syria has used chemical weapons, what next?

[britishboy]

syria has used chemical weapons according to the french, what next? should we get involved? and heres my source to stop arguments
www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-22773268

[Stronk Serb]

Same thing which was used as an excuse to invade Iraq. Foreign intelligence. Some rebel factions are using them. Leave them be and see what will happen. For the US it is a repeating pattern. Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya and now Syria. What did those countries have in common? Oil and a dictator regime, perfect for causing a war.

[tovaris]

Rumers circulate that chemical wepons have been used on all sides.
No mather how you look at it it is stila civil war not to be medled in by foreighn powers. We as the world may merly try to mediate the sides to a diplomatica agrement.

[Sugaree]

Same thing which was used as an excuse to invade Iraq. Foreign intelligence. Some rebel factions are using them. Leave them be and see what will happen. For the US it is a repeating pattern. Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya and now Syria. What did those countries have in common? Oil and a dictator regime, perfect for causing a war.

Hurr west is bad durr USA evil hurp de durp

Seriously, do you know how you sound? I didn't agree with Iraq, Afghanistan, or Libya either; but Syrian civilians are being killed every day just because they decide to cross the street. If the Syrian regime is using chemical weapons, it can't be tolerated.

[Stronk Serb]

Hurr west is bad durr USA evil hurp de durp

Seriously, do you know how you sound? I didn't agree with Iraq, Afghanistan, or Libya either; but Syrian civilians are being killed every day just because they decide to cross the street. If the Syrian regime is using chemical weapons, it can't be tolerated.

Better send non-NATO-related UN observers to check it out. In Iraq there were alleged rumours of CW, but were not found, yet the infrastructurebhas been drastically changed and Iraq became a US puppet state. I have reasons to doubt.

[britishboy]

Better send non-NATO-related UN observers to check it out. In Iraq there were alleged rumours of CW, but were not found, yet the infrastructurebhas been drastically changed and Iraq became a US puppet state. I have reasons to doubt.

civilians shouldnt be randomly killed, forget the politics put yourself in there situation

[Stronk Serb]

civilians shouldnt be randomly killed, forget the politics put yourself in there situation

But what if chemical weapons aren't used? Deliver humanitarian aid and doctors to civilians in all contessed territories. You will see from the wounds if chemical weapons are used, plus you wil treat those who are unfortunate enough to be in the thick of it.

[Pinkamena]

But what if chemical weapons aren't used? Deliver humanitarian aid and doctors to civilians in all contessed territories. You will see from the wounds if chemical weapons are used, plus you wil treat those who are unfortunate enough to be in the thick of it.

The biggest problem with that, is that the US Gov't is looking to extend their sphere of influence into the middle east (Which has mostly failed to a degree up until now), and Syria is a ripe country for neo-colonialism.
Syrian society has completely collapsed.
The bad thing is that, if the rebels win, not much will change. The only way to make the country peaceful again, was if they were tyrannical, and you see where that got them in the first place.

Personally, I hope the UN does not allow further foreign intervention. I'm rooting for Assad.

[britishboy]

But what if chemical weapons aren't used? Deliver humanitarian aid and doctors to civilians in all contessed territories. You will see from the wounds if chemical weapons are used, plus you wil treat those who are unfortunate enough to be in the thick of it.

I think they have, but if you ask me we should take out the government and remove the rebels, they have both commited war crimes and neither side should be supported, and the french and un observers have dna and video samples/footage and have proven positive for the chemical weapons and conferm on one count it was defently from the government but the uk and usa still want more evidence as they are still nervous about a repeat of iraq. whats your opinion on this?

[tovaris]

The biggest problem with that, is that the US Gov't is looking to extend their sphere of influence into the middle east (Which has mostly failed to a degree up until now), and Syria is a ripe country for neo-colonialism.
Syrian society has completely collapsed.
The bad thing is that, if the rebels win, not much will change. The only way to make the country peaceful again, was if they were tyrannical, and you see where that got them in the first place.

Personally, I hope the UN does not allow further foreign intervention. I'm rooting for Assad.

yes tyrany was/is a way to ieep such a unnatural country of unrelated nations, tribes and religiins; but perhaps the answer is in giving all the diferent parts and regions independance, that way they will be out of echothers way.

[Stronk Serb]

I think they have, but if you ask me we should take out the government and remove the rebels, they have both commited war crimes and neither side should be supported, and the french and un observers have dna and video samples/footage and have proven positive for the chemical weapons and conferm on one count it was defently from the government but the uk and usa still want more evidence as they are still nervous about a repeat of iraq. whats your opinion on this?

Middle eastern interventions= More unstable countries. In Middle Eastern thing, better to let them kill eachother and the survivors should form a new better society. No foreign military interventions and that's it.

[Pinkamena]

yes tyrany was/is a way to ieep such a unnatural country of unrelated nations, tribes and religiins; but perhaps the answer is in giving all the diferent parts and regions independance, that way they will be out of echothers way.

Balkanization is not an awful idea, however it leads to the core nation becoming less powerful, and the leaders of said country typically don't desire that.

[Left Now]

Assad is winning.He doesn't need to use chemical weapons.Also,it was a really easier way to get rid of rebels than fighting them city by city,house by house.
Assad could bomb rebels with planes but he didn't,so now is this right to tell he used chemical weapons.Also,there was a video which showed that Salafit rebels are using some mass killing weapons from Turkey.I think leaving Syria and Middle East alone is more better.Also,if there would be a war in Syria because of foreign intervention,the intervening nations will fail i think.

[tovaris]

Balkanization is not an awful idea, however it leads to the core nation becoming less powerful, and the leaders of said country typically don't desire that.

Who ever asked them anything. This is for the people to decide, do they want to lieve in a fake country created by the colonial powers or a country of their own narion. A confederation would also be a good choice. Jet this is stil the nations choice not to be medled in by foreighners.

[britishboy]

Middle eastern interventions= More unstable countries. In Middle Eastern thing, better to let them kill eachother and the survivors should form a new better society. No foreign military interventions and that's it.

have you herd of the war crimes against children? powerful countries have a responsibility to stop this

[Left Now]

have you herd of the war crimes against children? powerful countries have a responsibility to stop this

Dude,they themselves have done it in Iraq and Afghanistan.If you really want to help Syrian people,help them to get rid of Salafit rebels,then they can have an election.Unless the rebels are there,there won't be anything better than now,or maybe it would be even worse.

