Satanism

[TheDeepestDepths]

Why is Satanism regarded as a terrible and evil thing? I'm not one, but after doing some research I appreciate the honesty behind it. I'm not talking about the modern perception of it but the basic premises: individuality. Most actual Satanists do not believe in Satan, those that do are Devil-worshippers which is something different. I'm talking about LeVeyan (http://www.churchofsatan.com/Pages/Theory.html) Satanism in particular.

So my question is: what's so bad about the celebration of your carnal nature? What's so terrible about being taught to question everything and to have no patience for things such as stupidity, pretentiousness, self-deceit and herd conformity?

Why is the idea of Satanism so reviled? Is it just that it goes against the base ideas of Christianity?

[ovoxo23]

Why is Satanism regarded as a terrible and evil thing? I'm not one, but after doing some research I appreciate the honesty behind it. I'm not talking about the modern perception of it but the basic premises: individuality. Most actual Satanists do not believe in Satan, those that do are Devil-worshippers which is something different. I'm talking about LeVeyan (http://www.churchofsatan.com/Pages/Theory.html) Satanism in particular.

So my question is: what's so bad about the celebration of your carnal nature? What's so terrible about being taught to question everything and to have no patience for things such as stupidity, pretentiousness, self-deceit and herd conformity?

Why is the idea of Satanism so reviled? Is it just that it goes against the base ideas of Christianity?

I mean I'm a Catholic, so we're pretty strict religion-wise, but I have no problem with people believing in other religions. The main reason I think it is is because Christianity and Catholicism are so dominant in the world, and in such strict religions as Catholicism, you are taught not to believe in the devil and that the devil is the most evil of evil.

[Gigablue]

Most people don't know what Satanism is. They just assume it means people worship the devil. I think if people actually understood Satanism, particularly LeVeyan Satanism, it would be less hated.

[Jess]

They think it's evil because they think it's worshiping the devil, when it's not.

[tovaris]

i dont know just a nother religion

[LouBerry]

Hm i dont know ...
Because Stalin sent thousands to their defs, because Stalinism denies freedom of anithing...

We're discussing Satan-ism not Stalin-ism.

And I think that it's so misunderstood because of idiot high school kids who tell people that they hate God and praise Satan and all that shit.

[SaxyHaloBeast]

Why is Satanism regarded as a terrible and evil thing? I'm not one, but after doing some research I appreciate the honesty behind it. I'm not talking about the modern perception of it but the basic premises: individuality. Most actual Satanists do not believe in Satan, those that do are Devil-worshippers which is something different. I'm talking about LeVeyan (http://www.churchofsatan.com/Pages/Theory.html) Satanism in particular.

So my question is: what's so bad about the celebration of your carnal nature? What's so terrible about being taught to question everything and to have no patience for things such as stupidity, pretentiousness, self-deceit and herd conformity?

Why is the idea of Satanism so reviled? Is it just that it goes against the base ideas of Christianity?

Many believe that you shouldn't celebrate your carnal nature, but rise above it and become better than it. There is nothing wrong with asking questions but there is a fine line between asking a few questions and over questioning. It is the lack of patience for stupidity, pretentiousness, self-deceit and herd conformity that leads to conflict and war. If you cannot show patience for someone else, then why would they respect you or your beliefs?

I think it isn't reviled, per say. I would say it is frowned upon. It does go against general Christianity so of course people of Christian faith will tend to not appreciate it.

[TheBigUnit]

they should probably change their name

[Trace]

they should probably change their name

^ Agreed. Might gain a bit of respect.

[TheDeepestDepths]

Many believe that you shouldn't celebrate your carnal nature, but rise above it and become better than it.

Therein lies my question: why shouldn't we celebrate what we are? We have things like sexual urges and we wouldn't if we were not supposed to act on them. So why deny yourself?

There is nothing wrong with asking questions but there is a fine line between asking a few questions and over questioning.

Our opinions differ here. I don't believe ignorance should ever be celebrated or encouraged. Question everything, try learn everything you can, otherwise how can you form an opinion on a subject? I find it wrong to form an opinion on something you have not fully researched and studied. Before entering any debate I make sure I know exactly what I'm talking about and I hope the other person does too, otherwise why am I bothering with them?

