Why does everyone believe murder is wrong?

[triggerperson]

Can you really prove that murder is wrong? I mean, you can say it's immoral but since you can't even prove that morality is something that's true then that's a pointless argument. I guess you could say, "well it's against the law" which is true but the law only exist to try to keep society harmonized (not that it's working 100%). My point is, can anybody prove that murder is wrong? And if nobody can, why does everyone believe so?

Bonus question: Why do people only care about homicide then? What about gallinicide (those delicious nuggets of yours), vaccicide (hamburgers), culicide (mosquitoes)?

P.S. I don't want to committ murder myself and this is me justifying it (I don't see the point in such actions). I'm just curious. :)

[West Coast Sheriff]

How can you even ask that? Murder is wrong! Bottom line! Trying to justify it is just insane.

[triggerperson]

How can you even ask that? Murder is wrong! Bottom line! Trying to justify it is just insane.

I'm not trying to justify it but if the best argument against it is, "Murder is wrong! Bottom line!" Then that's kinda idiotic.

[Lost in the Echo]

It's wrong because nobody has the right to take another person's life. I don't know how you could seriously ask this ridiculous question, imagine what the world would be like if people just went around killing each other. Now justify how that isn't "wrong".

[PinkFloyd]

Are you suggesting that tragedies like the Holocaust or the 9/11 terrorist attacks weren't wrong in any way at all? kids with out their mothers at the dinner table. kids not born at all. That stuff is wrong. My point is that most people deserve to live and not have that jeprodised because their human and have a lot to offer the world.

[triggerperson]

It's wrong because nobody has the right to take another person's life. I don't know how you could seriously ask this ridiculous question, imagine what the world would be like if people just went around killing each other. Now justify how that isn't "wrong".

Are you suggesting that tragedies like the Holocaust or the 9/11 terrorist attacks weren't wrong in any way at all? kids with out their mothers at the dinner table. kids not born at all. That stuff is wrong. My point is that most people deserve to live and not have that jeprodised because their human and have a lot to offer the world.

You're not proving anything. All you are giving me are opinions, beliefs. Nothing concrete.

[PinkFloyd]

What to you is ""concrete""?

[triggerperson]

What to you is ""concrete""?

Facts.

[PinkFloyd]

What to you is ""concrete""?

side walk, pool floor, artificial rock?

[triggerperson]

What to you is ""concrete""?

side walk, pool floor, artificial rock?

What? No, concrete as in, "having verified existence". Jeez.

[Mob Boss]

How is morality not "true", in the first place? Aside from sociopaths - who apparently lack that voice of conscience that guide them - everyone has some kind of moral judgement, so saying it isn't true is a bit odd. Morals may not exist as a physical force, but they exist. Morality aside, murder of one own's species is just poor survival strategy. You (and when I say "you", I mean everyone) benefits from societal structure, so it would make sense to follow the rules of said society. "Wrong" might be the wrong word to use, if we're taking morality out of the equation, but "illadvised" would suit. Murder is irrational, unless given certain circumstances, in which case it would most likely be considered self-defense.

[triggerperson]

How is morality not "true", in the first place? Aside from sociopaths - who apparently lack that voice of conscience that guide them - everyone has some kind of moral judgement, so saying it isn't true is a bit odd. Morals may not exist as a physical force, but they exist. Morality aside, murder of one own's species is just poor survival strategy. You (and when I say "you" I mean anyone) benefits from societal structure, so it would make sense to follow the rules of said society. "Wrong" might be the wrong word to use, if we're taking morality out of the equation, but "illadvised" would suit. Murder is irrational, unless given certain circumstances, in which case it would most likely be considered self-defense.

Huh, it's like I've stepped into The Twilight Zone. Someone capable of thinking on this website. Unbelievable. Anyway, I mean morality isn't true in the sense that it's not absolute. There is no right morality and wrong morality, it depends on who you ask. Like, some believe murder can be justified (death penalty) while some don't. Who's right? Who's wrong? There is no way to know. And I agree it's "illadvised" but that wasn't the question now was it?

[Lost in the Echo]

You're not proving anything. All you are giving me are opinions, beliefs. Nothing concrete.

What the fuck has to be "concrete" about it. Everyone would be fucking crazy if we just went around killing each other. Everyone has beliefs, but trying to justify that nothing is wrong with murder is just completely crazy as fuck. How would you feel if someone you were close with got murdered, would you still say nothing is wrong with murder?

Not everything has to be "concrete". There is just shit that is right and shit that is wrong. That is just the way it is.

[Mob Boss]

Huh, it's like I've stepped into The Twilight Zone. Someone capable of thinking on this website. Unbelievable. Anyway, I mean morality isn't true in the sense that it's not absolute. There is no right morality and wrong morality, it depends on who you ask. Like, some believe murder can be justified (death penalty) while some don't. Who's right? Who's wrong? There is no way to know. And I agree it's "illadvised" but that wasn't the question now was it?

Okay, but you worded this whole thread, "Why does everyone believe murder is wrong?" You're going to get opinions, and talk of morality, because it's what people believe. You're right, it isn't absolute, which is why I said it wasn't a physical force. As for your question, people believe it's wrong because it's what they believe. Do I have solid proof it's wrong? No, I don't.

[MisterSix]

Well most people don't like being murdered, thats a fact.

[triggerperson]

Okay, but you worded this whole thread, "Why does everyone believe murder is wrong?" You're going to get opinions, and talk of morality, because it's what people believe. You're right, it isn't absolute, which is why I said it wasn't a physical force. As for your question, people believe it's wrong because it's what they believe. Do I have solid proof it's wrong? No, I don't.

I suppose I did word it a bit strangely.
What I meant was, how come murder is commonly thought to be wrong when there is no proof to back that up (that it's wrong), but I think I got sufficient answers anyway.

[Lost in the Echo]

I suppose I did word it a bit strangely.
What I meant was, how come murder is commonly thought to be wrong when there is no proof to back that up (that it's wrong), but I think I got sufficient answers anyway.

Well there is no proof to "back up" that murder is right either, did you think about that genius?

[Dietchy_Peach]

I think everyone is really getting their feathers ruffled over a small question.

[Lost in the Echo]

I think everyone is really getting their feathers ruffled over a small question.

No shit, that's why this is the "RAMBLINGS of the wise" forum.

[Gigablue]

Murder is wrong simply because we all agree that it is. There is no evidence that proves or disproves it being wrong. People agree that things that hurt others are bad. This isn't based on hard evidence, but simply because if we didn't, society couldn't function.

Morally are relative and a human construct. The only thing that makes something immoral is people's opinion. Murder is thought to be bad by most people, therefore we conclude that it is bad.

Is it objectively bad? No. There isn't really evidence that can be presented in a debate like this. As for facts, it does hurt other people and the species as a whole, so it makes sense that people would think under is bad. If we didn't, the species would die out.

[ImCoolBeans]

Murder is wrong simply because we all agree that it is. There is no evidence that proves or disproves it being wrong. People agree that things that hurt others are bad. This isn't based on hard evidence, but simply because if we didn't, society couldn't function.

Morally are relative and a human construct. The only thing that makes something immoral is people's opinion. Murder is thought to be bad by most people, therefore we conclude that it is bad.