[Harry Smith]

Same thing which was used as an excuse to invade Iraq. Foreign intelligence. Some rebel factions are using them. Leave them be and see what will happen. For the US it is a repeating pattern. Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya and now Syria. What did those countries have in common? Oil and a dictator regime, perfect for causing a war.

Did you hear about that new oil pipline, thanks to Tony Blair and the Iraq war I can now get oil sent directly to my front door through a pipe...

it's not to do with oil, we've been buying our oil from the middle east. We have no reason to steal it, going in there doesn't mean we can simply pump it out. Iraq wasn't to do with Oil, neither is Libya

Rumers circulate that chemical wepons have been used on all sides.
No mather how you look at it it is stila civil war not to be medled in by foreighn powers. We as the world may merly try to mediate the sides to a diplomatica agrement.

That's not going to happen, Assad is going to want to stay in power. You sound like the people who were present at Munich. You can't justify war crimes.

Better send non-NATO-related UN observers to check it out. In Iraq there were alleged rumours of CW, but were not found, yet the infrastructurebhas been drastically changed and Iraq became a US puppet state. I have reasons to doubt.

1)They sent in the peacekeepers last year, they got shot the hell out of. They had to withdraw due to the fact they're just policemen in blue helmets, they lack heavy weaponry to defend them-self. The UN has failed here.

2)Chemical weapons where in fact found in Iraq, mustard gas to be precise. Even though it was common knowledge that Saddam gassed his own people.

3) Iraq isn't a puppet state, they have free democratic elections.

Middle eastern interventions= More unstable countries. In Middle Eastern thing, better to let them kill eachother and the survivors should form a new better society. No foreign military interventions and that's it.

oh yeah that's real smart. I wish the British said that in WW2, oh sure let the SS shot the innocent women, the Germans will make a better society afterwards. You can simply watch and let people die. I thought you lot in the Balkans understood the reality of war

[tovaris]

ups . .

[tovaris]

Did you hear about that new oil pipline, thanks to Tony Blair and the Iraq war I can now get oil sent directly to my front door through a pipe...

it's not to do with oil, we've been buying our oil from the middle east. We have no reason to steal it, going in there doesn't mean we can simply pump it out. Iraq wasn't to do with Oil, neither is Libya



That's not going to happen, Assad is going to want to stay in power. You sound like the people who were present at Munich. You can't justify war crimes.



1)They sent in the peacekeepers last year, they got shot the hell out of. They had to withdraw due to the fact they're just policemen in blue helmets, they lack heavy weaponry to defend them-self. The UN has failed here.

2)Chemical weapons where in fact found in Iraq, mustard gas to be precise. Even though it was common knowledge that Saddam gassed his own people.

3) Iraq isn't a puppet state, they have free democratic elections.



oh yeah that's real smart. I wish the British said that in WW2, oh sure let the SS shot the innocent women, the Germans will make a better society afterwards. You can simply watch and let people die. I thought you lot in the Balkans understood the reality of war

Libia? (http://goo.gl/iLTUz)

Wheel than let the people take him out. Foreign intervention will only make things worse.

It is a historical fact that there were no weapons of mass destructions.

Anyone with a ounce of salt understands that foreign intervention only makes things worse.
And your people didn't go to WWII because human rights were being violated, if that was the case they would have declared it much earlier...

[Stronk Serb]

Did you hear about that new oil pipline, thanks to Tony Blair and the Iraq war I can now get oil sent directly to my front door through a pipe...

it's not to do with oil, we've been buying our oil from the middle east. We have no reason to steal it, going in there doesn't mean we can simply pump it out. Iraq wasn't to do with Oil, neither is Libya



That's not going to happen, Assad is going to want to stay in power. You sound like the people who were present at Munich. You can't justify war crimes.



1)They sent in the peacekeepers last year, they got shot the hell out of. They had to withdraw due to the fact they're just policemen in blue helmets, they lack heavy weaponry to defend them-self. The UN has failed here.

2)Chemical weapons where in fact found in Iraq, mustard gas to be precise. Even though it was common knowledge that Saddam gassed his own people.

3) Iraq isn't a puppet state, they have free democratic elections.



oh yeah that's real smart. I wish the British said that in WW2, oh sure let the SS shot the innocent women, the Germans will make a better society afterwards. You can simply watch and let people die. I thought you lot in the Balkans understood the reality of war

During the last invasion of Iraq there were no usable chemical weapons.
Iraq is a puppet state. Just because they have free elections does not mean it is used by the US to further their own agenda and spread influence to the Middle East.

You were doing nothing during '43-'44 in Yugoslavia. For every dead German, 100 Serbian civilians were shot, for every wounded, 50. You bombed Belgrade which resulted in massive civilian casualties and has not weakened the Germans' hold of the city.

Both loyalists and some rebel factions used chemical weapons. You cannot support neither side, either swoop in and take the both sides out and let the surviving civilians do what they want, without foreign military presence, or just don't do anything.

[Harry Smith]

Libia? (http://goo.gl/iLTUz)

Wheel than let the people take him out. Foreign intervention will only make things worse.

It is a historical fact that there were no weapons of mass destructions.

Anyone with a ounce of salt understands that foreign intervention only makes things worse.
And your people didn't go to WWII because human rights were being violated, if that was the case they would have declared it much earlier...

Ounce of salt? Wow. I never said we went to war for human rights did I... I said that it showed where foreign powers ( Britain and France) stepped in to help Poland.

How exactly are the people going to take him out when they're getting gassed and bombed, women and children are getting gassed and bombed. You can't expect them to try and take on an Army

During the last invasion of Iraq there were no usable chemical weapons.
Iraq is a puppet state. Just because they have free elections does not mean it is used by the US to further their own agenda and spread influence to the Middle East.

You were doing nothing during '43-'44 in Yugoslavia. For every dead German, 100 Serbian civilians were shot, for every wounded, 50. You bombed Belgrade which resulted in massive civilian casualties and has not weakened the Germans' hold of the city.

Both loyalists and some rebel factions used chemical weapons. You cannot support neither side, either swoop in and take the both sides out and let the surviving civilians do what they want, without foreign military presence, or just don't do anything.

