Ask a Christian :)

[Dobesta]

I feel that in the media today, the majority of Christians get a bad reputation from a minority of people who are often misled. So I wanted to be open and answer any questions anyone may have about anything to do with Christianity or my views on stuff. Ask away :)

[Cicero]

What made you the Christian Expert? Do you have a degree in Theology? Are you a Priest or Preacher or Minister? What the point of Christianity, is to live life like Christ and live by the bible. That's the point of Christianity.

[Magus]

Why do you believe in Assyrian and Babylonian myths remixed with Jewish ones?

[Dobesta]

What made you the Christian Expert?
I am by no means an expert :) But just want to give my honest view :)

Why do you believe in Assyrian and Babylonian myths remixed with Jewish ones?
First of all, the Jewish faith and Christianity are (to my knowledge) quite similar, seeing as Christianity is a branching off of Judaism, because Jesus is seen as the fulfilment of loads of prophecies made hundreds of years before his birth.
About the 'Assyrian and Babylonian myths', if you're talking about creation stories, then I would say that they all stem from one actual event. If you're not, please elaborate and I'll continue the conversation :)

[Anselmo]

Why do Christians see Catholics as God haters and stuff?? i mean we have the same God

[Cicero]

Why do Christians see Catholics as God haters and stuff?? i mean we have the same God

Christians don't see Catholics as God haters. Though we have the same God as Christians, our beliefs are slightly different. Catholics believe in Saints, whereas Christians dont fully believe in saints. Other than the apostles, Christians consider anyone reborn as a follower of Christ a saint. To be a saint, they must've done a certain amount of work, and have been recognized by the Roman Catholic Church. Christians only follow one thing, the bible. Catholics follow the Bible, Pope, and the Church as well as God. Christians see no need to confess their sins to a Priest, because they believe that God can here the confessions from anyone. Whereas Catholics believe you should confess your sins to a Priest. Their are also a few extra holidays that Catholics follow that Christians don't, like Lent. Christians have not been recognized by the Catholic Church. Catholics have been recognized by the catholic church.

[Magus]

First of all, the Jewish faith and Christianity are (to my knowledge) quite similar, seeing as Christianity is a branching off of Judaism, because Jesus is seen as the fulfilment of loads of prophecies made hundreds of years before his birth.
About the 'Assyrian and Babylonian myths', if you're talking about creation stories, then I would say that they all stem from one actual event. If you're not, please elaborate and I'll continue the conversation :)

Holy crappu, I didn't knew that first part! Shit, no wonder I wrote Jewish instead of Christian, because they are one and the same, but I didn't knew that! So thanks for telling me!

First of all, those Assyrian, Babylonian and Mesopotamian, let's just say Middle-Eastern for now, myths are actual MYTHS, in other words, they are allegories and fables.

Historians agree on these points.

1) They are myths, allegories, fables, poems and etc., and has no bearing in real life.
2) They preceded Abrahamic religions.
3) They were transfered from one region to another, and have a single point of origin.

Adam and Eve. The story of flood. Almost many of them are actual stories, not real life.

[sammy1996]

What makes Christianity any better than any other religion, in the way as that only Christians will apparently be able to go to heaven and other people devout to their respective religions wont?

In the face of scientific evidence disproving religous myths how can you still believe in creationism theories?

[Cicero]

What makes Christianity any better than any other religion, in the way as that only Christians will apparently be able to go to heaven and other people devout to their respective religions wont?

In the face of scientific evidence disproving religous myths how can you still believe in creationism theories?

When it comes down to it, Christianity is a faith based religion. But there is also plenty of evidence supporting it. Christianity is different than any other religion on the face of this earth by on thing, you cannot earn your way into heaven. Many, if not every religion has a way of earning yourself into heaven, either by good works, charitable donations, or volunteering. In Christianity, the only way to get to heaven, is accepting Gods son, Jesus Christ, into your heart. As a sign of accepting him, Christians are to live by the bible, and believe in the bible. Their are many analogies in the bible, but stories like Noah's Ark and Adam and Eve, are serious stories that are not made up. There are plenty sources to disprove Christianity, but there are plenty of stories that prove Christianity. There is also evidence to disprove other religions like Mormonism. But as I said, the core of Christianity, is based on Faith.

they are one and the same

No, not necessarily, Christianity and the Jewish faith split off at the inception of Jesus Christ. The Jewish faith only believes in 1/2 of the bible, the old testament, whereas Christianity believes in the old and new testament. So they really aren't the same.

[Abigballofdust]

Adam and Eve. The story of flood. Almost many of them are actual stories, not real life.
The main one, the one about Jesus is a direct derivation from the myth of Horus.

[Cicero]

The main one, the one about Jesus is a direct derivation from the myth of Horus.

Well, Greek and Roman Mythologies were developed with the Jewish faith in mind. Because the Jews believed their would be the Son of God to save the world, they decided to twist it and make it Horus.

[johngotti]

I feel that in the media today, the majority of Christians get a bad reputation from a minority of people who are often misled. So I wanted to be open and answer any questions anyone may have about anything to do with Christianity or my views on stuff. Ask away :)

lol i think your confusing christianity with islam

[ImCoolBeans]

Well. Honestly, your view doesn't matter when your trying to speak for a whole religion. Your views might be different than the bibles views. If you were to maintain this thread with a bunch of other Christians and decide with each other on each answer given that's different, but your one guy who "just want to give my honest view". Also, if a group of pastors wanted to do something like this, then they (might) be able to speak for a religion. The title should be renamed "Ask a Christian what his views are", and make sure people know your not speaking for the whole religion. Cause your not speaking for the whole religion, your speaking for your own religious views. Because as you said "just want to give my honest view"

Dude, shut up.

Who do you honestly think you are? You are no better than any other member here, so stop putting yourself above others. I'm sick and tired of seeing your attitude thrown around. He did not ONCE say that had a degree, was any kind of expert, or could speak for the religion as a whole. He simply said "my point of view..." That does not mean that he is speaking for the religion as a whole. You're honestly looking for trouble here, and if you have the intentions to continue that then you can leave this section because I'm not going to deal with the bullshit and annoyance of you derailing and ruining threads because you have to jump all over somebody for absolutely no reason. He said that he would like to share his views and stances, so you came in throwing around sarcastic lines and and highlighted some of your words in white to get your emphasize the fact that you think you're a tough guy here? Get over yourself and stop putting him down for no reason. I won't have it. If you have a problem with this you can shoot me over a PM, and if you have a problem with me talk to an admin about it, I'm sure they would love to hear about this.

[Magus]

Well, Greek and Roman Mythologies were developed with the Jewish faith in mind. Because the Jews believed their would be the Son of God to save the world, they decided to twist it and make it Horus.

Greek and Roman mythologies, yet again, precedes Jewish one.

And there are countless of religions where they have some variation of the "god son" thing. For example, Odin and Thor.

And lol at wiki.

. Worship of Odin may date to Proto-Germanic paganism. The Roman historian Tacitus may refer to Odin when he talks of Mercury. The reason is that, like Mercury, Odin was regarded as Psychopompos, "guide of souls."

[Jess]

When it comes down to it, Christianity is a faith based religion. But there is also plenty of evidence supporting it. Christianity is different than any other religion on the face of this earth by on thing, you cannot earn your way into heaven. Many, if not every religion has a way of earning yourself into heaven, either by good works, charitable donations, or volunteering. In Christianity, the only way to get to heaven, is accepting Gods son, Jesus Christ, into your heart. As a sign of accepting him, Christians are to live by the bible, and believe in the bible. There are many analogies in the bible, but stories like Noah's Ark and Adam and Eve, are serious stories that are not made up. There are plenty sources to disprove Christianity, but there are plenty of stories that prove Christianity. There is also evidence to disprove other religions like Mormonism. But as I said, the core of Christianity, is based on Faith.

how are those not made up?

[Cicero]

how are those not made up?

In the Christian faith they aren't made up.

[Abigballofdust]

Well, Greek and Roman Mythologies were developed with the Jewish faith in mind. Because the Jews believed their would be the Son of God to save the world, they decided to twist it and make it Horus.
Horus is part of Egyptian mythology, which is older than Judaism.

In the Christian faith they aren't made up.
So the Christian faith believes we are all born from an incestuous relationship between one (or both!) Eve's sons and Eve? And their sons and daughters had sex with each other and made even more humans? Please dude.
Also, how exactly do you put a male and a female of EVERY animal species on Earth on a boat?
Those stories are made up, in the Christian faith they are symbolism, analogies to something else or a simple way to explain nature. Some Greek philosophers believed everything was made by air differently compressed because they had no way to explain the world and they needed an explanation. Democritus said everything was made of small particles that he called 'atoms' which means indivisible; the human race accepted this theory for centuries before somebody divided the atom in smalled particles.
Bottom line, it's all fiction, simbolism and attempted science (or philosophy, if you wish), no truth can be found in such stories.

Greek and Roman mythologies, yet again, precedes Jewish one.

Not really. Greek, may aswell, but Judaism is thought to be 3500y/o, means it was born somewhere in 1500bC, Rome dates 756bC.

[Cicero]

Horus is part of Egyptian mythology, which is older than Judaism.


So the Christian faith believes we are all born from an incestuous relationship between one (or both!) Eve's sons and Eve? And their sons and daughters had sex with each other and made even more humans? Please dude.
Also, how exactly do you put a male and a female of EVERY animal species on Earth on a boat?
Those stories are made up, in the Christian faith they are symbolism, analogies to something else or a simple way to explain nature. Some Greek philosophers believed everything was made by air differently compressed because they had no way to explain the world and they needed an explanation. Democritus said everything was made of small particles that he called 'atoms' which means indivisible; the human race accepted this theory for centuries before somebody divided the atom in smalled particles.
Bottom line, it's all fiction, simbolism and attempted science (or philosophy, if you wish), no truth can be found in such stories.

No, in Christianity, it is believed that it happened. Plus, how would you know if it's a symbolism in Christianity or not? It's not about symbolism in the Christian faith, it's a story that actually happened, because man was to sinful, so God decided to wipe the earth clean. And yes, Adam and Eve did have sex together, then their kids had sex together and so on. Here (http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2010/04/100428-noahs-ark-found-in-turkey-science-religion-culture/) is proof about Noah's ark.

✞✞✞ Genesis 5:4 tells us that Adam had sons and daughters. At first, sons and daughters of Adam and Eve had to marry each other to populate the earth. Cain probably married a sister or niece or grand niece.

Assuming the accuracy of the Genesis account, and considering the length of lives recorded (around 900 years, on the average), a very sizeable population could have developed very rapidly. Using conservative guesses as to the size of families and average age, there easily could have been several million people living at the time of the death of Cain.

Moreover, the Scriptures nowhere indicate at what points in the life of Cain he murdered his brother, married his wife, or built his city. Even a few hundred years might have passed before all of the events took place, allowing for a sizable population with which to build a city.

All this raises the additional question of incest. If incest is scripturally forbidden, according to the Mosaic law, how do we explain all this marrying of siblings? Since Adam and Eve were created directly by God, and perfect, it can be presumed that their genes were perfect.

When sin entered the world at the Fall, bringing with it death, disease, and destruction, the gene pool would gradually become corrupted. At first, no harm would result from marriage of brothers and sisters, and had sin not entered the world, presumably no harm would have ever entered.

As the generations passed, however, disease, environment, and sin took their toll on the genetic pool, which resulted in mutant and defective genes. Incest was prohibited in Moses’ time, from a biological standpoint, because it now was dangerous and resulted in deformed, moronic, or otherwise defective offspring.

Moreover, in addition to the biological problem which arises from incest, there is also an ethical one. God forbids incest on moral grounds, and this is more crucial than the biological aspect (Leviticus 20:11 ).


Noah's ark

Is it easier for Jesus to turn water into wine or heal the sick? Is it easier for Jesus to walk on water or bring someone back to life? We as humans want to place limitations on God and also establish levels of difficulty upon His miracles. In the same way God wasn't constrained by any practical limitations of the rudimentary elements and forces of the natural world when setting forth His plans and desires for the ark.
Noah's Ark was divinely inspired by God. It wasn't simply Noah being left to his own efforts. God Himself per the Bible caused the animals to come to the Ark which wasn't possible without miraculous intervention.
God flooded the World with a volume of water that didn't exist before or after the flood and then made the water go away. Noah had 100 years to build the Ark with his sons and other help possibly.
People also assume that the animals were full grown, we dont know. Also, the Bible doesn't say that every single variety of species entered the Ark. Just pairs of species. In other words a pair of dogs and not 400 pairs representing each breed. The exception to this are birds which had pairs of every kind. Using pairs of species its quite possible to fit all of the animals onto an Ark that was 2 million cubic feet even without intervention from God. And it was God that shut them all in.
All in all either you believe in the power of God or you dont. Even to an atheist if its possibly to turn water into wine just by thinking about it its equally as possible to build a boat that holds a pair of all species. Either you believe or you dont. Why is it that no one challenges Jesus's claim that he turned water into wine?