It is the lack of patience for stupidity, pretentiousness, self-deceit and herd conformity that leads to conflict and war. If you cannot show patience for someone else, then why would they respect you or your beliefs?

How does a lack of tolerance for terrible attitudes lead to war. Do you have any examples? I have patience for other people but that patience runs out when they are being deliberately ignorant, pretentious, tenacious etc. Patience is given where it is deserved.

[Obsidian]

I clicked the link you posted and apparently one of the 'nine satanic statements' is "Satan represents indulgence instead of abstinence." As a Christian I've been taught that the devil tries to lure us away from God by convincing us to turn to things in life we find pleasurable instead of turning to God. We get distracted by the pleasurable things in life and forget God and the purpose of it all, and that's what the devil wants. I don't mean to sound all religious or preachy, and I don't judge satanists because I can easily accept that people are going to believe different things. But I didn't agree with a single thing that was on that webpage, and a lot of it just seemed really awful to me because of what I believe. I don't hate satanists or anything like that but I totally disagree with it.

[Taryn98]

most people don't know what satanism really is
it's a lot like most topics in general, people think they know what they are talking about but really are ignorant about it

inidividual indulgance seems to be a pervasive theme, which isn't really that bad

[TheDeepestDepths]

I clicked the link you posted and apparently one of the 'nine satanic statements' is "Satan represents indulgence instead of abstinence." As a Christian I've been taught that the devil tries to lure us away from God by convincing us to turn to things in life we find pleasurable instead of turning to God. We get distracted by the pleasurable things in life and forget God and the purpose of it all, and that's what the devil wants. I don't mean to sound all religious or preachy, and I don't judge satanists because I can easily accept that people are going to believe different things. But I didn't agree with a single thing that was on that webpage, and a lot of it just seemed really awful to me because of what I believe. I don't hate satanists or anything like that but I totally disagree with it.

Whatever rules and morals you choose to live you life by, that's fine. I'm not a Satanist and I was also raised a Christian but I just never understood why we should deny ourselves pleasures and knowledge, especially when they hurt no-one. (Indeed, things like regular sex are beneficial to our health.)

Satanism actually has little to do with the devil. More like it's taking the devil as a metaphor for indulgence, a lack of ignorance, etc. Satanists don't believe in deities. Turning away from God - I never agreed with the teachings of God and in the Bible in the first place, so it wasn't difficult to become an atheist.

[britishboy]

Satanism= evil, it has proved that all through history, I copied this from the website
To Satanists, Satan is
a symbol who represents pride,
liberty, and individualism
any psychopath that thinks Satan, the symbol of evil, should be locked in a secured hospital at treated for mental illness.

[Gigablue]

Satanism= evil, it has proved that all through history

What to you mean all of history? The church of satan was only founded in 1966.

[britishboy]

What to you mean all of history? The church of satan was only founded in 1966.

thats one website in America, Satanism went back to the middle ages where they worshiped the devil and tried to be as evil as him, if found they was hung but clans lived underground in caves conducting their evil, thats one group of Satanists that donr believe in Satan, many still do.

[TheDeepestDepths]

Satanism= evil, it has proved that all through history

Well, that was a shockingly narrow-minded and ignorant thing to say. Do you even know the first thing about actual Satanism? Or are you just going by the modern and false misconception that Satanism is all about Devil-worship?

You think Satanism is evil? Fine. Why? Which of it's rules do you disagree with strongly enough to label the whole thing evil?

Satanism has been labelled evil over the course of history because it preaches something Christianity condemns: Individualism and self-betterment.

[Gigablue]

thats one website in America, Satanism went back to the middle ages where they worshiped the devil and tried to be as evil as him, if found they was hung but clans lived underground in caves conducting their evil, thats one group of Satanists that donr believe in Satan, many still do.

Do you even know what satanism is? Satanists don't believe in satan.

