Make it clear about Islam

[Left Now]

When i heard about some useless debates about Islam in the forum,i decided to to make some clear visions about this religion:
Well,i think it will be good to start with this verse from Quran:
"...There is no compulsion in accepting the religion!"
Sura Al-Baqara 256
According to this verse of Quran,there will be no force for someone in accepting a religion;a person can be christian,jew,Zoroastrian,Hindu,Buduhist,without religion and live in an Islamic government,unless he does anything against the advantages of Islam and Muslims;

but when a person accepts to convert to Islam,then he has to obey the Islamic law and orders.According to Islamic law,a Muslim must not be homosexual or do adultery;Remember a Muslim must not do this,but there is no law in Islam to punish a not Muslim person because of this.

For example,a Christian can be homosexual in an Islamic government,and even if it is declared in public,he can still be homosexual,but if he/she does something which can threat the Islamic society,for example convince other Muslims to be against Islam,the Islamic government is allowed to stop him or her.

What is the meaning of Apostate in Islam?An apostate:A person who will fight against Islamic law in public of an Islamic Society.If a person converts from Islam to another religion,there is no law for his/her execution and it doesn't mean he is apostate;but if he/she fights against Islamic Principles in public of an Islamic Society,the government can stop him/her and execute him/her.So converting to another religion is not the meaning of a person becomes apostate in Islam,unless he fights against Islamic Principles in public.

[Stronk Serb]

Are non-Islamic women supossed to wear hoods in Islamic states? Is it stated by law that they should?

[kenoloor]

I'm not really sure of the purpose of this thread, but I'm going to go ahead and point something out- atheists do not have recognized legal status in many Islamic countries. So, while Muslim governments may claim not to force someone into being Muslim, they are still forcing atheists into associating with a religion in order to gain any sort of legal status.

[Left Now]

Are non-Islamic women supossed to wear hoods in Islamic states? Is it stated by law that they should?

If they are passing from a place which most of its population are Muslims,yes;But for example if they are going through a completely christian town,they can remove their veils.Remember the veil doesn't mean a long hood and mask;it means something which can cover hairs,breasts,arms,legs and stomach.

Something like this is acceptable:
http://webgardi.yjc.ir/files/fa/news/1390/9/23/8014_632.jpg

I'm not really sure of the purpose of this thread, but I'm going to go ahead and point something out- atheists do not have recognized legal status in many Islamic countries. So, while Muslim governments may claim not to force someone into being Muslim, they are still forcing atheists into associating with a religion in order to gain any sort of legal status.

Yes,because atheists are usually against the Islamic laws and principles and declare it in public,but if they do not want to have quarrels with Islamic principles they can carry the name of one of the not-monotheist religions like buduhism or hindu to have a religion in their birth certificates.

[kenoloor]

Yes,because atheists are usually against the Islamic laws and principles and declare it in public

That's a gross generalization.

but if they do not want to have quarrels with Islamic principles they can carry the name of one of the not-monotheist religions like buduhism or hindu to have a religion in their birth certificates.

That's still oppressive. Monotheistic, polytheistic, pantheistic, they're not atheistic. Forcing atheists to associate with a religion is still oppressive.

[Left Now]

That's a gross generalization.



That's still oppressive. Monotheistic, polytheistic, pantheistic, they're not atheistic. Forcing atheists to associate with a religion is still oppressive.

Yes,but the governments are doing this which i think is wrong,Islam does not have any quarrel with who doesn't do anything against its principle even if the person is atheist.

[Hank Hill]

Trying to understand what this thread is about exactly. Enjoyed reading it though.

[Left Now]

Trying to make some dark points of Islam,bright and clear for people.

[Jess]

Don't people get executed for blasphemy, if they "insult" the Prophet?

[TheRashad]

Don't people get executed for blasphemy, if they "insult" the Prophet?

No at most of the times but they are punished by paying fines,prison.....etc

[Harry Smith]

No at most of the times but they are punished by paying fines,prison.....etc

what you get put in Prision for saying that Mohammed had sex with a 12 year old girl, oh wait according to the Koran he did

[Left Now]

Don't people get executed for blasphemy, if they "insult" the Prophet?

Insulting the prophet is like insulting a person's father,when a person insults the prophet in the public of an Islamic Society,the people will react,even if government does not do anything.

However,most of the times they will be arrested and after a day and after asking why he did this act,they will make him\her free but he/she must promise to not do it again in public,or he/she will pay something more for this act.

what you get put in Prision for saying that Mohammed had sex with a 12 year old girl, oh wait according to the Koran he did

Which Quran,British Quran you mean?Haha..Go and read some more historical book,That girl was Aisha and she was 14 according to three trustworthy 10th century history books when she gave birth.14 was the best time for a a girl to have a baby in those times,even in Europe and Republic of Rome,China,Far east it was like this.

Also,that marriage between Aisha and Muhammad was not just a marriage,it was a political alliance between two tribes too.

When a person say something like this,if he wants to insult,then he must repay,it is like treason in UK,but if he wants to join a historical debate,then nothing will happen...

[Stronk Serb]

Are Islamic heresies accepted? Heresies like Bektashi, Yazidi etc.
About the adultery part, in Europe, it was normal for a ruler to marry a 10 year old girl and have a child a few years later. So by saying that by today's standards Mohammad only is a pedophile is not true. European monarchs sometimes married even younger girls. There were cases of 60+ years old rulers having 15-16 year old spouses.

[Left Now]

Are Islamic heresies accepted? Heresies like Bektashi, Yazidi etc.
About the adultery part, in Europe, it was normal for a ruler to marry a 10 year old girl and have a child a few years later. So by saying that by today's standards Mohammad only is a pedophile is not true. European monarchs sometimes married even younger girls. There were cases of 60+ years old rulers having 15-16 year old spouses.

In Islamic nations,Sunni and Shia are the main branches of Islam and such things like Bektashi and Yazidi and Suffism,are the branches of Shia and Sunni Islam.When a man is Bektashi,in his birth certificate,they will write Shia-Islam.

So they can say that it is acceptable.But heresies like this were just in Medieval ages;as i said,in Medieval ages the majority of Muslims were Sunnis and they knew other branches of Islam like Shia as heresy.But Bektashi is even known as heresy in Complete Shia(Twelvers),because it has many extremist beliefs in itself.

[Harry Smith]

Which Quran,British Quran you mean?Haha..Go and read some more historical book,That girl was Aisha and she was 14 according to three trustworthy 10th century history books when she gave birth.14 was the best time for a a girl to have a baby in those times,even in Europe and Republic of Rome,China,Far east it was like this.

Also,that marriage between Aisha and Muhammad was not just a marriage,it was a political alliance between two tribes too.

When a person say something like this,if he wants to insult,then he must repay,it is like treason in UK,but if he wants to join a historical debate,then nothing will happen...

I'm sorry that the Quran doesn't fall on my reading list.

Aisha was actually 11 when she had intercourse with Mohammed, and she was still as old as his grandchild. That's sick. How is it at all similar to treason... there is absolutely no evidence that supports Mohammed being related to God in anyway, it's just a way of enforcing rules. Mohammed married the girl when she was 5, that's fucked up

[Left Now]

I'm sorry that the Quran doesn't fall on my reading list.

Aisha was actually 11 when she had intercourse with Mohammed, and she was still as old as his grandchild. That's sick. How is it at all similar to treason... there is absolutely no evidence that supports Mohammed being related to God in anyway, it's just a way of enforcing rules. Mohammed married the girl when she was 5, that's fucked up

This is why i am telling you to read more history;Aisha was 9 when married and 14 when had intercourse.Bring me two trustworthy books about what you are saying;I have read over 16 books about it,and in all of them Aisha was over 13 years old when she gave birth.

Tabari History and Balkhi History are two great sources of today history books about Middle East and Islam,and both of them say,Aisha was over 13-14 when she gave birth.

[Reanne]

So what is the point in following something that doesn't change with the times. The world has changed enormously, so why doesn't Islam change?

In the past women couldn't vote, but common sense has prevailed and now they can in Western Countries.

[Harry Smith]

This is why i am telling you to read more history;Aisha was 9 when married and 14 when had intercourse.Bring me two trustworthy books about what you are saying;I have read over 16 books about it,and in all of them Aisha was over 13 years old when she gave birth.

Tabari History and Balkhi History are two great sources of today history books about Middle East and Islam,and both of them say,Aisha was over 13-14 when she gave birth.

I don't really want to read about your false god. I don't have any books on Islam due to the fact that I'm gay. But I managed to find this

''"Aisha said, "The Apostle of Allah married me when I was seven years old." ). "He had intercourse with me when I was 9 years old."
Abu-Dawud 2:2116

[Left Now]

So what is the point in following something that doesn't change with the times. The world has changed enormously, so why doesn't Islam change?

In the past women couldn't vote, but common sense has prevailed and now they can in Western Countries.

They can in Eastern Countries too;you really thought they can't?
Education,Social activities and work is appreciated for women in Islam,but some racist Arabs still have their pre-islamic traditions and disrespect the women's rights.For example they lock their daughters and wives in their home and do not let them do social activities;but it is against Islamic studies.The women have that right to choose for themselves and participating in elections is their right and Islam let the woman to bring her husband to court if he doesn't let her to do social activities.

Islamic principles are not changeable,but the ways of operating them can change during the time.For example wine is forbidden,drinking of grape juice was forbidden in Islam too because during making grape juice,it could turn into wine and make people drunken,but with advancing of technology,now they can remove the alcohol from the grape juice and now grape juice is not forbidden.

I don't really want to read about your false god. I don't have any books on Islam due to the fact that I'm gay. But I managed to find this

''"Aisha said, "The Apostle of Allah married me when I was seven years old." ). "He had intercourse with me when I was 9 years old."
Abu-Dawud 2:2116

"Aisha said,"When the prophet married me after Hijra(When she was 9 or 10)a year was past since Year of Sadness(Am-al Huzn) the time when prophet lost his wife Khadija and his uncle Abu-Talib."
History of Ahl-al Sunna,published in Damascus year 1932
After Hijra means the years after Aisha turned into 8,so it is impossible for her to marry the prophet when she was 7.

Also,a girl cannot have sex unless she is over 10 years old in Arabic culture,so she couldn't give birth when she was 9.it means she was over 10 when she had sex.