[Jess]

I agree with Abigballofdust. It's all FICTION. But believe it if you want to.....I don't care.

also, why would a loving God let millions of African children starve? if he was all-powerful, he could give them food!!!! it would be easier to give them food than let other people give help and food. but no! he still lets so many children and people suffer and die. loving God indeed >_>

[Abigballofdust]

I'm not Christian, but was raised as one.
Our Religion teacher said once that nobody with half a brain would believe Adam and Eve was a real story.
He also explained to us that until science disproves its own theories, in his eyes, God made the Universe by planning its whole course from the Big Bang to the moment it ends. He said that believers don't have to fear science but work with it, use it to understand the way God made this universe, the World and us. It's very agnostic, but he is Christian. He also believes in a whole shitload of other things, which I don't, but that doesn't matter.
Your quotes are incredibly funny though. The first one says it's ok to sin until it starts hurting, then stop cos it's bad and the second one implies you can stuff all the living species on Earth into a ship of 2mil cubic feet. But yeah, as said in the last quote, either you believe or you don't.

[StoppingTime]

I really don't understand the point to religious arguments. Most people see that there is no way that God's existence can be proven. Then again, it can't be disproven either. So why argue over something that can never truly have an answer?
And as for the argument, "If God is so powerful, why are people starving?" I quote this:

So anyway, imagine you have billions of dollars and thousands of men working under your command.
God would have billions of dollars and thousands of men working under his/her command, if he/she were human.

Would you use your force to destroy hunger?

Well, God doesn't, you don't.

See this as a test. God tests whether humans will combine their strength to fight against the evil in this world. That is something we do not do, and God simply cannot wipe out the Somalian tribes who kill people and rain steak and vegetables on those who die of hunger.

We should be having the guilty conscience. We live in this world yet we do not stop the evil, and as typical humans who hate responsibility, we blame it on something ( God ) who doesn't even live in our realm.

[Dobesta]

I'm not Christian, but was raised as one.
Our Religion teacher said once that nobody with half a brain would believe Adam and Eve was a real story.
He also explained to us that until science disproves its own theories, in his eyes, God made the Universe by planning its whole course from the Big Bang to the moment it ends. He said that believers don't have to fear science but work with it, use it to understand the way God made this universe, the World and us. It's very agnostic, but he is Christian. He also believes in a whole shitload of other things, which I don't, but that doesn't matter.
Your quotes are incredibly funny though. The first one says it's ok to sin until it starts hurting, then stop cos it's bad and the second one implies you can stuff all the living species on Earth into a ship of 2mil cubic feet. But yeah, as said in the last quote, either you believe or you don't.

It's true, there are plenty of different views between Christians on whether parts of the bible are literal or a representation of what happened. Personally I believe that the story of Adam and Eve is a real story, but they may not have necessarily been the only humans on the earth, simply the first. What I mean is that after they were evicted from Eden, then God may have made other humans to help populate the Earth. Also, the bible says (in my interpretation) that fallen angels actually bred with humans, and gave birth to who are called the 'nephilim', giants. Hence supporting the theory for goliath as a giant later on.
The creation thing about God causing the Big Bang and such, is to me a valid theory. And probably pretty close to what happened. In general most Christians (to my knowledge) believe in either old earth creationism (Each 'day' reference in the bible is actually an 'age', took much longer to create) or young earth creationism (6 days to create, earth is only ~8000 years old). Personally, I'm an old earth creationist. And yeah, no Christian should fear science at all. I don't see that anything can disprove God, only increase my wonder at the amazing intricacies of the universe he's made.
The ark thing. There's a possibility that God flooded the whole earth, and the ark carried two of every animal (what I believe). And also there's the idea that he only flooded the regions of the earth where people lived (let's just say Mesopotamia). I agree the the first idea. Also, new earth creationists sometimes say that the huge amounts of erosion that appear to have occurred over millions of years could have been cause by 40 days and nights of constant rain. Hope this helps :)

So the Christian faith believes we are all born from an incestuous relationship between one (or both!) Eve's sons and Eve? And their sons and daughters had sex with each other and made even more humans? Please dude.
I kinda addressed in the post I just did, but just wanted to highlight that adam and eve had other children. This is Genisis 5:3-5 (NIV) '3 When Adam had lived 130 years, he had a son in his own likeness, in his own image; and he named him Seth. 4 After Seth was born, Adam lived 800 years and had other sons and daughters. 5 Altogether, Adam lived a total of 930 years, and then he died.'

Other sons and daughters :)

Also I KNOW this will probably come up so here's my early reply. People back then had longer life spans because sin was not as prevalent in the world. This would mean that the affects of sin (disease, pain, death) were not as strong as they are now. Longer lifespans also allow for more offspring, helping to explain a much larger population boom.

lol i think your confusing christianity with islam

Islam does get a bad wrap, which is pretty sad because it's only extremists which cause the bad publicity.
I was talking about Christianity getting bad press because of people who are all like 'God hates gay people' which is COMPLETELY FALSE. And that fool who burnt the Qur'an. They're all silly.

[dontfiguremeout]

Well I am a Christian, and the one things I dislike about Christians is that they try to over protect about their religion. If something doesn't sound right to them, they "defend" themselves, and try to prove them right. Like sadly it happened to one of my close friends who is an atheist (our beliefs doesn't get in the way of our friendship) and she had to do a monologue and she picked a very deep atheist monologue, and she told me a couple nights after that so many Christians came up to her and just bullied her. I almost went into tears! I know she is an atheist and I didn't really enjoy her monologue, but Christians are suppose to be respectful to ALL believers! It just gave her another good reason to stay an atheist. But yeah, that's the one thing I don't really like about other Christians, is they are way to protective! Now I live by what I said about Christians needing to be respectful to all believers, because every post I posted about my religion I asked not to be bashed, but be respected as I would respect your beliefs. So yeah, please be respectful to this past, as I have read everyones posts on this thread and was very respectful to a lot of your beliefs.

[Dobesta]

Well I am a Christian, and the one things I dislike about Christians is that they try to over protect about their religion. If something doesn't sound right to them, they "defend" themselves, and try to prove them right. Like sadly it happened to one of my close friends who is an atheist (our beliefs doesn't get in the way of our friendship) and she had to do a monologue and she picked a very deep atheist monologue, and she told me a couple nights after that so many Christians came up to her and just bullied her. I almost went into tears! I know she is an atheist and I didn't really enjoy her monologue, but Christians are suppose to be respectful to ALL believers! It just gave her another good reason to stay an atheist. But yeah, that's the one thing I don't really like about other Christians, is they are way to protective! Now I live by what I said about Christians needing to be respectful to all believers, because every post I posted about my religion I asked not to be bashed, but be respected as I would respect your beliefs. So yeah, please be respectful to this past, as I have read everyones posts on this thread and was very respectful to a lot of your beliefs.

Yeah I agree. Bible bashing never helps anyone. And there is a very fine line. I hope I haven't overstepped it. Thanks for your input :) The purpose of this was not to preach to anyone, but to just dispel some of the ideas that people can have about Christianity and Christians (Eg. the whole 'God hates gay people' thing which is completely ridiculous)

[sammy1996]

No, in Christianity, it is believed that it happened. Plus, how would you know if it's a symbolism in Christianity or not? It's not about symbolism in the Christian faith, it's a story that actually happened, because man was to sinful, so God decided to wipe the earth clean. And yes, Adam and Eve did have sex together, then their kids had sex together and so on. Here (http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2010/04/100428-noahs-ark-found-in-turkey-science-religion-culture/) is proof about Noah's ark.




Noah's ark

So sin corrupted the gene pool?

[Cicero]

So sin corrupted the gene pool?

In a sense, I believe it did. As the original poster said, back then people lived longer. Which is true. Sin I believe caused the human race to decline in years. Also, (as he said I'm just agreeing) people were a lot bigger than today. It is believed that people back then, we're about 7-9 feet tall. Sounds unreal, but their are people who believe it. Which I do agree with. Also, (maybe off topic) I believe that their are different looking people and different colored people because of where they originally were from. Back with Pangea, people went all around the super continent. But as it drifted, different people evolved (changed slowing) to what they needed most. People in hot places were skinnier and darker, people in cold places were whiter and larger.
So basically, it is believed that sin had affected the gene pool. Many, many biblical scholars believe and agree with this.

[Dobesta]

In a sense, I believe it did. As the original poster said, back then people lived longer. Which is true. Sin I believe caused the human race to decline in years. Also, (as he said I'm just agreeing) people were a lot bigger than today. It is believed that people back then, we're about 7-9 feet tall. Sounds unreal, but their are people who believe it. Which I do agree with. Also, (maybe off topic) I believe that their are different looking people and different colored people because of where they originally were from. Back with Pangea, people went all around the super continent. But as it drifted, different people evolved (changed slowing) to what they needed most. People in hot places were skinnier and darker, people in cold places were whiter and larger.
So basically, it is believed that sin had affected the gene pool. Many, many biblical scholars believe and agree with this.

I pretty much agree with this. I'm still formulating within myself what I think about the whole super-continent thing. Although there's a fair bit of evidence so I think I agree. I had this thought that maybe at the tower of babel, God split up the people and separated the continents, leaving them as they are today.

[StoppingTime]

The earliest humans were thought to have been living about 2.3 million years ago. There were absolutely zero human species on Pangea, which existed hundreds of millions of years earlier.

[Dobesta]

The earliest humans were thought to have been living about 2.3 million years ago. There were absolutely zero human species on Pangea, which existed hundreds of millions of years earlier.

Ok, then completely disregard that theory :P See? Christians are often still formulating their own ideas about what the believe about creation :)

[StoppingTime]

Ok, then completely disregard that theory :P See? Christians are often still formulating their own ideas about what the believe about creation :)

...Or, they are trying to use science to make it fit with the Bible.

[Cicero]

...Or, they are trying to use science to make it fit with the Bible.

Or there is also science that can back up the bible as well as secular viewpoints. Also, Pangea is believed to be a theory.

[StoppingTime]

Or there is also science that can back up the bible as well as secular viewpoints. Also, Pangea is believed to be a theory.

"Believed to be a theory." Wow.
---
Anyway, what's your point to this statement?

[Cicero]

"Believed to be a theory." Wow.
---
Anyway, what's your point to this statement?

To prove religion doesn't try to make science fit, cause a lot of science does fit it

[StoppingTime]

To prove religion doesn't try to make science fit, cause a lot of science does fit it

But you just did that by saying Pangea, though you really had no idea what you were talking about. You were trying to make it fit.

[Cicero]

But you just did that by saying Pangea, though you really had no idea what you were talking about. You were trying to make it fit.

But it was just a theory I believed in, like how Christians battle between the long day theory vs short day theory
Long day is where it might've taken god thousands of years to create everything, whereas the short day suggestes it took god 7 days to do everything.

[StoppingTime]

So you just switch your beliefs once you realize it doesn't work? That doesn't seem to solid.

[Dobesta]

So you just switch your beliefs once you realize it doesn't work? That doesn't seem to solid.

That's exactly what science is??? When there's evidence for something different, then beliefs about what happened change. As long as what happens in the Bible (especially the fall of man and the sacrifice of Jesus) is at the core and remains the same it's all good. That's how Christians can believe different things about minor details and still believe essentially the same thing.

[Azunite]

I really don't understand the point to religious arguments. Most people see that there is no way that God's existence can be proven. Then again, it can't be disproven either. So why argue over something that can never truly have an answer?
And as for the argument, "If God is so powerful, why are people starving?" I quote this:

All I am going to do in this thread is to salute this man who spoiled me by quoting something I have said. Yay I feel so important for once.


Oh, another question: Do you think Muslims are demonspawns? This question is directed at the founder of this thread.

[Dobesta]

All I am going to do in this thread is to salute this man who spoiled me by quoting something I have said. Yay I feel so important for once.


Oh, another question: Do you think Muslims are demonspawns? This question is directed at the founder of this thread.

No way do I think that they're demonspawns. That's completely ridiculous haha :P I think that muslims are normal people. While I believe that they aren't correct, they're no better or worse than anyone else :)

[Azunite]

Why do you think they aren't correct? We all believe in the same God.

[Magus]

Also I KNOW this will probably come up so here's my early reply. People back then had longer life spans because sin was not as prevalent in the world. This would mean that the affects of sin (disease, pain, death) were not as strong as they are now. Longer lifespans also allow for more offspring, helping to explain a much larger population boom..

Is this me, or this guy never heard of ecology? Fuck ecolgy, basic biology, man.

[Azunite]

Is this me, or this guy never heard of ecology? Fuck ecolgy, basic biology, man.


He may be right, look at Elves, they live longer than any other race, and all they do is to spend their entire days in their libraries.

[Magus]

He may be right, look at Elves, they live longer than any other race, and all they do is to spend their entire days in their libraries.

Just about any race other than humans just live longer. Trolls, Goblins, Dwarves, Ogres, Demons and etcetera.

[Azunite]

Just about any race other than humans just live longer. Trolls, Goblins, Dwarves, Ogres, Demons and etcetera.

Goblins live longer than humans? :O

[Magus]

Goblins live longer than humans? :O
No. Honestly, I don't know.

[Azunite]

No. Honestly, I don't know.

Does it matter? They are all sliced in pieces by my steel!

But we digres

[Cicero]

No. Honestly, I don't know.

Does it matter? They are all sliced in pieces by my steel!

But we digres

Just about any race other than humans just live longer. Trolls, Goblins, Dwarves, Ogres, Demons and etcetera.