[britishboy]

Do you even know what satanism is? Satanists don't believe in satan.

the website given doesn't many do, read this off a similar website
Satan
appears wearing a long white robe
identical to what he is shown wearing
in the images below. Many of us see
him often and have a very close
relationship with him. He is beautiful.
His appearance is almost exactly like
in the pictures, other than he rarely
appears with wings.
theres a load of other bullshit and even if you dont believe in him, why use the symbol of evil as your symbol?

Well, that was a shockingly narrow-minded and ignorant thing to say. Do you even know the first thing about actual Satanism? Or are you just going by the modern and false misconception that Satanism is all about Devil-worship?

You think Satanism is evil? Fine. Why? Which of it's rules do you disagree with strongly enough to label the whole thing evil?

Satanism has been labelled evil over the course of history because it preaches something Christianity condemns: Individualism and self-betterment.

please read all of this, this website was made by real Satanists, please feel free to look at other pages as well

www.angelfire.com/empire/serpentis666/SATANIC.html

[TheDeepestDepths]

any psychopath that thinks Satan, the symbol of evil, should be locked in a secured hospital at treated for mental illness.

According to Christianity, Satan is the epitome and embodiment of all evil things. Alright, but it never said why. Because he disagreed with God? In the Bible God made some shady decisions too.

•God takes away Adam and Eve's eternal life, thus commiting the first murder, and holds their descendants responsible and visiting Adam and Eve's punishment down on their children. In today's moral standards, the sins of the father die with the father.
•God destroys all life on Earth in a great flood, except for a Noah and his family, for failing to worship him.
•God's tenth plague upon the Israelites was the unjustified murder of all firstborn sons in Egypt, which undoubtedly included little children.
•God orders the Levites to kill their "every man and his neighbor" for worshipping another god. This cost 3000 lives. (Exodus 32:27)
•God kills Onan for refusing to impregnate his late brother's (whom God also slew) wife and instead "spilling his seed on the ground." (Genesis 38:8-10)
•God gives all Philistines hemorrhoids in their pubic areas. (1 Samuel 5:9)
•God kills over 50,000 people for looking at an ark. (1 Samuel 6:19)
•God kills 70,000 people because King David decided to have a census. (1 Chronicles 21:7-14)
•Lastly, God makes sure that if you are guilty of even the smallest transgression, you shall suffer endlessly for all eternity, following a dramatic homecoming for Jesus, who will be extremely pissed off at everyone for putting him to death, even though it was just the Romans and even though he knew what was going to happen beforehand, and he could have easily avoided it by using his power as God to perform a miracle and prove who he was. (See the entire book of Revelation)

Compare this to Satan:

•Satan, like Prometheus, gave knowledge to humanity by giving Eve the fruit from the forbidden tree. Because of Satan, humanity gained knowledge of good and evil, according to Genesis. Since we couldn't have possessed knowledge of good and evil before eating the fruit, Adam and Eve couldn't have known that eating the fruit was evil, so it seems a little harsh to punish them as severely as God did. Satan gave humans true capacity for moral judgment, unlike God, who simply expected everyone to mindlessly obey his orders.
•There is no biblical record of Satan engaging in the murder of torture of any human being, unlike God, who is guilty (and proudly guilty) of committing genocide.
•There is no biblical record of Satan ever ordering someone to kill someone else, unlike God, who has repeatedly demanded the deaths of those who commit even the smallest of offenses.

Satanists do not use Satan as a metaphor of evil they use him as a metaphor for being against things like blind faith, ignorance, herd conformity, stupidity etc.

The Bible's meaning hinges solely on interpretation. You have chosen to interpret it one way, it is another's perfect right to do so differently.

thats one website in America, Satanism went back to the middle ages where they worshiped the devil and tried to be as evil as him, if found they was hung but clans lived underground in caves conducting their evil, thats one group of Satanists that donr believe in Satan, many still do.

The original question was why the basic premise of Satanism - the embrace of carnal nature - is something inherently wrong.

