Are you Judgmental? If so, with what? [Archive]

Gandalf

April 12th, 2013, 06:47 AM

I'm very judgmental, and sadly, I don't have much of a censor. So if I say a joke pertaining to race, I won't look to make sure no one of that race is there. I'm also judgmental toward really effeminate guys (guys who wear stuff like makeup, etc), and really masculine girls. Like my cousin came out as gay, and started to dress really weird and such, so when he started doing that, I basically disowned him lol, I haven't seen him in 2 years. He's an embarrassment to be around (in nicer words).

Yeah, I agree. I don't like homophobes

Quite a contradiction....

Back on topic, I normally judge actions rather than person. If you're nice to me I'll make an effort to be nice to you... Can't promise niceness 100% of the time because well life isn't perfect and there are times when people need showing that it's not ok to behave like an idiot.

I think we learn from the judgement of others to some extent too. If you can bring something good out of a situation then all the better :)

workingatperfect

April 12th, 2013, 08:25 AM

Yeah, I agree. I don't like homophobes, the only way I wouldn't care, is if something happened to them that pertained to homosexuality, like if a guy got molested by another guy or whatever

You don't like homophobes, but you said yourself you disowned your cousin for sounded effeminate and called him an embarrassment. Also, haven't you said before that your voice is kind of "gay" sounding?

Oh, I also judge people who are really hypocritical. Everyone is hypocritical of certain things even if it's very slight, but when someone is just really hypocritical and makes an ass out of themselves constantly, I judge them.

Cicero

April 12th, 2013, 12:34 PM

You don't like homophobes, but you said yourself you disowned your cousin for sounded effeminate and called him an embarrassment. Also, haven't you said before that your voice is kind of "gay" sounding?

Oh, I also judge people who are really hypocritical. Everyone is hypocritical of certain things even if it's very slight, but when someone is just really hypocritical and makes an ass out of themselves constantly, I judge them.

No,I said I disowned him because he started to dress really weird. He starting wearing black makeup, started painting his nails black, turned his front hair red, and he started to wear black clothing. One second he was this cool cousin to hangout with, the next he started dressing and looking like that.

Haydenn3

April 12th, 2013, 12:39 PM

I judge everyone but never will i tell them what i think of them unless they really pi** me off i am not homophobic but i dont see why when SOME not all gay guys come out they feel the need to show it and become all women like and wear makeup i just dont see the point in it you might aswell have a sex change i have a friend whos brother is gay and you would not know it and he is the same way as me he does not see the point in being all camp and stuff

Stronger

April 12th, 2013, 12:44 PM

Desuetude

April 12th, 2013, 12:47 PM

No,I said I disowned him because he started to dress really weird. He starting wearing black makeup, started painting his nails black, turned his front hair red, and he started to wear black clothing. One second he was this cool cousin to hangout with, the next he started dressing and looking like that.
So you disowned him for expressing himself? You should be encouraging him to find himself and not be a sheep like most people. It takes a lot of courage to completely change how you look. Also just because he started dressing differently that doesn't necessarily mean he became any less of a 'cool cousin' you just never gave him a chance.

I'm pretty judgemental but usually I give people the benefit of the doubt and get to know them before I make up a solid opinion and even then, nothing is set in stone. The one thing I judge people on mostly is the music they're into and I know it's wrong but I can't help the first impression I get of them through their music taste.

Everyone is judgemental in one way or another. You cannot say you've never judged someone because when you see someone you will always make a first impression which will stick with you until something changes that. The least you can do is to not let first impressions get in the way of getting to know someone because that's when judging becomes a problem in my opinion.

Cicero

April 12th, 2013, 01:04 PM

So just because he decided to be himself, he's no longer cool? Sure he changed his appearence but does the change the person on the inside? I think not and you sit there and laugh, I don't see anything funny about it.
That's not the "himself" I knew 4 year prior. yeah probably. He was basically wanting a style that said "Hey everybody, look at me! I dress weird and I'm extremely loud and Inconsiderate" At least before when he was loud and Inconsiderate towards others, people didnt look at him and (probably) think "wow what a freak" but now they would've looked at him and thought "wow what a freak). My parents even think his mom was embarrassed (but would've never said anything) because before he went mentally downhill, they used to attend our parties, but then after, they stopped. Cause our family would've been there (my cousin is my step cousin to my family, my family could've easily thought the word freak when they saw him)

Before I would've thought it would've been cool going to his school, now if I did, I would've acted like I didn't know him (he's younger, so I would've had to wait till HS, but not like I would actually go to his school). Its not that I don't associate myself with losers, cause I do. I just don't associate myself with freaks (ie. my cousin).
So you disowned him for expressing himself? You should be encouraging him to find himself and not be a sheep like most people. It takes a lot of courage to completely change how you look. Also just because he started dressing differently that doesn't necessarily mean he became any less of a 'cool cousin' you just never gave him a chance.

I'm pretty judgemental but usually I give people the benefit of the doubt and get to know them before I make up a solid opinion and even then, nothing is set in stone. The one thing I judge people on mostly is the music they're into and I know it's wrong but I can't help the first impression I get of them through their music taste.

Everyone is judgemental in one way or another. You cannot say you've never judged someone because when you see someone you will always make a first impression which will stick with you until something changes that. The least you can do is to not let first impressions get in the way of getting to know someone because that's when judging becomes a problem in my opinion.

I gave him a chance, I gave him a 4 month chance thinking exactly what you said. I thought it was a phase of him trying to see what he liked. I would've never thought him using he's gay as an excuse for him to completely change. I didnt just see him change and say "bye", I saw him change, thought it was a phase and waited. But after I noticed it wasn't. I started to withdraw from seeing him and his family, it pained me cause I used to be so close to him. But I had also noticed that when he changed, I started to talk o his sister, my other cousin, a lot more.

