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Old May 23rd, 2018, 11:24 AM   #1
mattsmith48
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Default That Would Never Work Here

Everytime there is debate about gun control, electoral reform, health care, any kind of socialist policy etc. the people in the US who are against those things will almost always say ''that would never work here''. And sure changing the constitution or completely change your electoral system and restarting the way your government works from scratch is difficult, but not impossible. So tell me why something that works everywhere else would never work in the US?

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Old May 23rd, 2018, 01:13 PM   #2
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Default Re: That Would Never Work Here

Where does socialism really work? The Nordic countries? Just compare their growth prior to embracing socialism in the 1970s versus after. The Nordic countries got rich off capitalism, and their "successful socialism" is really just them riding on the coattails of their capitalist past. You will notice that the Nordic countries are slowly reverting back to more capitalist, pro-business policies because of that. Their corporate tax rate was significantly lower than the USA prior to the recent tax cuts, so if you want to use Nordic socialism as an ideal for the USA, then you must be in favor of the lower corporate tax cuts, but you weren't.

Nordic countries also have a greater work ethic among the populace, contributed I believe to a strong national identity, something sorely lacking in the USA. That is shown quite clear when you see that Nordic immigrants in the USA have a significantly better standard of living than the average American. And they have a significantly better standard of living compared to the people of their homeland. If socialism is such a boom, why then are they so much better under capitalism? The real thing that America needs to import is the Nordic countries' work ethic and unified identity, not their stagnant economic policies.

In general when comparing European nations to the USA, there are obvious differences. European countries are overall small, densely populated ethnic states with a unified national identity. America is a vast nation with a much larger and diverse population in terms of ethnic and religious identity. That affects many things, for instance elections. When you have a uniformly populated and geographically small electoral region, direct elections work fine. That's why state elections are direct, and why European countries have them. When you have a large and sporadically populated and diverse nation, especially Federated nations (nations with a strong sharing of power between a centralized government and state governments) like the USA and unlike most of Europe, direct elections are often unfair in that geographically small but heavily populated regions can elect the president all by themselves, despite being less than 10% of the nation in terms of geography. European nations do not have that problem to such an extent, again because of being more densely and evenly populated.

The USA is the leader in medical development and breakthroughs, and would be even better if the FDA adopted the policies of it's European counterparts, but of course that would never work here . About work as well as Europe's much more conservative abortion laws and corporate tax rates. It's really amazing how people preach about how we should adopt Europe's healthcare, economic, and military spending policies, but then can't list any major European healthcare or business achievements of the last 50 years that even come close to comparing to the USA's. And next time they want to preach about US militarism, don't come begging to the US's door begging for help the next time Putin decides to carve another chunk out of you.
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Old May 23rd, 2018, 05:26 PM   #3
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Default Re: That Would Never Work Here

