Religious demise.

[GuardianofReason]

So, this has been on my head for way to long. So I've finally decided to express my thoughts. So, here's the question and my thoughts.

Do you think major religions such as sub-branches of Christainty will crumble into nothingness in the next 100 years?

Personally, I find that religions are alreaddy going down the shithole. With corruptness, child molestation (not all) and other sketchy business, Christianity's reputation had been hurt. It also seems like most of the remaining followers are older people, because it isn't mainstream for the young, or whatever. *Pope holds world youth day is Brazil because it has the most young followers>needs more young followers*.

The Church doesn't seem to have as much power and influence. Before it used to be like the government, calling all the shots. But now it's the minority, people are coming to think that maybe God isn't real, and we have evolved.

This is just my opinion. It's 2 AM, so please forgive me if this is. It written amazingly, I had to get this off my headm it's been keeping me up.

So, now it's time to discuss, what do you think, can it make it into the next century, is it falling?


*Just talking about one main religious group to keep it simple.

[Tarannosaurus]

I think organised religion might decline unless it seriously adapts to this day and age. Saying that I do think spirituality will last, but it'll be more of a personal thing.

[Cygnus]

I believe religions will reduce, yes (maybe Islam will stay the same since they seem to be spreading right now and have tougher rules) however some new bullshit will arise like scientology, but they will still be a minority. The amount of atheist is, undoubtedly, increasing as humanity gets smarter.

[Vlerchan]

It'll drop some in the more secular first-world. But across the globe? No. Definitely not.

The rise in the numbers of atheists has nothing to do with man getting smarter - some of the smartest people I know are Christian - but rather the internet, and all its dissenting ideas, are becoming more available and more easily accessible. Questioning the idea of a God now isn't half as taboo as it was even twenty-five years ago (here, anyway).

[sqishy]

I think that religions in general will have much less power and will decline. But they will still be there. This is, of course, assuming that the world continues it's conservative->liberal trend, and that may not be the case in the far future (thought I hope it is).

[BuryYourFlame]

Possibly, eventually. Definitely not in the next 100 years though. Religion has been built up for thousands of years, and we're only recently starting to see a major move away from it.

[Jess]

Yes, it is declining but I don't think it will be gone completely. Religion will also have way less power.

[Twilly F. Sniper]

Religion is reducing in popularity, but it will never be gone.

Because everyone will believe differently; the only cause of rising atheism and agnosticism is due to science.

[GuardianofReason]

I find each and everyone of your opinions very interesting, thanks for posting!

[conniption]

It will probably drop significantly, but it won't be gone completely and it'll still be fairly powerful. Of course, it will vary country to country.

[James Bond]

Religion will never fall. People go toward religion for peace of mind, for some, religion provides that peace of mind, for others, it provides hope. Religion has done a lot of good, but also a lot of evil. The Catholic Church shouldn't represent all of Christianity, not all Christians or Christian denominations are child molesters (don't mean to shock you. But it's the truth).

If people of the Christian faith would stick to what Christianity said, there would be even more peace. But sadly There's Christian's who's main goal is to judge. I think a Christian that all Christians should follow is Alice Cooper, he doesn't shove religion down anyone's throat, and he accepts and tolerates people, he's also a very kind man.

[thatcountrykid]

So, this has been on my head for way to long. So I've finally decided to express my thoughts. So, here's the question and my thoughts.

Do you think major religions such as sub-branches of Christainty will crumble into nothingness in the next 100 years?

Personally, I find that religions are alreaddy going down the shithole. With corruptness, child molestation (not all) and other sketchy business, Christianity's reputation had been hurt. It also seems like most of the remaining followers are older people, because it isn't mainstream for the young, or whatever. *Pope holds world youth day is Brazil because it has the most young followers>needs more young followers*.

The Church doesn't seem to have as much power and influence. Before it used to be like the government, calling all the shots. But now it's the minority, people are coming to think that maybe God isn't real, and we have evolved.

