Discipline = Abuse?

[Syvelocin]

First time I've been around these parts for a while, but it hit me while reading through a couple threads that this might be interesting, for the reason that VT seems to hold two contrasting views on this subject. On one side, some seem to think that any amount of corporal punishment is abuse and wrong, while the other half argues that physical discipline happens and is not illegal until it's taken too far.

So where I stand is while I don't personally support physical discipline and would never choose that if I were to have kids, it isn't illegal obviously in most of the countries VT members are in and certainly can be beneficial, and by no means abuse. Under some circumstances, having your parents hit you around a bit can teach you things you would have never learned otherwise with being raised soft. There are studies that have been done, I can recall (sorry if you want a source, but I have no clue, I just remember reading this), that most kids who were disciplined like this when they were younger grow up to be less likely to fail/drop out of school and overall are better behaved.

There's also the element that they're your parents. They can pretty much do whatever they please, taking into account the child protection laws in your area of course. What rights do you have as a kid? Very few. If your parents want to punish you, there's nothing much you can do about that, so it's best to instead learn how to avoid the punishment instead of saying that the punishment is incorrect.

Any input?

[MadManWithaBox]

Speakingvas someone who was badly abused my whole life, there's a fine line between abuse and discipline. These days kids seem to think any form of physical punishment is abuse, which it isn't. It's up to your parents at the end of the day. Of course being excessive in that punishment is a crime. But like people on here 'getting a smack' every once in a while isn't a crime.

[Death]

I've not one to personally endorse corporal punishment on anyone since its effects are likely to be more widespread than just gettint kids to behave. However, I would find it difficult to classify a light slap as actual physical abuse.

[Weeping]

In my opinion, any abuse/discipline is wrong. Yeah, maybe you did something wrong to "deserve it", but who does actually deserve to be slapped around by their parents (even if it's just discipline, there's way better ways for kids to learn what right/wrong/whatever).

In Sweden, it's illegal to do anything like it to kids. (:

[User Deleted]

Look, it is kind of ironic. Christianity would typically support 'a light spank' however it also basically says when you do something wrong you'll get whats coming to you. Self-contradicting isn't it? So religions set aside, I disagree with physical punishment. There are so many more options like grounding which in it self is versatile. Another thing that frustrates me is that young children have little endurance and adults forget that 'a light spank' is the equivalent of a powerful smack to them. And smacking an older child (especially in public) is like stripping away their honor. Honestly, the way I see it, the world could do without physical punishment.

[ShatteredWings]

I think it's the fine fine line between the two.

Abuse can be easily disguised as dicipline.
But dicipline can be easily taken as abuse.

The situation, the behavours leading up to, and the individual victim/recipiant really make it what it si

[User Deleted]

I think it's the fine fine line between the two.

Abuse can be easily disguised as dicipline.
But dicipline can be easily taken as abuse.

The situation, the behavours leading up to, and the individual victim/recipiant really make it what it si

In reality it would be easiest to simply avoid physical punishment and we would have abuse far more distinguished. Easy as that. No more problems in that area.

[Bimmerhead]

I know in my case my parents would spank me but not hard. They made me more afraid of what could potentially happen then what actually did. I was never abused and I would say it worked well. I was never one of those kids who flipped out in the middle of a store while my mom tried to shut me up by buying me things! lol

[MadManWithaBox]

Of course, there is a line. But its down to the discretion of the parent, to make sure they aren't crossing that line, or if they should use corporal punishment at all. Most of the time though, kids will cite any form of physical punishment as abuse, and get social services involved, and waste their time.

[User Deleted]

Of course, there is a line. But its down to the discretion of the parent, to make sure they aren't crossing that line, or if they should use corporal punishment at all. Most of the time though, kids will cite any form of physical punishment as abuse, and get social services involved, and waste their time.

Well in some countries it is illegal to use physical punishment as has allready been said before. Why shouldn't it be in the U.S. too?

[Neverender]

Here's my take: If your child is younger than age 7 or 8, give them a time out. under 12, tell them why what they did is wrong and speak to them. If they did something truely bad, give them a light slap accross the face and talk to them. If they are over age 13, talk to them. Have a discussion. Now, if your teenaged daughter just told her shes going to live with Joe the 28 year old in his trailer, give her a good slap accross the face, and tell her off.

Corporal punishment isn't acceptable in any of the above ages because under 7, they're too young to really understand. All they will know is to fear the lash. Not why what they did is wrong. Under 12 and it's degrading and undermining the intelligence of the child. 13 and older it's a power struggle between the adolescent teen and the parent. It's also degrading, and severely undermines the intelligence of both the parent and the teen.

Physical discipline is acceptable in certain circumstances. Corporal Punishment is not.

[Bimmerhead]

Well in some countries it is illegal to use physical punishment as has allready been said before. Why shouldn't it be in the U.S. too?

For the most part any type of physical punishment is illegal here in the US.

[Sith Lord 13]

I think it's the fine fine line between the two.

Abuse can be easily disguised as dicipline.
But dicipline can be easily taken as abuse.

The situation, the behavours leading up to, and the individual victim/recipiant really make it what it si

This, in its entirety.

Why shouldn't it be in the U.S. too?

Because there are times it serves a purpose, and some kids who won't respond to anything else.

Corporal punishment isn't acceptable in any of the above ages because under 7, they're too young to really understand. All they will know is to fear the lash. Not why what they did is wrong.

It's negative reinforcement, and gets a message across fast. Better a small smack than a child getting electrocuted.

Under 12 and it's degrading and undermining the intelligence of the child.

The degradation makes it a deterrent, and I fail to see how it, rather than the child's refusal to heed rules and previous corrections undermines the child's intelligence.

13 and older it's a power struggle between the adolescent teen and the parent. It's also degrading, and severely undermines the intelligence of both the parent and the teen.

See above.

Physical discipline is acceptable in certain circumstances. Corporal Punishment is not.

Can you elucidate the difference?

For the most part any type of physical punishment is illegal here in the US.

Not really.

[Lethe]

I hate seeing young children being buffeted around by their parents. Nowadays it seems like parents have more anger behind their physical punishments; they have angry faces and set jaws, and they usually speak very harshly to their children when they do it. It just seems like it's less of a rightful punishment and more a way for the parent to take out their anger on their child, for doing whatever he or she was doing wrong. But that is just the impression I get from seeing it.

Some physical punishment can be beneficial, but most really isn't. If you hit your child over the head every time he does something "wrong", it can send mixed signals. I really don't like that type of punishment. It can cause fear and stress. No child deserves to feel that way, especially at a young age.

[MykeSoBe]

Some few needed smacks are fine. Just don't overdo it in the ghetto way or more than that. That's my take. :P

[Syvelocin]

Some physical punishment can be beneficial, but most really isn't. If you hit your child over the head every time he does something "wrong", it can send mixed signals. I really don't like that type of punishment. It can cause fear and stress. No child deserves to feel that way, especially at a young age.

What about the kids who just won't behave? When there's nothing else that would get them to shut the fuck up and stop whatever they're doing? There are some very misbehaved kids and the parents just let them walk all over them. So by the time the parents finally crack, they freak out because they've been so used to getting their way.

Some kids definitely deserve a slap in my opinion. Would I be able to bring myself to do so? Probably not, unless they were really disgusting. Kids need consequences. Time out is quite pathetic in my opinion. And most parents don't know how to be affective with their words.