"Aisha was the daughter of Abu-Bakr and wife of Muhammad ibn Abdullah.When she was 10 she married Muhammad the Honest(Muhammad al-Amin) with the suggestion of his father and she accepted to do this because of the unity of her tribe.They married after the Hijra and migration from Mecca to Medina.In Medina she gave birth..."
Tarikh al-Tabari(Tabari History):Muhammad ibn Jarir al-Tabari

[tovaris]

I'm sorry that the Quran doesn't fall on my reading list.

Aisha was actually 11 when she had intercourse with Mohammed, and she was still as old as his grandchild. That's sick. How is it at all similar to treason... there is absolutely no evidence that supports Mohammed being related to God in anyway, it's just a way of enforcing rules. Mohammed married the girl when she was 5, that's fucked up

Read it before critisizing.
And what you see as sick or fucked up now is because you have been taught that way, these are the ruler and morals of your modern day society.
What ties his predicesors like Jezus/Hisus with god?

About mariage is kiling ones wife becauseyou cant get a divorce stil acceptible on the island? (Just making a point)

[Reanne]

I don't know women's voting rights or when they were allowed to. I was just using that as an example.

Why do some Muslims continue past hatreds. The hate for the Jews and American's from where I see it has gone on for years. I understand they have done some terrible things, but I think you fight back at the time of wrong doings. Not preach the hate to generations after generations. Violence and hate has to stop, no-one is gaining anything by it and most of the time innocent people die.

I think what you are doing by educating us is great. I think more Muslims should stand up and speak and show that terrorists are a minority group and aren't the normal follower of Islam.

[Harry Smith]

They can in Eastern Countries too;you really thought they can't?
Education,Social activities and work is appreciated for women in Islam,but some racist Arabs still have their pre-islamic traditions and disrespect the women's rights.For example they lock their daughters and wives in their home and do not let them do social activities;but it is against Islamic studies.The women have that right to choose for themselves and participating in elections is their right and Islam let the woman to bring her husband to court if he doesn't let her to do social activities.

Islamic principles are not changeable,but the ways of operating them can change during the time.For example wine is forbidden,drinking of grape juice was forbidden in Islam too because during making grape juice,it could turn into wine and make people drunken,but with advancing of technology,now they can remove the alcohol from the grape juice and now grape juice is not forbidden.



"Aisha said,"When the prophet married me after Hijra(When she was 9 or 10)a year was past since Year of Sadness(Am-al Huzn) the time when prophet lost his wife Khadija and his uncle Abu-Talib."
History of Ahl-al Sunna,published in Damascus year 1932
After Hijra means the years after Aisha turned into 8,so it is impossible for her to marry the prophet when she was 7.

Also,a girl cannot have sex unless she is over 10 years old in Arabic culture,so she couldn't give birth when she was 9.it means she was over 10 when she had sex.

"Aisha was the daughter of Abu-Bakr and wife of Muhammad ibn Abdullah.When she was 10 she married Muhammad the Honest(Muhammad al-Amin) with the suggestion of his father and she accepted to do this because of the unity of her tribe.They married after the Hijra and migration from Mecca to Medina.In Medina she gave birth..."
Tarikh al-Tabari(Tabari History):Muhammad ibn Jarir al-Tabari

Well that's is just great, one of the main character of your religion had sex with a girl but at least she was over 10. To me Islam just shows how religion is used to oppress the masses.

1)Look at Islam and Homosexuality, it has outdated hateful views.
2)Look at there views to women, forcing them to cover up there body, not allowing them to drive and forcing them to take a different lift to men in offices, not allowing them into funerals. The list goes on

It's a religion ran by people who quite simply don't want to give up power

[Left Now]

Well that's is just great, one of the main character of your religion had sex with a girl but at least she was over 10. To me Islam just shows how religion is used to oppress the masses.

1)Look at Islam and Homosexuality, it has outdated hateful views.
2)Look at there views to women, forcing them to cover up there body, not allowing them to drive and forcing them to take a different lift to men in offices, not allowing them into funerals. The list goes on

It's a religion ran by people who quite simply don't want to give up power

Your information about Islam is really out dated.Also,Not even in Islam,in christianity,buduhism,hinduism,judism,and also in atheist western nations before Islam and in ancient era,great leaders of tribes and nations,had wives who were about 11-15,so Muhammad did not do anything wrong in that era,this is why i am telling you,your education is just sucking in history and you are fully an idiot in history field.

Also,just in Saudi Arabia women are not allowed to drive and be in offices as equal as men,so open your eyes and do not make me think you are completely blind and cannot see Iranian and Egyptian and Iraqi and Syrian and...women can drive and work in offices and society as equal as men.Sorry to say that but your ideas about homosexuality is not a modern thing,Romans and Greeks and even Mayans had ideas like you about 2500 years ago and believed that homosexuality is even better than normal sex between men and women.

Your symbol of Islam is just a fucking country(Saudi Arabia),and you just want to see this as a complete symbol of Islam.

Damn Saudi Arabia!Damn it!

[Azunite]

Are non-Islamic women supossed to wear hoods in Islamic states? Is it stated by law that they should?

If they are passing from a place which most of its population are Muslims,yes;But for example if they are going through a completely christian town,they can remove their veils.Remember the veil doesn't mean a long hood and mask;it means something which can cover hairs,breasts,arms,legs and stomach.

Something like this is acceptable:
image (http://webgardi.yjc.ir/files/fa/news/1390/9/23/8014_632.jpg)


I apologize but this is a huge piece of S.

Qur'an does not force women to cover their heads. The original verse told them to cover their "valaubles", that being jewelry, etc (So simply they did not want any jewelry at all) because the poorer people would feel bad.
However, through time the verse got broken and this is the result.

Another reason for that is that it is an Arabic tradition for women to cover their heads. But since Islam was born in Arabia, the entire Muslim world took them as examples while converting to Islam.

[Harry Smith]

Your information about Islam is really out dated.Also,Not even in Islam,in christianity,buduhism,hinduism,judism,and also in atheist western nations before Islam and in ancient era,great leaders of tribes and nations,had wives who were about 11-15,so Muhammad did not do anything wrong in that era,this is why i am telling you,your education is just sucking in history and you are fully an idiot in history field.

Also,just in Saudi Arabia women are not allowed to drive and be in offices as equal as men,so open your eyes and do not make me think you are completely blind and cannot see Iranian and Egyptian and Iraqi and Syrian and...women can drive and work in offices and society as equal as men.Sorry to say that but your ideas about homosexuality is not a modern thing,Romans and Greeks and even Mayans had ideas like you about 2500 years ago and believed that homosexuality is even better than normal sex between men and women.

Your symbol of Islam is just a fucking country(Saudi Arabia),and you just want to see this as a complete symbol of Islam.

Damn Saudi Arabia!Damn it!

1)Don't call me an Idiot, I have an A* in History GCSE, so no it doesn't suck. Also if you insult my education please try to use correct grammar

2) Homosexuality was legalized in 1967 in Britain, so yes the LGBT movement is pretty modern.

3)In Tehran women and men have to take separate lifts in municipality offices.

[Left Now]

1)Don't call me an Idiot, I have an A* in History GCSE, so no it doesn't suck. Also if you insult my education please try to use correct grammar

2) Homosexuality was legalized in 1967 in Britain, so yes the LGBT movement is pretty modern.

3)In Tehran women and men have to take separate lifts in municipality offices.

1.I didn't want to call you idiot sir,i was angry(forgive me because of that),i just wanted to say that you are acting like an idiot in history field,because you do not know enough about the history of Islam and Middle East before and after Islam,but are talking about it in that wrong way which you think is right.

2.Homosexuality was legal in Rome and Greece before Christianity but not in Middle Eastern Empires of Parthians and Sassanids.
Rome and homosexuality: (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_ancient_Rome)

3.It would be very good if you just could come in Municipality of Tehran.
This is one of the parts of municipality of Tehran.(The separated people who sat down on chairs on the other side are regular employees who had come to Chamber Board of Directors for a discussion and the other people are
executives.)

http://fararu.com/images/docs/files/000108/nf00108570-2.JPG

I apologize but this is a huge piece of S.

Qur'an does not force women to cover their heads. The original verse told them to cover their "valaubles", that being jewelry, etc (So simply they did not want any jewelry at all) because the poorer people would feel bad.
However, through time the verse got broken and this is the result.

Another reason for that is that it is an Arabic tradition for women to cover their heads. But since Islam was born in Arabia, the entire Muslim world took them as examples while converting to Islam.

Veil was a tradition of noblewomen of Middle East.Noblewomen in Persia and Mesopotamia were required to have veil in public even before Islam.

About the veil in Quran,i suggest you to take a look on Sura Al-Ahzab verse 59 and Sura Noor verses 30 and 31,the places which a woman has to cover is noted there.

[Azunite]

Veil was a tradition of noblewomen of Middle East.Noblewomen in Persia and Mesopotamia were required to have veil in public even before Islam.

About the veil in Quran,i suggest you to take a look on Sura Al-Ahzab verse 59 and Sura Noor verses 30 and 31,the places which a woman has to cover is noted there.


These are not helpful for the continuum of the discussion. Like I said I believe that the Quran meant the "valuables" and not the all outer parts of a woman's body at first but then it was changed over time due to either misunderstandings or simply because of the Arabian tradition.

[Left Now]

These are not helpful for the continuum of the discussion. Like I said I believe that the Quran meant the "valuables" and not the all outer parts of a woman's body at first but then it was changed over time due to either misunderstandings or simply because of the Arabian tradition.

These verses clearly are telling women have to cover their hairs and if even you knew a little Arabic,you could recognize it.If you want more information about veil in Quran and Islam and Middle East,you can make me know anytime via PM.

Also,veil in Persia and Mesopotamia was because of the Zoroastrianism;there is no arabic tradition in Zoroastrianism.

[Azunite]

These verses clearly are telling women have to cover their hairs and if even you knew a little Arabic,you could recognize it.If you want more information about veil in Quran and Islam and Middle East,you can make me know anytime via PM.

Also,veil in Persia and Mesopotamia was because of the Zoroastrianism;there is no arabic tradition in Zoroastrianism.

First Paragraph: I know they clearly tell them that they should cover themselves. But this website relies on the Quran you can find anywhere. I say that the Quran was changed over time. So the very first copies of the Quran would not say so.