Is it objectively bad? No. There isn't really evidence that can be presented in a debate like this. As for facts, it does hurt other people and the species as a whole, so it makes sense that people would think under is bad. If we didn't, the species would die out.

This sums up my thoughts rather well. Murder is wrong because we have classified it as wrong. Simple as that. There is no objective or concrete evidence that says "murder is wrong"; but as humans we have come to a consensus that it is in fact "wrong".

Does this mean I think murder is okay? No. Do I agree that murder is wrong? Yes. But those are my beliefs, not objective evidence - It is subjective.

On another note, lets cut it out with the useless posts and insults, they have been deleted and if it's seen again this thread will come to a close.

[SmexiLexie510]

What right does anyone have to take anyone else's life? Ask yourself that. Absolutely none whatsoever. Question answered.

[Spook]

Alright, first of all; cussing is the last thing that's going to convince another person about your beliefs. Just needed to put that out there.
________

I know some of what I am about to say is a little broad-thinking, but that's just how I am.
__________________________
So- I have to say I agree with your points in a way. Humans will always hurt one another to either 1. get what they want, or 2. protect themselves. This of course isn't counting psychopaths (who kill for their own pleasure). Basically, humans are at the top of the food chain in modern society (discounting wild unfortunate incidents), and organisms kill what is lower than them. Think about it this way- why can humans kill a fly or a mosquito and not feel guilt? Because, they are lesser beings than we are.
So, if we murder a human, we believe the human is a lesser being. It's just nature.
But laws- that is the playing factor here.
Cavemen killed one another to get what they needed to survive- it was a world of every man for himself. But- when laws and intelligence came into the process, we began to stop. Until finally the only justified killing happening was in war.
Which is another question I would ask- isn't killing in war murder? But that's another story.
Anyways, now that I've cleared a few things, I'll get to the main question you wanted answered: Why do we believe its wrong?
Conscience.
Morals.
The way we were raised.
Think about this- a child who is raised in a violent household will hit and attack without a thought.
A child who is raised with gentle, loving family realtionships will likewise act the same way in their own families.
As children, we begin to piece together the right way to act at a very young age, and we get that information from the situation around us.
So, most likely someone who murders has either done it as an accident, they were provoked, or they came from a violent familial background.
That, of course; is just one theory.
But all in all, I think conscience is the key to why people believe murder is wrong.
They have sympathy for pain, death, a loss of life.
We have evolved greatly from our primitive time, and in the mind of a murderer they may be protecting themselves or getting something they need.
But we will always look down upon it.
Because, of course, that's nature.

As for those other forms of homocide you spoke about- there isn't really a difference.
The way someone kills another, in my mind, doesn't factor in to the end result- which is death.

[Dietchy_Peach]

No shit, that's why this is the "RAMBLINGS of the wise" forum.

i'm not seeing any wisdom, just a bunch of overly defensive teenagers thinking they are more right than anyone else.

[CourtingErmine]

Alright, this hasn't been presented yet, but taking another life, and taking away their potential is considered wrong. A person who has the answer to world peace is murdered when explaining his ideas. Their potential is taken away, and they had the real argument, this never working out. Though the death penalty I think is wrong because they should suffer for what they did, in a very restricted activity institute. Meaning no wifi, no computer, no nothing except for basketball to entertain them.

[FreeFall]

We decided it's wrong, because we don't want to be killed.
We decided it's wrong because we don't want to ruin lives.
We decided it's wrong because the murderer could very well turn on anyone, and they can't be allowed to slay whomever they want.

It's wrong because you've stolen the life of a mother, friend, cousin, loved one.
It's wrong because you've stolen a vital person from a child, husband, wife, parent, friend.
It's wrong because you've just ripped away someone very important to someone.
Be it a hobo, mom, dad, baby, teacher, you've disrupted people emotionally, mentally and caused intense grief, sorrow and worry.
Murder steals security and piece of mind.
Murder may have created trauma to some, that'll take years of therapy and help to at least make living bearable after the act.

As for killing food and bugs, self defense and survival. Bugs carry things, bite, make us itch, and I certainly do not appreciate any of that so I'll kill as many mosquito as I can. We kill for food, I enjoy burgers, if you don't that's fine. When a person's murdered, it's not because their killer want to eat them or they were itchy.

[huginnmuninn]

Define murder(if you already have i'm sorry i just didn't feel like reading all of that crap)

I wouldn't say any morality questions can be right or wrong. Morally inappropriate or morally unsound would be better terminology in my opinion but that might just be me.

[TheBigUnit]

Can you really prove that murder is wrong? I mean, you can say it's immoral but since you can't even prove that morality is something that's true then that's a pointless argument. I guess you could say, "well it's against the law" which is true but the law only exist to try to keep society harmonized (not that it's working 100%). My point is, can anybody prove that murder is wrong? And if nobody can, why does everyone believe so?

Bonus question: Why do people only care about homicide then? What about gallinicide (those delicious nuggets of yours), vaccicide (hamburgers), culicide (mosquitoes)?

P.S. I don't want to committ murder myself and this is me justifying it (I don't see the point in such actions). I'm just curious. :)

Well let's start off by asking what is the difference b/w what is immoral and what is wrong? Anyone care to answer???

[Azazel]

I don't understand how anyone could justify taking someone else's life.

[Pseudopyrif notropis]

What right does anyone have to take anyone else's life? Ask yourself that. Absolutely none whatsoever. Question answered.

What right does the any victim have to live?

[Sugaree]

What the fuck has to be "concrete" about it. Everyone would be fucking crazy if we just went around killing each other. Everyone has beliefs, but trying to justify that nothing is wrong with murder is just completely crazy as fuck. How would you feel if someone you were close with got murdered, would you still say nothing is wrong with murder?

Not everything has to be "concrete". There is just shit that is right and shit that is wrong. That is just the way it is.

Notice how OP wasn't saying we should just kill who we please; notice how his posts clearly asks a question: "Why is murder considered to be wrong?". Notice, also, how he did not say that there was nothing wrong with the action of murder. He simply wants evidence, from us specifically, as to why society believes murder is wrong.

To say that a particular belief (in this case, murder being wrong) does not have to be concrete is a load of shit. You need to have solid representation on your beliefs. I'm not saying everything has to be concrete. If someone told me "Life is hard for most people", then that's not hard to accept. There are many basic things that are concrete on their own.

And no, just because that's "the way it is" doesn't mean it's true. You are obviously looking at this thread in terms of morality and ethics.

I suppose I did word it a bit strangely.
What I meant was, how come murder is commonly thought to be wrong when there is no proof to back that up (that it's wrong), but I think I got sufficient answers anyway.

Murder is commonly thought to be wrong because it is seen as a form suppression. Think about it: you're taking away life, which is seen by many as an infinite object. In a way, you're ruining the natural order by taking away someone's, or something's, life. This pretty much divulges from the story of when Cain murdered Abel out of envy. However, killing is a natural part of life. Animals kill other animals for their nourishment, there's many insect killing plants, and so on. If murder for these things is justified for survival, I fail to understand why it is not justified for survival when it comes to killing another human.

Well there is no proof to "back up" that murder is right either, did you think about that genius?