Desuetude

April 12th, 2013, 01:24 PM

That's not the "himself" I knew 4 year prior. yeah probably. He was basically wanting a style that said "Hey everybody, look at me! I dress weird and I'm extremely loud and Inconsiderate" At least before when he was loud and Inconsiderate towards others, people didnt look at him and (probably) think "wow what a freak" but now they would've looked at him and thought "wow what a freak). My parents even think his mom was embarrassed (but would've never said anything) because before he went mentally downhill, they used to attend our parties, but then after, they stopped. Cause our family would've been there (my cousin is my step cousin to my family, my family could've easily thought the word freak when they saw him)

Before I would've thought it would've been cool going to his school, now if I did, I would've acted like I didn't know him (he's younger, so I would've had to wait till HS, but not like I would actually go to his school). Its not that I don't associate myself with losers, cause I do. I just don't associate myself with freaks (ie. my cousin).

I gave him a chance, I gave him a 4 month chance thinking exactly what you said. I thought it was a phase of him trying to see what he liked. I would've never thought him using he's gay as an excuse for him to completely change.
"He starting wearing black makeup, started painting his nails black, turned his front hair red, and he started to wear black clothing. One second he was this cool cousin to hangout with, the next he started dressing and looking like that."
You described how I choose to dress. Sure some might say it's different because I'm a girl and you could be all sexist but really, there's no point because it's not different.

Just because he doesn't dress like everybody else and doesn't choose to go along with the hella expensive fashion and stupidly overpriced designer brands that doesn't make him a freak. It doesn't make me a freak. Everyone should have the right to dress how they want without being afraid of being called names, especially by people you thought you could trust and rely on.

You've basically said his personality hasn't changed since before because he was "loud and inconsiderate" previous to the change in style. So you're also judging his personality on his appearance and that's just stupid putting it nicely. How would you like it if people judged you for the clothes you wear and used this as a reason not to get to know you because they'd already made up their minds that you're not worth it. That's how you're acting and in an extremely childish manner.

If I were his cousin I would be supporting him. I know about the looks and stares that he must get, I experience them myself and it's not fun. If you're giving him bullshit for expressing himself then I wouldn't be surprised if he's inconsiderate towards you. Why don't you take a moment to stop and think about how you treat people instead of making assumptions, especially about someone you've known (i'm assuming) for a large portion of your life.

Rayquaza

April 12th, 2013, 01:25 PM

That's not the "himself" I knew 4 year prior. yeah probably. He was basically wanting a style that said "Hey everybody, look at me! I dress weird and I'm extremely loud and Inconsiderate" At least before when he was loud and Inconsiderate towards others, people didnt look at him and (probably) think "wow what a freak" but now they would've looked at him and thought "wow what a freak). My parents even think his mom was embarrassed (but would've never said anything) because before he went mentally downhill, they used to attend our parties, but then after, they stopped. Cause our family would've been there (my cousin is my step cousin to my family, my family could've easily thought the word freak when they saw him)

Before I would've thought it would've been cool going to his school, now if I did, I would've acted like I didn't know him (he's younger, so I would've had to wait till HS, but not like I would actually go to his school). Its not that I don't associate myself with losers, cause I do. I just don't associate myself with freaks (ie. my cousin).

I gave him a chance, I gave him a 4 month chance thinking exactly what you said. I thought it was a phase of him trying to see what he liked. I would've never thought him using he's gay as an excuse for him to completely change. I didnt just see him change and say "bye", I saw him change, thought it was a phase and waited. But after I noticed it wasn't. I started to withdraw from seeing him and his family, it pained me cause I used to be so close to him. But I had also noticed that when he changed, I started to talk o his sister, my other cousin, a lot more.

Will you just stop coming up with lame excuses and actually listen to yourself for once? You've flip-flopped and contradicted yourself several times in this thread, and you sounds so stupid at the moment. You're talking like you're some 30 year old man, and it doesn't sound mature at all.

You said you disowned a cousin? How old are you? You're disowning someone who looks up to you as a role model just because he changed his god damn appearance? Have you lost your mind? So what if he wears black, just accept it. Who are you to dictate what and what not to wear? You said you hate homophobes right? This is just as bad as homophobia. He's wearing black because he likes it, the same another person comes out as gay and accepts it. You're just as bad a the parents that disown their children for coming out gay, where some of them don't even care about their sexuality, but moreover, their lifestyle. Besides, this isn't disowning, it's plain childish behaviour. If you seriously disowned him, you would have
1) not mentioned him
2) not said you've disowned him and admit it and
3) write "lol" next to it, because disowning someone is no laughing matter.

The people in this thread are being nice to you because they know you're going to complain about it but frankly I have seen the posts you have made here and they are absolutely down right ridiculous and complete balderdash. You better sort yourself and your connections before you end up a sad old man.

Cicero

April 12th, 2013, 01:34 PM

"He starting wearing black makeup, started painting his nails black, turned his front hair red, and he started to wear black clothing. One second he was this cool cousin to hangout with, the next he started dressing and looking like that."
You described how I choose to dress. Sure some might say it's different because I'm a girl and you could be all sexist but really, there's no point because it's not different.

Just because he doesn't dress like everybody else and doesn't choose to go along with the hella expensive fashion and stupidly overpriced designer brands that doesn't make him a freak. It doesn't make me a freak. Everyone should have the right to dress how they want without being afraid of being called names, especially by people you thought you could trust and rely on.

You've basically said his personality hasn't changed since before because he was "loud and inconsiderate" previous to the change in style. So you're also judging his personality on his appearance and that's just stupid putting it nicely. How would you like it if people judged you for the clothes you wear and used this as a reason not to get to know you because they'd already made up their minds that you're not worth it. That's how you're acting and in an extremely childish manner.

If I were his cousin I would be supporting him. I know about the looks and stares that he must get, I experience them myself and it's not fun. If you're giving him bullshit for expressing himself then I wouldn't be surprised if he's inconsiderate towards you. Why don't you take a moment to stop and think about how you treat people instead of making assumptions, especially about someone you've known (i'm assuming) for a large portion of your life.

