Do you agree with the Pope?

[Deleted_Account7]

This poll is closed thanks

[Jess]

that's completely ridiculous. of course they should be allowed to marry. THEY ARE HUMANS! there. they should be able to do anything straights can do. have all rights, I mean. :S

[Deleted_Account7]

----

[randy.boii]

I'm bi and if I fall in love with a guy I'm getting married and having sex

[Continuum]

Catholics have their own sphere to deal with. I mean, sure, it's a sin in their own narrow perspective, but they really need to mind their own fucking business. They've been following the same set of rules from about 2 to 3000 years before, and still they can't let a little discrepancy in human rights to slip? We're in the modern era, Goddamn it, following it would be much against the times. I'm sure God, if He existed, will let this right to pass, since He formed it in his Divine Cosmogeny Himself. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexual_behavior_in_animals)

Oh, and that was a misclick. Pardon me for clicking agree.

Yeah I agree and to be honest I'm shocked the Pope can get away with saying such unethical and politically incorrect things.

Everything the pope says is ethical for adherent and radical Catholics, even if he ordered to kill all babies because the Antichrist was among them. It's blatant and absurd.

[Sugaree]

Yeah I agree and to be honest I'm shocked the Pope can get away with saying such unethical and politically incorrect things.

He's the Pope of the Catholic Church. Of course he's going to get away with it, he's seen as a higher being. He's the ruler of an almost billion dollar a year business (it's no longer a 'Church' really). You expected him to be politically correct? More so, I admire him for not being politically correct. I don't agree with him, but it's a hell of a lot better than just going along with whatever is seen as 'correct'.

But before I go any further, if you can give some type of source (newspaper article, web link, etc.) of him saying this, it would definitely be a help.

[Starlight Blaze]

well tink about this: marriage is a religious thing
why should people do that, when its against the religion?
now civil union is completely fine, because thats a legal thing not religious
and sex, i really dont care about peoples sex lives

[Deleted_Account7]

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[Donkey]

Rights equal for everyone, however I don't disagree with phasing out the ability to marry for everyone :D It would be great if people could be more in touch with human emotion, and less so what a piece of paper says their emotions are.

[Dunce]

The catholic view is that you're allowed to be gay, because it's who you are. However, you are not allowed to act on these feelings whatsoever. I think it's bullshit.

If you love someone how are you supposed to refrain from being in a relationship with them? And if they are in a relationship then they should be allowed be intimate with each other, why not like? The only reason this is the case is because it's against "god's plan"-reproduction. But if you're gay your hardly going to get married with the opposite sex, have a child, and live happily ever after. So if they wont be reproducing anyway, what's the problem? And if they do choose to have a child anyway by surrogate then they're not going against "God's plan" anyway!

I think gay marriage can be controversial because it's a religious thing, religion is againt homosexuality. And the definition on marriage is the bond between a man and a woman.
If the couple wants to get married then they should be allowed, but they dont really need to :)

[Korashk]

Not usually.

[Deleted_Account7]

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[Severus Snape]

The Pope can eat shit and die. Worst Pontiff since Pius IX.

[Death]

I was torn between option 2 and 4 (chose 2 though), not because I wasn't sure if I fully accepted homosexuality, but because I think marriage in general is pointless (homosexual or heterosexual). By the way, who the fuck chose 1?

EDIT: Except Gaul...

[deadpie]

"I completely agree with the Pope, GLBTQ people shouldn't marry and it's a sin to have gay sex."

Except not everyone is Catholic and why should something be a sin if you can't control this nature of your body? Actually, sin isn't fair at all and it's completely rude. Oh, you were born gay? Well too bad! Fuck you and swim in a lake of fire! That's pretty much the ideology. Yeah, gay sex isn't natural just like it's totally natural for us to damage our body with alcohol and destroy our lungs with cigarettes hurr durrr. Plus, if you're going to say... well, if we're going to apply what The Bible says on gays being sinners, shouldn't we apply everything else The Bible calls sinners? Because then Fortunetellers, any friends of other religions, people who talk against their parents - they should just all die according to The Bible because this shit is sin!

You know how fucking dumb that is? The Bible is so out of times right now and I don't get how anyone could possibly agree with the nonsense in it.

I completely disagree with the Pope, GLBTQ people should be aloud to do everything hetro people can.

This is where I stand. My buttfucking and cocksucking is none of your business and you shouldn't give a shit just like I don't give a shit about who you're fucking.

I partly agree with the Pope. GLBTQ people should marry but not have sex.

WHAT THE FUCK? What's the point of even getting married then? What if straight people couldn't have sex after getting married? You think that'd be fair?And wait... so you can have sex, but you can't be married when having it. Does that make any fucking sense? I mean what the hell do you do in this marriage? Hold hands and hug as the most you can do instead of sex? How fucking dumb.

I partly agree with the Pope. GLBTQ people should have sex but not marry.

Why not? It's none of your business if they're getting married. I don't see how it effects you in any way shape or form other then it might 'gross' you out which makes you an immature dumbfuck.

Also, if the Pope wanted me to support him then I'd like to see him stop using a Popemobile to protect himself. Yes, I realize that increases his chances of dying, but that's the point.

[broseph92]

I agree. I'm Catholic. I always agree, even though I dont always follow what he says

[Zazu]

I always agree

Why?