This is just my opinion. It's 2 AM, so please forgive me if this is. It written amazingly, I had to get this off my headm it's been keeping me up.

So, now it's time to discuss, what do you think, can it make it into the next century, is it falling?


*Just talking about one main religious group to keep it simple.

Back during the time of something called the black plague people lost faith in the church extremely. But the church came back and is still here. Religion will always be here no matter what.

[saea97]

Couldn't come soon enough, in my opinion. It'll be a long, long time before the Middle East is liberated, but things are looking good for the West.

[Dalek-Todd]

Religion will never die. People will keep on believing what they want to believe.

[Sir Suomi]

Humanity will always look for higher purposes in life, and this can be found in religions. Therefore, religions will always be present in all of humanity's existence. So get over it.

[Stronk Serb]

Religion is a two-sided sword . On one hand the religious leaders helped the people, and on the other hand millions of people suffered from it's blade. I believe it will never cease to exist, it will only decrease in number amd power.

[Derryck]

Buddy, here's my honest opinion for ya: I, for one, think that EVERY religion is going to crumble within the next 100 yrs. be it Buddhism, Taoism or Taobuddhism, They're all going to die out. Lets face it, more and more people are starting to lose their faith. Pretty sad.

[SaxyHaloBeast]

Just a few things here.

Religion and intelligence are not indirectly related (one does not rise when the other falls).

There are so many different religions that it is very improbable that religion will die out completely.

Somewhere around 80 or 85 percent of the world's population is either religious or of a religion. You expect that many people to lose their faith in 100 years after how long many of the religions have survived and grown? Think practically and logically about that.

I have a religion and do my best to live the way I believe I should. I guess that makes me religious. But never once as a religious person have I ever cast aside atheism or any other belief system as false or likely to die off. Why do so many "science-minded" people feel the need to take down religion?

[GuardianofReason]

Just a few things here.

Religion and intelligence are not indirectly related (one does not rise when the other falls).

There are so many different religions that it is very improbable that religion will die out completely.

Somewhere around 80 or 85 percent of the world's population is either religious or of a religion. You expect that many people to lose their faith in 100 years after how long many of the religions have survived and grown? Think practically and logically about that.

I have a religion and do my best to live the way I believe I should. I guess that makes me religious. But never once as a religious person have I ever cast aside atheism or any other belief system as false or likely to die off. Why do so many "science-minded" people feel the need to take down religion?

I probably should of worded the OP differently, not that the religion would totally die,vbut face a rapid demise.

Also I was mainly talking about Christianty, because I feel like its the hardest hit.

[Syvelocin]

The religions we know now will crumble, like everything. Like Paganism did when Christianity took it over.

The issue is something else will rise above it. Whether another religion with similarities to these ones, or something completely different the people can put their faith into. There's a bit of mental evolution, I think, that needs to go on before humans as a whole feel they no longer need a god. Right now, people still can't stand uncertainty and must have some life meaning otherwise they have no will to live. Maybe religion will officially crumble when we finally get it around our brains that nothing is special and everything is special. When we finally find out what 100% absolutely happened that is proven with science. Deistic cults will probably be around, but then science will be the mainstream. I kind of hope it will happen earlier than when science can 100% prove everything, that people will just take on a different mindset, to take and accept the world as it is without having to lend our own fictional fairy stories, and live in the now, empowering ourselves as individuals.

I'm in one of those moods today. My condolences.

[saea97]

Just a few things here.

Religion and intelligence are not indirectly related (one does not rise when the other falls).

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2390774/Those-higher-intelligence-likely-believe-God-claims-new-review-63-scientific-studies-stretching-decades.html

Also, an extract from the paper "IQ and Religious Belief" by Lynn, Harvey, Nyborg:

A number of studies find negative correlations between intelligence and religious belief. A review of these carried out by Bell (2002) found 43 studies, of which all but four found a negative correlation.