About the different types of Satanism:
Religious Satanism is primarily divided into three major categories: Theistic Satanists (who are sometimes called "Spiritual" or "Traditional Satanists"), LaVeyan Satanists, and Deistic Satanists (also known as "Pantheistic Satanists" or "Dark Deists"). The theistic branch of Satanism is the branch in which it is believed that Satan is an actual deity or supernatural being of some sort, who is to be somehow revered and/or worshiped. The LaVeyan branch of Satanism is the branch in which it is believed that Satan is merely a force in nature or a symbol of man's animal nature, which itself is regarded as the object of worship. Typically, theistic Satanists can be understood to be Satan-worshipers (although there are exceptions), while LaVeyan and Deistic Satanists can be understood to be Self-worshipers.

[britishboy]

According to Christianity, Satan is the epitome and embodiment of all evil things. Alright, but it never said why. Because he disagreed with God? In the Bible God made some shady decisions too.

•God takes away Adam and Eve's eternal life, thus commiting the first murder, and holds their descendants responsible and visiting Adam and Eve's punishment down on their children. In today's moral standards, the sins of the father die with the father.
•God destroys all life on Earth in a great flood, except for a Noah and his family, for failing to worship him.
•God's tenth plague upon the Israelites was the unjustified murder of all firstborn sons in Egypt, which undoubtedly included little children.
•God orders the Levites to kill their "every man and his neighbor" for worshipping another god. This cost 3000 lives. (Exodus 32:27)
•God kills Onan for refusing to impregnate his late brother's (whom God also slew) wife and instead "spilling his seed on the ground." (Genesis 38:8-10)
•God gives all Philistines hemorrhoids in their pubic areas. (1 Samuel 5:9)
•God kills over 50,000 people for looking at an ark. (1 Samuel 6:19)
•God kills 70,000 people because King David decided to have a census. (1 Chronicles 21:7-14)
•Lastly, God makes sure that if you are guilty of even the smallest transgression, you shall suffer endlessly for all eternity, following a dramatic homecoming for Jesus, who will be extremely pissed off at everyone for putting him to death, even though it was just the Romans and even though he knew what was going to happen beforehand, and he could have easily avoided it by using his power as God to perform a miracle and prove who he was. (See the entire book of Revelation)

Compare this to Satan:

•Satan, like Prometheus, gave knowledge to humanity by giving Eve the fruit from the forbidden tree. Because of Satan, humanity gained knowledge of good and evil, according to Genesis. Since we couldn't have possessed knowledge of good and evil before eating the fruit, Adam and Eve couldn't have known that eating the fruit was evil, so it seems a little harsh to punish them as severely as God did. Satan gave humans true capacity for moral judgment, unlike God, who simply expected everyone to mindlessly obey his orders.
•There is no biblical record of Satan engaging in the murder of torture of any human being, unlike God, who is guilty (and proudly guilty) of committing genocide.
•There is no biblical record of Satan ever ordering someone to kill someone else, unlike God, who has repeatedly demanded the deaths of those who commit even the smallest of offenses.

Satanists do not use Satan as a metaphor of evil they use him as a metaphor for being against things like blind faith, ignorance, herd conformity, stupidity etc.

The Bible's meaning hinges solely on interpretation. You have chosen to interpret it one way, it is another's perfect right to do so differently.



The original question was why the basic premise of Satanism - the embrace of carnal nature - is something inherently wrong.

About the different types of Satanism:
Religious Satanism is primarily divided into three major categories: Theistic Satanists (who are sometimes called "Spiritual" or "Traditional Satanists"), LaVeyan Satanists, and Deistic Satanists (also known as "Pantheistic Satanists" or "Dark Deists"). The theistic branch of Satanism is the branch in which it is believed that Satan is an actual deity or supernatural being of some sort, who is to be somehow revered and/or worshiped. The LaVeyan branch of Satanism is the branch in which it is believed that Satan is merely a force in nature or a symbol of man's animal nature, which itself is regarded as the object of worship. Typically, theistic Satanists can be understood to be Satan-worshipers (although there are exceptions), while LaVeyan and Deistic Satanists can be understood to be Self-worshipers.
go to the link in my above post

[TheDeepestDepths]

go to the link in my above post

I read the page you linked me to and it addresses none of the points I made above. Are you just going to ignore those?

Besides, there are going to be extremists and a criminal fringe to every religion or are you denying their existence in other religions?