I wasn't rude around him. I just started to withdraw from his family. I was always nice to him. It was just that inside, I felt embarrassed. But he never would've known I felt like that. I treated him like I always did.

It's different when a guy wears nail polish, if a girl does its not weird, yet if a guy does, it is. I don't mind that he wanted to be different, but that style, for me, is a bit of an extreme. His family are full of differents, I dont care. I thought it was awesome. But even in a family full of differents, he himself was REALLY different. His mom even told mine that she was a tad worried about him and didnt like his style.

Will you just stop coming up with lame excuses and actually listen to yourself for once? You've flip-flopped and contradicted yourself several times in this thread, and you sounds so stupid at the moment. You're talking like you're some 30 year old man, and it doesn't sound mature at all.

You said you disowned a cousin? How old are you? You're disowning someone who looks up to you as a role model just because he changed his god damn appearance? Have you lost your mind? So what if he wears black, just accept it. Who are you to dictate what and what not to wear? You said you hate homophobes right? This is just as bad as homophobia. He's wearing black because he likes it, the same another person comes out as gay and accepts it. You're just as bad a the parents that disown their children for coming out gay, where some of them don't even care about their sexuality, but moreover, their lifestyle. Besides, this isn't disowning, it's plain childish behaviour. If you seriously disowned him, you would have
1) not mentioned him
2) not said you've disowned him and admit it and
3) write "lol" next to it, because disowning someone is no laughing matter.

The people in this thread are being nice to you because they know you're going to complain about it but frankly I have seen the posts you have made here and they are absolutely down right ridiculous and complete balderdash. You better sort yourself and your connections before you end up a sad old man.

Just because he's coincidentally gay and turned weird, doesn't mean I'm a homophobe. That was just one cousin(me), and I'm sure his other cousins did the same exact thing to him (from the stories they used to tell me, they are extreme Christians). He changed everything I knew about him, if he eased into it, then sure, I would've been fine. But one weekend I saw his family and he was normal, then bam, the next weekend he has completely changed.

Emerald Dream

April 12th, 2013, 01:34 PM

The White Padded Room :arrow: Ramblings of the Wise

Asking for opinions on being judgmental.

Desuetude

April 12th, 2013, 01:45 PM

I wasn't rude around him. I just started to withdraw from his family. I was always nice to him. It was just that inside, I felt embarrassed. But he never would've known I felt like that. I treated him like I always did.

It's different when a guy wears nail polish, if a girl does its not weird, yet if a guy does, it is. I don't mind that he wanted to be different, but that style, for me, is a bit of an extreme. His family are full of differents, I dont care. I thought it was awesome. But even in a family full of differents, he himself was REALLY different. His mom even told mine that she was a tad worried about him and didnt like his style.
Hell, this is the sexist opinion we're trying to get out of peoples heads. My favourite band members wear nail polish and eye liner, why is it out of the norm when 'normal' people do? This is what should be changed. So what if he's a little different or a lot different than everyone else? That doesn't mean you should completely disregard him and stop talking to him.

You're saying different is awesome yet you've stated that he's an embarrassment and a freak. If you're going to make a point, please stop contradicting it. My parents don't like the way I dress! I bet lots of parents don't like the way their kids dress but we're not meant to be following along with our parents expectations. We're meant to be expanding our individuality and expressing ourselves freely and it's people like you that are the reason why others are scared of being different.

Cicero

April 12th, 2013, 02:09 PM

Hell, this is the sexist opinion we're trying to get out of peoples heads. My favourite band members wear nail polish and eye liner, why is it out of the norm when 'normal' people do? This is what should be changed. So what if he's a little different or a lot different than everyone else? That doesn't mean you should completely disregard him and stop talking to him.

You're saying different is awesome yet you've stated that he's an embarrassment and a freak. If you're going to make a point, please stop contradicting it. My parents don't like the way I dress! I bet lots of parents don't like the way their kids dress but we're not meant to be following along with our parents expectations. We're meant to be expanding our individuality and expressing ourselves freely and it's people like you that are the reason why others are scared of being different.
That kind of different isnt awesome, being a gamer type different is awesome, or being gay is a different type of awesome (although its not as different anymore, but still is around many parts of the world), being a designer/model/tattoo artist is a different type of awesome. I don't find the "Hey look at me screaming for attention" type of different awesome. All he is wanting to achieve is to be noticed in the wrong type of way. Like my one teacher was telling us how she went to the store, and saw this guy having cuts all over his face and she said he was just screaming for attention, this type of different isnt awesome, but weird.

It's not sexist saying guys shouldn't wear makeup or nail polish. Bt sadly, the line between male and female is just getting blurred and distorted.

Desuetude

April 12th, 2013, 02:53 PM

That kind of different isnt awesome, being a gamer type different is awesome, or being gay is a different type of awesome (although its not as different anymore, but still is around many parts of the world), being a designer/model/tattoo artist is a different type of awesome. I don't find the "Hey look at me screaming for attention" type of different awesome. All he is wanting to achieve is to be noticed in the wrong type of way. Like my one teacher was telling us how she went to the store, and saw this guy having cuts all over his face and she said he was just screaming for attention, this type of different isnt awesome, but weird.

It's not sexist saying guys shouldn't wear makeup or nail polish. Bt sadly, the line between male and female is just getting blurred and distorted.
Okay, so you tell me, how is he screaming for attention? That's literally all I want to know. How is he trying to be noticed in the wrong type of way because someone wearing black and expressing themselves in the form of what they wear isn't attention seeking.

Also did your teacher know that guy? Did she know what he was going through in his life? Did she know anything about how those cuts came about? I assume not. Then who is she to judge and who are you to listen to her? Maybe he got in a car accident. Anything could have happened. This is why you need to give people the benefit of the doubt.

Well to me, it's not sadly but a good thing. Why shouldn't they wear makeup? Who are we to dictate what people should wear and how they should look to be accepted into the fucked up society we live in? There shouldn't be a line between men and women and the fact that people are recognising that is great.