And another, from the same:

At this interview they were asked: “To what extent are you a religious person?” The responses were coded “not religious at all”, “slightly religious”, “moderately religious”, and “very religious”. The results showed that the “not religious at all” group had the highest IQ (103.09), followed in descending order by the other three groups (IQs = 99.34, 98.28, 97.14).

It's correlation, not causation, of course, but a relationship can certainly be observed.

Somewhere around 80 or 85 percent of the world's population is either religious or of a religion. You expect that many people to lose their faith in 100 years after how long many of the religions have survived and grown? Think practically and logically about that.

I'd love them to, but no, I agree that they won't. People will cling to their dogmas for a lot longer than this century, in my opinion.

Why do so many "science-minded" people feel the need to take down religion?

Because the two make opposing claims about reality, and the claims of religion have never been scientifically proven (ergo, by the principle of the null hypothesis, they should be assumed false). Scientists by and large don't begrudge people their personal faith, but putting them on the same pedestal with regard to issues like health, education and rights? No no no.

[SaxyHaloBeast]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2390774/Those-higher-intelligence-likely-believe-God-claims-new-review-63-scientific-studies-stretching-decades.html

Also, an extract from the paper "IQ and Religious Belief" by Lynn, Harvey, Nyborg:

A number of studies find negative correlations between intelligence and religious belief. A review of these carried out by Bell (2002) found 43 studies, of which all but four found a negative correlation.

And another, from the same:

At this interview they were asked: “To what extent are you a religious person?” The responses were coded “not religious at all”, “slightly religious”, “moderately religious”, and “very religious”. The results showed that the “not religious at all” group had the highest IQ (103.09), followed in descending order by the other three groups (IQs = 99.34, 98.28, 97.14).

It's correlation, not causation, of course, but a relationship can certainly be observed.



I'd love them to, but no, I agree that they won't. People will cling to their dogmas for a lot longer than this century, in my opinion.



Because the two make opposing claims about reality, and the claims of religion have never been scientifically proven (ergo, by the principle of the null hypothesis, they should be assumed false). Scientists by and large don't begrudge people their personal faith, but putting them on the same pedestal with regard to issues like health, education and rights? No no no.

Just please don't assume someone is stupid because of their religion. That would be stereotyping and ignorant.

I don't understand why you want people to abandon religion so badly. It doesn't really affect you in any way and it actually can benefit people.

If religion and science are opposites like you suggest, then why do you accept science as the truth? You say that religion has never been scientifically proven, but has any ever thrown a fit about science not being religiously proven? Science and religion aren't opposites and can coexist.

[Mushin]

*Heads up, I went way overboard with this.

I think that monotheistic and polytheistic religions believing in an existent, conscious entity that could be defined in some sense as a "creator" will face a rapid decline within ~100 yrs. As the study of our universe continues to reveal more about the origins of our known world, religious explanations are beginning to take the back seat. It may not be very prominent - yet - but eventually scientific explanations will be much more predominant.

I noticed some people saying that this trend would only be noticeable in a "first world" society. Assuming "first world" is relating to functional and widespread technology; in the next ~100 yrs. the entire world will be "first world." Our population is growing at a rapid place which means we are needing more and more space to survive as a species. Also factoring in climate change which is making parts of the world uninhabitable (and even much more show in the next ~100 yrs.) the human species is going to be packed in some pretty tight quarters. And with the widespread use of technology as it is today, I can almost guarantee that the entire world will be consumed by it within that time.

So although religious beliefs involving a creator(s) or some variation may not be very common within the next ~100 yrs. I believe some religions will continue based on there values alone. There are numerous philosophical religions that do not believe in any form of a creator. They simply guide people in a way of life. I think these religions will continue to prosper regardless of any scientific breakthroughs because they are an independent variable; they're not hinged to science.

