OK im confusing my self.

[Professional Russian]

Is there a difference between a 69 Pontiac GTO and a 69 Pontiac GTO Judge?

[Stig]

Yes. The judge had a different engine, a spoiler on the back, special paint and decals as well as different wheels.

[Professional Russian]

Yes. The judge had a different engine, a spoiler on the back, special paint and decals as well as different wheels.

That's what I thought...now just to find one that's at or below 18000

[West Coast Sheriff]

They were different, these should explain it.

No, the Lemans and the GTO Judge are different, however they share the same sheetmetal and running gear (frame) for the most part. Think of it like an option, some GTO's came with an automatic, some were ordered with a 4-speed.
posted:* February 27, 2009

GTO Judge was the top of the line for 69 I believe, I think they had larger engines also?

Not all were Judges. It was an option that included a special paint and striping package, The Ram Air intake system which was really cool. Most GTO's hood scoops were sealed. The Ram Air had a vacuum operated set of dampers mounted to the underside of the hood. This mated to the aircleaner inlets when the hood was shut. I think, but am not sure that all Judges came with the Ram Air 4 engine. This motor was a BEAST!! I had a base model GTO with the standard 400 hp engine and it would fly. I never drove a RA 4 car, but I rode in a freinds several times and watched him blow my doors off regularly. The RA engine was a lot more powerful. Don't pay any attention to horsepower ratings. They were grossly underrated on these muscle engines. I think mine was rated at 330 horses. Back then (1974) we had biased ply hard compound tires. Good thing they were cheap! With the posi 3.73 rear end I went through a set in a couple months. Anyway, with those tires , trying to keep from spinning, I could run between 13.10's to 13.50's without really pushing the rpms. That GTO was probably the best car I ever owned. My folks sold it when they moved while I was in the service. I wish I still had it. You have a fine car there. With today's tires, and aftermarket suspension pieces you can inexpensively build a sweet driver. If you are not restoring, consider Chevy big-block power. It will be much cheaper than a Pontiac 400 or 455. My cousin built a 70 GTO with a Chev 427 once. Good luck, have fun!

[Boss...]

The Judge was basicly just a trim package, blacked out grill, decals, and spoiler. But they came with either a ram air intake or the HO engine.

And as for getting a Goat for under 18000 thats going to be hard. Here are the current market values I jacked from another site.

.............................low...........good.........high.........Price when New
Judge Convertible...$13,500...$40,600....$67,700....$3,714
Judge Hardtop........$12,200...$36,600....$61,100....$3,488
Convertible.............$9,000.....$27,100....$45,100....$3,382
Hardtop..................$8,100.....$24,400....$40,700....$3,156

low- almost done project
good- driver quaility
high- showroom new

[Professional Russian]

The Judge was basicly just a trim package, blacked out grill, decals, and spoiler. But they came with either a ram air intake or the HO engine.

And as for getting a Goat for under 18000 thats going to be hard. Here are the current market values I jacked from another site.

.............................low...........good.........high.........Price when New
Judge Convertible...$13,500...$40,600....$67,700....$3,714
Judge Hardtop........$12,200...$36,600....$61,100....$3,488
Convertible.............$9,000.....$27,100....$45,100....$3,382
Hardtop..................$8,100.....$24,400....$40,700....$3,156

low- almost done project
good- driver quaility
high- showroom new

I do want one that needs some restoration for a learning expierence

[Boss...]

I do want one that needs some restoration for a learning expierence

If you just want a learning experience, get something thats cheap and has lot of parts availabe, like a 1964- 1968 mustang. Do that car up right and make a few thousand and buy a goat.