I've always said that the best option is a no fly zone, and then allow the UN to go in. Because this no fly zone allows the movement of aid and people into the country. We need to protect the civilans.

Also back to WW2, I believe we're already at war with Germany, unlike Yugoslavia I believe we always fought them. We didn't side with the Nazis, your king did.

And Did nothing? How did the Serbians get those sten guns again? Do you really think you were the only country who had to face the Nazis. We were dropping agents across Europe to help, we tried are best but we were a bit busy fighting the Germans. Don't make it out that we did nothing, we send supplies, partisians and commando raids. I know you hate the west but we were on the same side

[tovaris]

Ounce of salt? Wow. I never said we went to war for human rights did I... I said that it showed where foreign powers ( Britain and France) stepped in to help Poland.

How exactly are the people going to take him out when they're getting gassed and bombed, women and children are getting gassed and bombed. You can't expect them to try and take on an Army



I've always said that the best option is a no fly zone, and then allow the UN to go in. Because this no fly zone allows the movement of aid and people into the country. We need to protect the civilans.

Also back to WW2, I believe we're already at war with Germany, unlike Yugoslavia I believe we always fought them. We didn't side with the Nazis, your king did.

And Did nothing? How did the Serbians get those sten guns again? Do you really think you were the only country who had to face the Nazis. We were dropping agents across Europe to help, we tried are best but we were a bit busy fighting the Germans. Don't make it out that we did nothing, we send supplies, partisians and commando raids. I know you hate the west but we were on the same side

Aha declere war on Germany because you have to than stay put and hope they dont atack...
The king signed nothing, he did side with the germand thiw but the people made that vorthles and later on got rid of the king in a democratic way (unlike the british or the french we did not kil ourr ex king we only banished him).
Oh yes about those agents, they were instructed first to side with Mihajlović, and then we only got some agents who changed nothing since no one foreighn agent can replace a single domastic solder.

Anywhoo... Back to the arab world...
The paople are mor powerfull than any dictator, army, plane, king, car, capitalist, etc; the people can do anithing even overfrow Asad. The people are winning mor and mor over the arab world look at Edipt, Libia... Do Not underastemate the nations of the World.

[Harry Smith]

Aha declere war on Germany because you have to than stay put and hope they dont atack...
The king signed nothing, he did side with the germand thiw but the people made that vorthles and later on got rid of the king in a democratic way (unlike the british or the french we did not kil ourr ex king we only banished him).
Oh yes about those agents, they were instructed first to side with Mihajlović, and then we only got some agents who changed nothing since no one foreighn agent can replace a single domastic solder.

Anywhoo... Back to the arab world...
The paople are mor powerfull than any dictator, army, plane, king, car, capitalist, etc; the people can do anithing even overfrow Asad. The people are winning mor and mor over the arab world look at Edipt, Libia... Do Not underastemate the nations of the World.

What are you talking about....

I've said that we need to at least arm these people, I've never supported Assad. Have you been drinking or do you just enjoy mindless rhetoric. The people currently can't overthrow a tank, the tank would crush them. We need to give them weapons in order for them to do.

You want the people to remove Assad but you don't want to arm them. That's like throwing a kitten in a tiger's cage and saying you want the kitten to win

[Twilly F. Sniper]

No.

Why?


I think WW3 would become imminent.

[tovaris]

What are you talking about....

I've said that we need to at least arm these people, I've never supported Assad. Have you been drinking or do you just enjoy mindless rhetoric. The people currently can't overthrow a tank, the tank would crush them. We need to give them weapons in order for them to do.

You want the people to remove Assad but you don't want to arm them. That's like throwing a kitten in a tiger's cage and saying you want the kitten to win

The people are all poverfull mor than any tank, if the world got involved it would be a disaster; even worst than the Spanish civil war.
Asad can only be defeted by the people not the western world keep in mind that the russiand are againced the rebils.

[Harry Smith]

The people are all poverfull mor than any tank, if the world got involved it would be a disaster; even worst than the Spanish civil war.
Asad can only be defeted by the people not the western world keep in mind that the russiand are againced the rebils.

They're quite obviously not. Have you seen Tienanmen square?

[tovaris]

They're quite obviously not. Have you seen Tienanmen square?

Foreighn powers should NOT get involved in any case.
We know what happend in the past.

[Harry Smith]

Foreighn powers should NOT get involved in any case.
We know what happend in the past.

yes, we do tend to know what happened in the past, it's called Memory....

Foreign powers got involved in Libya, we sorted it out. There is now a democratic government, the foreign powers helped remove a tyrant who butchered his own peoeple

[tovaris]

yes, we do tend to know what happened in the past, it's called Memory....

Foreign powers got involved in Libya, we sorted it out. There is now a democratic government, the foreign powers helped remove a tyrant who butchered his own peoeple

We will see how the foreighn envolvement goes for the lybians in the future.
But what about say?: Spain, Bosnia, Serbia, Vietnam...

[Harry Smith]

We will see how the foreighn envolvement goes for the lybians in the future.
But what about say?: Spain, Bosnia, Serbia, Vietnam...

thats just you accepting that you were wrong about Libya, you always just fall back onto that argument.

Spain- Different, happened about 80 years ago. Britain and France didn't intervene then, not all. They didn't want to trigger WW2. The Germans and Italians got involved and it worked very well for them. In fact you could say that Britain and France's failure to get involved was the main factor in Spain becoming a Dictatsrship.

Bosnia- We stopped War Crimes.

Serbia- We stopped Genocide

Vietnam-That's the Americans fuck up, and it's 100% different to Syria. Vietnam wasn't the Americans arming the people, it was the Americans arming the South Vietnam to oppose the North.

[tovaris]

thats just you accepting that you were wrong about Libya, you always just fall back onto that argument.
.

Libia was only made unstabil by the envolvement, the future will tel how fatal it was.



Spain- Different, happened about 80 years ago. Britain and France didn't intervene then, not all. They didn't want to trigger WW2. The Germans and Italians got involved and it worked very well for them. In fact you could say that Britain and France's failure to get involved was the main factor in Spain becoming a Dictatsrship..

The Spanish could have figured it outthemselves.


Bosnia- We stopped War Crimes.

.