[saea97]

Just please don't assume someone is stupid because of their religion. That would be stereotyping and ignorant.

I would never. I wouldm't even have brought it up had you not made the assertion, as I don't think it's hugely relevant. Just wanted to cite some data.


I don't understand why you want people to abandon religion so badly. It doesn't really affect you in any way and it actually can benefit people.

I want people to abandon religion because religion in a great many cases leads to bigotry and ignorance. Similarly, it's all well and good that people derive comfort from the possibly of a religious afterlife (for example) but if it's a lie, then it's detrimental to base your life on it. People are welcome to their opinions, but you can't have an opinion about a fact, and it would be beneficial to our species if everyone was scientifically literate.

If religion and science are opposites like you suggest, then why do you accept science as the truth? You say that religion has never been scientifically proven, but has any ever thrown a fit about science not being religiously proven? Science and religion aren't opposites and can coexist.

Science has not been religiously proven because nothing has been "religiously proven". There is no "religious method" by which one ascertains truth. All the religious doctrines are mere allegations which don't stand to the scientific method. Proposals like the existence of God are at best very weak hypotheses.

How do you propose to "religiously prove" the Theory of Evolution? By looking in the Bible?

Sure, science and religion can coexist in the minds of some people, but it's science that's important. Science that extended the average lifespan of our species from 25 to 75, allowed global travel and took us to the moon, and science that is now working on incredible treatments via stem cells that are opposed every sluggish step along the way by the religious right, leaving a trail of bodies behind who needn't have died. Sure, you may have reconciled religion and science, and so do many people. But the religious way of thinking (in particular the a priori way of ascertaining knowledge) is a direct detriment to the scientific one (which works, demonstrably).

[Lovelife090994]

I feel as if all religion will last since they have stood the tests of time. However in this world where people hate spirituality and seem to be disgusted by religion, religion's influence will never fade entirely.

Personally I wouldn't give humanity 100 years, it's fading already. We may be here but it'll be hell.

Besides, God (for Christians) cannot be removed entirely, so many people have a religion so it'll be here.

[Human]

In the future religions will start to fade away, or new age ones will come into existence, not based on the old traditional views of god, probably linked to science.
I'm in England, and out of about 200 people aged 15-16 I know, only about 5 believe in a god. I only know one practicing theist my age in my school.

[deadpie]

Religion may decline but not by much. I'd say beliefs would start taking a more liberal and open minded view on people and society as a whole. Religion will do what it has to in order to stay alive. Even if the entire universe is explained to you, there's a possibility it may not be enough to fulfill some people's spiritual needs.

I want people to abandon religion because religion in a great many cases leads to bigotry and ignorance. Similarly, it's all well and good that people derive comfort from the possibly of a religious afterlife (for example) but if it's a lie, then it's detrimental to base your life on it. People are welcome to their opinions, but you can't have an opinion about a fact, and it would be beneficial to our species if everyone was scientifically literate.

I used to be ten times as brutal of a pissed off militant atheist. There was a time here on VT where I think I'd make ten pages worth of arguments, all full of good sources and such just to bring people down for no apparent reason other than to make them feel stupid for believing in something. Absolutely rude. Some users have told me I've made them into atheists! That's fucked up in a way. I always had to make sure that I "won" the debate and completely destroyed people's views at all costs. For no actual reason other then being angry and lost in an infinite universe with a nihilistic view on life. One that I somewhat still have but have gotten more mature about and cope easier with.

Not all religious people are bigots and ignorant. You're just as equally ignorant from the post I'm reading TBH. "if it's a lie it's detrimental" bullshit. The entire fucking idea of an afterlife is to bring people into a sense that they get their spot on pretty clouds when they die. That doesn't cause harm! It makes them happy! Do I believe that happens? No. I don't know what happens when people die and I'm not going to pretend to know. From what I see it's either beyond human understanding or as simple as infinite nothingness.