[broseph92]

^ because Im Catholic and I agree. Damn

[deadpie]

^ because Im Catholic and I agree. Damn

What does that even mean? That's like people who say, "I believe in The Bible because The Bible says it's true". It means NOTHING! Not questioning anything and even if you don't really agree with it you just force yourself to? I don't get this.


well tink about this: marriage is a religious thing
why should people do that, when its against the religion?
now civil union is completely fine, because thats a legal thing not religious
and sex, i really dont care about peoples sex lives

(1) Christians aren't the only religious people getting married hurr durr (2) Not all religions are against gay sex or gay marriage (3) Marriage doesn't have to be about religion, but more of the symbolic nature of love. Even though I'm not really into that bullshit, I still think that's important.

[Donkey]

^ because Im Catholic and I agree. Damn

If you're Catholic, I wonder why you posted a thread just earlier about having threesomes with your 14 year old brother?

*regurgitates Bible quotes*

Yes, only agree with your religion when it includes looking down on other people!

[Zazu]

^ because Im Catholic and I agree. Damn

But why do you just 'agree'?

Why don't you view the evidence for both sides of the argument then make up your mind instead of just blindly agreeing with what some creepy, cheesy old bloke says?

[broseph92]

^ so you expect me to just agree with you? How about you worry about yourself and I'll worry about me

[Zazu]

^ so you expect me to just agree with you? How about you worry about yourself and I'll worry about me

Wait. What? No. That is exactly what I'm telling you NOT to do. Read it again bro.

I'm saying I think you should NOT just agree with anyone / anything. You should make your mind up for YOURSELF from what evidence you can find for and against.

And this is debating forum dear; please expect people to interject with agreements / disagreements with what you say.

[Amnesiac]

I agree. I'm Catholic. I always agree, even though I dont always follow what he says

I've never seen a more blatant admittance of blind conformity.

[Donkey]

I've never seen a more blatant admittance of blind conformity.

http://www.topnews.in/light/files/Paris-Hilton_11.jpg

“I don't really think,
I just walk.”

Paris Hilton

[broseph92]

how about you guys worry about your own effin beliefs and let me believe what I want? Im not telling you to believe what I believe so stop trying to make me believe how you do

[Donkey]

how about you guys worry about your own effin beliefs and let me believe what I want? Im not telling you to believe what I believe so stop trying to make me believe how you do
Why did you post in the debating forum, again?

[Zazu]

Ima just leave this here.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_useF5uhH9_U/TS42mipcw3I/AAAAAAAAACw/Q0VEY2LZIyg/s1600/pope_face_palm.jpg

[broseph92]

you can attack me all you want but you're still wrong

[deadpie]

you can attack me all you want but you're still wrong

Usually when you're in a debate forum you want to try to use sources and good reasoning to prove your right and not just say, "I'm right, you're wrong".

But I would like to thank you for ruining this thread because it wasn't going to go anywhere in the first place. Or maybe it was, but I could see it taking a downward turn from a distance and you just sped the process up.

[embers]

you can attack me all you want but you're still wrong

Oh dear, whatever happened to:

Im not telling you to believe what I believe

^ That?

On a more serious note, one: the Pope is a fucking flatulent piece of shit, and two: broseph... blind conformity and hypocrisy much?

[Amnesiac]

you can attack me all you want but you're still wrong

Then why come to the debate forum?

Really, if you're looking for a place to state your beliefs without criticism, take it to Facebook.

[Iceman]

Hey, hey, hey. Can we please get back on topic here? This thread is about do you agree with the Pope.

[Amnesiac]

Hey, hey, hey. Can we please get back on topic here? This thread is about do you agree with the Pope.

Yessir.

Anyway, the Pope and the Catholic Church as an institution are pieces of shit. Really, they're brainwashing hundreds of millions of people to be against birth protection, abortion and gays because they think of themselves as holier-than-thou.

Oh, how much better the world could be if the fucking Catholic Church didn't hamper the social progress of the human race with their inane social conservatism.

[Hunter Lily]

Not everyone is catholic and therefore the pope should not be allowed to make insensitive, blunt and simply rude comments like that. He is not in charge of everyone, not everybody even believes in what he believes. So not everyone needs to listen to him.

[Death]

Not everyone is catholic and therefore the pope should not be allowed to make insensitive, blunt and simply rude comments like that. He is not in charge of everyone, not everybody even believes in what he believes. So not everyone needs to listen to him.

This.

I don't give a shit who the bloody pope is, his (primative and bullshit) opinion is no more valid than any other mindless bigot who hides behind religion.

[Infidelitas]

Im not in any way, shape or form against the catholic church in anyway, i just dont like their views on somethings, but so many priests and bishops have been caught molesting young boys. Im not sure how thats supposed to be okay, if they can sweep that under the rug, what cant they do the same with with gay marriage? Its no different to marriage between a man and a woman.

GIVE US A FAIR GO!

[Sith Lord 13]

Marriage is defined as between a man and a woman. We can't change the dictionary to please people. That said, civil rights should be equal. Ergo, civil unions for all, gay and straight alike.

He's the Pope of the Catholic Church. Of course he's going to get away with it, he's seen as a higher being. He's the ruler of an almost billion dollar a year business (it's no longer a 'Church' really). You expected him to be politically correct? More so, I admire him for not being politically correct. I don't agree with him, but it's a hell of a lot better than just going along with whatever is seen as 'correct'.

But before I go any further, if you can give some type of source (newspaper article, web link, etc.) of him saying this, it would definitely be a help.