Aha video records show Serbian, Croatian and muslim wiman frowing stonea at UN trucks...



Serbia- We stopped Genocide
.

We have discused thia alredy and you were prowen wrong.
Historical facts say the oposite of your clame.


Vietnam-That's the Americans fuck up, and it's 100% different to Syria. Vietnam wasn't the Americans arming the people, it was the Americans arming the South Vietnam to oppose the North.

Foreighn powers got envolved Stil and cause unnedes suffering and basicly turned a pile of shit (this does not enply to thecountry but the situation) and turned itinto a reservoar full.

Siria must be alowed to sort out their problems themselves not with foreighn interventikn.

[Harry Smith]

Libia was only made unstabil by the envolvement, the future will tel how fatal it was.



The Spanish could have figured it outthemselves.


Aha video records show Serbian, Croatian and muslim wiman frowing stonea at UN trucks...



We have discused thia alredy and you were prowen wrong.
Historical facts say the oposite of your clame.



Foreighn powers got envolved Stil and cause unnedes suffering and basicly turned a pile of shit (this does not enply to thecountry but the situation) and turned itinto a reservoar full.

Siria must be alowed to sort out their problems themselves not with foreighn interventikn.

Are you delusional. I've given you documentened claims of war crimes and genocide that has been carried out by Serbians security forces in Kosovo. I have never been proved wrong about. Also you need to learn how to spell

[tovaris]

Are you delusional. I've given you documentened claims of war crimes and genocide that has been carried out by Serbians security forces in Kosovo. I have never been proved wrong about. Also you need to learn how to spell

If you find any spelling mistakes or typographical errors in my posts please report them to me immediately so that I can correct them.

I will not descus historical fact here if you wish to do so create a new thread.

This thread is siria whre foreighn power should not enterween.

Пиши као што говориш, говори као што пишеш. Вук Стефановић Караџић.

[Axw_JD]

both sides are committing crimes against mankind so no, there is probably no reason for the international community to get involved, since neither side is worth supporting.

However if the russians are selling weapons to the tyrant and their allies (venezuela, cuba, etc) then the UN will probably have to step in and help the rebels overthrow the tyrant.

[Southside]

yes, we do tend to know what happened in the past, it's called Memory....

Foreign powers got involved in Libya, we sorted it out. There is now a democratic government, the foreign powers helped remove a tyrant who butchered his own peoeple

Libya is the wild west, militas and gangs roaming around, the eastern part has no true policing or government presence. Ghaddafi was a tyrant, though prior to the Arab Spring Libya was pretty successful under him dont you think? Highest GDP in Africa, free education and healthcare for all, Western companies setting up oil complexes(British Petroleum to name one of them).

[Harry Smith]

If you find any spelling mistakes or typographical errors in my posts please report them to me immediately so that I can correct them.

I will not descus historical fact here if you wish to do so create a new thread.

This thread is siria whre foreighn power should not enterween.

Пиши као што говориш, говори као што пишеш. Вук Стефановић Караџић.

your going to be here a very long time

Libya is the wild west, militas and gangs roaming around, the eastern part has no true policing or government presence. Ghaddafi was a tyrant, though prior to the Arab Spring Libya was pretty successful under him dont you think? Highest GDP in Africa, free education and healthcare for all, Western companies setting up oil complexes(British Petroleum to name one of them).

yes, Gaddafi was a tyrant, he funded terrorists, he was responsible for the killing of over 150 innocent civilians on British soil, he funded the IRA and killed British troops in Germany. I'm not saying that the regime wasn't well managed but he was torturing the people of Libya, raping his own bodyguards and repressing democracy

[tovaris]

your going to be here a very long time


what do you meam by this reply?

[CharlieHorse]

Let's call in torchwood.

[Harry Smith]

Let's call in torchwood.

Separate from the government, outside the police, and beyond the United Nations. Welcome to Torchwood

[Left Now]

Libya is now all destroyed.The basic resources of the country and its industry got all destroyed by NATO air force operations.Foreign intervention just will destroy a country.For example now you can see in Syria,Aleppo is all destroyed;a city of Syrian industry is all destroyed and won't be back on its routine way of production until about 10 years later.

It is better to see what will happen in Geneva conferences.Maybe the civil war gets finished after these conferences.

[Harry Smith]

Libya is now all destroyed.The basic resources of the country and its industry got all destroyed by NATO air force operations.Foreign intervention just will destroy a country.For example now you can see in Syria,Aleppo is all destroyed;a city of Syrian industry is all destroyed and won't be back on its routine way of production until about 10 years later.

It is better to see what will happen in Geneva conferences.Maybe the civil war gets finished after these conferences.

No, do you have a source for Libya?

Isn't it the Iranians who are arming and training the Syrian Army?

[tovaris]

No, do you have a source for Libya?

Isn't it the Iranians who are arming and training the Syrian Army?

i thaught the un was againced yrming parymilitary organisations? And yet niw they want to arm them.
No foreighn intervention of yny kind is acceptible.

[Left Now]

Yes,Syria is a government and is an ally for us,like what your governments will do for their allies.Turkey is doing the wrong thing to arm and train Salafit rebels in Syria who are not even Syrians.Still Assad's government is a government and not a terrorist organ.Not just Iran,Iraq,Russia,China,Hezbollah and ... are aiding Assad's government because he is fighting a real terrorism organ,Salafits and Al-Qaeda.

Also,foreign intervention means a direct attack from a foreign country to another country to aid one of the sides in conflict.Sending supply doesn't mean intervention.


Libya:Civilian Losses during NATO operations (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_military_intervention_in_Libya#Civilian_losses)

[Southside]

your going to be here a very long time



yes, Gaddafi was a tyrant, he funded terrorists, he was responsible for the killing of over 150 innocent civilians on British soil, he funded the IRA and killed British troops in Germany. I'm not saying that the regime wasn't well managed but he was torturing the people of Libya, raping his own bodyguards and repressing democracy

Like I've said a million times before, I rather have a country that has a dictator with a iron grip than a country that is going wild with no law in placed.

[tovaris]

Yes,Syria is a government and is an ally for us,like what your governments will do for their allies.Turkey is doing the wrong thing to arm and train Salafit rebels in Syria who are not even Syrians.Still Assad's government is a government and not a terrorist organ.Not just Iran,Iraq,Russia,China,Hezbollah and ... are aiding Assad's government because he is fighting a real terrorism organ,Salafits and Al-Qaeda.