As for the website, you are focusing only on one section of Satanism - the devil-worshipers. These people are a minority within a minority. saying that all Satanists are like this would be like saying all Christians are Lutherans or Amish. You're simply wrong. This page (http://theisticsatanism.com/geifodd/varieties.html) tells you about all the different types of Satanism so you can stop being so narrow-minded.

Back to the original question once more: what do you believe is inherently wrong about individualism, embracing you carnal nature, and striving for knowledge? This is the core belief and morals of the type of Satanism I was talking about.

[britishboy]

I read the page you linked me to and it addresses none of the points I made above. Are you just going to ignore those?

Besides, there are going to be extremists and a criminal fringe to every religion or are you denying their existence in other religions?

As for the website, you are focusing only on one section of Satanism - the devil-worshipers. These people are a minority within a minority. saying that all Satanists are like this would be like saying all Christians are Lutherans or Amish. You're simply wrong. This page (http://theisticsatanism.com/geifodd/varieties.html) tells you about all the different types of Satanism so you can stop being so narrow-minded.

Back to the original question once more: what do you believe is inherently wrong about individualism, embracing you carnal nature, and striving for knowledge? This is the core belief and morals of the type of Satanism I was talking about.

I didnt read your big post, if I have time ill read it in the morning

[xxdrakeTxx]

Well im a devout spiritual satanist lavayen is all that u said but is the same and u do worship satan in away and if u that curious about satanism go to joyofsatan.com but the reason people fear satanist and stuff like that is becouse they dont reserch what they talk about and satanism is about self empowerment and understanding ur self and u also worship the demons and the past gods before the judeo/christian religion

[Camazotz]

Not once in my entire life have I encountered someone that was anti-Satanist; I have never known anyone that even knew what Satanism was, or at least they've never mentioned it. I think Satanists make up such a small number that there's not "widespread hate" for people that are LeVayen Satanists. I have never encountered anyone that connected "Satanist" to "devil-worshiper"; if they're referring to the people in robes that go in the middle of the woods and sacrifice a goat for its blood, they usually just call them devil-worshipers.

Personally, I find Satanism too pessimistic, arrogant, self-centered, and egocentric for my liking. There are aspects of Satanism I can agree with, such as questioning everything. But the idea of out-casting "stupid" people, not being patient with those who are "not worthy", and seeking revenge are just on the polar end of the spectrum for me. I'm a Secular Humanist- I believe in being altruistic, doing good for others (even if they might not deserve it) for the sake of creating good in the world, without a reward. Even though I'm not religious, I think the teachings of Christ (which are the opposite of Satanists) fit my beliefs, for the most part, much better than Satanism.

[Stronk Serb]

Just another religion. As long as they don't force people to pay *cough*Scientology*cough* and conducting sacrifices, I am fine with it.

[laurakoller0815]

wow much to read to consider all opinions. i think that most socities decline other forms of faith and standards due to missunderstandings and insufficent knowledge.

[Syvelocin]

Okay, now... *cracks fingers*

Most actual Satanists do not believe in Satan, those that do are Devil-worshippers which is something different. I'm talking about LeVeyan (http://www.churchofsatan.com/Pages/Theory.html) Satanism in particular.

Then please label your thread that. There is Theistic Satanism, LaVeyan, and Deistic (or Pantheistic) Satanism, along with Luciferianism (Theistic, Atheistic, Arcadic) which isn't Satanism but is a left-hand path religion. Satanism the word isn't a synonym for LaVeyan.

Why is the idea of Satanism so reviled? Is it just that it goes against the base ideas of Christianity?

Traditionally, religion is about control. Brainwashing the herd and keeping them in line. They do exactly this with the idea of Satanism. Christians are under the misconception that Satanists sacrifice babies, rape women, and have mass orgies together. They are told this by their religious leaders, pop culture, etc. And yeah, I'm sure Christians don't appreciate a religion that's purposefully the exact opposite of theirs.

they should probably change their name

Nope. That would completely void the point of the religion.