Cicero

April 12th, 2013, 02:58 PM

Okay, so you tell me, how is he screaming for attention? That's literally all I want to know. How is he trying to be noticed in the wrong type of way because someone wearing black and expressing themselves in the form of what they wear isn't attention seeking.

Also did your teacher know that guy? Did she know what he was going through in his life? Did she know anything about how those cuts came about? I assume not. Then who is she to judge and who are you to listen to her? Maybe he got in a car accident. Anything could have happened. This is why you need to give people the benefit of the doubt.

Well to me, it's not sadly but a good thing. Why shouldn't they wear makeup? Who are we to dictate what people should wear and how they should look to be accepted into the fucked up society we live in? There shouldn't be a line between men and women and the fact that people are recognising that is great.

My teacher assumed cause he was goth or emo (I don't know the different).

He's trying to get attention cause when he looks like that it points to him, cause most likely very few people look like that. Obviously if people see him wearing makeup and nail polish, they'll look at him

StoppingTime

April 12th, 2013, 03:01 PM

My teacher assumed cause he was goth or emo (I don't know the different).

Lol I'd like you to try and tell me what either of those terms even mean.

He's trying to get attention cause when he looks like that it points to him, cause most likely very few people look like that. Obviously if people see him wearing makeup and nail polish, they'll look at him

Or...... he's just expressing himself in a way that most people don't. It's really that simple.

And let's look at this hypothetically. What if he was doing it for attention? Who honestly gives a fuck?

Cicero

April 12th, 2013, 03:05 PM

Lol I'd like you to try and tell me what either of those terms even mean.

Or...... he's just expressing himself in a way that most people don't. It's really that simple.

And let's look at this hypothetically. What if he was doing it for attention? Who honestly gives a fuck?

Emo means cutting and wears black

And goth reminds me of a vampire for some reason lol

I hate attention. I never want attention, I'm shy, not loud.

I don't understand why he changed when he came out. His parents were already accepting. He could've done it before (and he did, but it wasn't as extreme)

Desuetude

April 12th, 2013, 03:05 PM

My teacher assumed cause he was goth or emo (I don't know the different).

He's trying to get attention cause when he looks like that it points to him, cause most likely very few people look like that. Obviously if people see him wearing makeup and nail polish, they'll look at him
You just proved my point. She knew nothing about him. She assumed. She doesn't know what the cuts were a result of and even then went off to spread rumours about someone she knows fuck all about. That's pretty heartless.

That's not necessarily attention seeking. I know I didn't change the clothes I wear because I wanted attention, I wanted less attention than I was getting but I feel comfortable putting on the clothes I like and don't have to be ashamed at hiding myself anymore. So? Who cares if people look at him. Good for him for standing out and standing up to people who think like you do. Really, you and your teacher are very alike in this instance and I'm sorry to say but you're both very wrong.
Emo means cutting and wears black

And goth reminds me of a vampire for some reason lol

I hate attention. I never want attention, I'm shy, not loud.

I don't understand why he changed when he came out. His parents were already accepting. He could've done it before (and he did, but it wasn't as extreme)
I have to admit you are very ignorant, you could at least do your research before slapping on terms you don't even know the meaning of.

Emo is a style of music. That's it. The definition of emo has been very, very badly distorted.
Gothic is also a style of music but can also lead into lifestyle and fashion. It's not about vampires or satan or anything like that.

You not wanting attention has nothing to do with what we're talking about.
Maybe this is about him feeling comfortable enough that he'd come out to express how he really feels. He wasn't trying to win the acceptance of anyone but just feel like himself without the fear of being judged. Obviously he didn't get that though. I think you've really misinterpreted everything about your cousin.

Troy35216

April 12th, 2013, 03:11 PM

I don't think I judge people so much but to be honest i am finding out that sometimes my first impressions of people have turned out to be wrong. So i guess that does count as judging so now I feel like an ass. but when i realize that my first impression was wrong I try to make up for it. and it is wrong both ways. sometimes I think someone is cool or nice or whatever and it turns out he's a dick. or sometimes I think someone is a total asshole or a racist or not too smart or whatever and then find out i was totally wrong. and sometimes it's not a good/bad thing. like i assume someone is poor who isn't, or assume someone is rich who isn't. it's not that I judge them for being that way but I might treat them differently. Like if i think someone is poor i make an excuse to accidentally have an extra burger or something dumb like that and then it turns out i'm the one being a dick accidentally. lol i always over think these things and my answers are 4 times as long as they need to be. so I "judge" by being too quick to form first impressions but I don't judge by someone's race or sexuality or anything like that, if that makes sense.

StoppingTime

April 12th, 2013, 03:12 PM

Emo means cutting and wears black

Lol omg you have no idea what you're saying. If you really stereotype people wearing black as "those emos who cut themselves and listen to metal all day" then there's an issue.

And goth reminds me of a vampire for some reason lol

.....

I hate attention. I never want attention, I'm shy, not loud.

So everyone has to be like you?

Cicero

April 12th, 2013, 03:51 PM

Lol omg you have no idea what you're saying. If you really stereotype people wearing black as "those emos who cut themselves and listen to metal all day" then there's an issue.

.....

So everyone has to be like you?

Well typically your friends are like you. So in a way he has to be like me if he wants to be my friend, otherwise, I will make sure everyone knows he is my STEP-cousin

You just proved my point. She knew nothing about him. She assumed. She doesn't know what the cuts were a result of and even then went off to spread rumours about someone she knows fuck all about. That's pretty heartless.

That's not necessarily attention seeking. I know I didn't change the clothes I wear because I wanted attention, I wanted less attention than I was getting but I feel comfortable putting on the clothes I like and don't have to be ashamed at hiding myself anymore. So? Who cares if people look at him. Good for him for standing out and standing up to people who think like you do. Really, you and your teacher are very alike in this instance and I'm sorry to say but you're both very wrong.