Second Paragraph: So? Arabians may have adopted the veil and told their women to cover themselves with veil.

[Left Now]

First Paragraph: I know they clearly tell them that they should cover themselves. But this website relies on the Quran you can find anywhere. I say that the Quran was changed over time. So the very first copies of the Quran would not say so.

Second Paragraph: So? Arabians may have adopted the veil and told their women to cover themselves with veil.

1.Quran has a code(i do not mean number 19 code of Quran which has been discovered in 1968) which 1000 years ago,during the reign of Abbasid Empire,the Islamic scholars and mathematicians discovered it.So changing Quran and meanwhile save this code in verses cannot be that easy or even possible.As you can see,Saudi Arabia once tried to do this and add some words to Quran,but very soon,scholars in other Islamic countries recognized it and put a sanction on Saudi Qurans until the government of Saudi Arabia announced that,it was just an accident and they would take all of the Qurans back and give their owners,the corrected ones.

2.Arab women before Islam were allowed to not have veil(for head) and just wear a long dress to cover their body;but in Persia,noblewomen must cover their hair.If they wanted to adopt it,why didn't they adopt the full veil from Persians?
Persian mounted noblewoman had veil in this pic:
http://www.hijabnews.net/images/docs/000016/n00016438-b.jpg

[Azunite]

1.Quran has a math code which since 1000 years ago,the Islamic scholars and mathematicians discovered it.So changing Quran and meanwhile save this code in verses cannot be that easy or even possible.As you can see,Saudi Arabia once tried to do this and add some words to Quran,but very soon,scholars in other Islamic countries recognized it and put a sanction on Saudi Qurans until the government of Saudi Arabia announced that,it was just an accident and they would take all of the Qurans back and give their owners,the corrected once.

Quran has a code? What kind of a code, can you explain it?

Because I doubt there could possibly be a code made by those who wrote the Quran and Muhammed, who could barely knew how to read and write ( thinking of the fact that they couldn't transfer God's saying word by word, comma by comma )

[Left Now]

Quran has a code? What kind of a code, can you explain it?

Because I doubt there could possibly be a code made by those who wrote the Quran and Muhammed, who could barely knew how to read and write ( thinking of the fact that they couldn't transfer God's saying word by word, comma by comma )

1.The first code is related to the music of Quran.As you know we have Qari's in islamic nations who will read the words of Quran with a great music(One of the famous Qari's is Abdul-baset).Qari's have different ways of reading the Quran but their disciplines in reading are completely the same.If one word in Quran changes,the Qari's will be able to read the Quran with completely different disciplines.

The second code which has been discovered in 1968 by an Egyptian Biochemist.This code is known as number 19 code of Quran which in all of the verses of all of the Qurans exists.

2.Muhammad could read but couldn't write.There are three persons who wrote the Quran:Abu bakr,Ali,Osman i think.When verses were going to be revealed to him,if one of these three persons were there,Muhammad would tell him to write what he(Muhammad) was receiving from the God.Then Muhammad would keep those notes until other verses be revealed.

The Quran got completely revealed before the death of Muhammad and approved by him.
According to "History of Kings and Prophets or Tabari History"

[Harry Smith]

[QUOTE=Broken Pen;2334402]

2.Homosexuality was legal in Rome and Greece before Christianity but not in Middle Eastern Empires of Parthians and Sassanids.
Rome and homosexuality: (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_ancient_Rome)

I understand that homosexuality was incorporated in rome, but that doesn't mean that LGBT movement is an old one, I mean it's only really been a public one for the last 60 years. It's like saying that because black people had rights in Africa that the civil rights movement was non effective.

But it doesn't hide Islams terrible attitude to homosexuals does it?

[Left Now]

[QUOTE=Broken Pen;2334402]

2.Homosexuality was legal in Rome and Greece before Christianity but not in Middle Eastern Empires of Parthians and Sassanids.
Rome and homosexuality: (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_ancient_Rome)

I understand that homosexuality was incorporated in rome, but that doesn't mean that LGBT movement is an old one, I mean it's only really been a public one for the last 60 years. It's like saying that because black people had rights in Africa that the civil rights movement was non effective.

But it doesn't hide Islams terrible attitude to homosexuals does it?

Islam is hostile toward homosexuality because it knows it something unbalanced in nature of Humans.In the view of Islam,humans have not been created to be unbalanced.The balance will exist when a creature be able to complete another creature.Animals will complete plants,night will complete the day,light will complete the darkness,male will complete the female;
But homosexuality is telling that male can complete the mail or female can complete the female too,which is unbalanced in the view of Islam.So it is not a strange thing if Islam is against homosexuality.

[Harry Smith]

[QUOTE=Harry Smith;2334751]

Islam is hostile toward homosexuality because it knows it something unbalanced in nature of Humans.In the view of Islam,humans have not been created to be unbalanced.The balance will exist when a creature be able to complete another creature.Animals will complete plants,night will complete the day,light will complete the darkness,male will complete the female;
But homosexuality is telling that male can complete the mail or female can complete the female too,which is unbalanced in the view of Islam.So it is not a strange thing if Islam is against homosexuality.

wow, that's complete and utter waffle. The balance of life? That has no revelance, the bottom line is that Islam wants to take away my rights based on my orientation, you can't disguise Islams hatred

[tovaris]

[QUOTE=Broken Pen;2334819]

wow, that's complete and utter waffle. The balance of life? That has no revelance, the bottom line is that Islam wants to take away my rights based on my orientation, you can't disguise Islams hatred

Islam in its core does not hate those who think diferently, islam lets it be, but what „islamic” goverments do is a completly diferent thing

[TheRashad]

I don't know women's voting rights or when they were allowed to. I was just using that as an example.

Why do some Muslims continue past hatreds. The hate for the Jews and American's from where I see it has gone on for years. I understand they have done some terrible things, but I think you fight back at the time of wrong doings. Not preach the hate to generations after generations. Violence and hate has to stop, no-one is gaining anything by it and most of the time innocent people die.

I think what you are doing by educating us is great. I think more Muslims should stand up and speak and show that terrorists are a minority group and aren't the normal follower of Islam.

Our hatred for jews and American isnt a past hatred and ended it still till now because they occupy palastine

[Left Now]

Our hatred for jews and American isnt a past hatred and ended it still till now because they occupy palastine

Islam does not hate Jews and Americans.Our hatred is just for Israel and its supporters;
But personally,people in Iran hate America and UK and USSR for something else,not just religious reasons.

America:In 1949,people of Iran elected a PM in Shah's time;his name was Muhammad Mosaddegh.One of his goals was to make Iran's oil national and take it from Anglo-Iran British oil company.UK tried a lot to stop him via Shah but at last he did what he promised(In 1951).

After a year and in 1952,Mosaddegh tried to make a republic and replace it with monarchy system in Iran,so with his rights according to the parliament ,he began to prepare the basic things for that republic;Shah recognized it and tried to fire him,but parliament and people was with him,so he at last escaped from Iran with his private Airplane.

When he was out of Iran,he met a lot of British and American and Soviet political ranks and requested them to help him go back to Iran.

Mosaddegh's power declined very much in 1953,because USSR didn't pay Iran the money of oil which Soviet Union took from Iran;and financial problems were going to put people in trouble.At last,Mosaddegh asked US for help,while people were against his decision,but he didn't have any other choice;however US refused to help Iran's democratic government.

At last,with a planed coup by CIA and MI6(This code was the code of beginning the coup which has been transferred by BBC radio:The time is exactly 12 o' clock!),finally the army overthrew Mosaddegh and invited Shah back to Iran.And then the government of Iran became absolute monarchy and Shah killed a lot of people to save his throne,but at last in 1979,he lost it.

This is one of the main reasons,why people in Iran hate America and UK,and do not trust them.

[Reanne]

Our hatred for jews and American isnt a past hatred and ended it still till now because they occupy palastine

I don't try to be an expert in this as I don't really know the facts, but my understanding was after the second world war via the united nations it was agreed that the jews had to have a place to call home and part of palastine was used to create the state of Israel.

Islam does not hate Jews and Americans.Our hatred is just for Israel and its supporters;
But personally,people in Iran hate America and UK and USSR for something else,not just religious reasons.

America:In 1949,people of Iran elected a PM in Shah's time;his name was Muhammad Mosaddegh.One of his goals was to make Iran's oil national and take it from Anglo-Iran British oil company.UK tried a lot to stop him via Shah but at last he did what he promised(In 1951).

After a year and in 1952,Mosaddegh tried to make a republic and replace it with monarchy system in Iran,so with his rights according to the parliament ,he began to prepare the basic things for that republic;Shah recognized it and tried to fire him,but parliament and people was with him,so he at last escaped from Iran with his private Airplane.

When he was out of Iran,he met a lot of British and American and Soviet political ranks and requested them to help him go back to Iran.

Mosaddegh's power declined very much in 1953,because USSR didn't pay Iran the money of oil which Soviet Union took from Iran;and financial problems were going to put people in trouble.At last,Mosaddegh asked US for help,while people were against his decision,but he didn't have any other choice;however US refused to help Iran's democratic government.

At last,with a planed coup by CIA and MI6(This code was the code of beginning the coup which has been transferred by BBC radio:The time is exactly 12 o' clock!),finally the army overthrew Mosaddegh and invited Shah back to Iran.And then the government of Iran became absolute monarchy and Shah killed a lot of people to save his throne,but at last in 1979,he lost it.

This is one of the main reasons,why people in Iran hate America and UK,and do not trust them.

Thank you for explaining this. I think some of the past politicians from UK, US did some ordinary things in the past and hopefully it stays in the past. I think oil has always been a big thing for the US and UK and they have probably bullied they're way in the middle east to get oil.

[Harry Smith]

Islam does not hate Jews and Americans.Our hatred is just for Israel and its supporters;
But personally,people in Iran hate America and UK and USSR for something else,not just religious reasons.

America:In 1949,people of Iran elected a PM in Shah's time;his name was Muhammad Mosaddegh.One of his goals was to make Iran's oil national and take it from Anglo-Iran British oil company.UK tried a lot to stop him via Shah but at last he did what he promised(In 1951).

After a year and in 1952,Mosaddegh tried to make a republic and replace it with monarchy system in Iran,so with his rights according to the parliament ,he began to prepare the basic things for that republic;Shah recognized it and tried to fire him,but parliament and people was with him,so he at last escaped from Iran with his private Airplane.