Also,foreign intervention means a direct attack from a foreign country to another country to aid one of the sides in conflict.Sending supply doesn't mean intervention.


Libya:Civilian Losses during NATO operations (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_military_intervention_in_Libya#Civilian_losses)

Sending suplies to any side is wrong because we need to force all sides to negotiate pece.
Suporting dictatorshio or totalitarium goverment is also wrong since it apreses the people, as would be wrong to suport any extremist grup, that is why we should fing a diplomatic, open solution for full democracy and posible balcanisation of the region. It nether side doesnt budge leave them alone.

[Left Now]

Sending suplies to any side is wrong because we need to force all sides to negotiate pece.
Suporting dictatorshio or totalitarium goverment is also wrong since it apreses the people, as would be wrong to suport any extremist grup, that is why we should fing a diplomatic, open solution for full democracy and posible balcanisation of the region. It nether side doesnt budge leave them alone.

Diplomatic!That is why i am telling you we have to wait for Geneva conferences.Iran started its aids for Syria after western countries and Arabs started their aids for rebels.But still Iran is supporting a diplomatic solution for this situation,all of the countries have to do this.

[tovaris]

Diplomatic!That is why i am telling you we have to wait for Geneva conferences.Iran started its aids for Syria after western countries and Arabs started their aids for rebels.But still Iran is supporting a diplomatic solution for this situation,all of the countries have to do this.

I say first cut them of from the world and stop all fighting, than negotiate oermenent pece andd cut the country up into lots of smaler national republics and let the deal with further problems themselves.

[Left Now]

I say first cut them of from the world and stop all fighting, than negotiate oermenent pece andd cut the country up into lots of smaler national republics and let the deal with further problems themselves.

You mean destroy a national unity?Still the majority are on government's side.about 58 percent according to some local presses of middle east.
However,Assad is winning the war,and it means that rebels have to act carefully in Geneva.

[Harry Smith]

You mean destroy a national unity?Still the majority are on government's side.about 58 percent according to some local presses of middle east.
However,Assad is winning the war,and it means that rebels have to act carefully in Geneva.

Assad is a god damn Fascist, along with Iran. Axis of evil?

[Southside]

Assad is a god damn Fascist, along with Iran. Axis of evil?

So what do you suggest happen in Syria? I'd love to hear your view

[Pinkamena]

To the people mentioning Libya:
US-led NATO funded rebels in Libya and provided air support to help fight Qaddafi after he declared that he wanted Libyan oil companies to be paid in gold, as opposed to the declining US$.

Now, the only way Syria won't completely collapse is if Assad wins. So yes, I am rooting for him.
And if the war continues the way it is going, he should win. Especially now that Quasyr has been captured, allowing Hezbollah and Iranian supporters easy access from Lebanon. Russian supplies could also be shipped in this way.
The only thing Assad has to worry about is if Israel decides to help the rebels (I'm thinking set up some kind of false-flag to drag themselves into the war), which would cause this to become a massive international war, possibly even dragging in the US and Russia.

[tovaris]

You mean destroy a national unity?Still the majority are on government's side.about 58 percent according to some local presses of middle east.
However,Assad is winning the war,and it means that rebels have to act carefully in Geneva.

The thing is they were newer trula one nation and will keep fighting if not ruled by a iron fist that is why they should become at leest a confederacy.

[Harry Smith]

So what do you suggest happen in Syria? I'd love to hear your view

A no fly zone should be implemented, humanitarian aid should be allowled to enter the country under the UN, this would include UN peacekeepers as well. This would ensure that civilians especially women and children would get access to food and Health care. Then we could bring in an investigation to see if the chemical weapons were used, if so then we bring Assad to the Hague and try him for war crimes.

[Left Now]

A no fly zone should be implemented, humanitarian aid should be allowled to enter the country under the UN, this would include UN peacekeepers as well. This would ensure that civilians especially women and children would get access to food and Health care. Then we could bring in an investigation to see if the chemical weapons were used, if so then we bring Assad to the Hague and try him for war crimes.

Right choice.Then the truth will be revealed.

[Stronk Serb]

Ounce of salt? Wow. I never said we went to war for human rights did I... I said that it showed where foreign powers ( Britain and France) stepped in to help Poland.

How exactly are the people going to take him out when they're getting gassed and bombed, women and children are getting gassed and bombed. You can't expect them to try and take on an Army



I've always said that the best option is a no fly zone, and then allow the UN to go in. Because this no fly zone allows the movement of aid and people into the country. We need to protect the civilans.

Also back to WW2, I believe we're already at war with Germany, unlike Yugoslavia I believe we always fought them. We didn't side with the Nazis, your king did.

And Did nothing? How did the Serbians get those sten guns again? Do you really think you were the only country who had to face the Nazis. We were dropping agents across Europe to help, we tried are best but we were a bit busy fighting the Germans. Don't make it out that we did nothing, we send supplies, partisians and commando raids. I know you hate the west but we were on the same side

That is why we deposed that traitor of ours you called a king of Yugoslavia. You were helping his ressistance untill '44. The king's ressistance killed Serbs, it was just a band of cutthroats who did not do a thing against the Nazis. You started helping the Partisans during the ending stages of the war, it was a matter of months when the war would end.

[Southside]

A no fly zone should be implemented, humanitarian aid should be allowled to enter the country under the UN, this would include UN peacekeepers as well. This would ensure that civilians especially women and children would get access to food and Health care. Then we could bring in an investigation to see if the chemical weapons were used, if so then we bring Assad to the Hague and try him for war crimes.

Then put the Al-Qaeda rebels in charge?

[Harry Smith]

That is why we deposed that traitor of ours you called a king of Yugoslavia. You were helping his ressistance untill '44. The king's ressistance killed Serbs, it was just a band of cutthroats who did not do a thing against the Nazis. You started helping the Partisans during the ending stages of the war, it was a matter of months when the war would end.

It was actually at the Tehran conference where we decided to support Tito and his partisans, that was 2 years before the war ended. You have to understand that it was natural for us to support the exile government at first rather than an a communist group. We had to support the exile government at first, it made sense

Then put the Al-Qaeda rebels in charge?