Actually, he's not a higher being, he's a man, just one who generally is supposed to know what he's talking about when it comes to faith and morals.
/15 years of Catholic schooling

Yeah I agree and to be honest I'm shocked the Pope can get away with saying such unethical and politically incorrect things.

This.

Freedom of speech and freedom of belief. It's not just for things you agree with.

[Continuum]

^ because Im Catholic and I agree. Damn

The pope orders you to commit heinous acts of bestiality and genocide on harmless rodents and flightless birds in order to atone for the sins you never did actually recognized or done (Remember having a threesome with your brother? It's Sodomy.). How's that sound?

you can attack me all you want but you're still wrong

Nobody is right or wrong. It's just a stupid post-it label you could stick on anything as you will. I could stick it on a wall, on myself, or on the propaganda ministries of the Church.


Anyway, the Pope and the Catholic Church as an institution are pieces of shit. Really, they're brainwashing hundreds of millions of people to be against birth protection, abortion and gays because they think of themselves as holier-than-thou.


Fuck pro-life. They're bunch of cheeky hypocrites not even agreeing to let the human race develop. They even threatened to excommunicate our president for this (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reproductive_Health_Bill_(Philippines))! I do not understand why giving away free condoms could cause such strife in our country, it's like we don't have the free will That God himself, as told by the official dogmata of the Church, endowed us with from the start. And yes, we are "secular", by terms that we need to answer the church first before passing a goddamn law, like we're some stupid lapdog for an organization that not everyone is a part of.

[Nevermore]

I chose the second one.

[User Deleted]

fly free little birdie

i disagree, youre life is yours

[anonymous53]

If that's what he wants to say, then he can say it. I don't agree with it, but it's free speech.

Gays and straights should have the same rights.

[Death]

If that's what he wants to say, then he can say it. I don't agree with it, but it's free speech.

Would you have an issue if I, theoretically, referred to you as a "deluded cunt"? Not that I will, because you're anything but deluded, but my question still stands.

Gays and straights should have the same rights.

Not just gays and straights, but also men and women. By disallowing gay marriage (but allowing straight marriage), you are giving men and women different rights when it comes to marrying individual people.

[Blake1994]

I agree. I'm Catholic. I always agree, even though I dont always follow what he says

Same.

I'm Catholic and yes I do agree with the Pope on this. But before everyone jumps on me about this, I would agree with what the Pope is saying regardless if I was Catholic or not. I have nothing against gays at all, but I do not believe gay sex is right and I don't think that gays should be allowed to marry. Does that mean I am anti-gay? Absolutely Not.

Please do not double post---Socko

[Korashk]

Same.

I'm Catholic and yes I do agree with the Pope on this. But before everyone jumps on me about this, I would agree with what the Pope is saying regardless if I was Catholic or not. I have nothing against gays at all, but I do not believe gay sex is right and I don't think that gays should be allowed to marry. Does that mean I am anti-gay? Absolutely Not.

Please do not double post---Socko
"I'm not amti-gay. I just think that what they do with each other in bed is morally wrong and want to deny them the same rights that non-gay individuals have."

People like you disgust me.

[Blake1994]

people like you disgust me.

Good, I'm glad.

[Rainstorm]

Good, I'm glad.

Can I ask. Do you know what abomination means in the old testament? Where it says Homosexuals are an abomination and such? (Paraphrasing and such)

[Iceman]

"I'm not amti-gay. I just think that what they do with each other in bed is morally wrong and want to deny them the same rights that non-gay individuals have."

People like you disgust me.

Good, I'm glad.

Guys. Chill. You both think you are smarter than the others, but in reality you are both being immature. This ends now.

[Blake1994]

Can I ask. Do you know what abomination means in the old testament? Where it says Homosexuals are an abomination and such? (Paraphrasing and such)

I could care less. I agree with what the Pope said, end of discussion.

[Rainstorm]

I could care less. I agree with what the Pope said, end of discussion.

Then why continue to come back to this thread?

Anyways, in the Old Testament, Abomination means unclean. Hebrews and the Jewish though that engaging in same sex relationships were unclean and lead to sickness and disease. Which is why it also states that eating any shellfish besides fish was an abomination. Not that God hated it but that the Jewish though that the disease from it was a punishment.

We don't persecute those that eat shrimp, do we?

Anyways, the Pope's interpretation is that of opinion and should not reflect the entire religious community. You shouldn't base your beliefs on that of a 2000 year book and go on the word of one person.

[Blake1994]

Then why continue to come back to this thread?

Anyways, in the Old Testament, Abomination means unclean. Hebrews and the Jewish though that engaging in same sex relationships were unclean and lead to sickness and disease. Which is why it also states that eating any shellfish besides fish was an abomination. Not that God hated it but that the Jewish though that the disease from it was a punishment.

We don't persecute those that eat shrimp, do we?

Anyways, the Pope's interpretation is that of opinion and should not reflect the entire religious community. You shouldn't base your beliefs on that of a 2000 year book and go on the word of one person.

Please don't preach to me. I'll base my beliefs on what I choose to.

[Rainstorm]

Please don't preach to me. I'll base my beliefs on what I choose to.

I'm not preaching. I'm simply stating what many people accept as truth from the Bible, which you seems to find as the eternal law.

Again, allow me to stress. Christian's are listening to a guy preaching from a 2000 year old book. The information stated in there were relevant back in the old days. However, it is the 21st century. We shouldn't be held back by religious ideas that have no point.