Goblins live longer than humans? :O

I would've thought demons or trolls live the longest :O

[Dobesta]

Why do you think they aren't correct? We all believe in the same God.

Well, because they both originally come from Judaism (I'm pretty sure islam kind of does), it's the same God. Although, Christians believe that Jesus Christ was God's son, the messiah, who died for the sins of the world. Jews believe that Jesus was a false teacher and a normal man. Muslims believe that he was just a man, and a prophet, but not the son of God. (I think they reject the son of God idea because they refuse to believe that someone as great and powerful as God would humble himself that much, but I'm not 100% sure)
Any jews or muslims out there please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, this is what I've heard/read.

Is this me, or this guy never heard of ecology? Fuck ecolgy, basic biology, man.

When you're talking about the spiritual and supernatural, science doesn't have to make sense. God made the laws of nature, he can do what he wants with them. I understand that you probably wont accept what I just said because you don't believe, and I get that. But that's what I believe. It might seem irrational, but think about it. With the premise of a God that created the universe and has complete control over it, with spiritual effects that we have no concept of, it's possible.

[Azunite]

Well, because they both originally come from Judaism (I'm pretty sure islam kind of does), it's the same God. Although, Christians believe that Jesus Christ was God's son, the messiah, who died for the sins of the world. Jews believe that Jesus was a false teacher and a normal man. Muslims believe that he was just a man, and a prophet, but not the son of God. (I think they reject the son of God idea because they refuse to believe that someone as great and powerful as God would humble himself that much, but I'm not 100% sure)
Any jews or muslims out there please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, this is what I've heard/read.

When you think, all 3 major religions are of the same origin, the only difference is that the places they were born in were different that's why cultures and traditions were also mixed in these religions, these make them different. It's still a silly fact for me and for other Muslims that Jesus was the Son of God. God is not a natural being and Christians really like to show God so, for example you show God as a male, which is again wrong for us. God isn't married to anyone either, so that means God has an illegitimate son? Way to go people.
Oh and yeah in our opinion he was simply at the wrong place at the wrong time. We believe Jesus Christ is not dead, but God "extracted" him out of the Earth and those who killed him killed a decoy instead. One day Jesus will return to Earth to beat this boss-level creature before Apocalypse, etc...


When you're talking about the spiritual and supernatural, science doesn't have to make sense. God made the laws of nature, he can do what he wants with them. I understand that you probably wont accept what I just said because you don't believe, and I get that. But that's what I believe. It might seem irrational, but think about it. With the premise of a God that created the universe and has complete control over it, with spiritual effects that we have no concept of, it's possible.

Even when you try to look from a religious perspective it is irrational: You say people live shorter now because the amount of sins has increased.
Think about it, if the amount of sins are increased, then so increases the amount of good deeds to make.

[Dabigdtc]

I'm a proud atheist

[Fractured Silhouette]

Here's a question: :)

http://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/Babies_dcc2e0_2377435.jpg

[Magus]

When you're talking about the spiritual and supernatural, science doesn't have to make sense. God made the laws of nature, he can do what he wants with them. I understand that you probably wont accept what I just said because you don't believe, and I get that. But that's what I believe. It might seem irrational, but think about it. With the premise of a God that created the universe and has complete control over it, with spiritual effects that we have no concept of, it's possible.No, thanks. I'd rather live inthe real world, noton some bronze age fantasy.

[Cicero]

No, thanks. I'd rather live inthe real world, noton some bronze age fantasy.

Than a lot of people must live on the bronze age, over 1 billion people that is.

[Magus]

Than a lot of people must live on the bronze age, over 1 billion people that is.

Can't help them, then. But it's up to them if they live their life believing in Assyrian and Mesoptamian myths or live in the real world.

[Dobesta]

When you think, all 3 major religions are of the same origin, the only difference is that the places they were born in were different that's why cultures and traditions were also mixed in these religions, these make them different. It's still a silly fact for me and for other Muslims that Jesus was the Son of God. God is not a natural being and Christians really like to show God so, for example you show God as a male, which is again wrong for us. God isn't married to anyone either, so that means God has an illegitimate son? Way to go people.
Oh and yeah in our opinion he was simply at the wrong place at the wrong time. We believe Jesus Christ is not dead, but God "extracted" him out of the Earth and those who killed him killed a decoy instead. One day Jesus will return to Earth to beat this boss-level creature before Apocalypse, etc...




Even when you try to look from a religious perspective it is irrational: You say people live shorter now because the amount of sins has increased.
Think about it, if the amount of sins are increased, then so increases the amount of good deeds to make.

In my opinion, Jesus was God's son. Conceived by the Holy Spirit in Mary's womb (obviously we don't know exactly how this worked, but exact details aren't incredibly important). What we need to understand is that Jesus was FULLY man and FULLY God. Not half and half. Both. That way, Jesus was perfect, never sinning. This meant he could take the punishment for our sin. Because he was perfect, he didn't deserve to die. But he was killed and took on all the sin of the world, past, present, future.
I wouldn't really say illegitimate son. Seeing as God isn't human and doesn't really have sex.

And can you just clarify that last bit, I didn't quite understand what you meant. Do you mean that if sins are increased, you need to do more good deeds to remedy that? Because if that's what you meant then in Christianity that's not correct. We aren't saved by our actions, we're saved by Christ's death on the cross and our response to that (following Jesus).

[Dobesta]

No, thanks. I'd rather live inthe real world, noton some bronze age fantasy.

So what happens to your conciousness after you die?

[Jess]

it's gone. you cease to exist.

[Azunite]

In my opinion, Jesus was God's son. Conceived by the Holy Spirit in Mary's womb (obviously we don't know exactly how this worked, but exact details aren't incredibly important). What we need to understand is that Jesus was FULLY man and FULLY God. Not half and half. Both. That way, Jesus was perfect, never sinning. This meant he could take the punishment for our sin. Because he was perfect, he didn't deserve to die. But he was killed and took on all the sin of the world, past, present, future.
I wouldn't really say illegitimate son. Seeing as God isn't human and doesn't really have sex.

If God doesn't have sex, then God may not have a child: Simple as that.

And can you just clarify that last bit, I didn't quite understand what you meant. Do you mean that if sins are increased, you need to do more good deeds to remedy that? Because if that's what you meant then in Christianity that's not correct. We aren't saved by our actions, we're saved by Christ's death on the cross and our response to that (following Jesus).

You said that people lived longer in the past because they committed less sins. I say that argument is wrong because as the options to sin increase, so increases the options to commit good deeds. So either way the ratio is 1:1, so commiting sins has nothing to do with lifespan.

[Haufen]

Just to clear it up: Catholics, protestants, reformists, calvinists etc are all Christians.
Seems like not all people (in particular Americans) understand this.

[Cicero]

Just to clear it up: Catholics, protestants, reformists, calvinists etc are all Christians.
Seems like not all people (in particular Americans) understand this.

Well, in a sense no :)

The Roman Catholic Church is a very different branch from it. General Christianity isn't governed by a supreme church and by the pope, it's just referred to as un-denominational, while Protestant, Lutherans, etc. are a certain denomination. None of them abide by the rules of the Roman Catholic Church. Yes, it's considered Christianity, but not in the sense of it being like Lutherans, Methodists, Baptists, Protestants, etc. they all abide by the Bible alone. While Roman Catholics abide by the Bible, and the Roman Catholic Church.

If God doesn't have sex, then God may not have a child: Simple as that.

It's a very complicated thing, you will not understand, and you will never understand. Christianity's greatest theologians have a hard time with the Holy Trinity. Theologians that have spent their whole lives trying to understand it, still could only grab a small grasp of it, so I doubt a 13-25 year old could understand it. Especially one that doesn't even believe in the faith of Christianity.

[Infinityslam]

Question: Do most people that believe in god (to clear that discussion up), and yes I wrote god with small letters because it 1: is not a special human of any kind and 2: is not more important that any human (people, be proud of yourself, please!). To continue my question, ...know how their religion started, in facts, not the stories from the bible.

[User Deleted]

Hypothetically Adam and Eve ate of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, then gained the ability to distinguish good from evil, though god did not want that therefor he punished them. One of the strangest things about this I feel is that since they had not yet eaten from the tree of knowledge of good and evil they hadn't the ability to see positive from negative, good from bad. This also means they couldn't see god, gods word, satan, or satans word as good or evil.This, by connection, means they even if they knew god created them there was no way of distinguishing if he was good or evil. Also that they could not possibly know if he was being truthful or lying about not eating from the tree. Then Satan tells them to eat, and eve does and proceeds to make adam eat. Without knowing good from evil how would they have known to listen to god or satan, or see who was right? What justifies god punishing them for an action they did not fully understand? Shouldn't they have gotten another chance where they knew where they were getting into?

[Cicero]

Question: Do most people that believe in god (to clear that discussion up), and yes I wrote god with small letters because it 1: is not a special human of any kind and 2: is not more important that any human (people, be proud of yourself, please!). To continue my question, ...know how their religion started, in facts, not the stories from the bible.

Your question was very confusing. But I think I understand some of it.

People who are Christian do not believe they are better than anyone else. Though some may act it, they really aren't better than anyone else. A Christian sometimes tries to help others to Christ, by pointing out some things they do is sinful, some people may see this as them trying to be better than everyone else, or them thinking down on another person. When that's not the case, they're doing it out of the kindness of their heart. People who hold I hate gays sign, aren't doing it out of love, which is how they're supposed to do it. When your trying to lead someone to Christ, your supposed to be extremely kind and loving about it. That's how it's supposed to be. But some people don't do that, and when they actually do it out of hate,like those anti gay holding signs (that say fags go to hell or whatever) they're committing a sin. The bible says that Christians are the candles of the world, they give light to a world of darkness. Which can be translated as, Christians giving the word of God to a very secular world.

Shouldn't they have gotten another chance where they knew where they were getting into?
I'm sure many Christians agree with you. But they did go against God, meaning that they sinned. They fell into temptation. But God gave them a choice. It's actually good, that God gave the, that choice. God didn't want us all robots, he wanted people to have choices in life, the choice to sin and the choice to follow him. God wanted us to have a choice, to follow him, or to not follow him.
Honestly think of a world where you couldn't sin. Some will see it as awesome, because people will automatically go to heaven. While others would think that'd be like being in jail, we couldn't even sin once, because we wouldnt understand sin, meaning their wouldn't be secular science, their wouldn't be any homosexuality, and their wouldn't be any tv shows that everyone loves (cause each tv show includes a sin).

So as you can tell. God set up that situation, to give everyone a choice. Because he loves everyone, and he didn't want us to be robots saying "Praise God, we love God".

The basis of Christianity, can only be believed in by faith alone. Science cannot prove Adam and Eve. Science can prove a lot of biblical events, whether you a Christian or not, you cannot deny that Jesus Christ existed, their are also ancient articles which prove that the king during Christs birth, went on a murdering rampage of all new burns, and you cannot deny that Noah built an ark of great magnitude, because they actually found an ark. But what does take faith, is that Jesus Christ was the son of God or Noah built the ark, because a world flood was imminent.

[User Deleted]

I'm sure many Christians agree with you. But they did go against God, meaning that they sinned. They fell into temptation. But God gave them a choice. It's actually good, that God gave the, that choice. God didn't want us all robots, he wanted people to have choices in life, the choice to sin and the choice to follow him. God wanted us to have a choice, to follow him, or to not follow him.

Honestly think of a world where you couldn't sin. Some will see it as awesome, because people will automatically go to heaven. While others would think that'd be like being in jail, we couldn't even sin once, because we wouldnt understand sin, meaning their wouldn't be secular science, their wouldn't be any homosexuality, and their wouldn't be any tv shows that everyone loves (cause each tv show includes a sin).

So as you can tell. God set up that situation, to give everyone a choice. Because he loves everyone, and he didn't want us to be robots saying "Praise God, we love God".

The basis of Christianity, can only be believed in by faith alone. Science cannot prove Adam and Eve. Science can prove a lot of biblical events, whether you a Christian or not, you cannot deny that Jesus Christ existed, their are also ancient articles which prove that the king during Christs birth, went on a murdering rampage of all new burns, and you cannot deny that Noah built an ark of great magnitude, because they actually found an ark. But what does take faith, is that Jesus Christ was the son of God or Noah built the ark, because a world flood was imminent.

I think you miss my point, I'm not saying that it's bad he gave them a choice. Quite on the contrary, I think it's good. If a god would let 66+% of the population burn forever while the rest are partying I'd honestly not want to be with the god, therefor I'd want the choice to not have to join him. But that is beside the point too. My point is this: God technically gave them a choice, but he didn't give them the ability to understand their choice. Before going against god and eating the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil (fuck, that's a long name) they couldn't know good from evil. By extension they couldn't understand if god was good or evil, or if his word was good or evil. Same with Satan. They lacked the concept of good and bad so upon receiving a second command there was no way to determine either right or wrong. What I'm saying is what good is a choice if you don't understand it?