If by "right" you mean "justified", then yes, there IS back up. For example, let's say you get into a fight and you were taught that throwing a punch was wrong. Your natural instincts tell your subconscious self to punch, but your morals tell you not to punch. Of course, you're most likely going to follow your natural instincts because it is part of the human "core", so to speak. Now if you don't follow that instinct, what are you going to do? Stand there and get beat up? Do you not think that, if someone starts a fight with you, that you shouldn't fight back in your own defense? Do you think self defense in the cases of home burglary, robbing, or any other threatening action is not justified if you can defend yourself? You can't just sit at the sidelines and pretend things will work out, because they don't.

I think everyone is really getting their feathers ruffled over a small question.

No shit, that's why this is the "RAMBLINGS of the wise" forum.

I'm beginning to think this forum needs to be renamed "Rustlings of the Jimmies".

Murder is wrong simply because we all agree that it is. There is no evidence that proves or disproves it being wrong. People agree that things that hurt others are bad. This isn't based on hard evidence, but simply because if we didn't, society couldn't function.

Morally are relative and a human construct. The only thing that makes something immoral is people's opinion. Murder is thought to be bad by most people, therefore we conclude that it is bad.

Is it objectively bad? No. There isn't really evidence that can be presented in a debate like this. As for facts, it does hurt other people and the species as a whole, so it makes sense that people would think under is bad. If we didn't, the species would die out.

tl;dr Murder is wrong because everyone says it is, so I'll go with that and not formulate my own opinion on the subject. Baaa.

[Stephan]

Please implore me on how murder can be justified in any way other than self defense.

[Lyra Heartstrings]

You're not proving anything. All you are giving me are opinions, beliefs. Nothing concrete.

This is Ramblings of the Wise, a forum to DEBATE. A DEBATE involves OPINIONS. Please realize this.

[Gigablue]

Please implore me on how murder can be justified in any way other than self defense.

No one is saying that murder is good. The OP was just asking why people think murder is wrong. He wasn't saying that it isn't wrong.

[Sugaree]

This is Ramblings of the Wise, a forum to DEBATE. A DEBATE involves OPINIONS. Please realize this.

A debate also must involve factual evidence from both sides as support for their opinions. Hurr.

[Gigablue]

What right does the any victim have to live?

People have the right to live because we decided they did. Not for any other reason. There isn't any intrinsic value to life, just the value we give it. If people didn't have the right to live, society wouldn't be able to function properly. We wouldn't have a basis for many of our laws.

[Sudds3]

If we can't determine wether or not murder is wrong, then by your logic nothing is wrong! So then there would be no laws and people would be able to do whatever they want, the world would be destroyed and all civilization would collapse! Murder is wrong because no person should take the life of another human because you only get life once. Who are you to decide when someone's life is ended? That's not our job, it will happen eventually. We need people to justify what is right and wrong to keep balance and order on our societies so we don't have the collapse of every nation and total outbreak of rage and riot onto the world for no one to end until every last person is dead.....worst case scenario

[Sugaree]

If we can't determine wether or not murder is wrong, then by your logic nothing is wrong! So then there would be no laws and people would be able to do whatever they want, the world would be destroyed and all civilization would collapse! Murder is wrong because no person should take the life of another human because you only get life once. Who are you to decide when someone's life is ended? That's not our job, it will happen eventually. We need people to justify what is right and wrong to keep balance and order on our societies so we don't have the collapse of every nation and total outbreak of rage and riot onto the world for no one to end until every last person is dead.....worst case scenario

>implying OP wants all laws to go away because you can't prove morality
>implying OP wants civilization to collapse and for people to do what they want without consequences

Yep, good job reading the posts in THIS thread, Sudd.

[Iris]

Huh, it's like I've stepped into The Twilight Zone. Someone capable of thinking on this website. Unbelievable.

Get over yourself.

Anyway, I mean morality isn't true in the sense that it's not absolute. There is no right morality and wrong morality, it depends on who you ask. Like, some believe murder can be justified (death penalty) while some don't. Who's right? Who's wrong? There is no way to know. And I agree it's "illadvised" but that wasn't the question now was it?

Morality is subjective, you're right. You'll still find laws criminalizing murder in every society, though. That's because no society that gives an individual the right to take basic freedoms from another individual will last very long. It would just become a lawless mess-you may be able to kill your neighbor, but soon enough your other neighbor will kill you. By establishing freedoms such as the freedom to live as fixed for others, you're ultimately establishing it for yourself, and everyone else in society follows. That being said, in different societies murder may be more or less acceptable in different situations. The military, the death sentence etc are considered justified murder, but without the strict rules regarding what murders are "ok" a society would fall apart. The death sentence may be carried out, but it's a long, difficult process for that reason. It's not weighed lightly.

We're also inherently against the killing of our own species in general. We're programmed to create more and more of ourselves, killing each other indiscriminately would definitely not help that cause.

[xXJust Jump ItXx]

Taking the life of another human being with the intent of doing so is wrong... In every way... Let me ask YOU, how is rape basically the worst thing in the world? It can be worse than murder... You dont die, you live thought this horrible tragic thing, knowing you were taken advantage of and attacked by some guy whos a perv! Its extremly emotionally scaring and devastating and ruins your life really. Is that good enough facts?

[randomnessqueen]

its wrong because youre enacting harm on another human with malicious intention, which in any form, including murder, is wrong.

[triggerperson]

You're all running in circles, you're not getting anywhere. You say it's wrong because, but because of what?

Taking the life of another human being with the intent of doing so is wrong... In every way... Let me ask YOU, how is rape basically the worst thing in the world? It can be worse than murder... You dont die, you live thought this horrible tragic thing, knowing you were taken advantage of and attacked by some guy whos a perv! Its extremly emotionally scaring and devastating and ruins your life really. Is that good enough facts?
You didn't give me a single fact in that incoherent jumble of words.


its wrong because youre enacting harm on another human with malicious intention, which in any form, including murder, is wrong.
You're not proving anything, you're not giving me any facts or anything even remotely logical.

And I'd like to end this with saying, of course I, too, feel that murder is wrong. It's my natural instinct in this matter but I also believe that, if we could see ourselves objectively, we would laugh at the thought of murder being wrong. If we could ask another species, I'm pretty sure they would disagree with us aswell.

[Lost in the Echo]

You're all running in circles, you're not getting anywhere. You say it's wrong because, but because of what?


You didn't give me a single fact in that incoherent jumble of words.



You're not proving anything, you're not giving me any facts or anything even remotely logical.

And I'd like to end this with saying, of course I, too, feel that murder is wrong. It's my natural instinct in this matter but I also believe that, if we could see ourselves objectively, we would laugh at the thought of murder being wrong. If we could ask another species, I'm pretty sure they would disagree with us aswell.

You're not going to get a proven fact. Besides the obvious self defense, murder is just wrong "not a fact" , I said it for you, however there is no real proof that murder is right or wrong, there are just opinions. Multiple people have told you this. So it's pointless to argue over this, nobody is going to give you a "fact" you will be satisfied with. You will just get opinions.

[xXJust Jump ItXx]

Okay... Why are you asking us? Are YOU thinking about murdering someone? Its just wrong, period. Okay, it is from reasons like rape is, and committing crimes on federal levels which are really bad to do.