[Korashk]

Guys. Chill. You both think you are smarter than the others, but in reality you are both being immature. This ends now.
You're no better. Talk about the pot calling the kettle black. How you got to be a moderator is beyond me.

I could care less. I agree with what the Pope said, end of discussion.
Are you ever going to actually discuss something Blake? You know, on the debating forum?

[Scarface]

You're no better. Talk about the pot calling the kettle black. How you got to be a moderator is beyond me.


Are you ever going to actually discuss something Blake? You know, on the debating forum?

How about we all calm down now and not disrespect each other and get back to the topic on hand or the thread is locked.

[Blake1994]

Are you ever going to actually discuss something Blake? You know, on the debating forum?

I was under the impression I already was.

[Jess]

You don't agree with gay marriage just because you agree with the Pope? is there a deeper reasoning you have why gays shouldn't have the same rights as straights? :/

[Blake1994]

You don't agree with gay marriage just because you agree with the Pope? is there a deeper reasoning you have why gays shouldn't have the same rights as straights? :/

No. I don't agree with gay marriage because I don't agree with it, not because the Pope says its wrong. I have never agreed with it regardless of who says it is right or wrong. It doesn't matter whether the Pope said it or not, those are my beliefs. Like I said in one of my earlier posts, even if I wasn't Catholic, I still would have agreed with what the Pope said, but not because he said it. Because I personally feel the same way. I don't understand why everyone seems to think that we must all agree with gay marriage. I am not changing my views at all. So you and anyone else can try and convince me until you are blue in the face, and I still would not change my opinion on this subject.

[Korashk]

No. I don't agree with gay marriage because I don't agree with it, not because the Pope says its wrong. I have never agreed with it regardless of who says it is right or wrong. It doesn't matter whether the Pope said it or not, those are my beliefs. Like I said in one of my earlier posts, even if I wasn't Catholic, I still would have agreed with what the Pope said, but not because he said it. Because I personally feel the same way. I don't understand why everyone seems to think that we must all agree with gay marriage. I am not changing my views at all. So you can try and convince till your blue in the face, and I still would not change my opinion on this subject.
Why do you believe homosexuality is wrong?

Even if you believe homosexual marriage is wrong, why should it be outlawed?

[Blake1994]

Why do you believe homosexuality is wrong?

Even if you believe homosexual marriage is wrong, why should it be outlawed?

Because I'm a Catholic, and it just is. Marriage should be between a man and a woman, plain and simple. Damn, why must I agree with you and all the others who support gay marriage?

[CaptainObvious]

Because I'm a Catholic, and it just is. Marriage should be between a man and a woman, plain and simple. Damn, why must I agree with you and all the others who support gay marriage?

I can understand you have strong opinions. However, this is the debate forum. The only reason this forum exists is to argue with people's opinions. If you post here, people will argue with you. If you don't want to be argued with, you should not post in this forum. Understand?

[Korashk]

Because I'm a Catholic, and it just is.
I guess "Because I'm a Catholic" is technically an answer to the question I asked. I was honestly looking for actual reasoning, not excuses.

Marriage should be between a man and a woman, plain and simple.
Why?

Damn, why must I agree with you and all the others who support gay marriage?
Nobody gives a shit if you agree. We just want you to justify your position rather than be a bigot for bigotry's sake.

[Blake1994]

I guess "Because I'm a Catholic" is technically an answer to the question I asked. I was honestly looking for actual reasoning, not excuses.


Why?


Nobody gives a shit if you agree. We just want you to justify your position rather than be a bigot for bigotry's sake.

How about you worry about your own fvcking beliefs and views and let me worry about my own. I am in no way expecting you to think and believe how I think and believe, so stop trying to make me think and believe how you think and believe.

I'm not a bigot either. Just because I do not believe that gay marriage should be legal at all does not make me a bigot. I don't care if someone has a homosexual relationship, but I do not believe they should be married. If they were to adopt a child, it is not fair on the child. That kid is going to be going around saying "I've got 2 mommies" or "I've got 2 daddies". It is not right. Does that justify it enough for you? Damnit.

[Bougainvillea]

No. I don't agree with gay marriage because I don't agree with it, not because the Pope says its wrong. I have never agreed with it regardless of who says it is right or wrong. It doesn't matter whether the Pope said it or not, those are my beliefs. Like I said in one of my earlier posts, even if I wasn't Catholic, I still would have agreed with what the Pope said, but not because he said it. Because I personally feel the same way. I don't understand why everyone seems to think that we must all agree with gay marriage. I am not changing my views at all. So you and anyone else can try and convince me until you are blue in the face, and I still would not change my opinion on this subject.

Not true.
You've obviously grown up in a very religious family, thus giving you a biased outlook on such topics. You don't form beliefs simply "juss cuz". You form such beliefs because you've been raised being told its true by the people you trust most. Your family.

Now, if you grew up in a more moderate/agnostic household, like I was, your views would be different.

But the fact that you are blinded by things like that is sad. Never just believe what someone says. That's dangerous, and gives someone the oppurtunity to control you.

Don't be a sheep simply because someone claims to be a shepherd.

[Amnesiac]

How about you worry about your own fvcking beliefs and views and let me worry about my own. I am in no way expecting you to think and believe how I think and believe, so stop trying to make me think and believe how you think and believe.

I'm not a bigot either. Just because I do not believe that gay marriage should be legal at all does not make me a bigot. I don't care if someone has a homosexual relationship, but I do not believe they should be married. If they were to adopt a child, it is not fair on the child. That kid is going to be going around saying "I've got 2 mommies" or "I've got 2 daddies". It is not right. Does that justify it enough for you? Damnit.

I'm just curious, do you believe that sodomy (gay sex) should be illegal?

Also, why are you against gays obtaining a civil marriage if that has nothing to do with religion?

Finally, what's wrong with a kid saying "I've got two daddies"? Why are you intentionally denying orphans loving parents out of some flawed belief? Don't you think that those orphans, who are a burden on the state, should be able to be adopted by any willing couple, be them straight or gay?

You make it sound like a child acknowledging their parents' sexuality is bad. I mean, as long as they don't have homosexuality forced on them, there's nothing wrong with having gay parents.

[Korashk]

How about you worry about your own fvcking beliefs and views and let me worry about my own. I am in no way expecting you to think and believe how I think and believe, so stop trying to make me think and believe how you think and believe.
Are you lost? This is the DEBATING forum. A fact that you've been informed of on numerous occasions. If you want me to leave your beliefs alone, stop posting them in the DEBATING forum.

I'm not a bigot either.
You fit the definition of a bigot to a tee.

Just because I do not believe that gay marriage should be legal at all does not make me a bigot.
True, it's the "obstinately devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices" bit that makes you a bigot.

I don't care if someone has a homosexual relationship, but I do not believe they should be married.
Why should they not be allowed to marry?

If they were to adopt a child, it is not fair on the child.
Why is it not fair on the child?

That kid is going to be going around saying "I've got 2 mommies" or "I've got 2 daddies". It is not right.
Why is it not right? I can do this all day.

Does that justify it enough for you? Damnit.
No, because you have yet to justify anything about your beliefs. You've just stated what they are in different ways while introducing more beliefs that need justification.

[Blake1994]

I can do this all day.

As I told y'all before.

Y'all can do this to you are blue in the face, but I ain't changing my views or opinions on anything in regards to this subject. I'm done with this, end of discussion.

[Bougainvillea]

As I told y'all before.

Y'all can do this to you are blue in the face, but I ain't changing my views or opinions on anything in regards to this subject. I'm done with this, end of discussion.
We're not trying to sway you, we just want a fucking explanation as to why you hold such ignorant beliefs.

[Blake1994]

We're not trying to sway you, we just want a fucking explanation as to why you hold such ignorant beliefs.

I've already told you all that my belief is that marriage should be between a man and a woman. I do not believe my beliefs are ignorant at all.

And who the Hell is to say that your fucking beliefs are so damn perfect and right?

[Amnesiac]

I've already told you all that my belief is that marriage should be between a man and a woman. I do not believe my beliefs are ignorant at all.

And who the Hell is to say that your fucking beliefs are so damn perfect and right?

Well, most would say that being less discriminatory is a preferred moral value.

I mean, none of us would deny the right of blacks to marry and adopt, right?

[Infidelitas]

I've already told you all that my belief is that marriage should be between a man and a woman. I do not believe my beliefs are ignorant at all.

And who the Hell is to say that your fucking beliefs are so damn perfect and right?

Dude, your in ROTW, people are going to disagree with your statements. End of story. If you dont want to be aregued with, leave.

If gays are not allowed to "marry" why dont we just create our own joing of two people. Its not marriage as such, but its the same principle.
You cant help who you love, so why deny people the right to legally be joined to some one of the oposite sex?

[Blake1994]

so why deny people the right to legally be joined to some one of the oposite sex?

Maybe down in Australia that kind of thing is acceptable, but its not to the majority of most Americans, especially here in Texas.

[Korashk]

I've already told you all that my belief is that marriage should be between a man and a woman.
We're aware. What we're looking for is an explanation as to why you hold them that's more than an excuse. Explanations (in case you don't know, which gaging from your responses you don't) are when you justify your beliefs using reasoning. Explanations are not stating what you believe over and over again when people are asking you to explain them.

[Amnesiac]

Maybe down in Australia that kind of thing is acceptable, but its not to the majority of most Americans, especially here in Texas.

Oh, really. (http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/04/20/gay-marriage-opponents-now-in-minority/)

[Infidelitas]

location is still no real excuse for homophobia. Love is love. You cannot change that. You love a person, not gender

[Korashk]

Maybe down in Australia that kind of thing is acceptable, but its not to the majority of most Americans, especially here in Texas.

http://www.squaremartinimedia.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/why-highway-sign.jpg

EDIT: I guess "why" isn't as applicable a response to that post. Seeing as you were just stating fact. The point remains that people are being denied rights because they're homosexual.

EDIT EDIT: I guess my first edit stands partially corrected. Interesting find CA.

[Blake1994]

Explanations (in case you don't know, which gaging from your responses you don't) are when you justify your beliefs using reasoning. Explanations are not stating what you believe over and over again when people are asking you to explain them.

No shit Sherlock, you don't say. Just because y'all obviously think I'm ignorant and sound it, I'm not. I am a fucking honor roll student, all straight A's, I'm at the top of my class, I volunteer in the community, I'm a dedicated athlete, and I've got a really really good chance of getting into the US Naval Academy in Annapolis when I graduate high school and hopefully become a US Naval Officer. I have been to Catholic Schools all my life. I'm not an idiot, I know what the Hell an explanation is.

Oh, really. (http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/04/20/gay-marriage-opponents-now-in-minority/)

I could care less. The NY Times is nothing but some liberal trash rag. I stand firm on what I believe.

location is still no real excuse for homophobia. Love is love. You cannot change that. You love a person, not gender

I am not homophobic regardless of what y'all may think. I have several people in my classes who are gay, I have no problem with them. They are very good people. I stand strongly by my beliefs.

[Bougainvillea]

I am not homophobic regardless of what y'all may think. I have several people in my classes who are gay, I have no problem with them. They are very good people. I stand strongly by my beliefs.

Then why deny them simple rights if they don't bother you?

[Blake1994]

Then why deny them simple rights if they don't bother you?

Because marriage is intended to be between a man and a woman, plain and simple.

[Bougainvillea]

Because marriage is intended to be between a man and a woman, plain and simple.

And you believe so even if not sanctioned by the church?

[Korashk]

Because marriage is intended to be between a man and a woman, plain and simple.
It's obviously not "plain and simple" here Blake. Why is marriage intended to only be between a man and a woman?

[Blake1994]

It's obviously not "plain and simple" here Blake. Why is marriage intended to only be between a man and a woman?

Because that's what I've been taught all my life, and that's what I believe.

[Bougainvillea]

Because that's what I've been taught all my life, and that's what I believe.

Do you have any other reasoning besides the fact that you were easily persuaded?

[Blake1994]

Do you have any other reasoning besides the fact that you were easily persuaded?

Whatever man, its fucking late and I'm getting tired. I'm getting undressed and going to sleep. I'm done with this ridiculousness.

[Korashk]

Because that's what I've been taught all my life, and that's what I believe.
What was the people that taught you's reasoning?

[iangillan]

Because marriage is intended to be between a man and a woman, plain and simple.

Who told you this `true`.Maybe,Pedophiles from church.Or some priests who talking about religion at sunday morning,and same day at night runing for children.

[Blake1994]

What was the people that taught you's reasoning?

Jesus fucking Christ, why in the Hell do you care? Give it a fucking rest. I believe what I believe and you believe what you believe. Damn.

[iangillan]

I believe what I believe and you believe what you believe. Damn.

I Agree,just keep it for yourself.

[Korashk]

Jesus fucking Christ, why in the Hell do you care? Give it a fucking rest. I believe what I believe and you believe what you believe. Damn.
I'm using the Socratic method to get you to critically examine your beliefs using logic and reasoning. Sure, you believe what you believe and I believe what I believe. The only difference is that you don't seem to want to examine your beliefs or subject them to scrutiny. This is bad. The blind acceptance of ideas has historically led to many, many, many horrible occurrences.

[Bougainvillea]

Jesus fucking Christ, why in the Hell do you care? Give it a fucking rest. I believe what I believe and you believe what you believe. Damn.

http://www.virtualteen.org/forums/picture.php?albumid=1796&pictureid=18061
Is this accurate?

[Blake1994]

I Agree,just keep it for yourself.

None of y'all are keeping it to yourselves though.

[Amnesiac]

I could care less. The NY Times is nothing but some liberal trash rag. I stand firm on what I believe.

It seems a bit unusual to just dismiss something that contradicted your statement as a "liberal trash bag".

But anyway, I digress.

[iangillan]

None of y'all are keeping it to yourselves though.

Yes,Of Course,But only you are going to argue,over and over,if someone do not accept you opinion.

[CaptainObvious]

I could care less. The NY Times is nothing but some liberal trash rag. I stand firm on what I believe.

Now that's just not a very good argument. Whether or not you agree with the New York Times' editorial stance, if you actually read what he linked to (which I suspect you did not), you would see that it is a statistical analysis performed by Nate Silver of FiveThirtyEight, who is a prominent statistician who has been probably the best predictor of elections and policy outcomes over the past few years. Though you were probably not paying attention much (being 13/14 at the time), he was remarkably excellent during the 2008 election, and ended up accurately predicting 49 out of 50 states, as well as every Senate race.

You can't argue with his reputation, so what are you arguing with? His statistical models? Be my guest, but I doubt you actually have the mathematical/statistical background to do so. Really, what you're saying here is "I believe it, so it's true." ("it" being that most Americans oppose gay marriage.) That's one thing to say about a moral opinion like whether or not you agree with gay marriage; it's straight up absurd to say that about something like statistical modeling. How many people do you think you've met in your life? Thousands? Tens of thousands maybe? You trying to tell me you've met everyone in America to be able to tell how many people support gay marriage? No, you're basing your opinion on the people you know in Texas. That's not valid. If I based my opinion on my friends here at college, I'd say 95% of everyone in America supported gay marriage. Obviously not.

[Death]

Because marriage is intended to be between a man and a woman, plain and simple.

That's it? That's all you have to say? Just because something wasn't intended for something that makes it wrong? I guess the Mythbusters who make experimental items to test their myths using objects materials (i.e. duct tape bridge) in ways they were never intended are wrong now are they? Bull. Shit.

Because that's what I've been taught all my life, and that's what I believe.

I've already told you before, but this only shows that your beliefs are by no means true. If you were brought up in India, you'd likely be a Hindu. If you were brought up in ancient Greece, you'd probably believe in ancient gods no-one believes in today. What does this say about its creditability?

Whatever man, its fucking late and I'm getting tired. I'm getting undressed and going to sleep. I'm done with this ridiculousness.