When he was out of Iran,he met a lot of British and American and Soviet political ranks and requested them to help him go back to Iran.

Mosaddegh's power declined very much in 1953,because USSR didn't pay Iran the money of oil which Soviet Union took from Iran;and financial problems were going to put people in trouble.At last,Mosaddegh asked US for help,while people were against his decision,but he didn't have any other choice;however US refused to help Iran's democratic government.

At last,with a planed coup by CIA and MI6(This code was the code of beginning the coup which has been transferred by BBC radio:The time is exactly 12 o' clock!),finally the army overthrew Mosaddegh and invited Shah back to Iran.And then the government of Iran became absolute monarchy and Shah killed a lot of people to save his throne,but at last in 1979,he lost it.

This is one of the main reasons,why people in Iran hate America and UK,and do not trust them.

The land belongs to Israel, whether you like it or not there flag flies over it and there is nothing you can do to stop them

[Left Now]

The land belongs to Israel, whether you like it or not there flag flies over it and there is nothing you can do to stop them

A country based on blood may can stand still for a long time,but at last it will fall.However,those lands belongs to Palestinians too;While Israel government doesn't let them to live there.I do not know what will you call it,but we call it stealing the lands.

I don't try to be an expert in this as I don't really know the facts, but my understanding was after the second world war via the united nations it was agreed that the jews had to have a place to call home and part of palastine was used to create the state of Israel.



Thank you for explaining this. I think some of the past politicians from UK, US did some ordinary things in the past and hopefully it stays in the past. I think oil has always been a big thing for the US and UK and they have probably bullied they're way in the middle east to get oil.

Maybe it past,but the policy of UK and US is still like this toward middle east.


-merged double post. -Emerald Dream

[Harry Smith]

A country based on blood may can stand still for a long time,but at last it will fall.However,those lands belongs to Palestinians too;While Israel government doesn't let them to live there.I do not know what will you call it,but we call it stealing the lands.

It's not stealing, it was granted to Israel by the UN in '49. It's based on blood because the Arabs attacked first but everyone forgets that

[britishboy]

hey guys if you haven't looked into the quran dont insult it and I think western people dont like it because its reallyyyyy different and associated with terrorism but if you look in to it, Islamic states have extremely strict laws and hang suspected terrorist

[Left Now]

It's not stealing, it was granted to Israel by the UN in '49. It's based on blood because the Arabs attacked first but everyone forgets that

Before UN declared Israel as a legal country,Jews massacred a lot of original people of Palestine,the Arabs just attacked there because it was their lands not foreign Jews who were from Europe and other countries.The first massacres happened when minority of Jews took guns and attacked Palestinian civilians.

[britishboy]

Before UN declared Israel as a legal country,Jews massacred a lot of original people of Palestine,the Arabs just attacked there because it was their lands not foreign Jews who were from Europe and other countries.The first massacres happened when minority of Jews took guns and attacked Palestinian civilians.

stop holding grudges, britian massacred millions in the empire, were one of the biggest supporters of human rights now and germany tried to wipe out the jews, theyre great allies now, move on with isreal and try to be friendly, if france can be friends and allies with germany, so can iran be friends with Israel

[Left Now]

stop holding grudges, britian massacred millions in the empire, were one of the biggest supporters of human rights now and germany tried to wipe out the jews, theyre great allies now, move on with isreal and try to be friendly, if france can be friends and allies with germany, so can iran be friends with Israel

Hah..!It is impossible!Israel must stop building Jewish towns and destroying Palestinian towns and house.We muslims are very supportive toward each others.Jewish emigrants(Not original jews of Palestine) in Palestine must go back to their original countries and Palestinian refugees must be allowed to get back to their lands.

[The LOLer]

If there is no compulsion, why the hell are radical musilms killing innocent people for not being Muslim?

[britishboy]

Hah..!It is impossible!Israel must stop building Jewish towns and destroying Palestinian towns and house.We muslims are very supportive toward each others.Jewish emigrants(Not original jews of Palestine) in Palestine must go back to their original countries and Palestinian refugees must be allowed to get back to their lands.

from what I understand of this (correct me if im wrong) isreal has promised countries like the USA and the UK that they will attack Iran if the countries want them to and this has annoyed Iran. it should be noted that many people think that if we ask them to attack they will say no

[Left Now]

from what I understand of this (correct me if im wrong) isreal has promised countries like the USA and the UK that they will attack Iran if the countries want them to and this has annoyed Iran. it should be noted that many people think that if we ask them to attack they will say no

Israel is even trying to convince US and UK to attack Iran.They are really aggressive.

[britishboy]

Israel is even trying to convince US and UK to attack Iran.They are really aggressive.

theyre our puppet state:/ this is actually funny, why would we listen to such an irrelevant country? and theyre not doing it very well, ive never herd of them questioning our foreign policies, I think theyre happy to be quiet and safe

[Left Now]

theyre our puppet state:/ this is actually funny, why would we listen to such an irrelevant country? and theyre not doing it very well, ive never herd of them questioning our foreign policies, I think theyre happy to be quiet and safe

You've never heard?They are always threatening Iran they will attack us?Their PM is really aggressive and savage about this.

[britishboy]

You've never heard?They are always threatening Iran they will attack us?Their PM is really aggressive and savage about this.

no stuff like the eu is more in our news, and as far as im aware its more threats like 'if iran does this we will attack' I think they are trying to look big to nato, but theyre not, do not fear them

[Left Now]

no stuff like the eu is more in our news, and as far as im aware its more threats like 'if iran does this we will attack' I think they are trying to look big to nato, but theyre not, do not fear them

Why should we fear them?Their whole country is in threat of us if they want to start an aggression against us.

Israel aggression to Iran == End of Israel.

Better for them to not do such a thing like this.

[britishboy]

Why should we fear them?Their whole country is in threat of us if they want to start an aggression against us.

Israel aggression to Iran == End of Israel.

Better for them to not do such a thing like this.

if they attack you it will be for a reason as they will not randomly attack as this will lose western support, this reason will probably spark NATO to help isreal

[Left Now]

If they attack,the transgressor will be Israel and UN has to be on our side.

[britishboy]

If they attack,the transgressor will be Israel and UN has to be on our side.

depends why they attack

[Stronk Serb]

It's not stealing, it was granted to Israel by the UN in '49. It's based on blood because the Arabs attacked first but everyone forgets that

Israeli are ethnicaly cleansing Palestine. By forcing Arab migrations and by violence.

[Stronk Serb]

If there is no compulsion, why the hell are radical musilms killing innocent people for not being Muslim?


And why the hell did radical Christians bomb abortion clinics? That Norwegian guy? They killed innoents.

[The LOLer]

And why the hell did radical Christians bomb abortion clinics? That Norwegian guy? They killed innoents.

You completely ignored my point. Pen said their was no compulsion to accepting of Islam, yet there are Muslims killing people for not being Islamic. Christians are against abortion, but we won't kill anybody. Those so-called Christian murderers are the farthest possible from Christianity.:yes:

[Harry Smith]

Why should we fear them?Their whole country is in threat of us if they want to start an aggression against us.

Israel aggression to Iran == End of Israel.

Better for them to not do such a thing like this.

Ok, Israel have nuclear weapons you don't, America's arsenal could flatten your country in 20 minutes, Christ we managed to change your government by paying a mobster to start a riot in '53

[Unique Physique]

I'm sorry that the Quran doesn't fall on my reading list.

Aisha was actually 11 when she had intercourse with Mohammed, and she was still as old as his grandchild. That's sick. How is it at all similar to treason... there is absolutely no evidence that supports Mohammed being related to God in anyway, it's just a way of enforcing rules. Mohammed married the girl when she was 5, that's fucked up

I agree it's fucked up for an old man to fuck an underage girl, but why attack only Islam for it? That was in the, what, 9th century.. do you know what the age of consent in the UK was prior to 1875? It was 12, and then raised to 13 via the Offences Against The Person Act 1875.

Until the 1890s in many USA states the age of consent was only 10. That was only 123 years ago, yet you (and others) continuously bash what a Muslim prophet did centuries ago before then.

Whether we like it or not, people in the past had a drastically different view on things like this. Young teenagers were pretty much treated like and considered full adults in many periods of history - they left school at 12, worked, got married, had kids. Life expectency was much shorter then too.

You may as well start slagging Winston Churchill off for being anti-Jewish, homophobic and a racist and George Washington for being a slave owner too if you're gonna judge historical figures by todays standards.

[Left Now]

Ok, Israel have nuclear weapons you don't, America's arsenal could flatten your country in 20 minutes, Christ we managed to change your government by paying a mobster to start a riot in '53

Yes,but remember why Mosaddegh got overthrown.Because of the Army;he didn't have the full control of the army,but now a coup in Iran is as impossible as water doesn't make a piece of silk wet.

Also,i do not think Israel and US want to have the hatred of the World once again with killing civilians right?Specially Israel;maybe they are savage enough to use their nuclear weapons to kill civilians,but i do not think after that they can exist in the world comfortably;Killing civilians of a country with nuclear weapon,means proving to the world that Israel is dangerous for the world and must be destroyed.Even then,the supports of UK or US or even UN won't be useful,because a great movement of people in the world will come to destroy that country.

[Stronk Serb]

You completely ignored my point. Pen said their was no compulsion to accepting of Islam, yet there are Muslims killing people for not being Islamic. Christians are against abortion, but we won't kill anybody. Those so-called Christian murderers are the farthest possible from Christianity.:yes:

Christianity dictates peacefulness and no forced indoctrination into it. There were and still are crimes against non-Christians by Christians for not being Christian. I am constantly harassed by the nationalist part of my class for not being Christian, an I have lost my "Serbness", even though, by blood I am more Serb then them. Just because I am not a Christian and am a communist does not mean I am not a Serb. Those Muslims are also the farthest, belonging to radical Islamic heresies. Christians have not declared any radical movements which strayed from the peaceful teachings of the Bible to be heretical.

[tovaris]

You completely ignored my point. Pen said their was no compulsion to accepting of Islam, yet there are Muslims killing people for not being Islamic. Christians are against abortion, but we won't kill anybody. Those so-called Christian murderers are the farthest possible from Christianity.:yes:

You would think that would be thw case since both religions propagate pece. And yet the american president puts his heand on the bible whrn begining a new term (evil), the crusades?, Spanhsh inquisition?, burning witches, bloving up bridges, killing blacks...