Let's take for example a baby, of course a baby understands good and bad on a basic level so this is sheerly for the purpose of decisions without proper knowledge. The mother for the first time sets the baby in her lap, evenly and centered. Before letting it feed first it warns her child not to suckle her right breast or she will kill him. Here comes the nasty brother, he knows what her mom will do so he wants to defy mom. He comes up to the baby and leads it's head to the right breast and says "the milk here is better." The baby doesn't really have any idea of what he heard because he doesn't understand speech, even with the tones of voice to represent feelings it doesn't know much about what is going on. Being closer to the one breast it suckles the right breast and the mom kills it for making the wrong choice and justifies it with "I warned you."

What does this have to do with god? Take my first paragraph, adam and eve without the knowledge of good and evil could make no informed decision based upon two contradicting commands of two separatism entities who they can't identify as good or evil. I know it's a bit more confusing but that might make more sense.

And just in case you missed it here it is in my last post:

What justifies god punishing them for an action they did not fully understand?

Onto historic "evidence." Many biblical events, more than can be "proven" can be disproved. Noahs arc is claimed to be about 450ft long, that's approximately six average houses lined up next to each other. Six houses, all the animals, BS. I did approximate math myself, it'd be more along the lines of 70,000ft. No matter how much wood you harvest and how much metal you smith no single wood structure that large could be built even in ten average lifetimes, much less survive the sea. That would take at least a whole town, and I believe the arc found may be remnant of a large boat of massive collaboration and in a small culture-- thus why it isn't documented. None the less the one found I believe could easily be 450ft.

The flood should be obvious, you know the theory of global warming? It's natural climate change, a cycle, it was in another cycle where the ice melted, and the ice probably more than once. Not that complected.

The seas splitting? Remember the myth of Atlantis? A relatively advanced city was found on an island off the coast of spain-- by the same quake that sunk it a tsunami may have formed, as do with many quakes, temporarily sucking the water far from shore.

Innumerous events in the bible that should have been huge weren't documented out of the bible on a further note.

Pardon me, I know much of that was not question, but a lot of this has been floating around my head and my close friends refuse to talk about it, this is something that I really needed to do.

[Dobesta]

If God doesn't have sex, then God may not have a child: Simple as that.



You said that people lived longer in the past because they committed less sins. I say that argument is wrong because as the options to sin increase, so increases the options to commit good deeds. So either way the ratio is 1:1, so commiting sins has nothing to do with lifespan.

1. God is not human. Therefore he doesn't need to have sex in order to create offspring. To be honest I don't know how he did it (I'm not God). I assume something along the lines of either creating a sperm to fertilise one of Mary's eggs or creating an embryo inside her.
2. I'm saying the sin just accumulated, and got up to the point we're at now. Sin can't just be cancelled out by doing good things. Just like a single drop of food colouring in a jug of water. No matter how much more water you put in, it will still be tainted.

Just to clear it up: Catholics, protestants, reformists, calvinists etc are all Christians.
Seems like not all people (in particular Americans) understand this.

Well, in a sense no :)

The Roman Catholic Church is a very different branch from it. General Christianity isn't governed by a supreme church and by the pope, it's just referred to as un-denominational, while Protestant, Lutherans, etc. are a certain denomination. None of them abide by the rules of the Roman Catholic Church. Yes, it's considered Christianity, but not in the sense of it being like Lutherans, Methodists, Baptists, Protestants, etc. they all abide by the Bible alone. While Roman Catholics abide by the Bible, and the Roman Catholic Church.



It's a very complicated thing, you will not understand, and you will never understand. Christianity's greatest theologians have a hard time with the Holy Trinity. Theologians that have spent their whole lives trying to understand it, still could only grab a small grasp of it, so I doubt a 13-25 year old could understand it. Especially one that doesn't even believe in the faith of Christianity.

Christian literally means 'Christ-follower'. As long as someone follows Jesus they're a Christian, simple as that :)

[Dobesta]

Question: Do most people that believe in god (to clear that discussion up), and yes I wrote god with small letters because it 1: is not a special human of any kind and 2: is not more important that any human (people, be proud of yourself, please!). To continue my question, ...know how their religion started, in facts, not the stories from the bible.

As in how did it start? Well technically, it started from the beginning of time, so there isn't any set 'starting point' but I guess you could say that the first real group to start actively practising a form of 'religion' would be the Israelites coming out of Jesus. Moses is believed to have written the first five(ish) books in the bible. With God's help seeing as he wasn't there in Genesis (Moses DID spend like 40 days on top of mount Sinai or something). So yeah, though the bible from that, tells the story from before then.

Hypothetically Adam and Eve ate of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, then gained the ability to distinguish good from evil, though god did not want that therefor he punished them. One of the strangest things about this I feel is that since they had not yet eaten from the tree of knowledge of good and evil they hadn't the ability to see positive from negative, good from bad. This also means they couldn't see god, gods word, satan, or satans word as good or evil.This, by connection, means they even if they knew god created them there was no way of distinguishing if he was good or evil. Also that they could not possibly know if he was being truthful or lying about not eating from the tree. Then Satan tells them to eat, and eve does and proceeds to make adam eat. Without knowing good from evil how would they have known to listen to god or satan, or see who was right? What justifies god punishing them for an action they did not fully understand? Shouldn't they have gotten another chance where they knew where they were getting into?

Well I would agree with you on the most part. It's true that Adam and Eve would not have been able to distinguish between good and evil, but God did say don't eat or you will surely die. Simple as that. It's all Satan's fault -_- and ours...

I think you miss my point, I'm not saying that it's bad he gave them a choice. Quite on the contrary, I think it's good. If a god would let 66+% of the population burn forever while the rest are partying I'd honestly not want to be with the god, therefor I'd want the choice to not have to join him. But that is beside the point too. My point is this: God technically gave them a choice, but he didn't give them the ability to understand their choice. Before going against god and eating the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil (fuck, that's a long name) they couldn't know good from evil. By extension they couldn't understand if god was good or evil, or if his word was good or evil. Same with Satan. They lacked the concept of good and bad so upon receiving a second command there was no way to determine either right or wrong. What I'm saying is what good is a choice if you don't understand it?

What does this have to do with god? Take my first paragraph, adam and eve without the knowledge of good and evil could make no informed decision based upon two contradicting commands of two separatism entities who they can't identify as good or evil. I know it's a bit more confusing but that might make more sense.

Like I just said in this post, God did warn Adam and Eve that they would die if they ate from the tree. You'd think that they would have remembered.

Also Tacitus, you said that if there was no sin there wouldn't be any science? I disagree with you there man, don't you think we would still have used science as a way to explore the amazing creation God made? :)

Innumerous events in the bible that should have been huge weren't documented out of the bible on a further note.

Examples? Not trying to be rude at all, just curious :)

[Cicero]

I think you miss my point, I'm not saying that it's bad he gave them a choice. Quite on the contrary, I think it's good. If a god would let 66+% of the population burn forever while the rest are partying I'd honestly not want to be with the god, therefor I'd want the choice to not have to join him. But that is beside the point too. My point is this: God technically gave them a choice, but he didn't give them the ability to understand their choice. Before going against god and eating the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil (fuck, that's a long name) they couldn't know good from evil. By extension they couldn't understand if god was good or evil, or if his word was good or evil. Same with Satan. They lacked the concept of good and bad so upon receiving a second command there was no way to determine either right or wrong. What I'm saying is what good is a choice if you don't understand it?

Let's take for example a baby, of course a baby understands good and bad on a basic level so this is sheerly for the purpose of decisions without proper knowledge. The mother for the first time sets the baby in her lap, evenly and centered. Before letting it feed first it warns her child not to suckle her right breast or she will kill him. Here comes the nasty brother, he knows what her mom will do so he wants to defy mom. He comes up to the baby and leads it's head to the right breast and says "the milk here is better." The baby doesn't really have any idea of what he heard because he doesn't understand speech, even with the tones of voice to represent feelings it doesn't know much about what is going on. Being closer to the one breast it suckles the right breast and the mom kills it for making the wrong choice and justifies it with "I warned you."

What does this have to do with god? Take my first paragraph, adam and eve without the knowledge of good and evil could make no informed decision based upon two contradicting commands of two separatism entities who they can't identify as good or evil. I know it's a bit more confusing but that might make more sense.

And just in case you missed it here it is in my last post:



Onto historic "evidence." Many biblical events, more than can be "proven" can be disproved. Noahs arc is claimed to be about 450ft long, that's approximately six average houses lined up next to each other. Six houses, all the animals, BS. I did approximate math myself, it'd be more along the lines of 70,000ft. No matter how much wood you harvest and how much metal you smith no single wood structure that large could be built even in ten average lifetimes, much less survive the sea. That would take at least a whole town, and I believe the arc found may be remnant of a large boat of massive collaboration and in a small culture-- thus why it isn't documented. None the less the one found I believe could easily be 450ft.

The flood should be obvious, you know the theory of global warming? It's natural climate change, a cycle, it was in another cycle where the ice melted, and the ice probably more than once. Not that complected.

The seas splitting? Remember the myth of Atlantis? A relatively advanced city was found on an island off the coast of spain-- by the same quake that sunk it a tsunami may have formed, as do with many quakes, temporarily sucking the water far from shore.

Innumerous events in the bible that should have been huge weren't documented out of the bible on a further note.

Pardon me, I know much of that was not question, but a lot of this has been floating around my head and my close friends refuse to talk about it, this is something that I really needed to do.

God doesn't want 66% of the populous to go to hell. But he allows it, it's the choice everyone makes. If they don't wanna accept Christ in their hearts, that's their choice. If God were to allow them into heaven, it would make him unholy. To be holy, sin must not be present. If sin was present in heaven, he'd be unholy. When Christ enters someone's life, all sin is forgiven. When they repent, sin is forgiven, so when they enter heaven, they are without sin, meaning heaven will still be holy. But honestly, God should be feared. He should be. But not the fear we think of, but we should fear God in the sense of respect. Kinda like fearing our parents, I fear my dad, in the sense of disrespecting him, but I still love him very much. In the old testament, God was feared in that way, now a days, people use blasphemy for his name and they don't care, in the old testament, they were scared for their lives to blasphemy God. Also, the book of Revelations is pretty scary too, that book is like the justice for all Christians persecuted, like the water turned into blood, the anti Christ, that's literally when all hell breaks lose. But I think that book is awesome cause of the two witnesses.

The two witnesses are 2 people who come down to heaven to save as many people as possible. Then the dragon (figurative speech, but the book of revelation is full of symbols and meaning, but must be taken literally, like the different dragons is Satan as politics and religion and etc) kills them. But before they die, they're preaching about God, anyone who tries to harm them, will be burnt to deat by the mouths of the two witnesses (literally this is taken in the bible, they will literally breath fire upon their enemies and those who try to harm them) and after a certain amount of days, they get killed and are on the streets for 2 days or so (forgot the exact days) while their dead everyone rejoices cause they'll be gone of learning about God (much how this community is, they just hate all the God stuff). So after those 2 days or so, they will rise up, and a major earthquake will happen. So then all who see will then believe and be saved. It really is an awesome book to read, especially for Christians. But it's a horrible book if your non Christian cause God then unleashes everything horrible onto the earth and Satan then comes as the anti Christ. But it's my favorite books :D you would even like it though, you might take it as fiction (while Christians will take it as nonfiction, it's basically what happens after the rapture, so Christians don't need to worry lol)

[User Deleted]

God doesn't want 66% of the populous to go to hell. But he allows it, it's the choice everyone makes. If they don't wanna accept Christ in their hearts, that's their choice. If God were to allow them into heaven, it would make him unholy. To be holy, sin must not be present. If sin was present in heaven, he'd be unholy. When Christ enters someone's life, all sin is forgiven. When they repent, sin is forgiven, so when they enter heaven, they are without sin, meaning heaven will still be holy. But honestly, God should be feared. He should be. But not the fear we think of, but we should fear God in the sense of respect. Kinda like fearing our parents, I fear my dad, in the sense of disrespecting him, but I still love him very much. In the old testament, God was feared in that way, now a days, people use blasphemy for his name and they don't care, in the old testament, they were scared for their lives to blasphemy God. Also, the book of Revelations is pretty scary too, that book is like the justice for all Christians persecuted, like the water turned into blood, the anti Christ, that's literally when all hell breaks lose. But I think that book is awesome cause of the two witnesses.

The two witnesses are 2 people who come down to heaven to save as many people as possible. Then the dragon (figurative speech, but the book of revelation is full of symbols and meaning, but must be taken literally, like the different dragons is Satan as politics and religion and etc) kills them. But before they die, they're preaching about God, anyone who tries to harm them, will be burnt to deat by the mouths of the two witnesses (literally this is taken in the bible, they will literally breath fire upon their enemies and those who try to harm them) and after a certain amount of days, they get killed and are on the streets for 2 days or so (forgot the exact days) while their dead everyone rejoices cause they'll be gone of learning about God (much how this community is, they just hate all the God stuff). So after those 2 days or so, they will rise up, and a major earthquake will happen. So then all who see will then believe and be saved. It really is an awesome book to read, especially for Christians. But it's a horrible book if your non Christian cause God then unleashes everything horrible onto the earth and Satan then comes as the anti Christ. But it's my favorite books :D you would even like it though, you might take it as fiction (while Christians will take it as nonfiction, it's basically what happens after the rapture, so Christians don't need to worry lol)

It amazes me how you manage to say so little yet take up so much space. You avoided my question, talked in the first paragraph about what I already know, and was completely off topic in the second paragraph. Did you read what I said? My points were this: Adam and eve could have not known good from bad eating from the knowledge of good and evil, because they lacked the knowledge of good and evil. What justifies giving them a decision without them knowing what the decision really meant? The scientific evidence leans towards atheism not theism. (no question involved here)

When I say 66% would die, that is all denominations of Christianity, taking yours specifically it would be more like 89% would go to hell. What kind of person with half a sense of morals would let anyone die forever for not believing in them? Much less 89% of people dying. People suffering eternal pain is not right no matter how you cut it. Hell is a control device used by christian leaders to scare people into fellowship. It's ironic, if someone slapped you and your options were let them live somewhere perfect and give them a second chance to get some real evidence, or die forever.