Oh yeah assume that Al-Qaeda control the rebels, they have a unified command structure more so now which an elected head

[tovaris]

It was actually at the Tehran conference where we decided to support Tito and his partisans, that was 2 years before the war ended. You have to understand that it was natural for us to support the exile government at first rather than an a communist group. We had to support the exile government at first, it made sense



Oh yeah assume that Al-Qaeda control the rebels, they have a unified command structure more so now which an elected head

You suported axis power suporters? thats natural?

The rebils have no one centrel comand there are many grups some of them extreem islamist, some of them democratic, some fanatical USA suporters. That is not a homogones grup, this is exactly why spliting up siria into lots of lsmaler democratisatical countries makes most sense; vithout foreighn intervention.

[Pinkamena]

Oh yeah assume that Al-Qaeda control the rebels, they have a unified command structure more so now which an elected head

The have found that groups fighting with the rebels have links to anti-US terrorist groups, namely the Mujaheddin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mujahideen#Syria). Their numbers are estimated around 10,000 soldiers, and roughly 6,000 foreign volunteers.

[Stronk Serb]

The have found that groups fighting with the rebels have links to anti-US terrorist groups, namely the Mujaheddin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mujahideen#Syria). Their numbers are estimated around 10,000 soldiers, and roughly 6,000 foreign volunteers.


Wait... The Mujaheddins have been fighting alongside Bosnian Muslim regulars in the Yugoslavian Civil War, and the US supported them... What the US government does on foreign affairs starts to lose sense every day. The US have been giving weapons to the rebels since there was no other posibility of the rebels getting their hands on FN FALs and on modern US AA missile systems. I am for Assad. Better ruled with an iron grip then living in absolute anarchy.

[Left Now]

Hey hey...
Mujaheddin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mujahideen-e_Khalq) is a terrorist group which is supported by US and it is against Islamic Republic Politics.Mujaheddin-e-Khalq.They have killed a lot of iranian civilians since 30 years ago.

[Stronk Serb]

Hey hey...
Mujaheddin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mujahideen-e_Khalq) is a terrorist group which is supported by US and it is against Islamic Republic Politics.Mujaheddin-e-Khalq.They have killed a lot of iranian civilians since 30 years ago.

They were active in Bosnia during the Yugoslav Civil War. They are a blight on Marx's teachings and Marxist ideology.

[Left Now]

They were active in Bosnia during the Yugoslav Civil War. They are a blight on Marx's teachings and Marxist ideology.

They are,but now the main Imperialism is supporting them.

[Harry Smith]

Wait... The Mujaheddins have been fighting alongside Bosnian Muslim regulars in the Yugoslavian Civil War, and the US supported them... What the US government does on foreign affairs starts to lose sense every day. The US have been giving weapons to the rebels since there was no other posibility of the rebels getting their hands on FN FALs and on modern US AA missile systems. I am for Assad. Better ruled with an iron grip then living in absolute anarchy.

No. The us haven't given the Rebels any weapons, Saudi Arabia have, private groups have but the US government haven't.

Seems to be the good old serbian attitude, let the leader gas his own people, kill women and children but as long as you have an Iron grip we'll be fine. No wonder they was so much war in your region.

The have found that groups fighting with the rebels have links to anti-US terrorist groups, namely the Mujaheddin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mujahideen#Syria). Their numbers are estimated around 10,000 soldiers, and roughly 6,000 foreign volunteers.

So what? We're not going to be arming these groups. We'll be giving our weapons to the free syrian army, who have an internationally backed leadership. I'm sure we have people who will stop these al-Quada groups. We can't let Assad get away with war crimes

They are,but now the main Imperialism is supporting them.

Imperialist implies we have an empire... it's also pretty hipocritcal when Iran are pumping assad full of guns. Your trying to assert your own 'imperialist agenda' on Syria. Iran is joke, you'll give anyone who can spell Death to America a gun

[Stronk Serb]

They are,but now the main Imperialism is supporting them.

The very same imperialists they sworn to kick out in the first place. Now they are their pawns and cannon fodder. Imperialists use them for goals they cannot accomplish.

[Harry Smith]

The very same imperialists they sworn to kick out in the first place. Now they are their pawns and cannon fodder. Imperialists use them for goals they cannot accomplish.

I know you love buzzword such as imperialists becuase alas you can't think of anything better but the definition is...

"an unequal human and territorial relationship, in the form of an empire, based on ideas of superiority and practices of dominance''

We don't think of our self as superior, we lack an empire and we don't have there territory.

[Stronk Serb]

No. The us haven't given the Rebels any weapons, Saudi Arabia have, private groups have but the US government haven't.

Seems to be the good old serbian attitude, let the leader gas his own people, kill women and children but as long as you have an Iron grip we'll be fine. No wonder they was so much war in your region.



So what? We're not going to be arming these groups. We'll be giving our weapons to the free syrian army, who have an internationally backed leadership. I'm sure we have people who will stop these al-Quada groups. We can't let Assad get away with war crimes



Imperialist implies we have an empire... it's also pretty hipocritcal when Iran are pumping assad full of guns. Your trying to assert your own 'imperialist agenda' on Syria. Iran is joke, you'll give anyone who can spell Death to America a gun


Source for Assad gassing his people?
I would raher live in a dictatorship where people would be afraid to commit crime then in an absolute unstable anarchy. At least if I am obediant in a dictatorship, I would not get killed. In an absolute anarchy, every day I could get killed by a crazyman wielding an illegally obtained AK.

[tovaris]

I know you love buzzword such as imperialists becuase alas you can't think of anything better but the definition is...

"an unequal human and territorial relationship, in the form of an empire, based on ideas of superiority and practices of dominance''

We don't think of our self as superior, we lack an empire and we don't have there territory.

You dont think as yourselfe as imperialist?
And may the brithis empire and the comenwelth last a hundred years... W. Churcil (but that was thqn)
Nowerdays you figured out a new way to do old tricks, by capitalistic fraud, corupition etc. You say your side are not impelialist and yet they suport and practise neocolonisatiin?

