible in all aspects of attempting to better humanity.

I believe that some people, in fact, need guidance in life in order to feel better about themselves and the world around them. Whether that is a matter of the way they think or their inability to make their own rational thoughts is not for me to decide as I am not them. I simply choose not to exclude religion as a bad thing because it may be good in terms of its overarching morals and teachings that are derived from the complexities of the sacred texts of that religion and such.

[darthearth]

I don't believe that the majority of people who have "conformed" to Atheism have done so because of the actions of various priests. Many of them, including me, respect Catholicism, Protestantism (which I was first born into), or any other religion or belief system, have converted because they developed a logical way of explaining things to ourselves, and they no longer require guidance from a god of any kind as we all have the ability to command our own lives and decisions.


Not to be off topic, but what do you mean by "....developed a logical way of explaining things to ourselves..."

I was just curious.

[IAMWILL]

Please list significant teachings you feel follow from "natural law" and not any scriptural text.

The Catholic Church's views on abortion, marriage, euthanasia, and contraception all are primarily derived from natural law.

[darthearth]

The Catholic Church's views on abortion, marriage, euthanasia, and contraception all are primarily derived from natural law.

This "natural law" concept you have come up with, how have you chosen to define it for yourself? Does the Catholic church speak of "natural law"? How have they chosen to define it? Seems like an ambiguous and arbitrary concept.

[The Trendy Wolf]

Not to be off topic, but what do you mean by "....developed a logical way of explaining things to ourselves..."

I was just curious.

I meant that those who do not apply themselves to a religion seeking guidance create their own thoughts, morals, goals and apply this logical reasoning to their lives and the world without needing a religion to explain it for them. It is as if we, ourselves, develop a religion, or as I stated in my older thread, a philosophy, structured from our own thoughts for our own lives to continue to succeed by following our beliefs.

Hoping this made sense, thank you. :D

[IAMWILL]

This "natural law" concept you have come up with, how have you chosen to define it for yourself? Does the Catholic church speak of "natural law"? How have they chosen to define it? Seems like an ambiguous and arbitrary concept.

Maybe I should have stated earlier that I did not come up with the idea of Natural law at all. The idea has existed for thousands of years and is the basis for an incredibly vast amount of philosophies and important writings, such as the Constitution. Here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_law) is the Wikipedia article on it and here (http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s1c3a1.htm) is the Catholic Church's explanation of it.

[Trenton_]

I don't believe that the majority of people who have "conformed" to Atheism have done so because of the actions of various priests. Many of them, including me, respect Catholicism, Protestantism (which I was first born into), or any other religion or belief system, have converted because they developed a logical way of explaining things to ourselves, and they no longer require guidance from a god of any kind as we all have the ability to command our own lives and decisions.

I would also like to state that much of what you hear about America is over-exaggerated by the media. I doubt that people of Catholicism would leave their religion simply because of a few incidents involving clergymen which have nothing to do with the religion's views or beliefs.

Lot of people left the church when they learned that the church leaders knew there was sexual abuse going on and didn't remove the priest or admit wrong doing. the priest was moved to a different church without letting the new parish know what he had done. Made people mad.

[darthearth]

Maybe I should have stated earlier that I did not come up with the idea of Natural law at all. The idea has existed for thousands of years and is the basis for an incredibly vast amount of philosophies and important writings, such as the Constitution. Here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_law) is the Wikipedia article on it and here (http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s1c3a1.htm) is the Catholic Church's explanation of it.

Oh, well I looked at the links. Ambiguous and arbitrary just as it seemed. How are the Catholic Church's views on abortion, marriage, euthanasia, and contraception derived from "natural law" when those teachings are controversial? It seems the idea of "natural law" is on a non-controversial level as being written in "hearts" and mainly referring to basic human rights from what I gather. How is the church's stance on something like same sex marriage according to "natural law"? People naturally have various sexual orientations, so how can it be against "natural law" for them to form a lasting partnership? I know what is written in my heart, the "natural law" I know, and it disagrees completely with Catholic church teaching. Whose "natural law" wins?

Tying the church's teachings to "natural law" is absurd when I would suspect 90% of people would disagree with the teaching (such as with contraception), don't you think? Doesn't make any sense.

No, I would say those teachings are not based on any definite "natural law", just one church's particular chosen interpretation of the concept.

[Achillea]

Oh, well I looked at the links. Ambiguous and arbitrary just as it seemed. How are the Catholic Church's views on abortion, marriage, euthanasia, and contraception derived from "natural law" when those teachings are controversial? It seems the idea of "natural law" is on a non-controversial level as being written in "hearts" and mainly referring to basic human rights from what I gather. How is the church's stance on something like same sex marriage according to "natural law"? People naturally have various sexual orientations, so how can it be against "natural law" for them to form a lasting partnership? I know what is written in my heart, the "natural law" I know, and it disagrees completely with Catholic church teaching. Whose "natural law" wins?

Tying the church's teachings to "natural law" is absurd when I would suspect 90% of people would disagree with the teaching (such as with contraception), don't you think? Doesn't make any sense.

No, I would say those teachings are not based on any definite "natural law", just one church's particular chosen interpretation of the concept.
What you have just said is absolutly crazy...How you think that the Catholics view of Natural law that didn't allow for Abortion, contraception, etc. is wrong just baffles me. I am certain that it is VERY unnatural to kill an unborn child and use contraception and if you disagree I think then your mind has been numbed by todays society. I understand that these practices have always gone on, for example homosexuality has been around for since forever but of course going back to basics, to the early christians, it did seem to go againt Nature, they aren't biologicly suited to be together. It wasn't just Christians though, it was most of the world. Of course now we know that love doesnt follow any rules:) Pope Francis welcomes gay people to the church. I think that the Abortion thing also isnt derived from Natural law but Gods Law: The ten commandments. So do you really think that is it natural to want an unborn baby dead?