Like I was saying if god was real he would be so cruel I would rather not live with him. Sometimes you have to give people a second chance, I'm not talking about being "saved" on earth, I'm saying a fair chance at knowing the decision they are making. A god would know anyone with a bit of logic would want evidence. A perfect god would have the compassion. Even if god is real he isn't perfect. And he changes his mind after Jesus experiences what being human is like, if he was omnipotent he wouldn't suddenly put up a charade that he wasn't horrible. At least he fesses up in the old testament. Heck yeah if you believe in god you should fear him, but not like a parent, he is so inconsiderate and horrible one should fear him like a chicken from a lion. He is just as terrible as Satan.

Of course Christians like the book, they take a morbid satisfaction in that the rude people, nonbelievers, people they don't like, they take the satisfaction they they don't have to punish them themselves rather they will suffer forever. Even worse they feel that while their enemies are suffering they are chilling in eternal happiness not caring that someone will be burning in pain forever. Forever is a concept they the mind cannot grasp. Even living forever would be torturous. Of course it is a horrible book to non-Christians.

[Dwl4]

Im athiest, sorry to all you religious people but i don't and i never will believe in god. i have my reasons so dont try to change my mind

[Cicero]

Im athiest, sorry to all you religious people but i don't and i never will believe in god. i have my reasons so dont try to change my mind

Ok your point to this post? This is a ask Christian thread. Not share what you believe.

Of course Christians like the book, they take a morbid satisfaction in that the rude people, nonbelievers, people they don't like, they take the satisfaction they they don't have to punish them themselves rather they will suffer forever. Even worse they feel that while their enemies are suffering they are chilling in eternal happiness not caring that someone will be burning in pain forever. Forever is a concept they the mind cannot grasp. Even living forever would be torturous. Of course it is a horrible book to non-Christians.

No they like the book,vbecause they know that they'll be taken up in the rapture,meaning eternal happiness sooner. But I like the book for kinda "twisted" ways, sure.

They knew everything they ever needed to know, Adam and eve I believe we're the smartest people to set foot on this earth. But it was temptation that made them do it and it was a sin. They weren't dumb hillbillies. They were probably the smartest people that were to ever step foot.

Plus, revelations is like "pay back" to all Christians who got killed for their beliefs and mocked for their beliefs. Why would god just allow the secular world to do that to his children?

[Jess]

Im athiest, sorry to all you religious people but i don't and i never will believe in god. i have my reasons so dont try to change my mind

good for you. but unfortunately this thread is for asking Christians...post here instead :) --> Why are you atheist? (http://www.virtualteen.org/forums/showthread.php?p=1836861)



okay, I have a question for the Christians. so if you believe God created everything and all, and the story of Adam and Eve...where do the dinosaurs, prehistoric beasts, prehistoric humans come in?

[Cicero]

good for you. but unfortunately this thread is for asking Christians...post here instead :) --> Why are you atheist? (http://www.virtualteen.org/forums/showthread.php?p=1836861)



okay, I have a question for the Christians. so if you believe God created everything and all, and the story of Adam and Eve...where do the dinosaurs, prehistoric beasts, prehistoric humans come in?

This has been a topic that's been debated a lot amongst theologians. We believe they either existed during the time that God was creating the earth (those who believe Gods time of 1 day was thousands of years most likely believe this) and there are also signs of dinosaurs in the book of job.

[User Deleted]

No they like the book,vbecause they know that they'll be taken up in the rapture, meaning eternal happiness sooner. But I like the book for kinda "twisted" ways, sure.

They knew everything they ever needed to know, Adam and eve I believe we're the smartest people to set foot on this earth. But it was temptation that made them do it and it was a sin. They weren't dumb hillbillies. They were probably the smartest people that were to ever step foot.

Plus, revelations is like "pay back" to all Christians who got killed for their beliefs and mocked for their beliefs. Why would god just allow the secular world to do that to his children?

I used to be a christian, I know why I liked the damn book. Opinions will differ I will give you that. You still don't fucking get it. The tree of knowledge of good and evil was what gave them the knowledge, even if the information was in their heads there was no understanding of what good and evil really were ere go they couldn't tell god or saran from evil or good. Why would he allow the world to do that to his children? Pay back? What the fuck, what about the good atheists who didn't do anything to "god's children?" Why should they suffer forever? Being a christian is the equivalent of being brainwashed, tell me different as you may the more I hear from all of you the more I'm convinced.

[Cicero]

I used to be a christian, I know why I liked the damn book. Opinions will differ I will give you that. You still don't fucking get it. The tree of knowledge of good and evil was what gave them the knowledge, even if the information was in their heads there was no understanding of what good and evil really were ere go they couldn't tell god or saran from evil or good. Why would he allow the world to do that to his children? Pay back? What the fuck, what about the good atheists who didn't do anything to "god's children?" Why should they suffer forever? Being a christian is the equivalent of being brainwashed, tell me different as you may the more I hear from all of you the more I'm convinced.

I said its like payback, it's not payback cause it's what is deserved. NO the tree didn't give them knowledge, that's just what it's called. Anyone who doesn't accept Christ in their hearts, will suffer the same fate. Jw. Why do you care about secular peopl going to hell, if you don't believe in Christianity?

[User Deleted]

I said its like payback, it's not payback cause it's what is deserved. NO the tree didn't give them knowledge, that's just what it's called. Anyone who doesn't accept Christ in their hearts, will suffer the same fate. Jw. Why do you care about secular peopl going to hell, if you don't believe in Christianity?

Oh, yeah, people who simply don't believe, good people, fucking deserve to burn forever. Makes goddamn perfect sense. Then why call it the tree of knowledge of good and evil? If it's just called that then it should be the forbidden tree or the tree of the damned or something mildly cool. It's absolutely ridiculous that they use such bland overworked words like good and bad. And why should anyone who was born in a bad situation, a family who doesn't believe in Christianity, why should they suffer forever? Why should I care? Isn't it obvious, what cruel hearted bastard wants someone to suffer for an incomprehensible time? Moreover why care if I don't believe? Why do I care? Because religion brainwashes people into believing that eternal suffering is fine, that you can't live your life doing things you want rather you have to spend your time worshiping a nonexistent being. It teaches terrorism, it tells you to teach these terrible teachings to everyone. It mentally probes you to suffer in thought thinking people you care for will suffer forever. Christianity teaches you to mentally destroy yourself. My life has been nothing if not happier since I became an atheist.

9qQQNZOzFo8&feature=plcp

[Cicero]

Oh, yeah, people who simply don't believe, good people, fucking deserve to burn forever. Makes goddamn perfect sense. Then why call it the tree of knowledge of good and evil? If it's just called that then it should be the forbidden tree or the tree of the damned or something mildly cool. It's absolutely ridiculous that they use such bland overworked words like good and bad. And why should anyone who was born in a bad situation, a family who doesn't believe in Christianity, why should they suffer forever? Why should I care? Isn't it obvious, what cruel hearted bastard wants someone to suffer for an incomprehensible time? Moreover why care if I don't believe? Why do I care? Because religion brainwashes people into believing that eternal suffering is fine, that you can't live your life doing things you want rather you have to spend your time worshiping a nonexistent being. It teaches terrorism, it tells you to teach these terrible teachings to everyone. It mentally probes you to suffer in thought thinking people you care for will suffer forever. Christianity teaches you to mentally destroy yourself. My life has been nothing if not happier since I became an atheist.

9qQQNZOzFo8&feature=plcp



Yeah buddy! 2,000,000,000 people and counting! Woot woot! Man, that video was inspirational, you know what happens everytime we go to church? We speak Arabic and plan suicidal death missions, and we even plan terrorist attacks! That's what happens in churches nationwide! The Vatican, is really the headquarters for millions of attacks worldwide! I'm so shocked you found out about our terrorist organization of Christianity, damn your smart!


If God allowed people who didn't accept Christ in their hearts. Then that would mean sin would enter. Heaven, Christ takes away sin. So when Christians enter heaven, they don't have any sin.

Stop argueing. Your getting no where argueing. I've already explained it in a previous post.

[User Deleted]

Yeah buddy! 2,000,000,000 people and counting! Woot woot! Man, that video was inspirational, you know what happens everytime we go to church? We speak Arabic and plan suicidal death missions, and we even plan terrorist attacks! That's what happens in churches nationwide! The Vatican, is really the headquarters for millions of attacks worldwide! I'm so shocked you found out about our terrorist organization of Christianity, damn your smart!


If God allowed people who didn't accept Christ in their hearts. Then that would mean sin would enter. Heaven, Christ takes away sin. So when Christians enter heaven, they don't have any sin.

Stop argueing. Your getting no where argueing. I've already explained it in a previous post.

Thanks for your sarcasm, it was right on the mark of my message. Psychological terrorism is exactly the same as killing people! Who know? Not me!

If god was omnipotent he could clean them of their sins, simple solution. You have failed entirely to address my main question properly. Okay, so you think the knowledge of good and evil is a name. Then what was the fucking purpose? To let them go against god? Why not let it rest in their action and have forbidden actions, like killing.

You have explained a lot, but nothing that can't be dis-proven and nothing relevant. That's the biggest reason I hate talking with Christians, changing the subject and claiming we take things out of context. If you refuse to give me a good answer, fine, I will believe you really don't have one, good day sir, and if you do congratulations you will be the first person religious or not to actually have an answer.

---

Completely separate question, can god create a boulder so large that god himself could not lift that boulder?

[Cicero]

Thanks for your sarcasm, it was right on the mark of my message. Psychological terrorism is exactly the same as killing people! Who know? Not me!

If god was omnipotent he could clean them of their sins, simple solution. You have failed entirely to address my main question properly. Okay, so you think the knowledge of good and evil is a name. Then what was the fucking purpose? To let them go against god? Why not let it rest in their action and have forbidden actions, like killing.

You have explained a lot, but nothing that can't be dis-proven and nothing relevant. That's the biggest reason I hate talking with Christians, changing the subject and claiming we take things out of context. If you refuse to give me a good answer, fine, I will believe you really don't have one, good day sir, and if you do congratulations you will be the first person religious or not to actually have an answer.

---

Completely separate question, can god create a boulder so large that god himself could not lift that boulder?

Ok, let me put this in something you can understand. He created the tree. So Adam and eve could have a choice. If he didn't create it, being gay wouldn't exist. Murderering would exist. Porn wouldn't exist. Cussing wouldn't exist. 99% of movies wouldn't exist. Anything that's a sin wouldn't exist. God did clean Chrostians of their sins, when they accept Christ into their lives. The whole purpose of Christ, was to be the sacrifice to clean our sins. But you know what we have to do first!? We have to accept him into our hearts (that's a figurative speech, not literal). First you admit your a sinner (sinning is a no no, sin is transgressive against divine law), then you believe Jesus died on the cross for your sins (die means stop living), then you confess to Jesus Christ! And their you have it, you have been wiped of all your sins! Wow! Everything you did before, BAM, gone! Then, you live everyday, trying to improve yourself, and try to become Christ like (referring to Jesus Christ). I'm sure your wondering, how can I make that step to become Christ like!? Well, do something Jesus Christ would do, like help the homeless, pray for your enemies, and try to be a better person!

And actually, NO WHERE IN THE BIBLE DO I SEE THE NAME THE TREE OF KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD AND EVIL. Here's what it says (I'll try to make it easier to read)
The Woman answered the snake, "We may eat fruit from trees in the garden. But God told us, "You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden. You must not even touch it, or you will die." But the snake said to the woman, "You will not die. God knows if you eat the fruit from the tree, you will learn about good and evil and you will be like God!" The woman saw that the tree was beautiful, that it's fruit was good to eat, and that it would make her wise. So she took some of the fruit and ate it.
~Genesis 3:2-7

Now, if you read that, No where did I see the name "The tree of knowledge of good and evil". And when your saying that that it was gonna make them wise. Your saying what the snake (who is really Satan, Satan is the bad guy in Christianity) said about the tree giving knowledge, when it didn't!

Completely separate question, can god create a boulder so large that god himself could not lift that boulder?

I don't know whether this is a legit question. The answer is no.