[Harry Smith]

Source for Assad gassing his people?
I would raher live in a dictatorship where people would be afraid to commit crime then in an absolute unstable anarchy. At least if I am obediant in a dictatorship, I would not get killed. In an absolute anarchy, every day I could get killed by a crazyman wielding an illegally obtained AK.

http://www.dnaindia.com/world/1843938/report-syria-french-lab-tests-show-assad-used-fatal-sarin-gas

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/1774665/UK-says-Assad-used-sarin-gas-in-Syria

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-22559421

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-22552029

http://www.jpost.com/Middle-East/Britain-finds-evidence-of-sarin-gas-use-in-Syria-315503

[Left Now]

Assad is winning the civil war,he doesn't need chemical gas to kill his own people.The only thing which is here is a real western propaganda.BBC even didn't show the videos of murdering of people in Myanmar,so this is why i do not trust western medias.Syrian chemical weapons are just for defending against foreign invasion not civil wars.
However,still i am really against a country having a mass killing weapon like chemical weapons,even when it is just for foreign threats.

[Stronk Serb]

I know you love buzzword such as imperialists becuase alas you can't think of anything better but the definition is...

"an unequal human and territorial relationship, in the form of an empire, based on ideas of superiority and practices of dominance''

We don't think of our self as superior, we lack an empire and we don't have there territory.

It is neo-imperialism. The same thing, just adapted to this time.

http://www.dnaindia.com/world/1843938/report-syria-french-lab-tests-show-assad-used-fatal-sarin-gas

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/1774665/UK-says-Assad-used-sarin-gas-in-Syria

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-22559421

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-22552029

http://www.jpost.com/Middle-East/Britain-finds-evidence-of-sarin-gas-use-in-Syria-315503

And those same rebels you are helping are using chemical weapons. Those could be samples from people killed by the rebels.

[Breakeven]

Assad is winning the civil war,he doesn't need chemical gas to kill his own people.The only thing which is here is a real western propaganda.BBC even didn't show the videos of murdering of people in Myanmar,so this is why i do not trust western medias.Syrian chemical weapons are just for defending against foreign invasion not civil wars.
However,still i am really against a country having a mass killing weapon like chemical weapons,even when it is just for foreign threats.

hes not winning and hes not losing either , its endless war! its gonna keep going for years!

[Left Now]

Imperialist implies we have an empire... it's also pretty hipocritcal when Iran are pumping assad full of guns. Your trying to assert your own 'imperialist agenda' on Syria. Iran is joke, you'll give anyone who can spell Death to America a gun

Not anyone.Also,most of the aids of Iran to Syria was with information not with guns.Some of our officials said that they helped Syrian Army to be successful in their operations in Al-Qusayr with intelligence information about the main hideouts of terrorists.If we wanted to give weapons to Assad,now Syrian Civil war was just a memory for the people of the World.

hes not winning and hes not losing either , its endless war! its gonna keep going for years!

Haven't you heard the news mistress?The war is going to its end.Because now Turkey cannot transport supplies to rebels and Al-Qusayr is now in the hands of Syrian Army.Rebels are gonna be destroyed if it continues like this.


-merged double post. -Emerald Dream

[tovaris]

Haven't you heard the news mistress?The war is going to its end.Because now Turkey cannot transport supplies to rebels and Al-Qusayr is now in the hands of Syrian Army.Rebels are gonna be destroyed if it continues like this.

Here ve can clerly see propaganda in media, those listening and reading english and other western media are whell informed how the rebils are in the vining side while those folowing pro asad media are equaly whel informed of the opoaite.
Where does the truth lie?

[Breakeven]

Haven't you heard the news mistress?The war is going to its end.Because now Turkey cannot transport supplies to rebels and Al-Qusayr is now in the hands of Syrian Army.Rebels are gonna be destroyed if it continues like this.

whats happening in turkey is way different from what happening in syria and have zero effect on syria, the only way to the war end is either assed die or the free army give up and thats not gonna happen too many people died and too many angery families

as for turkey protesters anti-government they are only demanding the resignation of Erdogan

[Harry Smith]

It is neo-imperialism. The same thing, just adapted to this time.



And those same rebels you are helping are using chemical weapons. Those could be samples from people killed by the rebels.

No, we have reports from the Syrian people that gas was devliered by Helicopters, something the rebels don't have. If you have doctors treating rebel fighers who have blisters and injuries consistent with gas then it's going to be the Syrian army who have done. I love how you assume that you know more than scientists and experts

[tovaris]

No, we have reports from the Syrian people that gas was devliered by Helicopters, something the rebels don't have. If you have doctors treating rebel fighers who have blisters and injuries consistent with gas then it's going to be the Syrian army who have done. I love how you assume that you know more than scientists and experts

other media state that chemicals were also used by the rebils.

[Harry Smith]

other media state that chemicals were also used by the rebils.

Did I ever say the Rebels didn't use chemical weapons?

If the rebels used it then it's a domestic case, just like if I let off a dirty bomb in my street. But the fact that Syria are using chemical weapons is an international war crime, we need to get assad to the Hague.

[Left Now]

whats happening in turkey is way different from what happening in syria and have zero effect on syria, the only way to the war end is either assed die or the free army give up and thats not gonna happen too many people died and too many angery families

as for turkey protesters anti-government they are only demanding the resignation of Erdogan

Didn't get that,With this demonstrations,Turkey's tourism activities will be reduced and one of the main sources of money of the country will be lost.So Turkish government will reduce its aids to rebels and will be more active to deal with its own problems.
Also,rebels got really weak because of losing Al-Qusayr and now the way of transportation of supplies from Lebanon to terrorists is blocked.The rebels are based on foreign aids and without them,they will fall very soon.

[Harry Smith]

Didn't get that,With this demonstrations,Turkey's tourism activities will be reduced and one of the main sources of money of the country will be lost.So Turkish government will reduce its aids to rebels and will be more active to deal with its own problems.
Also,rebels got really weak because of losing Al-Qusayr and now the way of transportation of supplies from Lebanon to terrorists is blocked.The rebels are based on foreign aids and without them,they will fall very soon.

And that's what Iran wants

[tovaris]

Did I ever say the Rebels didn't use chemical weapons?

If the rebels used it then it's a domestic case, just like if I let off a dirty bomb in my street. But the fact that Syria are using chemical weapons is an international war crime, we need to get assad to the Hague.