I have to admit you are very ignorant, you could at least do your research before slapping on terms you don't even know the meaning of.

Emo is a style of music. That's it. The definition of emo has been very, very badly distorted.
Gothic is also a style of music but can also lead into lifestyle and fashion. It's not about vampires or satan or anything like that.

You not wanting attention has nothing to do with what we're talking about.
Maybe this is about him feeling comfortable enough that he'd come out to express how he really feels. He wasn't trying to win the acceptance of anyone but just feel like himself without the fear of being judged. Obviously he didn't get that though. I think you've really misinterpreted everything about your cousin.
Most everyone where I live is like me when it comes to stuff like that, even in the city next to our small town it's kinda like that.

I never knew what those two terms meant, it's just based off of what others tell me.

StoppingTime

April 12th, 2013, 03:53 PM

Well typically your friends are like you. So in a way he has to be like me if he wants to be my friend, otherwise, I will make sure everyone knows he is my STEP-cousin

Well then I guess it shows that you're not a supportive friend. If you're not going to support your friend just because he chooses to dress differently than you, that's ridiculous. He didn't do anything wrong, and you're only making him feel worse.

Cygnus

April 12th, 2013, 03:55 PM

Being very judgmental is usually a sign of low self-esteem, just putting it out there.

Desuetude

April 12th, 2013, 03:59 PM

Well typically your friends are like you. So in a way he has to be like me if he wants to be my friend, otherwise, I will make sure everyone knows he is my STEP-cousin

Most everyone where I live is like me when it comes to stuff like that, even in the city next to our small town it's kinda like that.

I never knew what those two terms meant, it's just based off of what others tell me.
Wow that's really pathetic. My friends are absolutely nothing like me and it'd be really boring if we were all the same, don't you think? If you act like sheep and follow everyone else's style and trend then people will have less respect for you. If you're trying to mould him into someone he's not just so he can say he's friends with you then I don't think it's even worth it for him. Wow, that's low. Really low. So because he doesn't dress the way you want him to you're going to emphasis the fact that you're not blood related. That's one of the most pathetic things I've heard.

So you go along with what most people tell you? Could you not take 5 minutes of your time just to search up the words and find out for yourself instead of labelling people when you have no idea what you're saying?

Cicero

April 12th, 2013, 03:59 PM

Well then I guess it shows that you're not a supportive friend. If you're not going to support your friend just because he chooses to dress differently than you, that's ridiculous. He didn't do anything wrong, and you're only making him feel worse.

Well, I really wasn't his friend. But we were cousins.

Being very judgmental is usually a sign of low self-esteem, just putting it out there.

That's usually what people say to make themselves feel better about themselves for being bullied or judged, like when people say "Bullies bully because they are hurting inside" though that may be true, there are many people who bully because they may think that person is a freak or what not.

Bt yes, I do have a low self esteem, and that may be a reason why I don't want to be around him. Cause I worry people will associate myself with him. But it's also cause I don't like associating myself with people like that, people like that are always negative and I hate extra negative attention. I'm not like people like my cousin.

Wow that's really pathetic. My friends are absolutely nothing like me and it'd be really boring if we were all the same, don't you think? If you act like sheep and follow everyone else's style and trend then people will have less respect for you. If you're trying to mould him into someone he's not just so he can say he's friends with you then I don't think it's even worth it for him. Wow, that's low. Really low. So because he doesn't dress the way you want him to you're going to emphasis the fact that you're not blood related. That's one of the most pathetic things I've heard.

So you go along with what most people tell you? Could you not take 5 minutes of your time just to search up the words and find out for yourself instead of labelling people when you have no idea what you're saying?
I go along with my own style. Somedays, I don't have a style I'm just so lazy. I still like him, but I don't like his new style. Something happened between our two families and we haven't talked for a while, but if we did I will still treat him with kindness. I'm just gonna be embarrassed when we go out in public. I would most likely be forced to hangout with him if I wanted to hangout with his sister my other cousin

Stronger

April 12th, 2013, 04:11 PM

Well, I really wasn't his friend. But we were cousins.

That's usually what people say to make themselves feel better about themselves for being bullied or judged, like when people say "Bullies bully because they are hurting inside" though that may be true, there are many people who bully because they may think that person is a freak or what not.

Bt yes, I do have a low self esteem, and that may be a reason why I don't want to be around him. Cause I worry people will associate myself with him. But it's also cause I don't like associating myself with people like that, people like that are always negative and I hate extra negative attention. I'm not like people like my cousin.

I go along with my own style. Somedays, I don't have a style I'm just so lazy

Wow, oh wow Jason, you are a character, like seriously, who the fuck cares what people think, he's your fucking cousin, and you abandoned him, how can you even feel remotely good about yourself. This is where society is fucked up, people shouldn't have to hide there true person. No one said you had to be just like him, but show him you actually support him, but you don't and you still there and laugh, disgusting.

Skyline

April 12th, 2013, 04:11 PM

Well, I really wasn't his friend. But we were cousins.

That's usually what people say to make themselves feel better about themselves for being bullied or judged, like when people say "Bullies bully because they are hurting inside" though that may be true, there are many people who bully because they may think that person is a freak or what not.

Bt yes, I do have a low self esteem, and that may be a reason why I don't want to be around him. Cause I worry people will associate myself with him. But it's also cause I don't like associating myself with people like that, people like that are always negative and I hate extra negative attention. I'm not like people like my cousin.

I go along with my own style. Somedays, I don't have a style I'm just so lazy

If I mask ask... what exactly are "people like you cousin" like?

Cicero

April 12th, 2013, 04:17 PM

Wow, oh wow Jason, you are a character, like seriously, who the fuck cares what people think, he's your fucking cousin, and you abandoned him, how can you even feel remotely good about yourself. This is where society is fucked up, people shouldn't have to hide there true person. No one said you had to be just like him, but show him you actually support him, but you don't and you still there and laugh, disgusting.
Well, I don't have to support the way he wants to live, but I will be nice to him if I ever saw him.
If I mask ask... what exactly are "people like you cousin" like?