[Silver Assassin]

Agree with you, kurt

[Pierce]

Your making poitns and arguments that are invalid the bottom line is someobody can't take another persons life. I can write a paragraph on supporting my answer but the bottom line is no1 can take another persons life

[Sugaree]

Your making poitns and arguments that are invalid the bottom line is someobody can't take another persons life. I can write a paragraph on supporting my answer but the bottom line is no1 can take another persons life

So what happened to the 20,000 people in Syria? Did they just disappear into thin air? Of course someone can take the life another person, but no one here can look at that objectively enough.

[FreeFall]

I think this topic is similar to an atheist explaining their lack of belief to a devote christian. We can't prove how it's wrong to us as a whole without a hard, concrete fact that it is. It's just something we feel, maybe it's because we're designed to live and fear that someone can steal from us the drive to survive.
Perhaps it's subjective. Killing a random grandfather on his way back from daily shopping, the murderer is evil and rest that poor man's soul. It's wrong, that man did nothing and was going about his daily life.
A woman has raped about 20 little boys, killed 7 of them, and has finally been caught by a neighborhood vigilante group. They kill her, they've stopped future torment and brought some closure that a vile person has been brought down. It's still murder, but usually accepted.

[Sudds3]

>implying OP wants all laws to go away because you can't prove morality
>implying OP wants civilization to collapse and for people to do what they want without consequences

Yep, good job reading the posts in THIS thread, Sudd.

Always here to help :)

[Spook]

I love how everybody ignores my postings, and other postings bringing new ideas to the table; and instead argues with eachother about not giving facts.

[Sugaree]

I love how everybody ignores my postings, and other postings bringing new ideas to the table; and instead argues with eachother about not giving facts.

Because your post, and many others, don't present new ideas because they are based off of your own ethics.

[triggerperson]

I love how everybody ignores my postings, and other postings bringing new ideas to the table; and instead argues with eachother about not giving facts.
I can reply to your post if you want it.

Alright, first of all; cussing is the last thing that's going to convince another person about your beliefs. Just needed to put that out there.
________

I know some of what I am about to say is a little broad-thinking, but that's just how I am.
__________________________
So- I have to say I agree with your points in a way. Humans will always hurt one another to either 1. get what they want, or 2. protect themselves. This of course isn't counting psychopaths (who kill for their own pleasure). Basically, humans are at the top of the food chain in modern society (discounting wild unfortunate incidents), and organisms kill what is lower than them. Think about it this way- why can humans kill a fly or a mosquito and not feel guilt? Because, they are lesser beings than we are.
So, if we murder a human, we believe the human is a lesser being. It's just nature.
But laws- that is the playing factor here.
Cavemen killed one another to get what they needed to survive- it was a world of every man for himself. But- when laws and intelligence came into the process, we began to stop. Until finally the only justified killing happening was in war.
Which is another question I would ask- isn't killing in war murder? But that's another story.
Anyways, now that I've cleared a few things, I'll get to the main question you wanted answered: Why do we believe its wrong?
Conscience.
Morals.
The way we were raised.
Think about this- a child who is raised in a violent household will hit and attack without a thought.
A child who is raised with gentle, loving family realtionships will likewise act the same way in their own families.
As children, we begin to piece together the right way to act at a very young age, and we get that information from the situation around us.
So, most likely someone who murders has either done it as an accident, they were provoked, or they came from a violent familial background.
That, of course; is just one theory.
But all in all, I think conscience is the key to why people believe murder is wrong.
They have sympathy for pain, death, a loss of life.
We have evolved greatly from our primitive time, and in the mind of a murderer they may be protecting themselves or getting something they need.
But we will always look down upon it.
Because, of course, that's nature.

As for those other forms of homocide you spoke about- there isn't really a difference.
The way someone kills another, in my mind, doesn't factor in to the end result- which is death.
First of all, yes, murders that happen within a war zone are murders (quite obvious but you know, you asked so there ya go)

"Think about this- a child who is raised in a violent household will hit and attack without a thought."
No. That is a HUGE generalisation. Just. No.

"A child who is raised with gentle, loving family realtionships will likewise act the same way in their own families."
Not necessarily. There have been cases where people who come from nice, ordinary families committ murder. We call them psychopaths, you might have heard that word before. Though not all psychopaths committ murder or grow up to be criminals.

"...we will always look down upon it.
Because, of course, that's nature."
No it's not. :confused: Nature is cruel. In nature, we kill to survive. The survival of the fittest. Have you never heard of tigers, bears, sharks, eagles, etc.? It's like you've never stepped outside in your entire life and realised that there's an entire world out there. By the way, how do you think humans came to rule Earth? Peacefully? :what: We killed. We ate what we killed. We skinned living, feeling, creatures to keep ourselves warm. We were ruthless. We were cruel. We were what we naturally are: animals. And I'm guessing you're not a vegetarian, so you're cruel. You don't need to eat other animals, but you do. Why? Because you're an animal. Everyone is. If you are a vegetarian though, you must realise you are not natural. Because, as I repeat, nature is a cruel son of a bitch.

Your making poitns and arguments that are invalid the bottom line is someobody can't take another persons life. I can write a paragraph on supporting my answer but the bottom line is no1 can take another persons life

So basically, you're saying, "murder is wrong because I say so and I could totally prove it but I won't because you should believe it's so because I say so." No. Please, if you can, write a paragraph supporting your answer. If you don't, I won't believe you can. I need proof.

I think this topic is similar to an atheist explaining their lack of belief to a devote christian. We can't prove how it's wrong to us as a whole without a hard, concrete fact that it is. It's just something we feel, maybe it's because we're designed to live and fear that someone can steal from us the drive to survive.
Perhaps it's subjective. Killing a random grandfather on his way back from daily shopping, the murderer is evil and rest that poor man's soul. It's wrong, that man did nothing and was going about his daily life.
A woman has raped about 20 little boys, killed 7 of them, and has finally been caught by a neighborhood vigilante group. They kill her, they've stopped future torment and brought some closure that a vile person has been brought down. It's still murder, but usually accepted.

Hahaha! No. This topic is similar to a devoted Christian (you people saying, "because") refusing to give a clearheaded atheist (me:)) any concrete facts why I should believe in your imaginary friend ("God").

In all seriousness though, I'm gonna come forward with why I asked you all this question. To see you chase your own tail, so to speak. You can't prove it's wrong, it's impossible I know. But it's kinda amusing to see you squirm, running frantically trying to hold on to your distorted view of reality. :lol:

[Human]

How do you measure right and wrong? You can't. Murder is wrong according to our cultures morals, but it isn't exactly wrong. It's against the law, and in good reason but it isn't wrong.
As humans we need to remember we aren't superior to any kind of animal, as we are animals therefore we still have the basic instincts. In nature, it's the survival of the fittest, but at this point in human history it isn't really advancing the race by killing children.
It isn't really wrong though. Maybe morally objectionable :P

We decided it's wrong, because we don't want to be killed.
We decided it's wrong because we don't want to ruin lives.
We decided it's wrong because the murderer could very well turn on anyone, and they can't be allowed to slay whomever they want.