[The LOLer]

You would think that would be thw case since both religions propagate pece. And yet the american president puts his heand on the bible whrn begining a new term (evil), the crusades?, Spanhsh inquisition?, burning witches, bloving up bridges, killing blacks...

Ok, well its tradition to use the bible to inaugurate presidents. It has nothing to do with Christianity. As for the rest, the bible is strongly against those acts. Again not Christian.

[Left Now]

Ok, well its tradition to use the bible to inaugurate presidents. It has nothing to do with Christianity. As for the rest, the bible is strongly against those acts. Again not Christian.

Those terrorist are not Islamic neither.

[tovaris]

Ok, well its tradition to use the bible to inaugurate presidents. It has nothing to do with Christianity. As for the rest, the bible is strongly against those acts. Again not Christian.

I don't think the quran if for ackts of wae and teror ether.

[Harry Smith]

I agree it's fucked up for an old man to fuck an underage girl, but why attack only Islam for it? That was in the, what, 9th century.. do you know what the age of consent in the UK was prior to 1875? It was 12, and then raised to 13 via the Offences Against The Person Act 1875.

Until the 1890s in many USA states the age of consent was only 10. That was only 123 years ago, yet you (and others) continuously bash what a Muslim prophet did centuries ago before then.

Whether we like it or not, people in the past had a drastically different view on things like this. Young teenagers were pretty much treated like and considered full adults in many periods of history - they left school at 12, worked, got married, had kids. Life expectency was much shorter then too.

You may as well start slagging Winston Churchill off for being anti-Jewish, homophobic and a racist and George Washington for being a slave owner too if you're gonna judge historical figures by todays standards.

Then tell me in Britain why do we have Muslim sex gangs attacking white girls? They kidnap 13 year old girls and prostitute them, they don't do it to Asian girls. Nope, they're men who go to there mosque every week and then proceed to date rape British girls


Yes,but remember why Mosaddegh got overthrown.Because of the Army;he didn't have the full control of the army,but now a coup in Iran is as impossible as water doesn't make a piece of silk wet.

Also,i do not think Israel and US want to have the hatred of the World once again with killing civilians right?Specially Israel;maybe they are savage enough to use their nuclear weapons to kill civilians,but i do not think after that they can exist in the world comfortably;Killing civilians of a country with nuclear weapon,means proving to the world that Israel is dangerous for the world and must be destroyed.Even then,the supports of UK or US or even UN won't be useful,because a great movement of people in the world will come to destroy that country.

Hhm didn't your president call for the destruction of Israel with nuclear weapons?

[StoppingTime]

If they attack,the transgressor will be Israel and UN has to be on our side.

I can almost guarantee the UN would not side with Iran under almost any circumstance.

Israeli are ethnicaly cleansing Palestine. By forcing Arab migrations and by violence.

And I'm guessing that you're thinking, "oh, well all the 'original' Arabs and Muslims should go claim their Israeli land." In doing so, however, they'd be, as you put it, "ethically cleansing Israel" of Jews. Not too fair, hmm? Oh and in case any of you aren't aware (or simply only look at one side of the story), there are Muslims and Arabs who live, and are successful in Israel.

[Unique Physique]

Then tell me in Britain why do we have Muslim sex gangs attacking white girls? They kidnap 13 year old girls and prostitute them, they don't do it to Asian girls. Nope, they're men who go to there mosque every week and then proceed to date rape British girls

Do we? I'm very aware of the cases which have happened in Rochdale, Oxford, Liverpool etc. but I wasn't aware that it's some kind of epidemic among all Muslim men in Britain.

Is there any evidence that suggests that those vile scumbags raped and tortured those girls because they wanted to emulate their Prophet or were instructed to do so at the mosque? They drank alcohol and took drugs - both are prohibited in Islam. It doesn't sound, to me, like they were doing it to be good Muslims.

[Harry Smith]

Do we? I'm very aware of the cases which have happened in Rochdale, Oxford, Liverpool etc. but I wasn't aware that it's some kind of epidemic among all Muslim men in Britain.

Is there any evidence that suggests that those vile scumbags raped and tortured those girls because they wanted to emulate their Prophet or were instructed to do so at the mosque? They drank alcohol and took drugs - both are prohibited in Islam. It doesn't sound, to me, like they were doing it to be good Muslims.

Yes, it's being increasing. These are just simply men wanting to get laid, there is something systematic about the whole process. It wouldn't be the first time that a mosque has encouraged illegal behavior would it?

There is something about the night with Islam. You always have Muslims on TV claiming that Islam is getting perverted but surely there must be some truth in there claims, there must be some branch of Islam which encourages this.

But them it comes down to the fact that if your guiliable enough to believe something that has no evidence at all to support its existence then who knows what you would do

[Azunite]

I too want increased homosexual rights, they should be accepted into the society but you have to admit that it is an order-breaker. One must not get offended when I say order breaker, because half the things humanity made are order breakers.
The most primary function of sex is to reproduce, and same sex activity does not contribute to it.

And I must say that now you just defend the homosexuals so harshly only because you want to continue opposing Islam and try to show yourself that you are 21st century modern person and also the fact that you are an homoexual yourself.
You have to stay neutral.

[Left Now]

Then tell me in Britain why do we have Muslim sex gangs attacking white girls? They kidnap 13 year old girls and prostitute them, they don't do it to Asian girls. Nope, they're men who go to there mosque every week and then proceed to date rape British girls




Hhm didn't your president call for the destruction of Israel with nuclear weapons?

The first one;Who do you call Muslim?A man who has beard,goes to mosque every week to say his prayers?The Muslim man according to Quran and Hadith,is a person who won't steal,kill,rape and will help others and says his prayers and is kind with his wife and children,gives his wife money of al-Jize(it is the money which man should give his wife even if the wife was working)and does not accept the injustice;According to Quran,can you call them Muslims?No;This is why al-Qaeda,Taliban,Jihadists and ... do not have any place in the Islamic World and known as apostates according to Shia and Sunni scholars.

Propaganda again:Not with nuclear weapon;Destruction of Israel must be done by a great anti-war movement from all of the globe;Nuclear weapons are just foolish guns and do not have any useful consequences.

[britishboy]

The first one;Who do you call Muslim?A man who has beard,goes to mosque every week to say his prayers?The Muslim man according to Quran and Hadith,is a person who won't steal,kill,rape and will help others and says his prayers and is kind with his wife and children,gives his wife money of al-Jize(it is the money which man should give his wife even if the wife was working)and does not accept the injustice;According to Quran,can you call them Muslims?No;This is why al-Qaeda,Taliban,Jihadists and ... do not have any place in the Islamic World and known as apostates according to Shia and Sunni scholars.

Propaganda again:Not with nuclear weapon;Destruction of Israel must be done by a great anti-war movement from all of the globe;Nuclear weapons are just foolish guns and do not have any useful consequences.

Islam hangs gay men...... and Israel could be taken out in a day, you need to forget about them....

[Left Now]

Islam hangs gay men...... and Israel could be taken out in a day, you need to forget about them....

Muslims will just hang those who call themselves Muslims and are gay,not all of the gay men.

[britishboy]

Muslims will just hang those who call themselves Muslims and are gay,not all of the gay men.

Ow god, I know this is your culture but you must understand how odd and scary that is for a British guy like me, we don't even carry the death penalty

[Left Now]

Whoo!Who can prove that a person is homosexual?It needs about 4 witnesses,and also,the first time a gay or lesbian will be just lashed,also the second time,also the third time,and the fourth time they will hang him or her.We won't hang them at the first sight.
However,the punishment of being lashed can be forgiven by paying money i think.

[Stronk Serb]

Ow god, I know this is your culture but you must understand how odd and scary that is for a British guy like me, we don't even carry the death penalty


Four statements are needed, so unless 4 men saw you having sex/kissing with another guy, you are safe. If you are not Muslim, you are safe, they cannot hang you, if you are gay and Muslim, four witnesses must have seen you commiting homosexual acts, which is a very low probability unless you do it in public

[britishboy]

Four statements are needed, so unless 4 men saw you having sex/kissing with another guy, you are safe. If you are not Muslim, you are safe, they cannot hang you, if you are gay and Muslim, four witnesses must have seen you commiting homosexual acts, which is a very low probability unless you do it in public

In Britain you can kiss and hold hands in public like any other couple

[Harry Smith]

I too want increased homosexual rights, they should be accepted into the society but you have to admit that it is an order-breaker. One must not get offended when I say order breaker, because half the things humanity made are order breakers.
The most primary function of sex is to reproduce, and same sex activity does not contribute to it.

And I must say that now you just defend the homosexuals so harshly only because you want to continue opposing Islam and try to show yourself that you are 21st century modern person and also the fact that you are an homoexual yourself.
You have to stay neutral.

1) why do you assume that homosexuality has to be about sex, there is so much more to a relationship
2) If sex is so important what about sterile couples or elderly couples, should we stop them from marrying?



The first one;Who do you call Muslim?A man who has beard,goes to mosque every week to say his prayers?The Muslim man according to Quran and Hadith,is a person who won't steal,kill,rape and will help others and says his prayers and is kind with his wife and children,gives his wife money of al-Jize(it is the money which man should give his wife even if the wife was working)and does not accept the injustice;According to Quran,can you call them Muslims?No;This is why al-Qaeda,Taliban,Jihadists and ... do not have any place in the Islamic World and known as apostates according to Shia and Sunni scholars.

Propaganda again:Not with nuclear weapon;Destruction of Israel must be done by a great anti-war movement from all of the globe;Nuclear weapons are just foolish guns and do not have any useful consequences.

Then why does your country want to develop them?

Whoo!Who can prove that a person is homosexual?It needs about 4 witnesses,and also,the first time a gay or lesbian will be just lashed,also the second time,also the third time,and the fourth time they will hang him or her.We won't hang them at the first sight.
However,the punishment of being lashed can be forgiven by paying money i think.

That doesn't justify killing someone for being gay, and I love how advanced your justice system is, it sounds like something from the medieval times.