Guns come to my mind since I just recently saw a girl in a hoodie that read "black guns matter". It got me thinking of the guns in America, the demand for guns here, the communities with gun interests, and the individuals with gun interests. Just like the cannabis industry, now being regulated and controlled it's changed the country and the way people think. It boosts the economy.
With guns, there would be a big black market. Many Americans are culturally tied to guns.
Getting a gun should be harder than buying medicinal weed or buying a computer, but should be easier than buying/financing a house or financing a car.
Prostitution is regulated in many parts of the world and is operated quite efficiently. In United States, the demand, the nature of sex trafficking, and all that shows why regulated prostitution has worked in places of the world but not the states. Could the US regulate and control a paid-sex industry properly? I think it would be extremely difficult and near impossible to change the way this works. The United States hasn't done it well and would have no experience trying to start that. Here is an example of something that should stay illegal until maybe a proposed plan makes sense that could eliminate the dangers and increase safety for a high risk industry. I just don't see that happening. Abortions are not something I like. But should someone make the choice to terminate a pregnancy, I hope there are safe and legal options as opposed to back alley ops. Certain drugs are on the schedule I list that I don't agree with (but many are illegal for a reason an should stay that way) , yet in other countries there is even legalization I believe and decriminalization in other countries. But USA has a drug problem, there are a lot of consumers. Pharma wants to keep people on painkillers and other meds. This creates a lot of jobs for Americans (and other international high level doctors that come here) in the psychiatry field, pharmaceutical field, sales opportunities, medical research. The country would rather make money selling drugs than allow Mexico to make money selling drugs. The demand is so big that both markets exist and people often go from buying American drugs to buying Mexican drugs to save money (and as their addictions degress). People here want drugs. People here want guns. Black market sales of drugs and guns are interconnected so it's a much deeper problem. It boils down to poverty, those suffering from poverty and coping with it and those desperately taking the shortcuts to escape it. Who wants to make money? Yeah, a lot of citizens and civilians are fine making money the conventional way. Not everyone does. Rich people. Poor people with cash who want more. They want to make money and there is a lot of money in guns and drugs.
Lot of money in oil and war too. Importing from the Middle East is terrible, gives them money and hurts us. If we aren't getting oil here, (which we are we producing a ton on our own but just still can't get enough) I hate to say War might be the best thing for the uS. And money is not the main reason of war, but I'd say it's one of the big 4. (Prosperity,religious and cultural differences, a safe a protected America (#1), and the human inherent passion for violence. But, The engineers have jobs for making war equipment, the military is strong and passionate about this country, we are selling arms globally to allies who will be enemies soon. (I think in 10-20 years there is a 20-80% of war or "battle" with the Kurds. We have to compete as a nation with china for wealth and prosperity and if our country can't produce enough goods to export, the nation will make its profits in other ways. Our best chance for competing with china is to carry our own weight, and pray/hope that India and Mexico level the playing field. China invests a lot in Africa to develop the world there. They work for each other but the ultimately support China. Mexico also is somewhat tied to China but then again China really is the world champion of nations right now. Back to United States, we are trying to stay the #1 contender, by Creating jobs and especially those that help with fighting the bad guys.

Healthcare? All I know is it is expensive unless you are poor then you might get lucky. Obama helped people this way for a short time but hurt them in the long run by giving a hand out and not taking people out of their comfort zone for growth and development. Trump, idk what he's done, but I think he will try to do kinda what Clinton did in the 90's to yes help people but motivate them to work for themselves. Granted this is nearly 2 decades later so they have to take different factors into account. But still we can't pay for all this. Especially with the amount of people that come here. Our nation reached wealth and greatness, and like all great kingdoms, comfort,wealth and living near paradise made the people's slow down and not think about their future or well being. So now we need to bring or let in people here to do shit that people don't want to do. But There just isn't enough money to take care of our own people. People need to wake up in the 20's. I've thought people will wake up again in the 20's like the 60's. but instead with the afffect Americans, see what's happening in this nation, get hungry and get going but then idk what to do about the people here. There is a population crisis in this country and in the world. The only places that aren't overcrowded are the places that are undercrowded from lack of people making enough babies. Wouldn't it be great to provide around health care here in the states. I think it could be lit. But would we provide it in cities, rural areas, would States be responsible? There are so many holes.

We need to think about the long term of this nation. Future generations and so forth. It's easy to want what could be best for the United States but we can't just pay everyone live like utopia, go through the motions as a nation with easy made up jobs for everyone, because we will blow through our money and reserves, create a weaker less hungry generation. My generation isn't the best (certainly not the worst) and I'm hopeful but worried about the next generation to come.

Look at how Europe brought in so many people who didn't match the culture of Europe. Multiculturalism failed. But in the United States, things aren't perfect but we manage to do it better than anywhere else in the world. But what can you expect, people of different cultures are going to think differently of the other, there are fundamental values all cultures share and fundamental principles that can make two cultures incompatible. You take a person from one group and introduce him to someone from another group, I'd say no big deal but it actually is likely to have a positive outcome. You mix a group of peopleIt's all about exposure in my opinion and trying to understand we are all just human. But not everyone gets it this way, and many visitors fell unwelcome. Many foreigners have a great difficulty adjusting and adapting to the American way of life. In USA, latinos and whites both share Christianity from Europe and Catholicism from Spain. While Christianity in Northern Europe clashed with Catholicism centuries ago, the United States has worked to blend/unite its Christianity since the 1900s while Mexico has evolved their own simple but passionate and beautiful spin on Catholicism. These shared Christian values make integration easier. With Muslims, I think we have a lot of surface problems but we could definitely find common ground if we were willing to be open. I know christians who have no understanding of being open. For them, being open minded just means being open minded to Jesus. Now maybe with a growing Latino population, a lot of us may not bring gun values. We know what guns do in Mexico, the American cities and the world. But for the young latino men who have trouble adapting to American life, could live out a street culture that involves having guns without proper training or knowledge.