It's wrong because you've stolen the life of a mother, friend, cousin, loved one.
It's wrong because you've stolen a vital person from a child, husband, wife, parent, friend.
It's wrong because you've just ripped away someone very important to someone.
Be it a hobo, mom, dad, baby, teacher, you've disrupted people emotionally, mentally and caused intense grief, sorrow and worry.
Murder steals security and piece of mind.
Murder may have created trauma to some, that'll take years of therapy and help to at least make living bearable after the act.

As for killing food and bugs, self defense and survival. Bugs carry things, bite, make us itch, and I certainly do not appreciate any of that so I'll kill as many mosquito as I can. We kill for food, I enjoy burgers, if you don't that's fine. When a person's murdered, it's not because their killer want to eat them or they were itchy.


Bugs carry things, bite, make us itch, and I certainly do not appreciate any of that so I'll kill as many mosquito as I can. We kill for food, I enjoy burgers, if you don't that's fine.
Humans drop nuclear bombs destroying other wildlife's habitats, humans destroys the Earth, humans shoot each other, humans hunt for fun, humans are selfish as a whole. I certainly don't appreciate that, therefore it's morally right to kill humans.

Please don't double post. Use the edit button instead. -Gigablue

[xXJust Jump ItXx]

Im gonna just say... hate me if you want but it seems like many people think its okay to kill another human out of hate or anything really. Out of self defense is different but out of the fact you dont like em, or what they did thats just cold and wrong. Humans and animals can NOT be compared on many levels or the fact we hunt and eat them and well thank god we normally dont eat each other, or oh wait is that not wrong too? Its pretty screwed up to eat another human if you life doesnt depend on it!!

[FreeFall]

Humans drop nuclear bombs destroying other wildlife's habitats, humans destroys the Earth, humans shoot each other, humans hunt for fun, humans are selfish as a whole. I certainly don't appreciate that, therefore it's morally right to kill humans.
Obviously I've given double standards.

If it's in your morals go ahead fire away and destroy as much as you'd like, I'll be doing my best to stay out of your range.

It's not in my set of morals though to do it though.

[Spook]

"...we will always look down upon it.
Because, of course, that's nature."
No it's not. :confused: Nature is cruel. In nature, we kill to survive. The survival of the fittest. Have you never heard of tigers, bears, sharks, eagles, etc.? It's like you've never stepped outside in your entire life and realised that there's an entire world out there. By the way, how do you think humans came to rule Earth? Peacefully? :what: We killed. We ate what we killed. We skinned living, feeling, creatures to keep ourselves warm. We were ruthless. We were cruel. We were what we naturally are: animals. And I'm guessing you're not a vegetarian, so you're cruel. You don't need to eat other animals, but you do. Why? Because you're an animal. Everyone is. If you are a vegetarian though, you must realise you are not natural. Because, as I repeat, nature is a cruel son of a bitch.

Sorry, that last one was a mistyping on my part. Yes, basically the point I was trying to put across with my post was the animalistic quality of nature. You summed it up better than I did I suppose :yes:

[Human]

Im gonna just say... hate me if you want but it seems like many people think its okay to kill another human out of hate or anything really. Out of self defense is different but out of the fact you dont like em, or what they did thats just cold and wrong. Humans and animals can NOT be compared on many levels or the fact we hunt and eat them and well thank god we normally dont eat each other, or oh wait is that not wrong too? Its pretty screwed up to eat another human if you life doesnt depend on it!!
Animals hunt and eat us too... if we didn't have our brains we'd be getting furiously raped by grizzly bears at the moment. Just because you kill it doesn't mean you're a cannibal, some animals kill each other but they don't eat each other. Humans and animals cannot be compared, BECAUSE HUMANS ARE ANIMALS. It's just a prime example of how we humans are so selfish, and destructive because we believe we are better than anything and everything else.

[Guillermo]

Animals hunt and eat us too... if we didn't have our brains we'd be getting furiously raped by grizzly bears at the moment.

The percentage of animals that actually HUNT and eat us is exceedingly low...They literally only kill 50-250 people every year. Now it's different for animals that do it for self-defense or other reasons - which would no doubt be higher. But not too much higher.

Just because you kill it doesn't mean you're a cannibal, some animals kill each other but they don't eat each other.

Yeah, true. But this is usually for self defense. Which can be compared with humans, also. But humans don't usually kill another person to eat them. They do it for other reasons. So technically, those other reasons (jealousy, hate, fear, anger) would be why the general population thinks that it's wrong (or morally wrong) and not the murder itself? Maybe.

Humans and animals cannot be compared, BECAUSE HUMANS ARE ANIMALS.

Yes we can. Can animals build skyscrapers? No. Can animals go to school and get an education? No. Can animals form ideas and express them? No. One must understand the differences between humans and animals - because there are. But that doesn't mean that we're better than them. I'm 17 and you're not. Does that mean I'm better than you? No. You're from England and I'm not. Does that mean you're better than me? No. Animals are obviously an important part of the environmental world.

It's just a prime example of how we humans are so selfish, and destructive because we believe we are better than anything and everything else.

It's just that some people don't understand that we are all connected in the world. If you kill an entire species, then other species will die off because of that one species dying. Then other environmental problems will occur like maybe an over-population of one species or plants dying off because of overgrazing which can cause erosion over time. Sometimes whole ecosystems can be thrown off balance because of this. And humans will be affected in the process at one point or another.

[Human]

The percentage of animals that actually HUNT and eat us is exceedingly low...They literally only kill 50-250 people every year. Now it's different for animals that do it for self-defense or other reasons - which would no doubt be higher. But not too much higher.



Yeah, true. But this is usually for self defense. Which can be compared with humans, also. But humans don't usually kill another person to eat them. They do it for other reasons. So technically, those other reasons (jealousy, hate, fear, anger) would be why the general population thinks that it's wrong (or morally wrong) and not the murder itself? Maybe.



Yes we can. Can animals build skyscrapers? No. Can animals go to school and get an education? No. Can animals form ideas and express them? No. One must understand the differences between humans and animals - because there are. But that doesn't mean that we're better than them. I'm 17 and you're not. Does that mean I'm better than you? No. You're from England and I'm not. Does that mean you're better than me? No. Animals are obviously an important part of the environmental world.



It's just that some people don't understand that we are all connected in the world. If you kill an entire species, then other species will die off because of that one species dying. Then other environmental problems will occur like maybe an over-population of one species or plants dying off because of overgrazing which can cause erosion over time. Sometimes whole ecosystems can be thrown off balance because of this. And humans will be affected in the process at one point or another.
I don't know why you feel the need to cherry pick what I've said, and not relate it to the topic at all. The point of the thread is about if murder is wrong, not to take ideas out of context.
But if we're just going to have a big argument now, then so be it.
Yes we can. Can animals build skyscrapers? No. Can animals go to school and get an education? No. Can animals form ideas and express them? No. One must understand the differences between humans and animals - because there are. But that doesn't mean that we're better than them. I'm 17 and you're not. Does that mean I'm better than you? No. You're from England and I'm not. Does that mean you're better than me? No. Animals are obviously an important part of the environmental world.
Umm... can humans build nests out of their spit? No, but birds can. Can humans run at 80mph? No, but cheetahs can. That's no argument, because humans can do other things that other animals can't do, it doesn't mean we can do everything as well. I'll put something forward - Do humans have brains? Yes, does pretty much every animal from ants to whales have brains? Yes. Are humans made of biomass? Cells and flesh? Yes. What are dolphins made out of? Cells and flesh. And then you say "but that doesn't mean we're better than them". My point was that we're no better than animals and you say we're not better than animals, but we aren't animals? At the moment I can't tell who's side you're on.
Yeah, true. But this is usually for self defense. Which can be compared with humans, also. But humans don't usually kill another person to eat them. They do it for other reasons. So technically, those other reasons (jealousy, hate, fear, anger) would be why the general population thinks that it's wrong (or morally wrong) and not the murder itself? Maybe.
There is no definition on morally wrong. But what about people who murder for revenge? Most people wouldn't feel too bad if Anders Breivik was murdered.

