The Right to Deny Service

[PerpetualImperfexion]

So in Washington a women who owns a flower shop refused to provide flowers for her gay clients' wedding. She had been selling them flowers for nine years. The issue is that in the state of Washington you cannot refuse to sell something to someone based on their race, sexual orientation, sex, etc. She says that she was not discriminating against them because they are gay (she had been selling to them for nine years after all), but rather she didn't sell to them because she is against gay marriage.

Thoughts?

[Abigballofdust]

So in Washington a women who owns a flower shop refused to provide flowers for her gay clients' wedding. She had been selling them flowers for nine years. The issue is that in the state of Washington you cannot refuse to sell something to someone based on their race, sexual orientation, sex, etc. She says that she was not discriminating against them because they are gay (she had been selling to them for nine years after all), but rather she didn't sell to them because she is against gay marriage.

Thoughts?

The bolded pretty much explains it.
If you must not deny service, you must not deny service.

If I was the costumer I'd just go to the next shop and then paraded in front of her's with the invoice being all 'See what you just missed'...

[PerpetualImperfexion]

The bolded pretty much explains it.
If you must not deny service, you must not deny service.

If I was the costumer I'd just go to the next shop and then paraded in front of her's with the invoice being all 'See what you just missed'...

Is it not possible to be against gay marriage, but not against gays? That is the issue here.

I agree with you though. If I were them I wouldn't have bothered giving her my business. People should stop caring so much about what people who hate them think.

[Sir Suomi]

Is it not possible to be against gay marriage, but not against gays? That is the issue here.


That's actually true for me. Personally, I don't like the idea of homosexual relationships, but I have no problem against the homosexual community. It's hard to put in words, just basically I don't really support it, but as long as they do not bother me, I will definitely not bother them. :yeah:

But on the topic of the shop owner refusing to serve the homosexual couple, it's appalling. I would've thought, after the African American Civil Right's movement, America would've realized that just because you may not like something or someone, doesn't give you the right to be a complete prick about it. Sadly though, I guess not. :yawn:

[Sugaree]

Is it not possible to be against gay marriage, but not against gays? That is the issue here.

No it's not. Jesus Christ, you put a gay person into the issue and this site turns an entire issue into a "gay rights" debate. The issue here is whether store owners have the right to deny their service to who they please. If you come into my store not wearing a shirt or shoes, I'm not going to serve you. Why? Because you came into MY shop, meaning you abide by MY rules. If she doesn't agree with gay marriage doesn't want to serve gay customers, that's the entire point of being a business owner. Sure, it's pretty fucked up, but there's plenty of other places to get flowers for a wedding. She pays for it in the end by turning down profit for her business.

[randomnessqueen]

refusing service because its for gay marriage, is the same as refusing for sexual orientation, so she was in the wrong.
though there are times when refusing service should be allowed, like if a customer is being disrespectful

[MisterSix]

The key is to never give a reason why you refuse them service.

[Taryn98]

It's your store its your rules. You have the right to refuse service to anyone for any reason.

[Harry Smith]

No it's not. Jesus Christ, you put a gay person into the issue and this site turns an entire issue into a "gay rights" debate. The issue here is whether store owners have the right to deny their service to who they please. If you come into my store not wearing a shirt or shoes, I'm not going to serve you. Why? Because you came into MY shop, meaning you abide by MY rules. If she doesn't agree with gay marriage doesn't want to serve gay customers, that's the entire point of being a business owner. Sure, it's pretty fucked up, but there's plenty of other places to get flowers for a wedding. She pays for it in the end by turning down profit for her business.

It's your store its your rules. You have the right to refuse service to anyone for any reason.

So would it then be right to refuse service to someone because they're black?

[Sugaree]

So would it then be right to refuse service to someone because they're black?

It wouldn't be right, no; but if that's the business owner's decision, it's their decision. You can't tell someone that they HAVE to give their business to certain people when they have the right to deny service to whoever they see fit. I'm not going to give my services to some gangbanger looking black guy not because he's black, but because he's decided to make my business look like shit. However, if I was denying him service just BECAUSE he was black, that would be wrong because I'm denying to recognize a basic human right of respect.

This is what the issue boils down to when denying someone service: if you come into my store without showing respect for yourself, then I have no respect for you and will deny service. It's that simple.

[Atonement]

When people say, "We reserve the right to deny service.", that doesn't give them the right to break the law.

What is the difference between a heterosexual marriage, which she sells flowers for, and a homosexual marriage, which she refuses? The sexual orientation. Therefore, the service is denied on basis of sexual orientation.

To say that a shop owner has the right to deny service or business to someone for whatever criteria they see fit is similar to suggesting that segregation was right because the individual shops could set their own rules for their clientele.

[britishboy]

the jokes on her she missed out on business

[PerpetualImperfexion]

When people say, "We reserve the right to deny service.", that doesn't give them the right to break the law.

What is the difference between a heterosexual marriage, which she sells flowers for, and a homosexual marriage, which she refuses? The sexual orientation. Therefore, the service is denied on basis of sexual orientation.

To say that a shop owner has the right to deny service or business to someone for whatever criteria they see fit is similar to suggesting that segregation was right because the individual shops could set their own rules for their clientele.

If someone wanted flowers to celebrate an abortion and they told the woman what they were for she wouldn't have refused service because of discrimination, but because she thinks abortion is wrong. It's the exact same thing in this case, only with gay marriage.

Segregation was instituted by the government. People have the right to deny service to someone. The government does not have the right to force separation between two groups of people. There is a difference between segregation and discrimination. Segregation is almost always discrimination, but discrimination is not always segregation. Two separate things.