LaVeyan Satanism is so named for a couple reasons outlined by LaVey himself.
1. It keeps the people who are not meant to be Satanists, away from Satanism. 2. Satanists are the opposers of organized religion and specifically Christianity. Satan is the only one who dared to oppose God, and that is why he is evil. Satan is Greek for exactly that, "the opposer." 3. Shock value.

I clicked the link you posted and apparently one of the 'nine satanic statements' is "Satan represents indulgence instead of abstinence." As a Christian I've been taught that the devil tries to lure us away from God by convincing us to turn to things in life we find pleasurable instead of turning to God. We get distracted by the pleasurable things in life and forget God and the purpose of it all, and that's what the devil wants. I don't mean to sound all religious or preachy, and I don't judge satanists because I can easily accept that people are going to believe different things. But I didn't agree with a single thing that was on that webpage, and a lot of it just seemed really awful to me because of what I believe. I don't hate satanists or anything like that but I totally disagree with it.

Okay, I'll break out the Satanic Bible here, since no one here has used it as a resource yet.

"There is nothing wrong with dogma, providing it is not based on ideas and actions which go completely against human nature.
"Satanism is the only religion known to man that accepts man as he is, and promotes the rational of turning a bad thing into a good thing rather than bending over backwards to eliminate the bad thing."

Sin is human nature, why deny what you are? What is wrong with being human?

"When a person has no proper release for his desires they rapidly build up and become compulsions. If everyone had a particular time and place for the purpose of periodically indulging in their personal desires, without fear of embarrassment or reproach, they would be sufficiently released to lead unfrustrated lives in the everyday world."

Basically, LaVey believes abstaining leads to compulsion, which is so totally true. I only say it's 100% true because this doesn't even relate to Satanism, this is a complete psychology lesson that I've learned through experience. When something is taboo, people want to do it. Only when you release all negative connotations with an action or substance are you free to enjoy it once and a while without it having a hold on you.

Then he goes into saying Christians are masochists, but that doesn't prove my point so much as it just proves abstinence is a form of masochism.

Satanism= evil, it has proved that all through history, I copied this from the website

any psychopath that thinks Satan, the symbol of evil, should be locked in a secured hospital at treated for mental illness.

The Book of Satan, 1.5 "Too long right and wrong, good and evil have been inverted by false prophets!"

Christians are the ones who labelled Satan evil. Quoting my favourite television show right now, "Have you ever considered the fact that perhaps I am good? I was always the Queen, it was you who added Evil to my name."

Personally, I find Satanism too pessimistic, arrogant, self-centered, and egocentric for my liking. There are aspects of Satanism I can agree with, such as questioning everything. But the idea of out-casting "stupid" people, not being patient with those who are "not worthy", and seeking revenge are just on the polar end of the spectrum for me. I'm a Secular Humanist- I believe in being altruistic, doing good for others (even if they might not deserve it) for the sake of creating good in the world, without a reward. Even though I'm not religious, I think the teachings of Christ (which are the opposite of Satanists) fit my beliefs, for the most part, much better than Satanism.

I understand how LaVeyan's wording can seem a bit harsh. Really, I would say more like. The thing is, doing good for others is something some people receive a lot of joy from. There is nothing un-Satanic about being nice to people, they just don't advocate it if it is absolutely pointless: as in, if they don't appreciate it or you don't find that joy in doing it. If someone spit in your face when you were trying to help them time and time again, would you still want to help them? If they are that rude, they don't deserve your kindness. Go be helpful to someone who will appreciate it!

It can seem selfish to some, but I always emphasize how your life is nonexistent without you. Your body is a temple, not a shell to be used to worship something else. You are a magnificent, beautiful being and you are important. You are the God in your life. And in the case of selfless people, you have to take care of yourself before you can take care of others, otherwise you run the risk of becoming incapable of taking care of others.

[Cygnus]

I was told by a teacher about some things that certain (not all) satanists do during halloween and april 20th or 30th. They do some pretty fucked up blood and sex rituals, search that for yourselves.

[Syvelocin]

I was told by a teacher about some things that certain (not all) satanists do during halloween and april 20th or 30th. They do some pretty fucked up blood and sex rituals, search that for yourselves.

There's your problem there.