It sickens me how backwards your country is, the idea that people can't be kiss there partner in public just because some old book written by a pedophile in a cave

[Stronk Serb]

In Britain you can kiss and hold hands in public like any other couple


In Serbia legally, you can, but here are a lot of homophobes who often beat up gay people. In some studies, it has been revealed that a large percent of those people are "latent homosexuals" or something like that, meaning that they are homosexual, but due to judgements in society, they refuse to admit it and are homophobic and hate homosexuals for that.

[Left Now]

1)

Then why does your country want to develop them?



Iran wants to develop them?Are you fool?Salafits,Jihadists,Taliban and al-Qaeda are Sunni extremist groups who know killing Iranian Shias correct and deserves admiration.Why should a country develop a group which is against its people?Do not you know Iran is a Shia Islam country?Haven't you ever heard of terrorist bombings in Sistan and Baluchistan province of Iran which were organized by al-Qaeda?Or Jihadists killing Iranian Shia pilgrims in Iraq?

That doesn't justify killing someone for being gay, and I love how advanced your justice system is, it sounds like something from the medieval times.

It sickens me how backwards your country is, the idea that people can't be kiss there partner in public just because some old book written by a pedophile in a cave

Are you sure they can't?Couples can kiss and be with each other even in public but when others do not see them.Maybe your country is from stone age which in couples could even have sex with each other in public and in front of children.Our people are cultural not like stone age people who didn't know what is gentilesse.

1) why do you assume that homosexuality has to be about sex, there is so much more to a relationship
2) If sex is so important what about sterile couples or elderly couples, should we stop them from marrying?

You really know sex and love equal with each other?Love is not equal with sex,and not equal to any other sexual desires.When two men love each other it doesn't mean they are gay;me and my friend love each other and are ready to sacrifice ourselves for the other,but is it mean we have to have sex when we love each other?Foolish thing you said.
Old people and sterile couples are living with each other because of love not sex.Understand this if you can!

[Harry Smith]

Iran wants to develop them?Are you fool?Salafits,Jihadists,Taliban and al-Qaeda are Sunni extremist groups who know killing Iranian Shias correct and deserves admiration.Why should a country develop a group which is against its people?Do not you know Iran is a Shia Islam country?Haven't you ever heard of terrorist bombings in Sistan and Baluchistan province of Iran which were organized by al-Qaeda?Or Jihadists killing Iranian Shia pilgrims in Iraq?



Are you sure they can't?Couples can kiss and be with each other even in public but when others do not see them.Maybe your country is from stone age which in couples could even have sex with each other in public and in front of children.Our people are cultural not like stone age people who didn't know what is gentilesse.



You really know sex and love equal with each other?Love is not equal with sex,and not equal to any other sexual desires.When two men love each other it doesn't mean they are gay;me and my friend love each other and are ready to sacrifice ourselves for the other,but is it mean we have to have sex when we love each other?Foolish thing you said.
Old people and sterile couples are living with each other because of love not sex.Understand this if you can!

That was the point I was making... are you thick or is reading still a struggle

My point was that sex is NOT the basis of a relationship, love is. Please read my posts.

In Britain, a country which has a higher GDP than Iran you are allowed to kiss in public in front of people, we don't have to hide our self away. Your from a backwards country with non existing human rights record, don't lecture me about how Britain is from the stone age

[Rayquaza]

I'm not sure if these have been asked already but;

Why do muslims need to eat Halal meat?
Why are there no pictures or drawings of Allah and why is this?

[Left Now]

I'm not sure if these have been asked already but;

Why do muslims need to eat Halal meat?
Why are there no pictures or drawings of Allah and why is this?

Q1:Two reasons

First:We have some special unclean things in Islam:
1.Blood
2.Body of a dead person
3.Urine and Faeces
4.Sheared nails and hair
5.Dog and Pig(meat,hair,Urine,spit)
6.Rabbit's meat and urine
Halal meat is a meat which has been provided by Islamic slaughtering or Zibh.
While an animal has been slaughtered by Zibh,whole blood of the body will be drawn and then the meat will be ready to eat.

Second:Halal meat must be provided from halal animals: Pig's meat is forbidden,also Shark and carnivorous animals and birds and incests and ...

Halal meat is from sheep,cow,goat,lamb,chicken,flaked fishes and ...
This is why muslims need to eat halal meat.

Q2:According to Quran,Allah(The God)is not a material thing and related to another immortal world which we cannot see until we die(like angels,evil),so drawing a picture from God is forbidden because of this,because it means The God is mortal and has shape,which will deny its immortality.

[Magus]

Q1:Two reasons

First:We have some special unclean things in Islam:
1.Blood
2.Body of a dead person
3.Urine and Faeces
4.Sheared nails and hair
5.Dog and Pig(meat,hair,Urine,spit)
6.Rabbit's meat and urine
Halal meat is a meat which has been provided by Islamic slaughtering or Zibh.
While an animal has been slaughtered by Zibh,whole blood of the body will be drawn and then the meat will be ready to eat.

Second:Halal meat must be provided from halal animals: Pig's meat is forbidden,also Shark and carnivorous animals and birds and incests and ...

Halal meat is from sheep,cow,goat,lamb,chicken,flaked fishes and ...
This is why muslims need to eat halal meat.

Q2:According to Quran,Allah(The God)is not a material thing and related to another immortal world which we cannot see until we die(like angels,evil),so drawing a picture from God is forbidden because of this,because it means The God is mortal and has shape,which will deny its immortality.

Rabbit is Halal. Only 12ever shiites made it Haram from no reason. It has no mention in the Quran and Hadith much as Pigs and dogs did. And recently considered Makruh(not Haram) because it menstruate.

Shark meat is also halal because it is from the sea(although it doesn't lay egg), and so are shrimps and other seafood.

And there is no viable reason to eat halal.

Immortality and Shape are two different things. :)

Britain is from the stone age

If you know what I mean (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/fe/Stonehenge_Distance.jpg)

[Harry Smith]

Q2:According to Quran,Allah(The God)is not a material thing and related to another immortal world which we cannot see until we die(like angels,evil),so drawing a picture from God is forbidden because of this,because it means The God is mortal and has shape,which will deny its immortality.

That sounds very convenient, you can see him but he must exist because someone told me

[Origami]

When i heard about some useless debates about Islam in the forum,i decided to to make some clear visions about this religion

From the OP, to this current page. Guess what this thread has become!

some useless debate

[tovaris]

:yummy:That sounds very convenient, you can see him but he must exist because someone told me

That is how all religions work Islam only takes the next step of admiting it does not know how the thing looks like and therefore does not make images of it just like cristians and Jews shouldnt

[Left Now]

That sounds very convenient, you can see him but he must exist because someone told me

It is like saying a crystal clear glass doesn't exist because i cannot see it.You
have to use other senses to understand its existence.Maybe you cannot understand it with non of your 5 senses,but you still have a sixth sense and seventh sense.Sixth sense is useful for guessing and seventh sense is for divine things.I personally really believe in these two senses because i have seen a lot of things related to them.

Shark meat is also halal because it is from the sea(although it doesn't lay egg), and so are shrimps and other seafood.

Jellyfish is from the sea too;Is it halal to eat it?But yes,i have forgotten that Shark is halal,but not all of its body.shrimps is halal and also simple crabs,also lobster.

Immortality and Shape are two different things.
When you have shape,your shape will change,but God is not changeable.If God has shape,then it can change but an immortal thing will never change.
Did you get their relation with each other?

[tovaris]

It is like saying a crystal clear glass doesn't exist because i cannot see it.You
have to use other senses to understand its existence.Maybe you cannot understand it with non of your 5 senses,but you still have a sixth sense and seventh sense.Sixth sense is useful for guessing and seventh sense is for divine things.I personally really believe in these two senses because i have seen a lot of things related to them.



Jellyfish is from the sea too;Is it halal to eat it?But yes,i have forgotten that Shark is halal,but not all of its body.shrimps is halal and also simple crabs,also lobster.


When you have shape,your shape will change,but God is not changeable.If God has shape,then it can change but an immortal thing will never change.
Did you get their relation with each other?


I find it interesting that Cristians and Muslims even thow they worshipe the same good stil have conpletly diferent aproches to it.
Cristians like to make images of it a lot whole muslims will newer do that, for example.

[Snookers]

The religion (or any other in thins world) has nothing to do with anything.
The followers are those who need to be blamed. Well, not all of course, but many of them.

Why do people always have to worship someone/thing?? Why? Do we really feel the urge to be like sheep? To follow something blindly? Why can't all humans discover, ask questions and try to understand the world? Why do we always have to blame some kind of supernatural force for something we don't know??

I think the most funny thing about this world is that a person without any religious beliefs is like someone who has no personality. It's like it's necessary for someone to have a certain religion so that he/she can exist.

And also

Why do people obey these "rules" form certain bibles?
Why/how eating a certain type of meat is a sin?
or
Homosexual people need to be exterminated, yet 70+ yr olds are allowed to marry post pubescent girls.

(These are all rhetorical questions, so don't bother with them)

For me, religions will never make any sense, or why do people still follow them.

[tovaris]

The religion (or any other in thins world) has nothing to do with anything.
The followers are those who need to be blamed. Well, not all of course, but many of them.

Why do people always have to worship someone/thing?? Why? Do we really feel the urge to be like sheep? To follow something blindly? Why can't all humans discover, ask questions and try to understand the world? Why do we always have to blame some kind of supernatural force for something we don't know??

I think the most funny thing about this world is that a person without any religious beliefs is like someone who has no personality. It's like it's necessary for someone to have a certain religion so that he/she can exist.

And also

Why do people obey these "rules" form certain bibles?
Why/how eating a certain type of meat is a sin?
or
Homosexual people need to be exterminated, yet 70+ yr olds are allowed to marry post pubescent girls.

(These are all rhetorical questions, so don't bother with them)

For me, religions will never make any sense, or why do people still follow them.

It seams to be our nature to believe in something be it good or some personal belef doesnt mather what. The thimg that enojes me about religious people is that they do not think with their head butblindly folow the preast...

[Left Now]

The religion (or any other in thins world) has nothing to do with anything.
The followers are those who need to be blamed. Well, not all of course, but many of them.

Why do people always have to worship someone/thing?? Why? Do we really feel the urge to be like sheep? To follow something blindly? Why can't all humans discover, ask questions and try to understand the world? Why do we always have to blame some kind of supernatural force for something we don't know??

I think the most funny thing about this world is that a person without any religious beliefs is like someone who has no personality. It's like it's necessary for someone to have a certain religion so that he/she can exist.