If God has the ability to do what he does in the below verses, then he has the ability to send anyone who doesnt accept Christ into their hearts to hell. The below verses are also pretty awesome :D

Then I saw another angel coming up from the east who had the seal of the living God. And he called out in a loud voice to the four angels whom God had given power to harm the earth and the sea. He said to them, "Do not harm the land or the sea or the trees until we mark with a sign on the foreheads of the people who serve our God."
Revelation 7:1-4

And if anyone tries to hurt them, fire comes from their mouths and kills their enemies. And if anyone tries to hurt them in whatever way, in that same way that person will die. These witnesses have the power to stop the sky from raining during the time they are prophesying. And they have the power to make the waters become blood, and they have the power to send every kind of trouble to the earth as many times as they want.
Revelation 11:4-7

(I think the red makes it more eye catching. This is all what God does during the last days after Christians go to heaven. This is very just of God to do this to all who have persecuted his children and who have lived sinfully without repenting. So yes, God is also all loving, and that's why he made the tree of the forbidden fruit, so everyone has a choice. They can follow him or not :) its pretty loving he made that tree so everyone who chooses not to follow him, can. But they do have consequences tht might not be all to pleasant.

[User Deleted]

Ok, let me put this in something you can understand. He created the tree. So Adam and eve could have a choice. If he didn't create it, being gay wouldn't exist. Murderering would exist. Porn wouldn't exist. Cussing wouldn't exist. 99% of movies wouldn't exist. Anything that's a sin wouldn't exist. God did clean Chrostians of their sins, when they accept Christ into their lives. The whole purpose of Christ, was to be the sacrifice to clean our sins. But you know what we have to do first!? We have to accept him into our hearts (that's a figurative speech, not literal). First you admit your a sinner (sinning is a no no, sin is transgressive against divine law), then you believe Jesus died on the cross for your sins (die means stop living), then you confess to Jesus Christ! And their you have it, you have been wiped of all your sins! Wow! Everything you did before, BAM, gone! Then, you live everyday, trying to improve yourself, and try to become Christ like (referring to Jesus Christ). I'm sure your wondering, how can I make that step to become Christ like!? Well, do something Jesus Christ would do, like help the homeless, pray for your enemies, and try to be a better person!

And actually, NO WHERE IN THE BIBLE DO I SEE THE NAME THE TREE OF KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD AND EVIL. Here's what it says (I'll try to make it easier to read)
The Woman answered the snake, "We may eat fruit from trees in the garden. But God told us, "You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden. You must not even touch it, or you will die." But the snake said to the woman, "You will not die. God knows if you eat the fruit from the tree, you will learn about good and evil and you will be like God!" The woman saw that the tree was beautiful, that it's fruit was good to eat, and that it would make her wise. So she took some of the fruit and ate it.
~Genesis 3:2-7

Now, if you read that, No where did I see the name "The tree of knowledge of good and evil". And when your saying that that it was gonna make them wise. Your saying what the snake (who is really Satan, Satan is the bad guy in Christianity) said about the tree giving knowledge, when it didn't!



I don't know whether this is a legit question. The answer is no.

Again, most of this was garbage I already knew, but since it is out there let's go over it anyway. Okay, tree, choice, great! Murdering wouldn't exist? Homosexuality wouldn't exist? All these things wouldn't exist without the tree? This is impossible, because while they have a choice they do not have true free will, so why make a tree anyway, why not give them a set of rules? That would be true free will. Asking Jesus into your heart is ridiculous, is simple forgiveness not good enough for god?

Side note what on earth is wrong with homosexuality? Just so you don't give me what I know again, I know that supposedly man and women were created for each other but if a child were born and raised in such a way he wanted to be with a man and was truly happy with that man, it would be the greatest hing other than god in his life even, what is wrong with homosexuality?

Fucking thank you you finally gave me a legitimate answer. Was that so hard? Now that leads to another question, what did the tree do? If adam and eve really had free will they wouldn't need it to kill or preform any sin.

Yes, legitimate question, because if god cannot create a boulder he can lift then he cannot create anything, but if he can than he cannot lift anything, therefor god can literally not be all powerful. What mends the paradox?

[Dobesta]

Ok let me set the record straight. Here's a run down of (my) Christianity from the top, don't feel like you have to read it if you don't want to, just in case you wanted to know exactly what it is I believe:

GRACE - Grace means 'unmerited favour'. Imagine you had a friend who one day randomly gave you a brand new car car. No reason whatsoever, just a free gift. And no matter what you do you can't pay this person back for this massive gift. In the same way, God wants to give us the free gift of eternal life. There's NOTHING we can do to earn or deserve it. It says in Ephesians 2:8-9 '8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith —and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast.' There is NO amount of good works that can make us a 'good person'.
Why can't we earn or deserve it?
SIN - Sin is anything we do in rebellion against God, whether it's in our thoughts, words or actions. It's even not doing 'good' things we should do for others. And EVERYONE sins, we're all as messed up as each other. Romans 3:23 says 'For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God'.
We can't save ourselves any more than a drowning person can save themselves by pulling on their own hair to lift the out of the water. If we wanted eternal life by ourselves, we would need to be perfect, which like I said, no one is. This sin breaks our relationship with God and the ability to receive eternal life. And the amount someone sins is not important. Just like a drop of poison in a glass of water makes the whole glass undrinkable, even if someone only sinned once in their whole life, they are unacceptable to God.
So how does God react to our sin?
GOD - God is loving. He loves us more than anything and doesn't want us to suffer forever. God loves us in spite of our sin, and this love isn't dependent on who we are or what we've done. God is also just (something a lot of people seem to forget). God is gracious yet he doesn't leave the guilty unpunished. And the punishment of sin, as described in Romans 6:23 is 'for the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life'. So God has this tension between his love and his justice. God can't just change who he is, he's eternal and unchanging. But he loves us so much that he would send his son to die and take the judgement in our place. That way the need for a punishment is satisfied and we do not need to take the punishment.
Ok here's an illustration:
Imagine a revolutionary army in the 19th century, carrying all their supplies with them as well as looking after their families. One day the leader's assistant came to him and said that someone had been stealing rations. This leader was furious, so he called all the people together and told them that from now on, if someone was caught stealing food they would be publicly whipped. A few days pass, and the assistant comes back to tell the leader that someone had still been stealing the rations. The leader is furious and demands the culprit be found. The next day the assistant comes back with some good news and bad news. They've found the culprit, but it's the leader's mother. If the leader's mother was whipped, then she would definitely die because she's so old, but he can't go back on his word, because then what kind of a leader would he be, undermining his own authority??? Instead he takes the punishment for his mother, that way he shows the love for his mother and the need for justice is served.
In the same way, God sent Jesus to show love and satisfy the punishment.

CHRIST - Jesus was fully God AND fully man. He had all of the attributes of a human being and went through all the same emotions and sufferings as us. He lived a perfect life and never sinned, hence he did not deserve to die. He took our sin upon himself and ROSE FROM THE FLIPPING DEAD so that we can have a relationship with God and eternal life.

FAITH - Faith IS NOT simply knowing a bunch of 'stuff' about God or praying when you feel like it in the hope you'll get something good out of it OR trying to live like Jesus says because you don't want to go to hell. Faith is recognising that Jesus is God's son and trusting him to take control of your life forever. It's giving him your life in response to the amazing love God showed to us through Jesus. Faith is knowledge and acceptance of Jesus death and resurrection, and trusting Jesus as their God. In John 14:6 Jesus says: 'I am the way, the truth and the life. No one comes to the father except through me'. Faith in Jesus is the only way to eternal life, not 'being a good person'.

Trusting in Jesus is like letting a hitch-hiker drive your car. Trusting him is all you've got, and let me tell you - In my life and the lives of Christians around me I see a much greater sense of personal fulfilment. I don't mean they have more stuff or whatever. They are more content with their lives.

[Dobesta]

Yes, legitimate question, because if god cannot create a boulder he can lift then he cannot create anything, but if he can than he cannot lift anything, therefor god can literally not be all powerful. What mends the paradox?

Simple answer - God created the universe and hence is not bounded by the laws which he has put in place to govern matter. Therefore, the question is invalid. Here's some perspective - the universe to God is like a speck. He is so much beyond all of it.

[Cicero]

Again, most of this was garbage I already knew, but since it is out there let's go over it anyway. Okay, tree, choice, great! Murdering wouldn't exist? Homosexuality wouldn't exist? All these things wouldn't exist without the tree? This is impossible, because while they have a choice they do not have true free will, so why make a tree anyway, why not give them a set of rules? That would be true free will. Asking Jesus into your heart is ridiculous, is simple forgiveness not good enough for god?

Side note what on earth is wrong with homosexuality? Just so you don't give me what I know again, I know that supposedly man and women were created for each other but if a child were born and raised in such a way he wanted to be with a man and was truly happy with that man, it would be the greatest hing other than god in his life even, what is wrong with homosexuality?

Fucking thank you you finally gave me a legitimate answer. Was that so hard? Now that leads to another question, what did the tree do? If adam and eve really had free will they wouldn't need it to kill or preform any sin.

Yes, legitimate question, because if god cannot create a boulder he can lift then he cannot create anything, but if he can than he cannot lift anything, therefor god can literally not be all powerful. What mends the paradox?

According to God homosexuality is an abomination that should only be punishable by eternity in hell. Who said they had free will. Gods only rule, was to not eat the forbidden fruit. That's not to hard is it? You are forgiven through Jesus Christ. Whys it so hard asking him into your heart? I don't see how it can be hard. Anyone can ask him. Adam and eve didnt know about sin. The only thing they knew they couldn't do under any circumstance is eat the fruit of the tree, or even touch it. They wouldn't have been homosexual because they wouldn't have even thought of it, because it wasn't natural. You can argue whether you think it's natural or not. But it's unnatural. If anal sex were meant to be, it wouldn't hurt. Having sex the normal way doesn't hurt but is pleasurable.

[Azunite]

If anal sex were meant to be, it wouldn't hurt. Having sex the normal way doesn't hurt but is pleasurable.


Are you high? So this is what I get from your sentence:

"If something gives you pain in this life, it means it should not be done / it is illegal in God's Court."

Lol.

[Cicero]

Are you high? So this is what I get from your sentence:

"If something gives you pain in this life, it means it should not be done / it is illegal in God's Court."

Lol.

Well, if it's something as natural as sex. I stand by what I said. Something that's supposed to be pleasurable, shouldn't be painful. Theirs nothing wrong if something isn't natural. I was just replying to him, that according to God, homosexuality is an abomination and is punishable by eternity in hell. According to the bible. I was replying to him. Because he had asked a question.

[User Deleted]

According to God homosexuality is an abomination that should only be punishable by eternity in hell. Who said they had free will. Gods only rule, was to not eat the forbidden fruit. That's not to hard is it? You are forgiven through Jesus Christ. Whys it so hard asking him into your heart? I don't see how it can be hard. Anyone can ask him. Adam and eve didnt know about sin. The only thing they knew they couldn't do under any circumstance is eat the fruit of the tree, or even touch it. They wouldn't have been homosexual because they wouldn't have even thought of it, because it wasn't natural. You can argue whether you think it's natural or not. But it's unnatural. If anal sex were meant to be, it wouldn't hurt. Having sex the normal way doesn't hurt but is pleasurable.

That was the point of the tree, to give them a choice, having one choice is essentially just as bad as no choice.

What's so hard? In our generation numerous religions dominate differing areas, being born into a religion means you have a high chance of being born into the wrong one, that is presuming there is a correct one. Not only that he gave people around 0 ano domine people had far more reason to believe, because there would be actual evidence. So it isn't that asking him into your heart is hard, rather that it is hard to believe in him, and if you don't believe you'd just be lying to yourself and god, you'd be better off trying to score a better ring in hell and not lying.

There are so incredibly many things wrong with the natural argument. To start off, I don't like the idea of sex, and breaking the hymen must hurt for the girl, so sex must be unnatural too! Wrong! We can both agree that that is at best an opinion, and a poor one at that. Everything that exists within this reality is natural, natural isn't necessarily good, you could swim in a pool of acid and uranium while sucking poop and it would be as natural as anything else, but it wouldn't be good. Is having a tenancy that you were born with, a tenancy to be with the same gender, really bad enough to burn forever? I can't emphasize this enough, no matter what the punishment is I can't see justification for eternal suffering. What makes hurting forever okay?

[Cicero]

That was the point of the tree, to give them a choice, having one choice is essentially just as bad as no choice.

What's so hard? In our generation numerous religions dominate differing areas, being born into a religion means you have a high chance of being born into the wrong one, that is presuming there is a correct one. Not only that he gave people around 0 ano domine people had far more reason to believe, because there would be actual evidence. So it isn't that asking him into your heart is hard, rather that it is hard to believe in him, and if you don't believe you'd just be lying to yourself and god, you'd be better off trying to score a better ring in hell and not lying.

There are so incredibly many things wrong with the natural argument. To start off, I don't like the idea of sex, and breaking the hymen must hurt for the girl, so sex must be unnatural too! Wrong! We can both agree that that is at best an opinion, and a poor one at that. Everything that exists within this reality is natural, natural isn't necessarily good, you could swim in a pool of acid and uranium while sucking poop and it would be as natural as anything else, but it wouldn't be good. Is having a tenancy that you were born with, a tenancy to be with the same gender, really bad enough to burn forever? I can't emphasize this enough, no matter what the punishment is I can't see justification for eternal suffering. What makes hurting forever okay?

I just was replying to you about what Christianity and God thinks of Homosexuality. Once, again, he says it's an abomination punishable by eternity in hell. If you know and your ok with going to hell, do whatever you want I think, it's only in Christianity do they believe in all that.

