15-year-old Toronto boy kills a cop.

[Magenta]

Well, saw another post about people driving underage and reminded me of this story.

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/police-funeral-styles-killed-van-driven-teen-set-133548300.html

NEWMARKET, Ont. - Police charged a 15-year-old boy Wednesday with first-degree murder in the death of a York Regional police officer who was dragged and crushed by a minivan during a pre-dawn traffic stop.

Police say the boy was driving the van that Const. Garrett Styles pulled over early Tuesday morning on a rural highway north of Toronto.

Styles, a 32-year-old father of two, was standing at the driver's door when police say the vehicle suddenly accelerated, dragging the officer some 300 metres and trapping him underneath it.

He died later in hospital.

Reports say the 15-year-old has serious injuries and was charged Tuesday night at a Toronto hospital. He was remanded into custody and is scheduled to appear in a Newmarket court July 7.

A charge of first-degree murder is automatic when a homicide case involves the death of a police officer.

The teen cannot be identified under the Youth Criminal Justice Act. The maximum sentence allowed for anyone convicted under that act is a life sentence with no possibility of parole for 10 years...

Personally, my father is a police officer and I'm reminded through these stories of how much I hate his job yet respect him for doing it. Anyone driving underage... ugh. We have driving laws for a reason. I know a ton of kids who are like "oh yeah, I can drive" when they're under 16 and don't have their G1...

Well, I can drive a standard- doesn't mean I'm going to go off in my dad's truck. I'll wait like everyone else has to.

[Magus]

I still don't know how to drive, playah.

Yep, adding this to my list.

[Magenta]

Sometimes I just think that underage people are so stupid... Like really, what are they going to tell that cop's kids? No, he didn't die trying to save someone's life or doing something heroic. He died because some kid was an idiot and couldn't wait like everyone else in our province to learn to drive.

Ugh.

[Bougainvillea]

Sometimes I just think that underage people are so stupid... Like really, what are they going to tell that cop's kids? No, he didn't die trying to save someone's life or doing something heroic. He died because some kid was an idiot and couldn't wait like everyone else in our province to learn to drive.

Ugh.

That doesn't mean shit. It doesn't matter what he was doing, and there shouldn't be any more or less pride in that person. He was doing a public service, and died while doing it.
Just like my father. He was a police officer, and got killed because some pothead was a coward. He wasn't in some heroic gun fight. He wasn't trying to save a child from a burning house. He was standing by the driver-side window and the man pointed a gun at him and shot him while he was writing a ticket.

Honestly, if you feel like that. There is something that you should start having serious thoughts on.

[Magenta]

That doesn't mean shit. It doesn't matter what he was doing, and there shouldn't be any more or less pride in that person. He was doing a public service, and died while doing it.
Just like my father. He was a police officer, and got killed because some pothead was a coward. He wasn't in some heroic gun fight. He wasn't trying to save a child from a burning house. He was standing by the driver-side window and the man pointed a gun at him and shot him while he was writing a ticket.

Honestly, if you feel like that. There is something that you should start having serious thoughts on.

Well, like I know but what kid wants to grow up hearing that their dad was killed because some kid didn't have a brain?

Dude, I even said my father is a cop. Either way, I respect cops so much for what they do but if my dad was killed like that... it's just about ten times more infuriating.

I wasn't saying that cops who don't die saving children from burning houses aren't worth as much. I'm just saying that he was killed by stupidity and that's terrible to have to live with. No one should have to live knowing that they've lost someone because someone else didn't have common sense.

[Scoob]

Wait... people don't start driving at age 14 where you all live? He's considered above the standard of driving where I live so I wasn't seeing a problem with it until I read some of the comments of 'underage driving'.

[Magenta]

Wait... people don't start driving at age 14 where you all live? He's considered above the standard of driving where I live so I wasn't seeing a problem with it until I read some of the comments of 'underage driving'.

No. In Ontario, you can begin to drive at 16 and we have a graduated licensing system here. You don't get your full license until 18.

http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/dandv/driver/gradu/

This explains it better. :)

[Bougainvillea]

Well, like I know but what kid wants to grow up hearing that their dad was killed because some kid didn't have a brain?

Dude, I even said my father is a cop. Either way, I respect cops so much for what they do but if my dad was killed like that... it's just about ten times more infuriating.

I wasn't saying that cops who don't die saving children from burning houses aren't worth as much. I'm just saying that he was killed by stupidity and that's terrible to have to live with. No one should have to live knowing that they've lost someone because someone else didn't have common sense.

What I'm saying is that thinking about how someone dies is pointless. A large percent of people die from stupidity, or because of a lack of common sense. Its a fact of life, and its certainly not something worth dwelling on. It doesn't matter. It really doesn't, because there is nothing you can do about it. I get angry because I know the person who meant the world to me is no longer here. But once again. I try to control it, because I am never going to see him again. No matter how angry, or upset I get.

Maybe its just how I feel. Seeing your dad die does things to you.

And, please. Don't call me "dude".

[Magenta]

What I'm saying is that thinking about how someone dies is pointless. A large percent of people die from stupidity, or because of a lack of common sense. Its a fact of life, and its certainly not something worth dwelling on. It doesn't matter. It really doesn't, because there is nothing you can do about it. I get angry because I know the person who meant the world to me is no longer here. But once again. I try to control it, because I am never going to see him again. No matter how angry, or upset I get.