And also

Why do people obey these "rules" form certain bibles?
Why/how eating a certain type of meat is a sin?
or
Homosexual people need to be exterminated, yet 70+ yr olds are allowed to marry post pubescent girls.

(These are all rhetorical questions, so don't bother with them)

For me, religions will never make any sense, or why do people still follow them.

It is your opinion;But this religion made many of the technological advances of the world!Do not forget today's Algoritm system of computers is the result of muslim mathematician researches Al-Khwarezmi.If you read his biography,then you will recognize his religion and Quran helped him in his researches.

[Origami]

I find it interesting that Cristians and Muslims even thow they worshipe the same good stil have conpletly diferent aproches to it.
Cristians like to make images of it a lot whole muslims will newer do that, for example.

The Bible says God made Adam and Eve in his image. This is why Christians can give a picture of God. And all Abrahamic religions are different, not just the Christian and Islamic faiths.

It seams to be our nature to believe in something be it good or some personal belef doesnt mather what. The thimg that enojes me about religious people is that they do not think with their head butblindly folow the preast...

I blindly follow no man. Please, don't generalize religious people so blatantly. It's no different than me saying all Atheists take every opportunity to bash religion, when not all do.

[tovaris]

The Bible says God made Adam and Eve in his image. This is why Christians can give a picture of God. And all Abrahamic religions are different, not just the Christian and Islamic faiths.



I blindly follow no man. Please, don't generalize religious people so blatantly. It's no different than me saying all Atheists take every opportunity to bash religion, when not all do.

The bibla also sais something about not worsheping idols...

I genaralise on experiance with criatians i an in contact with i dont know about the others and i dont knkw all religious people on the world but it is a widly acuring pattern.

[Origami]

The bibla also sais something about not worsheping idols...

I genaralise on experiance with criatians i an in contact with i dont know about the others and i dont knkw all religious people on the world but it is a widly acuring pattern.

Yes, but Christians don't worship portraits or the cross or any other symbol. They're not suppose to anyway.

Again, generalizing does no good. Most every Atheist I have encountered has been rude and as bigoted as the Christians they attack. I don't generalize the whole lot of them based on what others have done. It's not a matter of what religious or non-religious people do, but rather the individual themselves.

[tovaris]

Yes, but Christians don't worship portraits or the cross or any other symbol. They're not suppose to anyway.

Again, generalizing does no good. Most every Atheist I have encountered has been rude and as bigoted as the Christians they attack. I don't generalize the whole lot of them based on what others have done. It's not a matter of what religious or non-religious people do, but rather the individual themselves.

Than why do we get hords of sheep insted of humans? I blame it on religious institutions not the religion itself.

[Origami]

Than why do we get hords of sheep insted of humans? I blame it on religious institutions not the religion itself.

Because people rally together in various ways regarding their beliefs. This applies to religion as much as it would apply to a woman who is pro-abortion. When you get a leader it is very easily to not realize when your leader has gone astray from your original belief.

Yes. Religious institutions are corrupt. This is why I have not attended church in almost four years and have chosen to pursue my religious beliefs in private. But generalizing Christians is blaming them, not the institution.

[tovaris]

Because people rally together in various ways regarding their beliefs. This applies to religion as much as it would apply to a woman who is pro-abortion. When you get a leader it is very easily to not realize when your leader has gone astray from your original belief.

Yes. Religious institutions are corrupt. This is why I have not attended church in almost four years and have chosen to pursue my religious beliefs in private. But generalizing Christians is blaming them, not the institution.
http://www.virtualteen.org/forums/showthread.php?t=181452

[Harry Smith]

It is like saying a crystal clear glass doesn't exist because i cannot see it.You
have to use other senses to understand its existence.Maybe you cannot understand it with non of your 5 senses,but you still have a sixth sense and seventh sense.Sixth sense is useful for guessing and seventh sense is for divine things.I personally really believe in these two senses because i have seen a lot of things related to them.

I can feel glass, I can smash glass. I can eat glass, I can make glass. I can heat glass. I can't do any of them for god, your only evidence for god is that you can sense him.

Do you have any evidence that this god does exist?

[Stronk Serb]

I can feel glass, I can smash glass. I can eat glass, I can make glass. I can heat glass. I can't do any of them for god, your only evidence for god is that you can sense him.

Do you have any evidence that this god does exist?

You can't smell glass. :P At least while un-heated. Oh wait glass is a divine element, all hail glass! Joking. It is possible to replicate that 'feeling of a god' by using a machine and make the feeling more intensive.

[Magus]

It is like saying a crystal clear glass doesn't exist because i cannot see it.You
have to use other senses to understand its existence.Maybe you cannot understand it with non of your 5 senses,but you still have a sixth sense and seventh sense.Sixth sense is useful for guessing and seventh sense is for divine things.I personally really believe in these two senses because i have seen a lot of things related to them.

There is no such thing as sixth and seven senses. Those are bunch of hoolabaloo created by New-Ageins, and that which has absolutely no scientific bases.

We have 5 sense, and most of them are weak and flawed.

Jellyfish is from the sea too;Is it halal to eat it?If it dead, and doesn't causes venomous effect and palatable, then yes.

When you have shape,your shape will change,but God is not changeable.If God has shape,then it can change but an immortal thing will never change.
Did you get their relation with each other?

Circle is immortal. It has no ending or beginning point. There, I debunked your claim.

It is your opinion;But this religion made many of the technological advances of the world!Do not forget today's Algoritm system of computers is the result of muslim mathematician researches Al-Khwarezmi.If you read his biography,then you will recognize his religion and Quran helped him in his researches.

Hardly. Most Muslim scholars did not contribute to much, but actually did a few advances in some fields based on older researches.

And do you think they did that because they were Muslims, they were able to do that? I don't think so. Religion has absolutely nothing to do with scientific advancements.

If so indeed, then why aren't there Muslim scientist now? Or, are they busy wondering which is halal and which clothes they shouldn't wear?

[Stronk Serb]

There is no such thing as sixth and seven senses. Those are bunch of hoolabaloo created by New-Ageins, and that which has absolutely no scientific bases.

We have 5 sense, and most of them are weak and flawed.

If it dead, and doesn't causes venomous effect and palatable, then yes.



Circle is immortal. It has no ending or beginning point. There, I debunked your claim.



Hardly. Most Muslim scholars did not contribute to much, but actually did a few advances in some fields based on older researches.

And do you think they did that because they were Muslims, they were able to do that? I don't think so. Religion has absolutely nothing to do with scientific advancements.

If so indeed, then why aren't there Muslim scientist now? Or, are they busy wondering which is halal and which clothes they shouldn't wear?


I think Islam allowed them to do research, since in the Christian world in that era, you would get lashed to a cross and burned on a pyre for doing scientific research.

[Magus]

I think Islam allowed them to do research, since in the Christian world in that era, you would get lashed to a cross and burned on a pyre for doing scientific research.

Even during Islamic period, those who did research got a lot of backlash and criticism too.

Astronomers were called Astrologers. Chemist were called magicians.

But those periods were kinda lax in the so called Islamic world, to the point Homosexuality wasn't looked down upon.

[Left Now]

Circle is immortal. It has no ending or beginning point. There, I debunked your claim.

Circle is not immortal,it has an end like other geological shapes,because it has been made from a lot of squares.Do not you remember the Pi number?Also,it is completely changeable.Circle will be an oval shape if you make its radian unbalanced.Another shape right?So it is not immortal

Astronomers were called Astrologers. Chemist were called magicians.

Ha?Chemist magicians?Chemists were called Al-Kimist not magician.Al-Kimist comes from the word Al-Kimia(A knowledge which was for making Gold from other metals with chemical materials not magic in Greece but changed into the knowledge of changing natural materials into chemical materials in Islamic World) or in Latin Al-chemy.Al-Kimists were very respectful in Islamic Society,like mathematicians and physicians.

Astrologers were called Tale'-bin(soothsayer in Kings' palaces)astronomers were called Monajjems(A person who will study stars and sun with his mathematical knowledge).

Astrologers were not Astronomers,they were completely different;Sometimes an astrologer wanted help from a monajjem and then he would give him his knowledge about the positions of stars and their positions in the future.Astronomers were very respectful between people and nobles of an Islamic Society;For example one of them Qias-al-Din Jamshid Kashani,the writer of book "Sollam-al-Sama" or "Ladder of the Sky"

Hardly. Most Muslim scholars did not contribute to much, but actually did a few advances in some fields based on older researches.

And do you think they did that because they were Muslims, they were able to do that? I don't think so. Religion has absolutely nothing to do with scientific advancements.

If so indeed, then why aren't there Muslim scientist now? Or, are they busy wondering which is halal and which clothes they shouldn't wear?

Few advances?The Islamic books which was looted during the Crusades were the sources of information for Renaissance scientists and modern ages of technology.Islamic Scholars were the main rivals of European scientists until 1740.Sheik Bahaei was one of the best Muslim scientists in 17th century do not you remember him?

The invasion of European countries(The Europe advanced in making guns and better weapons during the Renaissance,while Islamic Countries advanced in medical fields and architecture and space math)is the main reason why now Muslims have less scientists.

UK,France and Russia during 1750-1800 destroyed math and Fiq'h schools in India,Afghanistan,Iran,Egypt,Morocco,Algiers and Ottoman Empire,then they killed or assassinated Islamic scholars and stole their books.

Also,we still have Muslimgreat scientists in the world.Who said we have few?The muslims scientists who are not secular and won noble prizes.

You can't smell glass. :P At least while un-heated. Oh wait glass is a divine element, all hail glass! Joking. It is possible to replicate that 'feeling of a god' by using a machine and make the feeling more intensive.

Hey!Do not Insult my senses,I can smell glass even without heating!(Kidding)
But seriously,i can smell glass.Maybe it is strange but the sixth sense helps to smell it;I tested it many times and i made my classmates surprised with it!

[Stronk Serb]

Hey!Do not Insult my senses,I can smell glass even without heating!(Kidding)
But seriously,i can smell glass.Maybe it is strange but the sixth sense helps to smell it;I tested it many times and i made my classmates surprised with it!


It might have a weak smell which my nose cannot pick up and process.

[Left Now]

It might have a weak smell which my nose cannot pick up and process.

Maybe,it has a smell like stone?Have you ever smell stone?