My general point is, we're no better than animals, so why is it particularly wrong to kill for some reason? Of course it varies by society, it's just like moral relativism, different people and different cultures have different definitions on morality. You can't say for sure whether it is right or wrong, as it's only your opinion. Just because the majority says it's wrong doesn't mean it's wrong. (I'm not in support of murder literally by the way, this is more in a philosophical sense)

by the way, shout out to the neg rep guy at least put your name xox

[Jean Poutine]

Of course murder is wrong.

Harm principle, law of equal liberty, John Stuart Mill.

If you can't figure out why murder is wrong when the act completely removes the faculty of another person to freely exercice his/her will, forever, there's something very wrong with you. It's not cultural or anything. It's not even anything about morality. It's...common sense.

The freedom of one ends where the freedom of another starts. This is non-negotiable. If morality's curtains can get woozy, finicky, and sometimes even blow off with harsh winds, that rule is the pole that holds it all. It's not about morality, it's about the bigger picture. Killing somebody is completely counterproductive : you lose potential manpower for no significant gain. Think about it for a single second.

[Straight]

Very hard question if you try not to put your opinion across. So i'll just try...

We have human rights. One of those human rights is a right to life. No one can take your human rights, so killing someone is taking your right to life.

Agh! Its impossible to say why murder is wrong without using opinion. In my opinion, Murder is wrong because a man would spend his whole life working towards something, and it shouldn't be so easy to take that goal away.

[Stefani]

Personally, I think people instinctively shy away from murder because they've evolved to be that way. People are animals, and survival is key to all animals. If humans killed each other over the slightest thing, the population would advance as much. As far as morality goes, which then leads to law, it's pretty much based on that instinct. Murder in and of itself cannot really be wrong or right, since right and wrong are simply words that describe a perspective. People find ways of justifying murder, i.e war.

Why are humans endowed such rights? and by whom? Perhaps people simply assign these "rights" to save themselves.

Please don't double post. Edit your previous post instead. -Gigablue

[TheWaterPrince]

I think about it like this. Who are you (a.k.a one murdering someone) to determine that a completely innocent person should die? You have no right to determine that.

[Stefani]

What if in my view, my murdering of that person, is completely justified and I am doing no wrong because I came to the conclusion that i was some how endowed that right?

[ArsenicCatNip]

There are no facts when it comes to morals considering everyone has different morals and nations are built with laws based on different morals. While it isn't a fact suicide is wrong no one ever wakes up and says “I think I'll kill myself today” because it goes against our nature, which you could say murder is objectively wrong because you are killing off your own species and thus making it difficult to thrive.

[HUSTLEMAN]

Uh... ITS MURDER, you just stole the life of a human being FOR WHAT? Besides, when has it EVER been good?

[MattsyPad]

Bonus question: Why do people only care about homicide then? What about gallinicide (those delicious nuggets of yours), vaccicide (hamburgers), culicide (mosquitoes)?


This is survival of the fittest. And did you really ask why murder is wrong? Because you are killing a human being. A human is the same as any other human when it comes to this.

[ManyPearTree]

Morality is a blessing of mortality in a human being. Otherwise we would be killing each other without care..

[Twilly F. Sniper]

How can you even ask that? Murder is wrong! Bottom line! Trying to justify it is just insane.

Thats truly the BOTTOM LINE. This line of right and rong shalln't be crossed by murder. How could the question even be asked?

[West Coast Sheriff]

Thats truly the BOTTOM LINE. This line of right and rong shalln't be crossed by murder. How could the question even be asked?

Exactly!

[Fiction]

The definition of "murder" is up for discussion really.

If the definition of murder is "wrongful killing", then the statement is analytic, and therefore murder is wrong by definition, no arguement. Then the real question would be "Is killing another person wrong?"

If the definition of murder (as it is by the google dictionary) is "unlawful killing" or just "killing" then it's up for discussion :p

And this is just one of those questions with no difinitve answer, so what's the point? Take each day as it comes and consider each situation in it's self. Sometimes it may be right to kill someone, sometimes it might not. Does it really matter until you're in that situation?

[Human]

This is survival of the fittest. And did you really ask why murder is wrong? Because you are killing a human being. A human is the same as any other human when it comes to this.

So according to your 'survival of the fittest' we should kill disabled people?
There is no survival of the fittest with human beings.

[Danny_boi 16]

How can you even ask that? Murder is wrong! Bottom line! Trying to justify it is just insane.

murder is seriously wrong, unless in self-defense. What is immoral is killing another civil human being, its like feeding a pig pork , that is how wrong it is. However, while murder is wrong, i believe in capital punishment.

[MattsyPad]

So according to your 'survival of the fittest' we should kill disabled people?
There is no survival of the fittest with human beings.

What the hell are you talking about? Of course there is. What do you think evolution is? Gay fish frogs?

[Human]

What the hell are you talking about? Of course there is. What do you think evolution is? Gay fish frogs?

Survival of the fittest doesn't happen when the non fittest still have the same chances. And what the hell do gay fish frogs have to do with evolution?

[ArsenicCatNip]

Survival of the fittest doesn't happen when the non fittest still have the same chances. And what the hell do gay fish frogs have to do with evolution?

Survival of the fittest is still applicable considering we're an example of it, and it will be if say a species comes out of the blue that is superior to us.

[Zenos]

Can you really prove that murder is wrong? I mean, you can say it's immoral but since you can't even prove that morality is something that's true then that's a pointless argument. I guess you could say, "well it's against the law" which is true but the law only exist to try to keep society harmonized (not that it's working 100%). My point is, can anybody prove that murder is wrong? And if nobody can, why does everyone believe so?

Bonus question: Why do people only care about homicide then? What about gallinicide (those delicious nuggets of yours), vaccicide (hamburgers), culicide (mosquitoes)?

P.S. I don't want to committ murder myself and this is me justifying it (I don't see the point in such actions). I'm just curious. :)

Theres a diffrence between murder(premeditated),and killing in self defence(to save you're life or anothers life),get it?

It's wrong because nobody has the right to take another person's life. I don't know how you could seriously ask this ridiculous question, imagine what the world would be like if people just went around killing each other. Now justify how that isn't "wrong".

It's wrong because nobody has the right to take another person's life.


Let me address this please,if someone is trying to kill you are a loved one you do have the right to defend yourself and said loved one even if you have to kill the person trying to kill you or said loved one.

yes yes i knwo soemones gonna say well the bible says Thou Shaly not kill.