[Sugaree]

" /ATHEIST"
i decide on the situation whether or not you deserve tolerance based on a rational judgment of character.

Then by that measure, you deserve to be treated the same way you treat others.

[IAMWILL]

Oh, well I looked at the links. Ambiguous and arbitrary just as it seemed. How are the Catholic Church's views on abortion, marriage, euthanasia, and contraception derived from "natural law" when those teachings are controversial? It seems the idea of "natural law" is on a non-controversial level as being written in "hearts" and mainly referring to basic human rights from what I gather. How is the church's stance on something like same sex marriage according to "natural law"? People naturally have various sexual orientations, so how can it be against "natural law" for them to form a lasting partnership? I know what is written in my heart, the "natural law" I know, and it disagrees completely with Catholic church teaching. Whose "natural law" wins?

Tying the church's teachings to "natural law" is absurd when I would suspect 90% of people would disagree with the teaching (such as with contraception), don't you think? Doesn't make any sense.

No, I would say those teachings are not based on any definite "natural law", just one church's particular chosen interpretation of the concept.

What exactly did you find "ambiguous and arbitrary" about the explanations? Maybe I can attempt to explain it more clearly.

Slavery was a controversial issue in the 17/1800s. Many issues whose resolutions are clear today have been controversial at some point.

I could briefly outline how the Church derives its views on the topics you mentioned from natural law if you'd like.

Natural law isn't something that varies really. Although everyone may have their own interpretation of it (as you noted you have), there should really only be one true understanding for how it applies to each issue or concept. This one understanding would be the most logical answer that could be reached based on what we understand about the issue concerned (thats where science comes in, and why the Church will change its teachings based on what science can teach us.) For example, if for some reason embryologists reversed their findings and determined that embryos were in no way human beings, the Church would probably modify its position on abortion. Then again, it wouldn't be considered abortion at that point if the life form being killed wasnt human.

[Arie_]

It's a joke. You don't worship Jesus' mom

[Sugaree]

It's a joke. You don't worship Jesus' mom

The Catholic religion doesn't worship Jesus' mother. They venerate her, yes, but they don't worship her.

[Lovelife090994]

I actually like much of the Catholic religion but I am not Catholic, I am what they would consider Protestant.

[darthearth]

What you have just said is absolutly crazy...How you think that the Catholics view of Natural law that didn't allow for Abortion, contraception, etc. is wrong just baffles me. I am certain that it is VERY unnatural to kill an unborn child and use contraception and if you disagree I think then your mind has been numbed by todays society. I understand that these practices have always gone on, for example homosexuality has been around for since forever but of course going back to basics, to the early christians, it did seem to go againt Nature, they aren't biologicly suited to be together. It wasn't just Christians though, it was most of the world. Of course now we know that love doesnt follow any rules:) Pope Francis welcomes gay people to the church. I think that the Abortion thing also isnt derived from Natural law but Gods Law: The ten commandments. So do you really think that is it natural to want an unborn baby dead?

I guess you also feel it "unnatural" to wear earrings? If not, why not? And are you saying that natural law changed since we now know "love doesn't follow any rules"? Is this concept of "natural law" changeable to you?

Abortion is not derived from natural law but God's law? and then you ask if I think abortion is "natural"? I don't follow, it seems like with the latter comment you are assuming natural law, but that contradicts the former comment. I believe there can be a stronger argument for the concept of natural law in the specific case of abortion. That would be the most solid ground when talking about natural law. But I fail to see hardly any other controversial issue able to be governed by a unique natural law that everyone can clearly see. Some would like to claim natural law follows logic and "information", but whose logic and perceived information? This is the problem isn't it?


What exactly did you find "ambiguous and arbitrary" about the explanations? Maybe I can attempt to explain it more clearly.

Slavery was a controversial issue in the 17/1800s. Many issues whose resolutions are clear today have been controversial at some point.

I could briefly outline how the Church derives its views on the topics you mentioned from natural law if you'd like.

Natural law isn't something that varies really. Although everyone may have their own interpretation of it (as you noted you have), there should really only be one true understanding for how it applies to each issue or concept. This one understanding would be the most logical answer that could be reached based on what we understand about the issue concerned (thats where science comes in, and why the Church will change its teachings based on what science can teach us.) For example, if for some reason embryologists reversed their findings and determined that embryos were in no way human beings, the Church would probably modify its position on abortion. Then again, it wouldn't be considered abortion at that point if the life form being killed wasnt human.


"one understanding"?
Whose understanding wins?

"most logical answer"?
Whose logical answer wins?

"based on what we understand about the issue concerned"?
Whose understanding is this to be based upon? Why is the church against contraception? What is this "understanding" that makes it wrong? Sex is only to procreate? Why? Please tell me why sex should only be for procreation outside of the most petulant opinionated dogma. Please tell me why women cannot be priests, what is the "logical understanding" there. Again, tell me why it is logically wrong for same sex partners to enter into a civil marriage when that is their God-given orientation?

Really.

[nklarke]

I'm not Catholic.

What I find ridiculous is in fact related to your last line. Whoever consider itself the "owner of the absolute true" is a sign for me that is something fake.

[Sugaree]

I'm not Catholic.

What I find ridiculous is in fact related to your last line. Whoever consider itself the "owner of the absolute true" is a sign for me that is something fake.

This is why I converted to Buddhism, as it does not claim to be the way, but merely the finger pointing to the way.