[Stronk Serb]

Maybe,it has a smell like stone?Have you ever smell stone?


Yes. This debate turned from Islam to how glass smells. >.>

[britishboy]

Glass doesn't smell?:p it might be something on the glass you can smell?:p

[Left Now]

Glass doesn't smell?:p it might be something on the glass you can smell?:p

I can smell different glasses.But yes you are right!Maybe there were somethings on them...

Haha!Get back to topic!

[Harry Smith]

Hey!Do not Insult my senses,I can smell glass even without heating!(Kidding)
But seriously,i can smell glass.Maybe it is strange but the sixth sense helps to smell it;I tested it many times and i made my classmates surprised with it!

bollocks, if you can smell glass then what does your god smell of?

[Left Now]

bollocks, if you can smell glass then what does your god smell of?

Nothing.What does your thinking smell of?Can you hear your thinking?Can you sight your thinking?Can you touch your thinking?Can you test your thinking?...
Oh!So you do not think because it doesn't exist in material world.

[Harry Smith]

Nothing.What does your thinking smell of?Can you hear your thinking?Can you sight your thinking?Can you touch your thinking?Can you test your thinking?...
Oh!So you do not think because it doesn't exist in material world.

Thinking can be monitored in the material world by a CP scan and different stimuli can be shown, and then your brain activity can be detected. So yes it can be seen

[Left Now]

Thinking can be monitored in the material world by a CP scan and different stimuli can be shown, and then your brain activity can be detected. So yes it can be seen

Detected,it is brain work!But can you really hear the sounds and see pics in your memories and dreams in real material world?Over 30 strong scientists since 100 years ago,have tried to bring pictures of dreams on monitor or at least their sounds on a computer program!But they couldn't.They couldn't because it was something out of reach point of their knowledge!But an Indian ascetic can do this very easily.Without any science or scientific works,just with his own special senses.

[britishboy]

Alright, no religion has a god you can smell and harry your being really offensive, and yes broken pen let's please get back on topic,
what's the difference between the two types of Muslims? And why do they hate each other?

[Left Now]

Alright, no religion has a god you can smell and harry your being really offensive, and yes broken pen let's please get back on topic,
what's the difference between the two types of Muslims? And why do they hate each other?

We have two major groups of Muslims:Sunni,Shia;No they do not hate each other,they just have some differences in minor beliefs.We even have a week in Iran in the name of Week of Unity,in which we will show our respects to each other.
We have some minor heretical sects in Sunni Islam which know killing Shias allowed and deserves appreciation;Like Va'habis(in al-Qaeda group),Salafi Jihadists(in al-Qaeda,Taliban),Takfiris(in al-Qaeda,Jund allah group).All of this groups are supported by Saudi Arabia,financially and military.Saudi Arabia is a great supporter of Va'habism.

[Harry Smith]

Alright, no religion has a god you can smell and harry your being really offensive, and yes broken pen let's please get back on topic,
what's the difference between the two types of Muslims? And why do they hate each other?

hwo the fuck am I being offensive?

Also please stop backseat modding, I see a lack of green on your name

[britishboy]

hwo the fuck am I being offensive?

Also please stop backseat modding, I see a lack of green on your name

okay im not a mod so lets all talk off topic? its being responsible and mature and heres the quotes:
Then tell me in Britain why do we have Muslim sex gangs attacking white girls? They kidnap 13 year old girls and prostitute them, they don't do it to Asian girls. Nope, they're men who go to there mosque every week and then proceed to date rape British girls



this is horrible stereotyping and you have in the past called prophet Mohamed a pedophile and refered to the Islamic god as 'the man in the sky' I can not find these quotes however im sure broken pen will conferm that you have said these things

[Harry Smith]

okay im not a mod so lets all talk off topic? its being responsible and mature and heres the quotes:

Lool yeah sure you're responsible,it's not your job to tell people what to post on this forum, it's not even my job. If a mod feels it's going off topic they can step in, I was talking about the Religion of Islam that's not of topic. It's not your job to moderate the forum.

this is horrible stereotyping and you have in the past called prophet Mohamed a pedophile and refered to the Islamic god as 'the man in the sky' I can not find these quotes however im sure broken pen will conferm that you have said these things


Lool yeah sure you're responsible,it's not your job to tell people what to post on this forum, it's not even my job. If a mod feels it's going off topic they can step in, I was talking about the Religion of Islam that's not of topic. It's not your job to moderate the forum.


1)He was, he had sex with an 11 year old girl... by definition pedophilia is the attraction to girls before they reach puberty

2) How is that offensive, there is no proof that he even exits. That's a fact

[Left Now]

Lool yeah sure you're responsible,it's not your job to tell people what to post on this forum, it's not even my job. If a mod feels it's going off topic they can step in, I was talking about the Religion of Islam that's not of topic. It's not your job to moderate the forum.


1)He was, he had sex with an 11 year old girl... by definition pedophilia is the attraction to girls before they reach puberty

2) How is that offensive, there is no proof that he even exits. That's a fact

Over thirty Jewish history books will confirm that he existed.He was a merchant and a politician and a commander.Also,if it wasn't necessary,he wouldn't even marry Aisha even if she was 20,because Abu-bakr suggested his daughter to marry him because of the unity of arabic tribes against polytheists of Mecca.He was not attracted to her;also,puberty for girls will begin in 10-11 according to biology.

[Stronk Serb]

Lool yeah sure you're responsible,it's not your job to tell people what to post on this forum, it's not even my job. If a mod feels it's going off topic they can step in, I was talking about the Religion of Islam that's not of topic. It's not your job to moderate the forum.


1)He was, he had sex with an 11 year old girl... by definition pedophilia is the attraction to girls before they reach puberty

2) How is that offensive, there is no proof that he even exits. That's a fact

1) Just like many other rulers in that time. Yes, by today's standards they are all pedophiles.

2) Do not take Jack's advice on what is offensive, since he is very offensive in many cases.

And I agree with you, this is on topic since it is about Islam.

[Harry Smith]

Over thirty Jewish history books will confirm that he existed.He was a merchant and a politician and a commander.Also,if it wasn't necessary,he wouldn't even marry Aisha even if she was 20,because Abu-bakr suggested his daughter to marry him because of the unity of arabic tribes against polytheists of Mecca.He was not attracted to her;also,puberty for girls will begin in 10-11 according to biology.

I'm not denieing the existant of Mohammed, I'm denying the existence of Allah.

So then if you sleep with a girl who is 11 that's perfectly fine?

I thought I would put this up here

''A medical diagnosis, pedophilia or paedophilia is a psychiatric disorder in persons 16 years of age or older typically characterized by a primary or exclusive sexual interest toward prepubescent children (generally age 11 years or younger, though specific diagnosis criteria for the disorder extends the cut-off point for prepubescence to age 13''

I wasn't wrong in saying he was pedophile was I?

[Left Now]

I'm not denieing the existant of Mohammed, I'm denying the existence of Allah.

So then if you sleep with a girl who is 11 that's perfectly fine?

I thought I would put this up here

''A medical diagnosis, pedophilia or paedophilia is a psychiatric disorder in persons 16 years of age or older typically characterized by a primary or exclusive sexual interest toward prepubescent children (generally age 11 years or younger, though specific diagnosis criteria for the disorder extends the cut-off point for prepubescence to age 13''

I wasn't wrong in saying he was pedophile was I?

No,you are right,but as i said,there were no attraction,it was something necessary for preventing a war happen.Also,if you take a look on "Life of Aisha" book,you will recognize that Aisha tried to convince Muhammad to have a baby from her;In Jewish book of "Monotheistic in Arabia" 1302 AC,you will read it too.

[Harry Smith]

No,you are right,but as i said,there were no attraction,it was something necessary for preventing a war happen.Also,if you take a look on "Life of Aisha" book,you will recognize that Aisha tried to convince Muhammad to have a baby from her;In Jewish book of "Monotheistic in Arabia" 1302 AC,you will read it too.

Damn women trying to convince a 50 year old man to have her baby, how could she?

[Left Now]

Damn women trying to convince a 50 year old man to have her baby, how could she?

It was not because of sexual desire,If Muhammad had a baby from Aisha,then polytheist part of Aisha's tribe,was required to not attack Muhammad's monotheist Bani-Hashim tribe.They just didn't want people to die because of Mecca army attacks.

[Magus]

No,you are right,but as i said,there were no attraction,it was something necessary for preventing a war happen.Also,if you take a look on "Life of Aisha" book,you will recognize that Aisha tried to convince Muhammad to have a baby from her;In Jewish book of "Monotheistic in Arabia" 1302 AC,you will read it too.

Aisha is the daughter of Abu-Bakr. Abu Bakr Al Siddiq is a friend of the Prophet Mohammad.

I don't know what sources you are reading. Her marriage to Mohammad is not out of necessity to prevent tribal wars - as both her father and Mohammad were of the same tribe.

Mohammad married her when she was six, and consummate the marriage when she was nine.

I don't think it is a good example for anyone to marry a six year old, when you are 50 years old.

[Left Now]

Aisha is the daughter of Abu-Bakr. Abu Bakr Al Siddiq is a friend of the Prophet Mohammad.

I don't know what sources you are reading. Her marriage to Mohammad is not out of necessity to prevent tribal wars - as both her father and Mohammad were of the same tribe.

Mohammad married her when she was six, and consummate the marriage when she was nine.

I don't think it is a good example for anyone to marry a six year old, when you are 50 years old.

My sources are history of Ahl-Sunna and Nahj-al Balaghe and History of tribal wars in Islam,Islam before attacking Persia,Relations between Persia and Islam,Muhammad the Murder,Muhammad the Honest,A Biography on Prophet's Life.Aisha married him when she was 7,went to his house when she was 9,gave birth when she was 12-13.Also,that year was Am-al-Hozn(Year of Sadness).Muhammad lost his uncle and recently his first wife(Lady Khadija)his only supporters;Muhammad and Abu-Bakr were in the same major tribe(Quraish) but not in the same branches and minor tribes.

Muhammad was in branch of Bani-Hashim but Abu-Bakr was in Bani-Taim.The Bani-Taim tribe promised to support Muhammad,but if only Muhammad choose a wife from their tribe;Abu-Bakr was the closest person to Muhammad in Bani-Taim tribe,so suggested him to choose his daughter.Read the History of Tabari or "History of Prophets and Kings"