Dark, satanic supporting, wears dark clothing that's depressing, wears dark makeup, etc.

Desuetude

April 12th, 2013, 04:36 PM

Well, I don't have to support the way he wants to live, but I will be nice to him if I ever saw him.

Dark, satanic supporting, wears dark clothing that's depressing, wears dark makeup, etc.
His clothes hardly show how he wants to live.

You really are one of the most closed minded, ignorant people I've ever come across. You think that wearing dark clothes implies negativity? Do you understand the meaning of the word depressing/depression? I'm here trying to work out how a colour is 'depression' because the reason the only colour I wear is black is because it's a nice colour. Because I want to express myself by wearing a colour I feel comfortable in and because I don't want to stand out too much - which is what happens to people wearing loads of colour, therefore trying to minimise attention centred around me. Do you ever just stop, think and listen to what you're saying?

Oh and what in the world has your cousin done to make you think he's 'satanic supporting'? Please, enlighten us.

Rayquaza

April 12th, 2013, 04:39 PM

Just because he's coincidentally gay and turned weird, doesn't mean I'm a homophobe. That was just one cousin(me), and I'm sure his other cousins did the same exact thing to him (from the stories they used to tell me, they are extreme Christians). He changed everything I knew about him, if he eased into it, then sure, I would've been fine. But one weekend I saw his family and he was normal, then bam, the next weekend he has completely changed.

Stories? Easing into it? Normal then changed? This is by far the sorriest attempt of excuses I have seen by far. Ever. I didn't say you were homophobic, I was saying you were just as bad as those that are homophobic, disowning someone all of a sudden because they're doing something that's not frowned upon by society and makes them happy. Who actually cares what you think? You're just ignorant and you need to take a look at yourself before you judge others.

And I don't care what stories are said. You have sunken so low that you're blaming everything around you for your views when actually it's you, and will always be you to have these ideas. You're incredibly immature for thinking this way.

Emo means cutting and wears black

And goth reminds me of a vampire for some reason lol

I hate attention. I never want attention, I'm shy, not loud.

I don't understand why he changed when he came out. His parents were already accepting. He could've done it before (and he did, but it wasn't as extreme)

What an arrogant, chauvinistic, close minded opinion you have on the world, my dear friend. You think "emo" means cutting and wearing black? I feel sick having to read that. That is totally stereotypical of you. Don't so be damn facetious. Emo DOES NOT mean that. And who gives a shit if goths remind you of vampires. Are you too thick to realise they're not the same thing?

Wasn't as extreme? You come out and that's it. There is no "measure of extremeness".

I hate attention. I never want attention, I'm shy, not loud.

I am just reeling at this statement. You love attention, you say you're shy but your posts scream for attention. You say the most contradictory and controversial subjects ever, you always say things that deviate from social norms.

Well, I really wasn't his friend. But we were cousins.

That's usually what people say to make themselves feel better about themselves for being bullied or judged, like when people say "Bullies bully because they are hurting inside" though that may be true, there are many people who bully because they may think that person is a freak or what not.

Bt yes, I do have a low self esteem, and that may be a reason why I don't want to be around him. Cause I worry people will associate myself with him. But it's also cause I don't like associating myself with people like that, people like that are always negative and I hate extra negative attention. I'm not like people like my cousin.

I go along with my own style. Somedays, I don't have a style I'm just so lazy. I still like him, but I don't like his new style. Something happened between our two families and we haven't talked for a while, but if we did I will still treat him with kindness. I'm just gonna be embarrassed when we go out in public. I would most likely be forced to hangout with him if I wanted to hangout with his sister my other cousin

Gosh, this is where you're blaming him again. Just stop it and accept him. The world doesn't revolve around you.

Dark, satanic supporting, wears dark clothing that's depressing, wears dark makeup, etc.

And this is where I worry for that little boy, the cousin you disowned, looking up to you, an uneducated cretin. If you seriously disowned him, then good, actually. You're not going to change your views and you're too ignorant to see whole picture, but rather focus on your one area and throw different arguments which have no meaning. Stop blaming him for everything, because your feelings are entirely your fault, and is in your control. I'm sorry but you and your opinions are just a massive one way road. You can only say why you're correct and not take what people say or admit you're wrong, when frankly you are.

Cicero

April 12th, 2013, 04:39 PM

His clothes hardly show how he wants to live.

You really are one of the most closed minded, ignorant people I've ever come across. You think that wearing dark clothes implies negativity? Do you understand the meaning of the word depressing/depression? I'm here trying to work out how a colour is 'depression' because the reason the only colour I wear is black is because it's a nice colour. Because I want to express myself by wearing a colour I feel comfortable in and because I don't want to stand out too much - which is what happens to people wearing loads of colour, therefore trying to minimise attention centred around me. Do you ever just stop, think and listen to what you're saying?

Oh and what in the world has your cousin done to make you think he's 'satanic supporting'? Please, enlighten us.

Well, when I see someone wearing all black I think "They must be depressed". I'm depressed but I don't wear black. Idk, it's just what I associate it with.

He does witch craft, listens to artists who are known satanists, and he draws pictures with Satan in them

Stronger

April 12th, 2013, 04:41 PM

Well, I don't have to support the way he wants to live, but I will be nice to him if I ever saw him.

Dark, satanic supporting, wears dark clothing that's depressing, wears dark makeup, etc.

No I guess you don't, and from the looks of it, I wouldn't want your support either.

So what your saying, everyone should wear bright colourful rainbow clothing, with neon and sparkles?

Cicero

April 12th, 2013, 04:43 PM

Stories? Easing into it? Normal then changed? This is by far the sorriest attempt of excuses I have seen by far. Ever. I didn't say you were homophobic, I was saying you were just as bad as those that are homophobic, disowning someone all of a sudden because they're doing something that's not frowned upon by society and makes them happy. Who actually cares what you think? You're just ignorant and you need to take a look at yourself before you judge others.