Maybe its just how I feel. Seeing your dad die does things to you.

And, please. Don't call me "dude".

Okay then... I'm not going to argue this merely because I don't see the point. I said something, it was misinterpreted, okay.

[Bougainvillea]

That wasn't a misinterpretation.

But if you'd like to believe that, its fine with me.

[Magenta]

Okay, this will be easiest to understand: I'm not trying to pick a fight. I made a comment, done.

[Bougainvillea]

I'm not trying to pick a fight.

This is just the way I am. I don't really mean to be argumentative. So I hope there isn't any hard feelings.

A conversation with two different views is a whole different thing than a fight.

[Magenta]

I'm not trying to pick a fight.

This is just the way I am. I don't really mean to be argumentative. So I hope there isn't any hard feelings.

A conversation with two different views is a whole different thing than a fight.

I know... I just end up opinionated and then shoot my mouth off so I'm just going to avoid that. *nod*

Easier for me to just run away while I can, lol.

[trooneh]

How's the Canadian driving system work exactly?

Also, underaged driving...so stupid to do, excepting in parking lots with a parent or on private property (when it's actually legal).

[Magenta]

How's the Canadian driving system work exactly?

Also, underaged driving...so stupid to do, excepting in parking lots with a parent or on private property (when it's actually legal).

Basically, it takes a few years of training to drive properly to hopefully make sure that driving is safe... but there's still a ton of issues.

[Kayden]

Some people are so stupid when they drive. Went for a drive with my friend to McDonalds which was 300m away. He managed to brake 4 laws on the way there. He also failed parking and parked half his car over the line.

[Korashk]

A charge of first-degree murder is automatic when a homicide case involves the death of a police officer.
Bull. Shit. I hate how cops automatically get preferential treatment in matters of law. Officially and unofficially.

[Magenta]

Bull. Shit. I hate how cops automatically get preferential treatment in matters of law. Officially and unofficially.

Well, in this case, he's been killed in the line of duty, doing his job to keep US safe.

I agree that when it's something they've done wrong and they got off because they're cops is unjust and unfair but, in this case, I think it's fine.

And, given the circumstances of the police officer's death, it's still considered manslaughter (first degree murder) so it doesn't really matter anyway.

[Love.Hate]

Well even if he was underage of not, the fact he killed someone is pretty horrible.

I feel very sorry for his children.

[trooneh]

Bull. Shit. I hate how cops automatically get preferential treatment in matters of law. Officially and unofficially.


You don't think this is justified when a police officer is killed in the line of duty? Example, the police officer is conducting a traffic stop and gets hit by a drunk driver and killed. Don't you think the drunk driver deserves a charge of first degree murder, particularly if the police car's lights were on?

[Korashk]

Well, in this case, he's been killed in the line of duty
So?

I agree that when it's something they've done wrong and they got off because they're cops is unjust and unfair but, in this case, I think it's fine.
It's either always fine, or it's never fine.

And, given the circumstances of the police officer's death, it's still considered manslaughter (first degree murder) so it doesn't really matter anyway.
Manslaughter and first degree murder are wildly different crimes when it comes to the trial, sentencing, etc.

You don't think this is justified when a police officer is killed in the line of duty?
No, I do not.

Example, the police officer is conducting a traffic stop and gets hit by a drunk driver and killed. Don't you think the drunk driver deserves a charge of first degree murder, particularly if the police car's lights were on?
Well, let's see:

first degree murder n. although it varies from state to state, it is generally a killing which is deliberate and premeditated (planned, after lying in wait, by poison or as part of a scheme), in conjunction with felonies such as rape, burglary, arson, involving multiple deaths, the killing of certain types of people (such as a child, a police officer, a prison guard, a fellow prisoner), or with certain weapons, particularly a gun. The specific criteria for first degree murder are established by statute in each state and by the United States Code in federal prosecutions. It is distinguished from second degree murder in which premeditation is usually absent, and from manslaughter which lacks premeditation and suggests that at most there was intent to harm rather than to kill.

Do you think it should be first degree murder?

[Magenta]

Do you think it should be first degree murder?

For the record, you quoted the AMERICAN legal system and this is a case in Canada.

Also, I made a mistake. Manslaughter is third degree murder. I'm sorry, that was my fault. However, this kid was stupid and reckless and knew exactly what he was doing when he got into that car illegally and underage. He knew the risks and was aware someone could have been killed. I think first degree may be a tad harsh but either way, he did kill someone while doing something with obvious consequences.

In the end, the police officer was killed because this kid was doing something stupid and illegal and he's being punished. Good enough for me.

[Jess]

that's so horrible! it shouldn't be first degree murder though...

[Korashk]

For the record, you quoted the AMERICAN legal system and this is a case in Canada.
The differences are negligible and meaningless within the context of this discussion.

In the end, the police officer was killed because this kid was doing something stupid and illegal and he's being punished. Good enough for me.
In the end, this kid is being charged with a crime that he only committed because of a legal exception given to cops. Do I think this kid should be punished, yeah. But I also think that cops don't deserve special treatment from the law.

[Bougainvillea]

And there wasn't direct intention to do it, and it seems like that he is being treated as if it was.