Wrong thats a mistranslation directly from hebrew into english when corrcetly translated it says:Thou Shalt not Murder" big difference!

Please don't double post. Edit your previous post or use the multi-quote button instead. -Gigablue

[Lost in the Echo]

It's wrong because nobody has the right to take another person's life.


Let me address this please,if someone is trying to kill you are a loved one you do have the right to defend yourself and said loved one even if you have to kill the person trying to kill you or said loved one.

yes yes i knwo soemones gonna say well the bible says Thou Shaly not kill.

Wron thats a mistranslation directly from hebrew into english when corrcetly translated it says:Thou Shalt not Murder" big diffrence!

Well no shit Einstein that's obvious. I'm talking about serial killers and shit, the kind of people who you see on the news for murdering someone. Again, it's obvious if you kill someone out of self defense, it's understandable, so to what I said, I would make self defense an exception. So why would you state the obvious?
I think that's the second time someone has quoted me and brought up self defense. So self defense is so obvious of an exception, that I shouldn't have to add it in my post.

[Guillermo]

Survival of the fittest doesn't happen when the non fittest still have the same chances.


You do realize that around 1/3 of all humans live off of the land right? So this means that they don't rely on anyone but themselves (and other people of their groups or tribes) to find food and basically survive. They must survive by gathering food or killing - not going to a supermarket. Not only this though, but people in some African countries have to actually kill (so murder) someone to obtain their food for their starving families and survive. Is this justifiable? Killing another person to help your starving family survive? Possibly...

[Human]

You do realize that around 1/3 of all humans live off of the land right? So this means that they don't rely on anyone but themselves (and other people of their groups or tribes) to find food and basically survive. They must survive by gathering food or killing - not going to a supermarket. Not only this though, but people in some African countries have to actually kill (so murder) someone to obtain their food for their starving families and survive. Is this justifiable? Killing another person to help your starving family survive? Possibly...

generally that 1/3 don't go hunting or gathering, they use agriculture.

[MattsyPad]

Survival of the fittest doesn't happen when the non fittest still have the same chances. And what the hell do gay fish frogs have to do with evolution?

You have never watched South Park, obviously.

[Zenos]

Well no shit Einstein that's obvious. I'm talking about serial killers and shit, the kind of people who you see on the news for murdering someone. Again, it's obvious if you kill someone out of self defense, it's understandable, so to what I said, I would make self defense an exception. So why would you state the obvious?
I think that's the second time someone has quoted me and brought up self defense. So self defense is so obvious of an exception, that I shouldn't have to add it in my post.


Well do you always state stuff on a topic of this nature in a manner that implies that no one has a right tio take a life even in self defense!

Because thats just the way it sounds:


"It's wrong because nobody has the right to take another person's life."

You made no distinction between muder or self defense.

[Human]

You have never watched South Park, obviously.

I have, just not that episode
anyway this is a bit off topic now

[Zenos]

generally that 1/3 don't go hunting or gathering, they use agriculture.

I think most humans today couldn't hunt worth beans.

Um being from England with guns being banned and all,what woudldyou do if things fell apart and you had to hunt?

[Lost in the Echo]

Well do you always state stuff on a topic of this nature in a manner that implies that no one has a right tio take a life even in self defense!

Because thats just the way it sounds:


"It's wrong because nobody has the right to take another person's life."

You made no distinction between muder or self defense.

I shouldn't have to, because like I said it should be obvious. I said self defense is an exception, that should be obvious, so don't be a smartass.

[Zenos]

I shouldn't have to, because like I said it should be obvious. I said self defense is an exception, that should be obvious, so don't be a smartass.

I wasn't being a smartass! Trust me if I was being one i'd have been banned for what i said!

[Lost in the Echo]

I wasn't being a smartass! Trust me if I was being one i'd have been banned for what i said!

Me too! I really don't know why you're going out of your way to be an asshole to me over stupid shit. Nobody has the right to take another person's life, WITH THE EXCEPTION OF SELF DEFENSE OBVIOUSLY! There I said it, it's obvious! Leave me the fuck alone now!

[Sir Suomi]

When it's a situation like self-defense, I think if you have no other option, it is deemed neccesary to commit murder. But even in that case, I don't believe murder is right. Especially murder in cold blood.

[Zenos]

When it's a situation like self-defense, I think if you have no other option, it is deemed neccesary to commit murder. But even in that case, I don't believe murder is right. Especially murder in cold blood.

When it's a situation like self-defense, I think if you have no other option, it is deemed neccesary to commit murder. But even in that case, I don't believe murder is right.

I'd hate for you to be the DA if I killed someone is self defense they'd probably fry either way!



But here is little bit of stuff to show that Killing in self-defense and murder are two diffrent birds .

I'm not wanting to nitpick are fight are anything I just want to just to show that killing in self defense is not murder it's in another llaw category altogether:


There are several factors that distinguish self defense from murder. Perhaps the most important factor is that murder is usually unprovoked; that is, an individual kills another individual without reasonable cause.

In self defense cases, an individual may kill another if he or she had reasonable cause. Typically, reasonable cause is defined as reasonable fear for physical safety or death. In other words, if you feel your life is in danger and most reasonable people would feel the same way in the same situation, you may have acted in self defense


Also:

Murder is the unlawful killing, with malice aforethought, of another human, and generally this state of mind distinguishes murder from other forms of unlawful homicide (such as manslaughter).

Acting in self-defense or in defense of another person is generally accepted as legal justification for killing a person in situations that would otherwise have been murder. However, a self-defense killing might be considered manslaughter if the killer established control of the situation before the killing took place. In the case of self-defense it is called a "justifiable homicide". A killing simply to prevent the theft of one's property may not be a justifiable homicide, depending on the laws of a place.

[Sir Suomi]

When it's a situation like self-defense, I think if you have no other option, it is deemed neccesary to commit murder. But even in that case, I don't believe murder is right.

I'd hate for you to be the DA if I killed someone is self defense they'd probably fry either way!



But here is little bit of stuff to show that Killing in self-defense and murder are two diffrent birds .

I'm not wanting to nitpick are fight are anything I just want to just to show that killing in self defense is not murder it's in another llaw category altogether:


There are several factors that distinguish self defense from murder. Perhaps the most important factor is that murder is usually unprovoked; that is, an individual kills another individual without reasonable cause.

In self defense cases, an individual may kill another if he or she had reasonable cause. Typically, reasonable cause is defined as reasonable fear for physical safety or death. In other words, if you feel your life is in danger and most reasonable people would feel the same way in the same situation, you may have acted in self defense


Also:

Murder is the unlawful killing, with malice aforethought, of another human, and generally this state of mind distinguishes murder from other forms of unlawful homicide (such as manslaughter).

Acting in self-defense or in defense of another person is generally accepted as legal justification for killing a person in situations that would otherwise have been murder. However, a self-defense killing might be considered manslaughter if the killer established control of the situation before the killing took place. In the case of self-defense it is called a "justifiable homicide". A killing simply to prevent the theft of one's property may not be a justifiable homicide, depending on the laws of a place.