Ridiculousness? Obviously you've never truly thought over what you've said. You are one person arguing against many and you think that the ones with the 'ridiculousness' are the many who have argued with you with proper refutals, facts, and statistics? I'm inclined to believe that you're just trolling. I mean seriously, you're coming to a debate forum and refusing to debate...

[Blake1994]

Troll? Yeah ok, call me a troll if you like. Whatever helps you sleep at night Death.

[Death]

Troll? Yeah ok, call me a troll if you like. Whatever helps you sleep at night Death.

I didn't call you a troll. I said you might be trolling. Now are you going to address anything anyone has said or not? Because it would be better for all of us if you did.

[Blake1994]

I didn't call you a troll. I said you might be trolling. Now are you going to address anything anyone has said or not? Because it would be better for all of us if you did.

No. I'm done with this bullshit thread.

[Death]

No. I'm done with this bullshit thread.

This why you PMed me with this?

"Go get fucked and stop living your pathetic, sad, pitiful excuse of a life on a website. Judging by the amount of posts you've made on this site, that's apparently all you do with your life. Or better yet why don't you go fuck the magical flying spaghetti monster you little Limey Shit."

[Bougainvillea]

That wasn't a very catholic thing to do.

[Blake1994]

All right once and for all. I do not believe gay marriage is right because it ruins the foundation of the traditional American marriage, between a man and a woman. Gay marriage in my personal opinion is morally wrong. My personal opinion. Do I believe anyone should agree with me? Again, as I said before, absolutely not. Yes I am Catholic. I hold firmly to my beliefs. I believe that marriage is something sacred that should not be violated. A child is a wonderful product of marriage and a child can only be conceived by a marriage between a man and a woman. Not by two people of the same sex. I do not believe gay marriage is something that should be legalized in the United States.

[Death]

All right once and for all. I do not believe gay marriage is right because it ruins the foundation of the traditional American marriage, between a man and a woman. Gay marriage in my personal opinion is morally wrong. My personal opinion. Do I believe anyone should agree with me? Again, as I said before, absolutely not. Yes I am Catholic. I hold firmly to my beliefs. I believe that marriage is something sacred that should not be violated. A child is a wonderful product of marriage and a child can only be conceived by a marriage between a man and a woman. Not by two people of the same sex. I do not believe gay marriage is something that should be legalized in the United States.

What about that PM you sent me? What was that about? You obviously hate people who disagree with you. So I'm going to ask you what you have against the more liberal people who do believe in human rights. So come on, what's your reasoning?

[Bougainvillea]

it ruins the foundation of the traditional American marriage, between a man and a woman. Gay marriage in my personal opinion is morally wrong.

Just because it ruins your personal view of what marriage "should" be in America, doesn't justify denying someone's right to be happy.

[Blake1994]

What about that PM you sent me? What was that about? You obviously hate people who disagree with you. So I'm going to ask you what you have against the more liberal people who do believe in human rights. So come on, what's your reasoning?

No I don't hate people who disagree with me at all. This is not North Korea.

And here is Death's response via PM:

"You claim to know me now do you? Any particular reason you are unable to debate and can only use pitiful insults? People like you give religion a bad name. Go on, prove yourself to be even more of a bigot and give me all the more reason to hate religious indoctrine. Well, what are you waiting fore, troll?"

First of all man, it's "for", not "fore", there is no "e" on the end, learn to fucking use spell check bro.

I am not a troll. I am not trolling in anyway. I have explained my position on this subject very clearly. I don't see how I can make it any clearer. I have debated it and I have stated my opinion. I have nothing more to say on this nonsence.

[Death]

^^ I've already responded to this in the other thread should you wish to view it.

[CaptainObvious]

Enough. Anyone continuing this completely ridiculous fight from this post forward will be infracted. In PMs is exactly where you should leave this ridiculous bickering.

[Death]

Why are we worrying about spelling? I just want to have a discussion about the pope. Okay, here goes:

I disagree completely with the pope, I think people need to be treated equally regardless of gender. By disallowing gay marriage you are giving genders different rights when it comes to who they can marry. Who disagrees with me (I'm just trying to keep this thread going)?

[Infidelitas]

All right once and for all. I do not believe gay marriage is right because it ruins the foundation of the traditional American marriage, between a man and a woman.

American marriage? Is this different from Spanish marriage, or Australian marriage? I respect the fact that you have beliefs, but you wont accept a fair debate.

Marriage is the union of two different surnames, in friendship and in love, in order to continue the posterity of the former sages, and to furnish those who shall preside at the sacrifices to heaven and earth, at those in the ancestral temple, and at those at the altars to the spirits of the land and grain
This is a quote by Confucius, he never made any reference for marriage to be with a man or a women, or a man and a man. He doesnt say its wrong.

t is a relatively new practice that same-sex couples are being granted the same form of legal marital recognition available to mixed-sexed couples Article on wikipedia. I know wikipedia isnt a viable source for information, but it does have some value.

"'...So they are no longer two, but one. Therefore what God has joined together, let man not separate."

– Jesus[Matthew 19:6]

Jesus never defined marriage to be between a man and a women. This quote has value, which is that, if a man loves a man, or a women loves a women, why should we separate them.

Marriage should have no real bounderies (other than marrying family members) Us homosexuals deserve to have a life too. We deserve to be bound to the person we love, like heterosexual couples.