And I don't care what stories are said. You have sunken so low that you're blaming everything around you for your views when actually it's you, and will always be you to have these ideas. You're incredibly immature for thinking this way.

What an arrogant, chauvinistic, close minded opinion you have on the world, my dear friend. You think "emo" means cutting and wearing black? I feel sick having to read that. That is totally stereotypical of you. Don't so be damn facetious. Emo DOES NOT mean that. And who gives a shit if goths remind you of vampires. Are you too thick to realise they're not the same thing?

Wasn't as extreme? You come out and that's it. There is no "measure of extremeness".

I am just reeling at this statement. You love attention, you say you're shy but your posts scream for attention. You say the most contradictory and controversial subjects ever, you always say things that deviate from social norms.

Gosh, this is where you're blaming him again. Just stop it and accept him. The world doesn't revolve around you.

And this is where I worry for that little boy, the cousin you disowned, looking up to you, an uneducated cretin. If you seriously disowned him, then good, actually. You're not going to change your views and you're too ignorant to see whole picture, but rather focus on your one area and throw different arguments which have no meaning. Stop blaming him for everything, because your feelings are entirely your fault, and is in your control. I'm sorry but you and your opinions are just a massive one way road. You can only say why you're correct and not take what people say or admit you're wrong, when frankly you are.

Yah, before he tried out the dark clothing and died his hair black. But it wasn't as extreme as he became after he came out. He then started wearing chains around his neck and nail polish and dark clothes and dark colored makeup. I don't like attention. But on here I feel like I can post my opinions. In real life, I'm very shy and quiet.

No I guess you don't, and from the looks of it, I wouldn't want your support either.

So what your saying, everyone should wear bright colourful rainbow clothing, with neon and sparkles?
Only in a perfect world. Lol Jk.

People IMO should just look normal.

Rayquaza

April 12th, 2013, 04:45 PM

Yah, before he tried out the dark clothing and died his hair black. But it wasn't as extreme as he became after he came out. He then started wearing chains around his neck and nail polish and dark clothes and dark colored makeup. I don't like attention. But on here I feel like I can post my opinions. In real life, I'm very shy and quiet.

Stop dodging the question.

And basically, what you're saying is
"I act tough on the internet because I'm too weak to stand up for myself offline"

Desuetude

April 12th, 2013, 04:47 PM

Well, when I see someone wearing all black I think "They must be depressed". I'm depressed but I don't wear black. Idk, it's just what I associate it with.

He does witch craft, listens to artists who are known satanists, and he draws pictures with Satan in them
Well I really think it's time you change your opinion about that because one, it's not true and two, it's a pathetic stereotype that's going to get you no where and fast if you keep at it. It's the same as you looking at someone wearing all pink and thinking "they must be really happy and love fairies and cooking and make up and all the girly stuff" when really, they just love the colour and the rest of that bullshit is very unlikely to be true.

Is he hurting anyone by being involved in this? By being interested in Satan he's doing nothing to harm you. It's won't affect you so why are you so damn against this poor boy who you're meant to be guiding. With your closed minded, bigoted opinions he really wouldn't get far at all so maybe it's for the best that he doesn't associate with you anymore.

Stronger

April 12th, 2013, 04:50 PM

Yah, before he tried out the dark clothing and died his hair black. But it wasn't as extreme as he became after he came out. He then started wearing chains around his neck and nail polish and dark clothes and dark colored makeup. I don't like attention. But on here I feel like I can post my opinions. In real life, I'm very shy and quiet.

Only in a perfect world. Lol Jk.

People IMO should just look normal.

Humour me, what is your defintion of "normal".

Cicero

April 12th, 2013, 04:52 PM

Stop dodging the question.

And basically, what you're saying is
"I act tough on the internet because I'm too weak to stand up for myself offline"
Kinda yeah, kinda no.

I won't be the one to always bring up my beliefs, but if its relevant I will. If everyone at the table is saying "I love abortion!" I will be the one to say "I dislike abortion."
Well I really think it's time you change your opinion about that because one, it's not true and two, it's a pathetic stereotype that's going to get you no where and fast if you keep at it. It's the same as you looking at someone wearing all pink and thinking "they must be really happy and love fairies and cooking and make up and all the girly stuff" when really, they just love the colour and the rest of that bullshit is very unlikely to be true.

Is he hurting anyone by being involved in this? By being interested in Satan he's doing nothing to harm you. It's won't affect you so why are you so damn against this poor boy who you're meant to be guiding. With your closed minded, bigoted opinions he really wouldn't get far at all so maybe it's for the best that he doesn't associate with you anymore.

I'd also think that about people who wear the color pink all the time. So can you tell me what the big difference is between emo and goth? All I learned is that it's a type of music.

Apollo.

April 12th, 2013, 04:52 PM

Stop dodging the question.

And basically, what you're saying is
"I act tough on the internet because I'm too weak to stand up for myself offline"

So do you bully people like Cicero because if you tried to bully someone in real life they would kick the shit out of you?

Seriously you and the rest of your little VT clique of old members need to sort it out! You all think you own the fucking site well you dont! Your all pathetic online bullies!

Oh and yeah infract me because I've ran out of fucks to give on this site!

Rayquaza

April 12th, 2013, 04:54 PM

Kinda yeah, kinda no.

I won't be the one to always bring up my beliefs, but if its relevant I will. If everyone at the table is saying "I love abortion!" I will be the one to say "I dislike abortion."

I'd also think that about people who wear the color pink all the time. So can you tell me what the big difference is between emo and goth? All I learned is that it's a type of music.

Firstly, yes it is what you said. Don't take back something when I've simplified your words into something shorter with identical meaning.

And also, you just said that it emos were cutters, and that people that wear black are satan-lovers. Stop beating around the bush and admit you're wrong, because this is getting beyond ridiculous now. They are not "types of music", since when did Emo and Goth become Genres?