Was it used outside Sirija?
And the fact they used chemical wepons makes them no bether than Asads army that is why a diplomatical soulution is the way to go, without any foreighn medeling in the war.

[Left Now]

That is what many people want.Assad must fall,but rebels must not win the civil war.If rebels win the civil war,then it is 100 per 100 possible they use chemical weapons against other countries and neighbours.
Assad will fall after the rebels got destroyed and a national election gets committed.
However,Syrians opinion toward Israel and Turkey won't change after the election.

[Stronk Serb]

No, we have reports from the Syrian people that gas was devliered by Helicopters, something the rebels don't have. If you have doctors treating rebel fighers who have blisters and injuries consistent with gas then it's going to be the Syrian army who have done. I love how you assume that you know more than scientists and experts

Visual proof of those helicopters? Like pictures or video footage? For what we know, the rebels could have injured themselves by using the chemical weapons. They are an untrained rabble which can barely drive a tank assuming they have any, let alone use chemical weapons.

[Harry Smith]

Visual proof of those helicopters? Like pictures or video footage? For what we know, the rebels could have injured themselves by using the chemical weapons. They are an untrained rabble which can barely drive a tank assuming they have any, let alone use chemical weapons.

haha yeah source biased cough cough

I'm certain that if a 60 year syrian is getting gassed the first thing she'll do is get her iphone 5 out of her pocket

what was the point is asking for a source if you then assume that the rebels did it to themself. It's like if you see someone with a stab wound to the chest you wouldn't think 'oh damn they stabbed themself'

[Harry Smith]

Was it used outside Sirija?
And the fact they used chemical wepons makes them no bether than Asads army that is why a diplomatical soulution is the way to go, without any foreighm medeling in the war.

A diplomatic solution requires a no fly zone, which needs to be enforced by foreign powers.

You have a 'typographical' mistake in what I quoted

[tovaris]

A diplomatic solution requires a no fly zone, which needs to be enforced by foreign powers.

You have a 'typographical' mistake in what I quoted

No a no fly zone enforced by foreighn powers would onlyy alove these powers to get a stronger grim on the country they want to absorve in their neoenpire.
You cant just shoot at people for fliing in their own country just because you are a big power, leave them alone.
http://goo.gl/IJM3O

[Harry Smith]

No a no fly zone enforced by foreighn powers would onlyy alove these powers to get a stronger grim on the country they want to absorve in their neoenpire.
You cant just shoot at people for fliing in their own country just because you are a big power, leave them alone.
http://goo.gl/IJM3O

No, it would be endorsed by a united nations resolution, Europeon countries would then enforce the No-Fly, it doesn't mean you shot them down. You escort them out of the airspace. This allows for aid to be send in which will help deal with the crisis

[Stronk Serb]

haha yeah source biased cough cough

I'm certain that if a 60 year syrian is getting gassed the first thing she'll do is get her iphone 5 out of her pocket

what was the point is asking for a source if you then assume that the rebels did it to themself. It's like if you see someone with a stab wound to the chest you wouldn't think 'oh damn they stabbed themself'


Perhaps. But what if the rebels gassed civilians on former loyalist territories? There could be dozens of possibilities. I am rooting for Assad.

[britishboy]

in my opinions we must take outBOTH sides, they have both commited war crimes

[Harry Smith]

Perhaps. But what if the rebels gassed civilians on former loyalist territories? There could be dozens of possibilities. I am rooting for Assad.

I'm glad your rooting for someone who has not only committed war crimes but represses people's fundamental right to vote. It shows just what communists think of democracy

[Stronk Serb]

I'm glad your rooting for someone who has not only committed war crimes but represses people's fundamental right to vote. It shows just what communists think of democracy

Better order then anarchy.

[Harry Smith]

Better order then anarchy.

How would it be anarchy if we replace him?

The UN come into the country and investigate the claims of war crimes, then we take him to the Hague whilst UN peacekeepers patrol the country and hand out aid. Then monitored elections are held, and a new constitution is drawn up. That's better than a brute twisted Fascist.

You also criticize the west, specifally Britain for having a Dystany in charge ( the royal family). Assad is only in charge because his dad was the leader, that's not democratic at all. It's good to see you've abandoned your beliefs

[Stronk Serb]

How would it be anarchy if we replace him?

The UN come into the country and investigate the claims of war crimes, then we take him to the Hague whilst UN peacekeepers patrol the country and hand out aid. Then monitored elections are held, and a new constitution is drawn up. That's better than a brute twisted Fascist.

You also criticize the west, specifally Britain for having a Dystany in charge ( the royal family). Assad is only in charge because his dad was the leader, that's not democratic at all. It's good to see you've abandoned your beliefs

Was he? I meant, better Assad then the rebels. Do whatever you want. I don't care anymore.

[Southside]

in my opinions we must take outBOTH sides, they have both commited war crimes

Then put who in? Nobody can be trusted over there, its more bad guys than good guys. I know what your probably thinking,Install a UN or NATO Puppet state?

[britishboy]

Then put who in? Nobody can be trusted over there, its more bad guys than good guys. I know what your probably thinking,Install a UN or NATO Puppet state?

no hold a vote, and monitor carefully the winner also moniter what they do, and severely limit the military

[Harry Smith]

no hold a vote, and monitor carefully the winner also moniter what they do, and severely limit the military

No, that's not our decision to make. We can't impose our will on them after we've sorted out the mess, in order to limit there military we would have to get them to sign a treaty

[britishboy]

No, that's not our decision to make. We can't impose our will on them after we've sorted out the mess, in order to limit there military we would have to get them to sign a treaty

yeah of course, I hate the puppet states but im sure after whats happened they will agree to the treaty and maybe be an allie like isreal?

[tovaris]

No, it would be endorsed by a united nations resolution, Europeon countries would then enforce the No-Fly, it doesn't mean you shot them down. You escort them out of the airspace. This allows for aid to be send in which will help deal with the crisis

Because it vorked so tood in Libia right...
This is stil foreighm medeling let tze sort it out themselves.

no hold a vote, and monitor carefully the winner also moniter what they do, and severely limit the military

Esantaly a nondemocratic pupet state.

yeah of course, I hate the puppet states but im sure after whats happened they will agree to the treaty and maybe be an allie like isreal?

their are an arab country that zas to protect itself from israel they cannot conspire with the people suporting it