Good thing I'm going to be a doctor instead right? ;)

[Wesl3y]

It's wrong, because it is taking the life of a human that most likely wants to continue living. Think of it this way. Is it right or wrong for a you to just decide that you want a person dead and taje their life? Wouldn't it pods you off if,some random person came along and killed you just because. If not then you should probably get checked out.

[workingatperfect]

No, you can't prove that it's wrong. People can say, it's wrong because you're taking another person's life, all they want, but the fact is, there's no solid proof or evidence that can say something, anything, not just murder, is right or wrong. It's wrong because you're taking another person's life. Well what proves that taking another's life against their will is wrong? Nothing. You can't prove this sort of thing.

Is it a generally accepted belief that murder is wrong? Yeah. Does that mean it is without a doubt, 100%, proven to be wrong? No. You can't prove morals to be right or wrong, it's impossible. It's a personal belief and opinion.

(Note: Obviously I do believe murder to be immoral/wrong, I'm just saying, there is no proof of it being wrong, and that's what the op was asking.)

[PurpleReign]

Well, who can really "prove" morality? Nobody. It's an abstract idea.

But the fact that it's one of the few things that 99% of the population agrees on, we can probably conclude that it's wrong. ;)

[ArsenicCatNip]

As I've said before murder is objectively wrong because it disrupts the human race on being able to thrive.

[Pipo]

When it's a situation like self-defense, I think if you have no other option, it is deemed neccesary to commit murder. But even in that case, I don't believe murder is right.

I'd hate for you to be the DA if I killed someone is self defense they'd probably fry either way!



But here is little bit of stuff to show that Killing in self-defense and murder are two diffrent birds .

I'm not wanting to nitpick are fight are anything I just want to just to show that killing in self defense is not murder it's in another llaw category altogether:


There are several factors that distinguish self defense from murder. Perhaps the most important factor is that murder is usually unprovoked; that is, an individual kills another individual without reasonable cause.

In self defense cases, an individual may kill another if he or she had reasonable cause. Typically, reasonable cause is defined as reasonable fear for physical safety or death. In other words, if you feel your life is in danger and most reasonable people would feel the same way in the same situation, you may have acted in self defense


Also:

Murder is the unlawful killing, with malice aforethought, of another human, and generally this state of mind distinguishes murder from other forms of unlawful homicide (such as manslaughter).

Acting in self-defense or in defense of another person is generally accepted as legal justification for killing a person in situations that would otherwise have been murder. However, a self-defense killing might be considered manslaughter if the killer established control of the situation before the killing took place. In the case of self-defense it is called a "justifiable homicide". A killing simply to prevent the theft of one's property may not be a justifiable homicide, depending on the laws of a place.

Do that here and you're in jail for murder they don't care is it "self defense" or not.

:whistle:

[Apollo.]

Nobody has the right to take a life unless the person who's life they are taking has killed before, I don't think I could kill anybody unless they had hurt someone close to me. I just wouldn't have it in me. There is nothing but common human decency to say murder is wrong but I bet 99% of people couldn't kill someone for no reason

[Fire16rescue]

Tell you what, next time I'm trying to console some poor bugger's family after he's been shot a few times I'll ask them.

[Human]

I think most humans today couldn't hunt worth beans.

Um being from England with guns being banned and all,what woudldyou do if things fell apart and you had to hunt?

you're just moving away from the original point

[Zenos]

Do that here and you're in jail for murder they don't care is it "self defense" or not.

:whistle:

Let me guess from fro the UK right?

[Zenos]

Good thing I'm going to be a doctor instead right? ;)

lol yep it is.:D

[Pipo]

Let me guess from fro the UK right?

nope :-o

[kyle001]

It is not just bad it is sick

[Reina]

I feel like the intent of this post was to seem "edgy" or something. My suspicion is backed by your signature.

I have lost family members and friends to murder. This has torn apart everything about my existence. To attempt to justify the ending of someone's life is absolutely disgusting. I don't care how badly you want to seem cool on the internet, this is not 4chan, and this is awful.

If you truly believe that there is nothing wrong with murder, you need to get professional help.

[squibles976]

Perhaps its on a genetic level, maybe its hardwired into your genes not to harm your own species

I feel like the intent of this post was to seem "edgy" or something. My suspicion is backed by your signature.

I have lost family members and friends to murder. This has torn apart everything about my existence. To attempt to justify the ending of someone's life is absolutely disgusting. I don't care how badly you want to seem cool on the internet, this is not 4chan, and this is awful.

If you truly believe that there is nothing wrong with murder, you need to get professional help.

And i know too well how you feel, my grandma murdered my uncle

Please don't double post. Edit your previous post instead.

[Mob Boss]

I understand what you guys are saying, and I don't think the OP was trying to be malicious -- more or less just trying to start a debate on a taboo subject. Nevertheless, you can't debate using purely morals. Morals aren't physical, hard proof and that's what he was looking for. Yeah, murder is frowned upon, bad, sick, and all that good, juicy stuff, but that isn't concrete proof. Animals kill everyday, and believe it or not, humans are animals. More advanced animals, but animals. I'm not in any way agreeing with murder; simply pointing out you can't really prove it's wrong/bad without the introdction of morals/personal beliefs.

[Antisthenes]

Can you really prove that murder is wrong? I mean, you can say it's immoral but since you can't even prove that morality is something that's true then that's a pointless argument.

First, you can prove this. You just need to define your terms here.

Also, you make no sense when you say, "morality is something that's true." Morality is well known to be true. There is a morality, as, you just referenced it. Concepts exist. Morality is a concept. Morality exists. So I don't understand when you say, "morality is something that's true."

That's a bit nonsensical. It'd be like saying "A rock is something that's true." Meaningless statement. It's sophistical. However, perhaps you mean, are our views of morality regarding killing humans correct? This is necessarily the case.

Morality has come about precisely because it is correct. That's the only reason why it's here at all. If it was incorrect, it wouldn't be here. Hence, our views of morality are correct.

Consider two societies:

One society takes to initiating it's young by murdering those young.
The other society takes to loving one another, socially cooperating, and working together to make a better life for each individual.

Which society is morally correct? Whichever one lasts. The first obviously does not last. The second one certainly will, as we see today.

Bonus question: Why do people only care about homicide then? What about gallinicide (those delicious nuggets of yours), vaccicide (hamburgers), culicide (mosquitoes)?

Why do you think? The same reason a lion cares if you kill a lion but does not care if you kill a gazelle. Chickens and cows are food. Mosquitoes are pests.

[Gigablue]

I feel like the intent of this post was to seem "edgy" or something. My suspicion is backed by your signature.

I have lost family members and friends to murder. This has torn apart everything about my existence. To attempt to justify the ending of someone's life is absolutely disgusting. I don't care how badly you want to seem cool on the internet, this is not 4chan, and this is awful.

If you truly believe that there is nothing wrong with murder, you need to get professional help.

The OP wasn't saying that murder isn't wrong, he was just asking why it's wrong. I think everyone here can agree that murder is wrong, but OP wants to know the reasoning for reaching that conclusion.

[Castle of Glass]

i don't think it is wrong in anyway. murder is just taking ones life. then how about when soldiers kill each other at war. they are honored and awarded metals for killing or murdering other people. if murder is wrong, then shouldn't soldiers also be punished?