So do you bully people like Cicero because if you tried to bully someone in real life they would kick the shit out of you?

Seriously you and the rest of your little VT clique of old members need to sort it out! You all think you own the fucking site well you dont! Your all pathetic online bullies!

Oh and yeah infract me because I've ran out of fucks to give on this site!

If you think that me having a debate and stating why someone is wrong, in a debating forum, is bullying, you seriously need to get your shit together. Stop conforming to anti-conformity and say something if it's relevant to the thread rather than coming here and causing un-necessary arguments out of nothing.

Desuetude

April 12th, 2013, 04:55 PM

I'd also think that about people who wear the color pink all the time. So can you tell me what the big difference is between emo and goth? All I learned is that it's a type of music.
There are no words.

Is there no way you could be independent and search this up for yourself or are you yet again going to take the words from someone else? You need to learn to back up your evidence by finding out first and and stop being so damn lazy.

Cicero

April 12th, 2013, 05:03 PM

Firstly, yes it is what you said. Don't take back something when I've simplified your words into something shorter with identical meaning.

And also, you just said that it emos were cutters, and that people that wear black are satan-lovers. Stop beating around the bush and admit you're wrong, because this is getting beyond ridiculous now. They are not "types of music", since when did Emo and Goth become Genres?

If you think that me having a debate and stating why someone is wrong, in a debating forum, is bullying, you seriously need to get your shit together. Stop conforming to anti-conformity and say something if it's relevant to the thread rather than coming here and causing un-necessary arguments out of nothing.

I said my cousin was into satan and stuff like that.

Nikki said it was a type of music

You just proved my point. She knew nothing about him. She assumed. She doesn't know what the cuts were a result of and even then went off to spread rumours about someone she knows fuck all about. That's pretty heartless.

That's not necessarily attention seeking. I know I didn't change the clothes I wear because I wanted attention, I wanted less attention than I was getting but I feel comfortable putting on the clothes I like and don't have to be ashamed at hiding myself anymore. So? Who cares if people look at him. Good for him for standing out and standing up to people who think like you do. Really, you and your teacher are very alike in this instance and I'm sorry to say but you're both very wrong.

I have to admit you are very ignorant, you could at least do your research before slapping on terms you don't even know the meaning of.

Emo is a style of music. That's it. The definition of emo has been very, very badly distorted.
Gothic is also a style of music but can also lead into lifestyle and fashion. It's not about vampires or satan or anything like that.

You not wanting attention has nothing to do with what we're talking about.
Maybe this is about him feeling comfortable enough that he'd come out to express how he really feels. He wasn't trying to win the acceptance of anyone but just feel like himself without the fear of being judged. Obviously he didn't get that though. I think you've really misinterpreted everything about your cousin.

There are no words.

Is there no way you could be independent and search this up for yourself or are you yet again going to take the words from someone else? You need to learn to back up your evidence by finding out first and and stop being so damn lazy.
So I googled it and here's what came up:

emo is short for emotional. The difference between emo and goth is that emo is a little punkier and emos tend to be more of cutters. Other than that, they're pretty much the same.

Apollo.

April 12th, 2013, 05:07 PM

Desuetude

April 12th, 2013, 05:08 PM

So I googled it and here's what came up:
And which reliable source did that come from?

Cicero

April 12th, 2013, 05:10 PM

And which reliable source did that come from?

Google --->>> Yahoo!

Desuetude

April 12th, 2013, 05:12 PM

Google --->>> Yahoo!
Yahoo is a reliable source? I don't think so. If you just accept and listen to everything you see on the internet by clicking on the first source avaliable you're never going to learn.

nice

April 12th, 2013, 05:12 PM

Google --->>> Yahoo!

It honestly looks like something from urban dictionary

Cicero

April 12th, 2013, 05:14 PM

Yahoo is a reliable source? I don't think so. If you just accept and listen to everything you see on the internet by clicking on the first source avaliable you're never going to learn.

That's why I requested assistance from you. You know what to look for better, I'm an outsider looking in.

Origami

April 12th, 2013, 05:15 PM

Dearest Cicero, while these are not always the most accredited resources, they sure do beat Yahoo.

"Emo (pron.: /ˈiːmoʊ/) is a style of rock music characterized by melodic musicianship and expressive, often confessional lyrics. It originated in the mid-1980s hardcore punk movement of Washington, D.C., where it was known as "emotional hardcore" or "emocore" and pioneered by bands such as Rites of Spring and Embrace."

Desuetude

April 12th, 2013, 05:20 PM

That's why I requested assistance from you. You know what to look for better, I'm an outsider looking in.
It's not hard to know what is and isn't reliable. A damn dictionary is all it takes.
Main points:
a style of rock music resembling punk but having more complex arrangements and lyrics that deal with more emotional subjects.
a style of rock music derived from punk, typically with apocalyptic or mystical lyrics.

Underneath it also has this which basically stereotypes 'emo' and 'goth'
-an admirer of emo music or a member of the subculture associated with it, typically favouring black clothing and long dyed black hair
-a member of a subculture favouring black clothing, white and black make-up, and goth music.

StoppingTime

April 12th, 2013, 05:20 PM

Well look at that, we've gone so incredibly off topic once again.

As Mike said in an earlier thread today, the apparent fighting in threads won't be tolerated. If you see a thread which you know is only going to go down the road of bashing, off topic debates, personal attacks, and all that, just ignore it and move on. There's absolutely no reason to "feed" a thread like this, and it only ends up in angering people, and infractions needing to be issued.
No member here is more or less entitled to say anything to anyone, and you've all been here long enough to know that, without a doubt. These "debates" (though it's more yelling back and forth honestly) not only make the site look unwelcoming, but current members are angered by them, as well. This should be a community void of that, and I really expect you guys to understand that. Too many of these threads have been coming up lately, and they need to stop now.

I encourage any of you to PM me (http://www.virtualteen.org/forums/private.php?do=newpm&u=39049) with any questions, comments, etc.

We're done here. :locked: