New LD resolution, and America as a world power

[Hauptmann Kauffman]

The new LD res. has to do with the US preventing the acquisition of nuclear weapons by countries that pose a military threat. And This got me thinking. Couldnt we say that the US is THE major threat to other countries in the world today? We have the best military, the most nuclear weapons, and we completely disregard other nations opinions on most subjects (For example, the UN opposed the Iraq war, we are supposed to get approval). So cant we say that the US is really the dangerous power? That Bush IS the molevelant dictator? I can elaborate more later...

[Hyper]

Oeh.. Never ceases to amaze me how slowly people think

EDIT: Hmm, yet even doing so they happen upon some major flaws.. Though I can understand that since you're just starting to open your eyes

I've got nothing more to say on this.. Not in the mood to argue with some American ''patriot'' and get bashed by another 40 of them.

But you should look at one of your last sentences and go on from there, though I wouldn't suggest it.. Could ruin the beatiful dream that the world is a democracy and so on and on.. ( Don't mind me.. Just reading the news so I am pessimistc... )

[Hauptmann Kauffman]

Well, it would be nice for you to elaborate, so there could be some good arguments here. And I hope you weren't referring to me as an American patriot. I personally believe the US is a big man with a big club and a small brain. Lots of power, influence, but fucks everything up, even when it tries to do good. Perhaps we WERE once a great protector of freedom, etc. etc. , but now we obviously have/are straying from those original ideals, and now America is more of a hinderance to the world then a help, or "savior".

[archangel]

The new LD res. has to do with the US preventing the acquisition of nuclear weapons by countries that pose a military threat. And This got me thinking. Couldnt we say that the US is THE major threat to other countries in the world today? We have the best military, the most nuclear weapons, and we completely disregard other nations opinions on most subjects (For example, the UN opposed the Iraq war, we are supposed to get approval). So cant we say that the US is really the dangerous power? That Bush IS the molevelant dictator? I can elaborate more later...

Hey Rtas, yeah i got that same LD resolution from my coach this week too. It is a very interesting topic. And on your idea about portraying America as the evil power because we have the most nukes and best military is either gonna hit very well, or sink in the water. Unless your judge is a communist like "Kolte" or not an American, you will lose. I would easily shoot down your debate with points on how America has already lessened our Nuclear Arsenal after the Cold War. Also that we have a very long process of checks and balances before any major and influential military action can be approved. Rogue nations with nuclear weapons have no such constraints. Therefore I must urge an Affirmative ballot. Thankyou.

[*Dissident*]

I refuse to say the pledge of alligence for a reason. I refuse to lower my hat at ball games for a reason. Some say its disrespect. Im sure they are right. But thats not why i do it. I do it because I cannot support the american flag any longer. Archangel will hate me for it, will give me some patriotic rant on how I am an evil communist baby killing faggot, but really, Im just fed up with America. I have the right to my opinion (for how much longer is unclear) and I choose to use it.

Our nuclear arsenal is hardly diminished enough to make any difference. If we really had an effective system of checks and balances, we would never have gone to Iraq. why would be trying (most of the united states is, at any rate) to leave iraq? why is a timetable a major issue in the '08 elections? why are so many people angry at Bush?! BECAUSE HE'S NOT LISTENING TO US. he is doing his own thing with little to no regaurd for the will of America or the lives of the soldiers and civilians that the war is costing.

In general I am not very good about vocalizing my views. Anthony, in my personal forum, did a great job at it and I agree with most everything he said, and wish I could say it just as well. But I cant. And there really isnt much use arguing with anyone here. We all have our opinions that we think are infallible and morally correct, and we will refuse to change them. there is no winning because there is no contest. whatever.

[archangel]

LOL ok first off you just like said that debate is useless. I agree, but its fun :).

"I refuse to say the pledge of alligence for a reason. I refuse to lower my hat at ball games for a reason. Some say its disrespect. Im sure they are right. But thats not why i do it. I do it because I cannot support the american flag any longer. Archangel will hate me for it, will give me some patriotic rant on how I am an evil communist baby killing faggot, but really, Im just fed up with America. I have the right to my opinion (for how much longer is unclear) and I choose to use it."
That first paragraph actually made me laugh! hahahahahaha the best part is the 'for how much longer is unclear'... hahaha im totally serious that was funny. Now to the real points:

Actually, if you go and account for your congress, there was overwhelming support for the Iraq war resolution.

How do you know how much our nuclear aresenal has been diminished? You dont know.

By blatantly pissing on the American way of life by choosing (within your rights) to not pay respects to our flag, you have essentially said that you disagree with the Constitution and everything America has stood for in the past 200+ years. So tell me, according to you, America has never made this world better once in her entire history?

If you are so concerned about the lives of our soldiers, then pay the respect they are due by saying the Pledge and removing your cap for the star spangled banner.

Last point. "Fed up with America"? Then leave. Make it all the better for the rest of us.

(in no way am i personally attacking you, this has nothing to do with you, im sure you are a great guy etc, i just like to employ certain shady debate tactics :) )

[Hauptmann Kauffman]

I have got to say, I say the pledge of allegiance, and I have to disagree with you Dissident on that. I say the pledge because It represents what America stands for, not what It currently is. The governments come and go, good and bad, but the IDEAL, of a good and just America, is why I say that pledge. I am pledging myself to the IDEALS, not the government, and I find ta very powerful experiance to pledge myself to those ideals of peace and freedom.

Now back to Archangel's argument. I will be looking at this from the rest of the worlds point of view, not an American point of view. We have barely tapped into our arsenal of nuclear weapons, we can still destroy the world many times over with our arsenal.

Yes, we have a certain system of checks and balances, but those dont always work, and even If they do, we also need to repsect the UN, which we obviously havent been doing. (IE, Iraq invasion)

If we do not follow the wishes of the UN, and think of everyone, we lower ourselves to the level of these rogue nations, and to the rest of the world, we BECOME one of these rogue nations.

Vote Neg! :P

[archangel]

(nothing against you) But if i had a Cross Examination with you i would ask "Why do you hate America?" also, this is Lincoln Douglas debate, not model united Nations. This is an American issue, dont go scrounging up support from the random thoughts of third world countries!
Thanks and i urge an Aff ballot.

[Hauptmann Kauffman]

haha, I love America, but hate its government, and what It is doing. And we are discussing interfering with other countries in the world, which brings the UN into consideration. Its a world issue, not a national one.

[archangel]

But we still must value the united states over the considerations of small third world countries

[Whisper]

America does whatever the hell it wants
It obeys international laws only while they remain convenient
It demands of others what it would never hold to itself
One of the reasons it has severe issues with its international reputation

[Octo22]

This is an American issue, dont go scrounging up support from the random thoughts of third world countries!

You've already lost your argument. Americans fucking with THE WORLD isn't just up to the Americans. The world should have a say, no? Oh wait! Speaking for them? True American way I guess ;)

Also, the real reason you've lost this argument.

U.N. = third world to you? DO SOME RESEARCH.

Let's see, almost every nation is a part of it, and not everyone apart from you is third world. Also if you consider only the MAJOR countries in the United Nations...hmm...Russia, England, France, China, Canada....need we continue?