[Dobesta]

Are you high? So this is what I get from your sentence:

"If something gives you pain in this life, it means it should not be done / it is illegal in God's Court."

Lol.

I don't necessarily agree with the pain thing either. But there is a simple explanation. Butts are meant for pooping :P

That was the point of the tree, to give them a choice, having one choice is essentially just as bad as no choice.

What's so hard? In our generation numerous religions dominate differing areas, being born into a religion means you have a high chance of being born into the wrong one, that is presuming there is a correct one. Not only that he gave people around 0 ano domine people had far more reason to believe, because there would be actual evidence. So it isn't that asking him into your heart is hard, rather that it is hard to believe in him, and if you don't believe you'd just be lying to yourself and god, you'd be better off trying to score a better ring in hell and not lying.

There are so incredibly many things wrong with the natural argument. To start off, I don't like the idea of sex, and breaking the hymen must hurt for the girl, so sex must be unnatural too! Wrong! We can both agree that that is at best an opinion, and a poor one at that. Everything that exists within this reality is natural, natural isn't necessarily good, you could swim in a pool of acid and uranium while sucking poop and it would be as natural as anything else, but it wouldn't be good. Is having a tenancy that you were born with, a tenancy to be with the same gender, really bad enough to burn forever? I can't emphasize this enough, no matter what the punishment is I can't see justification for eternal suffering. What makes hurting forever okay?



I just was replying to you about what Christianity and God thinks of Homosexuality. Once, again, he says it's an abomination punishable by eternity in hell. If you know and your ok with going to hell, do whatever you want I think, it's only in Christianity do they believe in all that.

Dude, no. Just because someone is gay does NOT mean they're automatically going to hell. By that logic, we'd all be going to hell because we all sin. I cannot stress this enough, HOMOSEXUALITY, WHILE A SIN, IS NO WORSE THAN ANY OTHER SIN. You can be forgiven for homosexuality the same as anything else. I believe if someone is attracted to their gender they can still go to heaven. Homosexuality is lust anyway. Just happens to be lust toward the same gender.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFyvS8UGFpI&list=UU8SJGXxX9OWZHW9axxxPPqw&index=0&feature=plcp
this is cool :) Pretty much my point of view :)

Posts merged ~ Mike/ImCoolBeans

[Cicero]

Dude, no. Just because someone is gay does NOT mean they're automatically going to hell. By that logic, we'd all be going to hell because we all sin. I cannot stress this enough, HOMOSEXUALITY, WHILE A SIN, IS NO WORSE THAN ANY OTHER SIN. You can be forgiven for homosexuality the same as anything else. I believe if someone is attracted to their gender they can still go to heaven. Homosexuality is lust anyway. Just happens to be lust toward the same gender.

The bible says they do. It even specifically talks about homosexuals in several verses...

[Dobesta]

The bible says they do. It even specifically talks about homosexuals in several verses...

The bible says that we'll all go to hell if we aren't forgiven. It says there's one unforgivable sin - blasphemy against the holy spirit. I.e. Even up until when you die you refuse to believe in God when you've heard about him.

[Cicero]

The bible says that we'll all go to hell if we aren't forgiven. It says there's one unforgivable sin - blasphemy against the holy spirit. I.e. Even up until when you die you refuse to believe in God when you've heard about him.

Wrong, anyone can believe in God. Satan believes in God. You have to accept Christ in your heart. Thats the only way, not just believing in God.

[Sudds3]

Are you high? So this is what I get from your sentence:

"If something gives you pain in this life, it means it should not be done / it is illegal in God's Court."

Lol.

What I've been told by several priests is that any sexual intercourse that is not being put towards reproduction is "an abomination." that means oral sex, anal sex, gay sex, masterbating, and well I guess even a wet dream too! Despite the fact that y cannot possibly control getting a wet dream other than masterbating....contradictory right? Seems like God would have planned for that, then fixed it if He didn't. One of the many reasons why I'm a doubting Catholic!

[Dobesta]

Wrong, anyone can believe in God. Satan believes in God. You have to accept Christ in your heart. Thats the only way, not just believing in God.

Sorry, that's what I meant. I guess it wasn't the clearest statement, but yeah I did mean accepting Christ and following him.
Also, you've said you're catholic I think. Just asking, but what is the significance of Mary in your beliefs, like what's the 'hail mary' thing? Is that something all catholics do, or just some? Just curious :)

What I've been told by several priests is that any sexual intercourse that is not being put towards reproduction is "an abomination." that means oral sex, anal sex, gay sex, masterbating, and well I guess even a wet dream too! Despite the fact that y cannot possibly control getting a wet dream other than masterbating....contradictory right? Seems like God would have planned for that, then fixed it if He didn't. One of the many reasons why I'm a doubting Catholic!

I reckon, in the case of wet dreams, that it can just be the body's way of getting rid of semen. Also, masturbation in itself is not a sin, but the lust that comes with it. So if you could masturbate without lusting (somehow, i dunno I think that's pretty impossible!) then it's ok.
Also, lust within marriage is ok. Lust for a spouse is perfectly ok - to an extent. Lust shouldn't be the basis for any relationship.

[randomnessqueen]

while i dont have the highest view of protestant christians, i dont disrespect them and agree they are shown in much to negative a manner. its not christianity where the problem is, its in its followers. christianity in itself is a great thing.

[Dobesta]

while i dont have the highest view of protestant christians, i dont disrespect them and agree they are shown in much to negative a manner. its not christianity where the problem is, its in its followers. christianity in itself is a great thing.

Yeah, and that's one of the fundamental things about Christianity everyone needs to realise: We're all broken people, and just because someone is a Christian doesn't mean they're a 'better person' than someone else. The Church is made up of imperfect people, for imperfect people, with the ONLY perfect person at it's centre.

[Johnny B. Fnord]

Do you believe we should follow the laws of the Bible to the letter? Do you believe the Old Testament (Talmud) still applies to Christians?

[Azunite]

Do you think the state should adopt a religion and abolish secularism?

[StoppingTime]

Do you believe we should follow the laws of the Bible to the letter? Do you believe the Old Testament (Talmud) still applies to Christians?

The Old Testament and the Talmud are not the same thing.

[Johnny B. Fnord]

The Old Testament and the Talmud are not the same thing.

The Talmud consists of scriptural and non-scriptural parts. Christianity accepts the Tanakh (the scriptural portion). The Torah is the first five books of the Tanakh (Bereshit, Shemot, Vayikra, Bamidbar, Devarim), what Christians call the Old Testament.

The Talmud is just Rabbinic commentaries on the Tanakh and Torah.

(note: I meant to write Torah not Talmud).

[Dobesta]

Do you believe we should follow the laws of the Bible to the letter? Do you believe the Old Testament (Talmud) still applies to Christians?

I believe that when Jesus came, he abolished the old laws (E.g. we don't need to make sacrifices any more because Jesus was the ultimate sacrifice). Jesus said in Matthew 22:36-40:
36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?"
37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’[a] 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’[b] 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”
So pretty much yes, but I don't believe in all the punishments that were stated in the old testament, and all the purity laws and such. Just a fun thought: If you think about it, a lot of the laws God gave in the old testament regarding mildew and other random stuff is just good hygiene practice. I reckon he gave them just to help the Israelites stay healthy :P

Do you think the state should adopt a religion and abolish secularism?

NO. The whole world is not made up of Christians. Unless everyone in a certain country believes in the same thing (extremely unlikely), then there should be a separation of church and state. As proved in the past, when this happens, bad things come of it (I.e. the crusades, which in my opinion were just power hungry leaders using religion as an excuse to round up more men and conquer new lands). All people are sinful though, so don't expect Christians to be perfect.

[Sudds3]

I reckon, in the case of wet dreams, that it can just be the body's way of getting rid of semen. Also, masturbation in itself is not a sin, but the lust that comes with it. So if you could masturbate without lusting (somehow, i dunno I think that's pretty impossible!) then it's ok.
Also, lust within marriage is ok. Lust for a spouse is perfectly ok - to an extent. Lust shouldn't be the basis for any relationship.

Sounds good to me! But I just feel that if we were created by God...then we wouldnt have so many freaking flaws such as cancer and disease, there really isn't a point to it all! Unless you believe in things like cancer making someone realize how quickly life can changeand that all diseases were created to make people realize stupid stuff like that, then well....I'm still lost! Can anyone explain this to me?

[Dobesta]

Sounds good to me! But I just feel that if we were created by God...then we wouldnt have so many freaking flaws such as cancer and disease, there really isn't a point to it all! Unless you believe in things like cancer making someone realize how quickly life can changeand that all diseases were created to make people realize stupid stuff like that, then well....I'm still lost! Can anyone explain this to me?

Well, disease and famine and all of that came with sin when it tainted creation. Suffice it to say that if there wasn't sin in the world, no one would die. There would be no ageing, no sickness, hunger, thirst, etc.
To be honest, the world's a mess. You can thank sin for that :/
But I do also think that cancer and such can have SOME good outcomes. Obviously it's definitely not a good thing, but I know people who have become closer to God through their pain.

My best friend's mum had cancer all through her face and throat etc. a couple years ago and she was taken off all treatment except painkillers and was admitted to palliative care. She was told she had a couple of weeks, and my bible study were all praying for his mum. After a 'couple of weeks' she had a scan and the tumour had shrunk to a small enough size that could easily be cut out. Through that my friend who through the sickness was questioning God (i.e. why did this happen to her, to me?). This really helped strengthen his faith and realise that God has a plan for everything and has it under control.

[Jess]

has it under control? so many other people die of cancer everyday, does he bother saving them? their families, if they're religious, pray, but they still die.

[LouBerry]

^Everyone dies. We can't live forever. As a Christian, I rejoice when someone dies, because their suffering is over. I lost my Mom when I was a little girl, so I understand being angry at God and not understanding how he could take her away if he loved me, but it was hurt time. Now shes happy and she'll never be in pain again.

[War-Is-Real]

*eye twitch*
So, what you are saying is god has complete control of everything, he isn't controled by the laws in which he put, and can easily wipe the universe away in moments.
Seem legit.
But I have to pull the 'What is this bull shit?' card

[MattHolyman41]

I was wondering, do you (OP) as a Christian, accept scientific theories that describe the origin of the universe, celestial bodies, life, and species? What is your opinion on creationism? I believe it's wrong, even though I have no problem when people have faith in God. You condense Christian belief and scientific knowledge, right? Many scientists are an example of that (currently living, not in middle ages or renaissance. Almost everybody was a creationist back then, because we didn't know any better).

[User Deleted]

So someone is attracted to their own gender, let's say, yes they are homosexual. So due to the attraction said person gets a sex change. They get the hormone therapy and they have the opposite organs. Now technically they have the original gender. Let's say they were male and now they have female organs. The vagina was recreated entirely with penile and preexisting tissue on the one person, and the breasts were made by hormone therapy. So being entirely XY but with a girl body... do they still need to sleep with females to avoid the hypothetical sin, or males despite their chromosomes? Does that make sense? It was hard to explain.

[Cicero]

So someone is attracted to their own gender, let's say, yes they are homosexual. So due to the attraction said person gets a sex change. They get the hormone therapy and they have the opposite organs. Now technically they have the original gender. Let's say they were male and now they have female organs. The vagina was recreated entirely with penile and preexisting tissue on the one person, and the breasts were made by hormone therapy. So being entirely XY but with a girl body... do they still need to sleep with females to avoid the hypothetical sin, or males despite their chromosomes? Does that make sense? It was hard to explain.

It makes sense. I too, am a little confused on this, and I have also wondered about this. According to God, sleeping with the same sex is wrong. Changing sexes, is extremely wrong to do. But I'm guessing that it would still be a sin, because they were originally created as a boy/girl. I'm sure if they wanted to become Christian, God would want them to change back to their original sex. But if their was no way that could happen, they would get accepted into heaven, based on their acceptance of Jesus Christ.

[Dobesta]

*eye twitch*
So, what you are saying is god has complete control of everything, he isn't controled by the laws in which he put, and can easily wipe the universe away in moments.
Seem legit.
But I have to pull the 'What is this bull shit?' card

Yes. Exactly. It's not that hard to understand. It's kinda like if you made a computer program in which certain rules applied, you, yourself are not limited by those laws and you can change, or even delete the laws or the program.

I was wondering, do you (OP) as a Christian, accept scientific theories that describe the origin of the universe, celestial bodies, life, and species? What is your opinion on creationism? I believe it's wrong, even though I have no problem when people have faith in God. You condense Christian belief and scientific knowledge, right? Many scientists are an example of that (currently living, not in middle ages or renaissance. Almost everybody was a creationist back then, because we didn't know any better).