There's many scientifically literate people who are spiritual and religious. Ever thought that some people believe in these things for themselves? Not everyone bashes it into other people's faces and shoves it down someone's throat. Not all religious people even believe in creationism! Yes, there are religious people that believe in evolution. People are WAY more complicated then you think. Don't think of people as to be so simple and retarded.

Yes, it's quite obvious that people's skewered use of religion has done lots of harm, started the majority of wars, lead to the deaths of many people. That is the power of humanity, not religion. Religion is a set of moral beliefs linked to spirituality in shortest terms. There's over 42,000 religions across the world. All of them very different but very much the same at the same time.

I would consider myself a very scientific and logical thinking person. Even though I am a convert and practice religion now, I don't think it's made me dumber or more ignorant. If anything it's let me understand more knowledge and open new doors and possibilities. Truth; some people find happiness in religious beliefs and don't harm anyone in result of it.

It's ok if you want to be the intense angry atheist that makes other atheists look bad. You know, where you can't associate with anyone that isn't like you, so you lose friends, get more insanely pissed off, blame religion more, bash more religious people online, feel more superior, et al. It's all very dorky. It doesn't actually mean anything - all of the never ending ramblings at people whether it's online or real life. It goes nowhere.

[saea97]

Religion may decline but not by much. I'd say beliefs would start taking a more liberal and open minded view on people and society as a whole. Religion will do what it has to in order to stay alive. Even if the entire universe is explained to you, there's a possibility it may not be enough to fulfill some people's spiritual needs.



I used to be ten times as brutal of a pissed off militant atheist. There was a time here on VT where I think I'd make ten pages worth of arguments, all full of good sources and such just to bring people down for no apparent reason other than to make them feel stupid for believing in something. Absolutely rude. Some users have told me I've made them into atheists! That's fucked up in a way. I always had to make sure that I "won" the debate and completely destroyed people's views at all costs. For no actual reason other then being angry and lost in an infinite universe with a nihilistic view on life. One that I somewhat still have but have gotten more mature about and cope easier with.

Not all religious people are bigots and ignorant. You're just as equally ignorant from the post I'm reading TBH. "if it's a lie it's detrimental" bullshit. The entire fucking idea of an afterlife is to bring people into a sense that they get their spot on pretty clouds when they die. That doesn't cause harm! It makes them happy! Do I believe that happens? No. I don't know what happens when people die and I'm not going to pretend to know. From what I see it's either beyond human understanding or as simple as infinite nothingness.

There's many scientifically literate people who are spiritual and religious. Ever thought that some people believe in these things for themselves? Not everyone bashes it into other people's faces and shoves it down someone's throat. Not all religious people even believe in creationism! Yes, there are religious people that believe in evolution. People are WAY more complicated then you think. Don't think of people as to be so simple and retarded.

Yes, it's quite obvious that people's skewered use of religion has done lots of harm, started the majority of wars, lead to the deaths of many people. That is the power of humanity, not religion. Religion is a set of moral beliefs linked to spirituality in shortest terms. There's over 42,000 religions across the world. All of them very different but very much the same at the same time.

I would consider myself a very scientific and logical thinking person. Even though I am a convert and practice religion now, I don't think it's made me dumber or more ignorant. If anything it's let me understand more knowledge and open new doors and possibilities. Truth; some people find happiness in religious beliefs and don't harm anyone in result of it.

It's ok if you want to be the intense angry atheist that makes other atheists look bad. You know, where you can't associate with anyone that isn't like you, so you lose friends, get more insanely pissed off, blame religion more, bash more religious people online, feel more superior, et al. It's all very dorky. It doesn't actually mean anything - all of the never ending ramblings at people whether it's online or real life. It goes nowhere.