[Continuum]

All right once and for all. I do not believe gay marriage is right because it ruins the foundation of the traditional American marriage, between a man and a woman. Gay marriage in my personal opinion is morally wrong. My personal opinion. Do I believe anyone should agree with me? Again, as I said before, absolutely not. Yes I am Catholic. I hold firmly to my beliefs. I believe that marriage is something sacred that should not be violated. A child is a wonderful product of marriage and a child can only be conceived by a marriage between a man and a woman. Not by two people of the same sex. I do not believe gay marriage is something that should be legalized in the United States.

Like they always say, Fuck social conservatism.* The pope doesn't only address the people of America, by the way. The Catholic church is as diverse as a jar of jellybeans. Homosexuals deserve a chance to be happy for themselves. They're humans, the same as you (Or, are you?) and everyone of us. They deserve the same rights as heterosexual people do. Oh, and don't even try that unnatural argument on me, just as I have said in my previous post:

I'm sure God, if He existed, will let this right to pass, since He formed it in his Divine Cosmogeny Himself (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexual_behavior_in_animals).

God Himself included homosexuality in his "intelligent design". It exists in nature. We can't do much about it than letting it pass. Why should humanity blot out its existence anyway? If you want marriage to be sacred, fine. Keep it within your Church. It shouldn't be a problem by your government, just let them have Civil Unions. Everyone should have the chance to marry outside the Church's butt-ins.

*Courtesy of Justin's insidious quote, by the way. :rolleyes:

[Sith Lord 13]

If gays are not allowed to "marry" why dont we just create our own joing of two people. Its not marriage as such, but its the same principle.

And my idea comes up again. I've long been saying that fully binding civil unions should be expanded to all orientations, and to leave marriages to churches.

location is still no real excuse for homophobia. Love is love. You cannot change that. You love a person, not gender

Well, unless you're pansexual, you do love a gender

It seems a bit unusual to just dismiss something that contradicted your statement as a "liberal trash bag".

As much as I hate to agree with him, the Times is more liberal than Fox News is conservative. (Though that has no bearing on the study itself)

This why you PMed me with this?

For the record Death (and everyone else), it is EXTREMELY bad etiquette to repost a PM without the consent of the sender. If you have a problem with a PM, report it.

[somethingrandom]

I personally don't agree much with the pope on this issue, but that's my own opinion. The government shouldn't ban gay marriage because they shouldn't regulate anything beyond a civil union. If they want to ban sodomy, I don't see a big issue with that as long as the same laws apply to homosexual AND heterosexual couples. I may not agree with those bans, but it's not my right to decide

[Infidelitas]

A civil union is a legally recognized union similar to marriage. If gays are'nt supposed to marry, why do we have a civil union? Its practically the same principle of marriage
"Marriage in the United States is a civil union; but a civil union, as it has come to be called, is not marriage," said Evan Wolfson of Freedom to Marry.

[somethingrandom]

If gays are'nt supposed to marry, why do we have a civil union? Its practically the same principle of marriage

Well no, the concept of a civil union is to have all the legal benefits of marriage without the religious sacredness of a marriage. Marriage should be run by religious or other institutions, civil unions should be regulated by the government

[CaptainObvious]

since we've now got 2 discussions I'm going to split this up.

*edit*

OK, keep this thread on topic from here on out, please.

[Jess]

All right once and for all. I do not believe gay marriage is right because it ruins the foundation of the traditional American marriage, between a man and a woman. Gay marriage in my personal opinion is morally wrong. My personal opinion. Do I believe anyone should agree with me? Again, as I said before, absolutely not. Yes I am Catholic. I hold firmly to my beliefs. I believe that marriage is something sacred that should not be violated. A child is a wonderful product of marriage and a child can only be conceived by a marriage between a man and a woman. Not by two people of the same sex. I do not believe gay marriage is something that should be legalized in the United States.

what? so are you saying that in a marriage you should have children? Also a gay couple could adopt. they should have that right, but that's another topic to discuss.

why do you have to have children during a marriage? I, if I'm ever getting married, will never have children. never ever

who cares about the traditional meaning of marriage? If two men or two women marry it's not hurting ANYONE. -_- it's no one else's business either.

[slappy]

Religious figures should have no say of love

[Genghis Khan]

I never really saw why it would offend people if they marry someone from the same sex, a grandmother with a pencil dick, a cow with a human head, or anything. Why does it concern people who others choose to have their relationships with? If it's God, then (assuming he exists) why does an all powerful being with such implausible power care so much about our sex lives?

Moving on, I whole heartedly disagree with the pope. He is an evil tyrant, and I have irrefutable proof of this.

http://pigroll.com/img/deny_you_cannot.jpg

[embers]

I love calm and collected debates.
Please read my signature bellow.

We've moved on from the bickering. So should you.

[Iceman]

I love calm and collected debates.
Please read my signature bellow.

We've moved on from the bickering. So should you.
I have taken care of this, so this end here.

[embers]

I have taken care of this, so this end here.

Indeed.

Moving on, I pretty much agree with Rawal here:

I never really saw why it would offend people if they marry someone from the same sex, a grandmother with a pencil dick, a cow with a human head, or anything. Why does it concern people who others choose to have their relationships with? If it's God, then (assuming he exists) why does an all powerful being with such implausible power care so much about our sex lives?

Hell, the idea that God even used to think of trivial things like clothes made of more than one fabric as a sin should be enough to put people off Christianity.