Yes I do accept (most) scientific theories, or at least have no problem with them. The thing is, God COULD have created the universe by way of the big bang, whether or not he did, I don't know, but that might have been how he did it.
I don't necessarily agree with evolution (Once again, if it is true, I have no problem with it, God could have made humans through evolution, but I doubt it). There are too many discrepancies in the fossil record and there's only been very few 'transitional species' actually discovered (e.g. archaeopteryx). Also, for fossils to form, the dead animal has to be buried under loads of sediment VERY quickly, otherwise they'll just decompose (flood erosion anyone?). But honestly, I don't know everything so I couldn't tell you how it all happened.
I generally class myself as an 'old earth' creationist. I believe that God built the universe over more than 24 hour days, as the word used in the original hebrew ('yom') can also be translated as an 'age'. Also, something interesting that I read was that in the first few moments after the big bang, everything was travelling incredibly fast, and space and time were expanding. I know a bit about relativity, and I could agree with some scientists who have said that those moments could have ended up equating to millions of years on earth due to time dilation and that.
I think God created the universe over a longer time, as the universe needed to go through certain processes for life to be able to exist, processes which took time.
Hope this sufficiently answers your question :) ask me to clarify if you need me to :)

[Andy4419]

I don't believe in a God, I really don't see why anyone would expescially the Christian God so many flaws in the Bible his morals are outdated such as slavery, incest, murder, genocide, ect. And if you try to justify this things then maybe you souls really ask your self why don't you do it. If he is okay with it and yyou might say that Jesus changed that but he didn't he said he would wasn't here to change the laws and they will stand till the earth and the universe is destroyed. I don't like the idea that some one can do everything right donate all their money, save lives and so in but if he doesn't believe in God then he will burn in "hell" I don't support that and I hope you wouldn't but I will respect what you believe and when I join the military I will fight and die foe your that even when your God thinks I should burn

Sorry about some of the flaws in my last post I'm really tired and doing this from a phone haha. Peace and love y'all

Don't double post, next time please edit your first post instead. ~Mirage

[War-Is-Real]

Um. You can decompose and still fossilize. Like dafuq.
And anyone who is out of his own rules is a hypocrite, and if the 'Almighty' is real, he has lost my respect.

[Dobesta]

Um. You can decompose and still fossilize. Like dafuq.
And anyone who is out of his own rules is a hypocrite, and if the 'Almighty' is real, he has lost my respect.

Dude, fossils are formed by being quickly covered with sediment. Not sitting on the ground and being broken down. Sure, the things that are fossilised decompose, that's what a fossil is, not the actual bone or whatever. I mean that unless something is buried very soon after it dies, it wont fossilise.

What are you talking about? By his rules, you know I simply mean the laws of physics yeah???

[Andy4419]

You can believe Bigfoot created the univerise it doesn't make you right. Not all religions can be right, but they all can be wrong

[Dobesta]

You can believe Bigfoot created the univerise it doesn't make you right. Not all religions can be right, but they all can be wrong

And the relevance to this discussion is???

[tcspencer]

I'm sorry, but if god has a plan for everyone and all morality is derived from him (as many theologians claim), then we as a species should be rebelling against him. What is the justification for child rape or murder? In Iran, it's illegal to execute a virgin. But you can rape a girl and then execute her because god says that's ok. Any person who tells me I should give myself to, at best, such a morally ambivalent and at worst a completely evil and infinitely spiteful being is deluded. God doesn't exist and if he did he would deserve nothing less that utter loathing.

[Allbutanillusion]

I feel that in the media today, the majority of Christians get a bad reputation from a minority of people who are often misled. So I wanted to be open and answer any questions anyone may have about anything to do with Christianity or my views on stuff. Ask away :)

I must commend you Dobesta, you step into the lion's den and they did indeed rip into you.

I think people should be able to believe whatever they want if it does not affect others . What I find a little hypocritical here , is that people in this forum who are quick to defend gays from negative connotations or being bullied are the same one's who bully people who choose to enhance/better their life through religion. Shame on you, hypocrites.

Also to those deluded ones who seem to think that they superior than/to everyone else ( which laughable at best,) need to remember that ...

Science is not perfect. And this may sound cliche but nothing can ever truly be perfect. There is always some degree of error in science. Some variable that is unaccounted for or that cannot be control. There will always be things that happen in science that are unexpected.

Here's an example: When scientists were first looking into a new theory on what makes up the universe, called the string theory, they thought that they had hit upon a "theory of everything". In short, a theory that describes how everything in the universe works. Now, by the very nature of such a theory there could only be one "theory of everything". You cannot have two things perfectly describing how everything works, because they would invairably conflict. But when scientists began working with the string theory, they found it had FIVE versions! Five solutions to everything? It wouldn't work. Eventually they got it narrowed down to which one that thought worked the best. But there is still some conflict over if the string theory is correct at all, and which version is correct. So , science is not perfect. Otherwise it would have come up with one solution everyone agreed on.

[Magical]

Why do you believe in the Book of Mormon?

Yes, I know I'm being an asshole, but you left that WIDE OPEN.

Christianity is a religion with MANY different subsects, including Mormonism.

So tell me.

Also, what parts of the Bible do you believe in, and what parts do you ignore?

EDIT: I'm sorry, I couldn't resist. You make me AAAANGRY, Allbutanillusion. So much RAAAAAAGE.


Science is not perfect. And this may sound cliche but nothing can ever truly be perfect. There is always some degree of error in science. Some variable that is unaccounted for or that cannot be control. There will always be things that happen in science that are unexpected.

Here's an example: When scientists were first looking into a new theory on what makes up the universe, called the string theory, they thought that they had hit upon a "theory of everything". In short, a theory that describes how everything in the universe works. Now, by the very nature of such a theory there could only be one "theory of everything". You cannot have two things perfectly describing how everything works, because they would invairably conflict. But when scientists began working with the string theory, they found it had FIVE versions! Five solutions to everything? It wouldn't work. Eventually they got it narrowed down to which one that thought worked the best. But there is still some conflict over if the string theory is correct at all, and which version is correct. So , science is not perfect. Otherwise it would have come up with one solution everyone agreed on.

Who ever said science is perfect? What absolute moron blithered that out of their inept head? SO WHAT is science isn't perfect? It is improving. On that note, numbers can be perfect. Do you know what a perfect number (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfect_number) is? It's perfect.

With regards to your example: WHAT THE HELL IS YOUR POINT HERE? WHAT IS THIS EXAMPLE? You complain that String Theory isn't yet perfect, which you say it can't be.

Even though science isn't perfect, it is FAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR better than religion. Yes, the R's were neccesary.

This forum? Science. The device I type this on? Science.

Again, I must wonder how many -reps I will get from this.

[oneDay]

And the relevance to this discussion is???

Do you suggest that we ignore the possibility that religions can be wrong? Its incredible to me that people defend religion as if it's somehow perfect or undeserving of criticism and deep analysis. But it doesn't surprise me that people led to believe in things they have to have faith in would cause them to be extremely sensitive and defensive of as most religions require people to justify what they believe because they can't truly define what it is they believe.

[Bath]

A reminder for you guys to please be respectful. This is the debate forum, so you're more than welcome to explain your beliefs, but please do it in a respectful way. If you feel yourself wanting to insult another member, remove yourself from the conversation or you'll get an infraction otherwise.

[Haufen]

Christians don't see Catholics as God haters. Though we have the same God as Christians, our beliefs are slightly different.



Holy shit please tell me you guys are not this stupid.
Do you know that catholics are Christians too?
Catholicism, protestantism and orthodoxism are all branches of christianity.
For a long time Catholicism was the christianity, up until late medieval times when uprisings of a new christianity (protestantism) in Northern Europe started.

Catholics are as much christians as protestants, maybe even more, since protestantism didn't exist until around the 16th century.

[Cicero]

Holy shit please tell me you guys are not this stupid.
Do you know that catholics are Christians too?
Catholicism, protestantism and orthodoxism are all branches of christianity.
For a long time Catholicism was the christianity, up until late medieval times when uprisings of a new christianity (protestantism) in Northern Europe started.

Catholics are as much christians as protestants, maybe even more, since protestantism didn't exist until around the 16th century.
Edit: Oh and a lot of Christians don't even see Catholicism and Mormonism within the same religion as Christianity, they see them as a completely new and differen religion.
Were talking about undenominational Christian, Christians do not have a pope or nuns, Christians believe that anyone can marry, Catholics believe that priests shouldn't marry. Catholics are not more Christian, all throughout history there have been different denominations. Christianity itself was around at longer than catholicism, then that came around in the frat 1000 years after Christ, Catholicism changed a few things, cause most every great bible character in the bible was married, then catholicsm said that the people of there church cannot marry. Original Christianity didn't believe in a pope. Catholics see the pope and catholic priests as people who can send in a. Good word to God, Christians believe that they themselves can talk to God where as Catholics believe that a priest must be there. THEY ARE DIFFERENT!!! And please don't quote old posts of mine, I don't Even wanna be in this thread cause it's arguing that goes no where.

[Sir Suomi]

Alright, I've really kind of been lost. I receantly accepted Jesus into my heart, but there is one problem. Is masturbation considered a sin? I know Catholics are totally against it, but are just regualr ol' Christians also not allowed to do it? Please help.
Also, what's your fav Bible verse? Mine's Isaiah 40:29-31

[Haufen]

Incoherent rambling by a mentally impaired individual.

Catholicism is a branch of christianity. End of story. You cannot deny that. You cannot say that is not true, because it is.
I don't know what education you had, but here the average 10 year old knows that.

"for many the term usually refers to Christians and churches, western and eastern, in full communion with the Holy See, known alternatively as the Catholic Church or as the Roman Catholic Church.[3] However, many others use the term to refer to other churches with historical continuity from the first millennium."

"The earliest recorded evidence of the use of the term Catholic Church is the Letter to the Smyrnaeans that Ignatius of Antioch wrote in about 107 to Christians in Smyrna. Exhorting Christians to remain closely united with their bishop, he wrote: "Wherever the bishop shall appear, there let the multitude [of the people] also be; even as, wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church."[8][9] Numerous other early writers including Cyril of Jerusalem (c. 315–386), Augustine of Hippo (354–430) and others further developed the use of the term "catholic" in relation to Christianity."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholicism

"b often capitalized : of, relating to, or forming the ancient undivided Christian church or a church claiming historical continuity from it"

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/catholic

"Worldwide, the three largest groups of Christianity are the Roman Catholic Church, the Eastern Orthodox Church, and the various denominations of Protestantism. The Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox patriarchates split from one another in the East–West Schism of 1054 AD, and Protestantism came into existence during the Protestant Reformation of the 16th century, splitting from the Roman Catholic Church.[7]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianity

"catholic, (from Greek katholikos, “universal”), the characteristic that, according to ecclesiastical writers since the 2nd century, distinguished the Christian Church at large from local communities or from heretical and schismatic sects."

http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/99796/catholic


There you go, should be enough proof to satisfy your feeble mind.

[Mob Boss]

I'm not sure if this has been discussed already, but my grandfather was a Mormon (I know that isn't the same as Christianity, but from what I've gathered some of the beliefs are similar) anyways, he didn't believe in organ donation because his church preached something along the lines of preserving the body you were born into. A little odd, and seemingly sad that there are perfectly good organs someone else could use, but it's frowned upon. I was wondering what your beliefs are pertaining to organ donation?

[nice]

I'm a Christian like you but I'm a lot more open minded than most of us. why do you think we get such a bad rep from people?

[huntersteele11]

why do sum chrsitians judge others when the bible say to not judge? why are most churches about the money now and being bigger and more powerful and care less about the poor and the weak? why are most churches into ploitics when it suposed to be seperation of church and state? why are sum people not good enuf to get welcum in sum churches? i love god but our god is not like that he is about love for every one.

[ArsenicCatNip]

Completely separate question, can god create a boulder so large that god himself could not lift that boulder?

No, because that would not make him omnipotent.

[Jess]

Tell me why God won't just appear to prove his existence. Don't tell me he doesn't need to. Why wouldn't he need to? If he wants to save those who are nonbelievers or of other religions, he should prove he exists by appearing to someone or something. But he never does.

[WickedWeekend]

why do sum chrsitians judge others when the bible say to not judge?
Because these Christians are hypocrites. They don't like to listen to this part of Scripture.
why are most churches about the money now and being bigger and more powerful and care less about the poor and the weak?
Listen to the title track of Church Clothes by Lecrae. The song is in the perspective of a person like you, a person realizing the Church's hypocrisy. Lecrae gives a very good explanation, and explains that the Churches decisions are beyond God's power.
why are most churches into ploitics when it suposed to be seperation of church and state?
That is primarily the Catholic church, from what I have heard. Don't get up all on me. I haven't studied the Catholic church much.
why are sum people not good enuf to get welcum in sum churches?
Most churches are very accepting of who they allow in their doors, but again, you have your churches full of hypocrites.

[huntersteele11]

thanks for your answers but it seems you might agree with me that many christians are hypocrits and not real christians at all and your wrong it isnt just the catholic church because near where we live there are 3 gigantic churches and they are all christian churches not catholic. i luv god and we go to a small church that helps the poor and luvs everyone but not to many churches seem to be like that no more. sum churches hate gays and dont want street people in there church and the god we know luvs street people just as much as he loves the richest member and mabe even more. just sayin

[Gigablue]

No, because that would not make him omnipotent.

There is a problem with this reasoning. If he can, then he is unable to lift the boulder, therefore is not omnipotent. If he can't, then there is something that he can't do, therefore he is not omnipotent. Therefore there cannot be an omnipotent deity.

[User Deleted]

No, because that would not make him omnipotent.

The idea is, that if he can't create a boulder that large, how can he be omnipotent, and if he can, he can't lift it, and either way how can he be omnipotent. Just an interesting concept.