Thanks for the reply. I'm sorry for the offence my post clearly caused; I do try very hard to be objective and I really don't see how I came across as angry as you've painted me to be, but offence is never my intention. I don't like religion one bit (and, yes, I think people would be better off without it), but I like and respect many people of faith just as much as people without it. It's not the be and and end all, it's just a factor of their life that I happen to disagree with. I reserve my democratic right to voice my objections to religion, and I hope you would defend that right, just as I would go to my grave defending your right to believe whatever the fuck you want to believe.

So, offence cleared up, hopefully.. as to the statement about scientific literacy: yes, that referred to creationism, and no, nowhere did I say all religious people are creationists, or that all religious people are scientifically illiterate. The fact is, however, that young-earth creationism is false. There is no debate about that. And believing the earth is 6000 years old makes a person scientifically illiterate. Such a phrase is clearly very cutting, so if you'd rather I said something softer, then fine.

And belief in an afterlife doesn't just apply to those people who believe everybody ends up in heaven on a cloud. While that's a lie, it's a very pretty one that probably doesn't cause much harm (except for the material harm that can be caused by people who think they'll go to heaven no matter what). It becomes detrimental when parents and preachers terrify children by saying they'll go to Hell if they have lustful thoughts or watch porn or use condoms or read Harry Potter or any of a billion other things. That's wrong and incredibly scary and even the hopelessness of nihilism is more appealing.

[Twilly F. Sniper]

In the future religions will start to fade away, or new age ones will come into existence, not based on the old traditional views of god, probably linked to science.
I'm in England, and out of about 200 people aged 15-16 I know, only about 5 believe in a god. I only know one practicing theist my age in my school.

I live in small town Texas (yet again that) but I only know about 1 or 2 (other) atheists at my school. (your situation reversed). (Because about 90% of them are Catholic or Baptist)

[deadpie]

So, offence cleared up, hopefully.. as to the statement about scientific literacy: yes, that referred to creationism, and no, nowhere did I say all religious people are creationists, or that all religious people are scientifically illiterate. The fact is, however, that young-earth creationism is false. There is no debate about that. And believing the earth is 6000 years old makes a person scientifically illiterate. Such a phrase is clearly very cutting, so if you'd rather I said something softer, then fine.

And belief in an afterlife doesn't just apply to those people who believe everybody ends up in heaven on a cloud. While that's a lie, it's a very pretty one that probably doesn't cause much harm (except for the material harm that can be caused by people who think they'll go to heaven no matter what). It becomes detrimental when parents and preachers terrify children by saying they'll go to Hell if they have lustful thoughts or watch porn or use condoms or read Harry Potter or any of a billion other things. That's wrong and incredibly scary and even the hopelessness of nihilism is more appealing.

So from what I'm seeing you're mainly talking about Christianity. I do honestly believe the idea and mans creation of 'hell' is not only brilliant for a brainwashing technique, but extremely evil. That's one of the million reasons I'm not a Christian. BTW i'm not offended. Takes a lot to bother me.

[james251]

After the demise of religion, people will be no more rational than they were with it. If religion exists that is because along the whole history of mankind it has been emotionally rewarding for the people. Religion could be defined as a private philosophy acting emotionally in individuals’minds and being shared by others, allowing then cognitive cultural changes.

[Human]

I live in small town Texas (yet again that) but I only know about 1 or 2 (other) atheists at my school. (your situation reversed). (Because about 90% of them are Catholic or Baptist)

I live in a small British parish with churches, so we're meant to be traditionally Christian :P

[darthearth]

Religion will always be around because science will never be able to answer the "first cause" question. It doesn't matter if the Universe is a forever loop of creation and destruction, there will still be the question of where it came from. Why is there something rather than nothing? This is the "in" for people to keep believing in God if they wish, no matter what science comes up with. Also, I don't believe science will ever to be able to explain p-consciousness, in fact p-consciousness is one of the main logical reasons that I believe we are an immortal spirit. Once one understands we are immortal spirits, the floodgates of spirituality open. And personally, I see a lot that is not very intelligent among atheists, just like theists.