The Latino boys who are firing guns over money, and drugs and even girls. From my experience, knowing people who know people a lot of latinos in Denver were sent to Denver health (our biggest hospital) frequently with gun shots. I don't mean to stereotype but I've seen it with my own eyes, black male shootings are fatal much more than the Latino shootings. Young black men killing other young black men. That's one kid who's mom or grandma will never see again and another kid who has ruined his life and has to think about what he did to another man his whole life and live with it. Over money. Drugs. Anger.
There's a difference between the planning that goes down before a shooting. When anger and andernaline get a hold of a young man, he might not think before he acts. Whereas some men are ready to respond, ready to strategize, and ready to act. Others take deep preparation on their act of violence. Instead of inflicting violence upon an individual, they aim the violence against humanity. Some young men take their anger and passion and make the world pay in the name of their God. Other lonely boys, have nothing to loose, their weak mentality turns to a disturbed one. Perception and the way someone experiences the world can change so many ways. Their anger, frustration and hatred leads them to attacking humanity.
The question is are we more concerned with these large atrocities that happen quite often but relatively rare to the day to day epidemic of violence amongst young males. Both issues boil down to human inherent capability for violence and young males without a purpose or proper upbringing turning agresssive as opposed to soft, but both have their own trends and what we need is to look at solutions. Perhaps we should look at how to help young boys grow into good men. But the schools have only so many resources, and in bad environments how does one make an impact, home environment lives are huge to the development of young people.

I guess we sorta know the problems and the issues but do we understand them deeply enough. We don't know the solution. Do we even have the right questions to ask about what changes we need to make to fix our society?

Anything with a question mark at the end was not intended to be rhetorical, feel free to quote me, back me up, firm up my points, debate me, prove me wrong, keep me open minded etc.
I always appreciate feedback especially when I'm making claims I believe to be accurate about the world, anything you disagree with or I wasn't able to articulate clear enough, or whatever. I come to ROTW to learn.




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Old May 23rd, 2018, 06:06 PM   #4
Dmaxd123
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Default Re: That Would Never Work Here

because many of us look at the greater picture and realize that although no system is perfect including our own... ours is working fairly well

there is no utopia and there never will be.

plasma ham commented about nordic countries & the strong national identity, many countries aren't as diverse as the US when you start going from Florida to Maine to Nebraska, Texas, California, and Alaska we have a lot of different people to try and keep going in the same direction with the same set of laws


now I know some people especially you Matt HATE the electoral college.
2016 Election Stats which show some of the reason that the electoral college works for the US when electing the president since our country is so vast/diverse:
3141 Counties in the USA
Trump Won 2626
Clinton Won 487
NY has 62 Counties
Trump Won 46
Hillary 16

in the 5 counties that make up NYC, Clinton won 4 of them.

in the whole election Clinton did have 1.5million more popular votes than trump, in the 5 counties that make NYC she had over 2 million more popular votes so those 5 counties can sway the WHOLE nation's vote if we went 100% popular vote in a national election!

when the nation is almost 4 million square miles and NYC is 319 square miles it shows how the current system actually does work.

on a national level one gets a bit more of a voice, on a state level here in NY we are still ruled by NYC, Albany, Binghamton, Rochester, & Buffalo because the states are a 1 vote = 1 vote so higher population dictates what happens in rural America on the state level
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Old May 23rd, 2018, 10:42 PM   #5
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Default Re: That Would Never Work Here

Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasmaHam View Post
Where does socialism really work? The Nordic countries? Just compare their growth prior to embracing socialism in the 1970s versus after. The Nordic countries got rich off capitalism, and their "successful socialism" is really just them riding on the coattails of their capitalist past. You will notice that the Nordic countries are slowly reverting back to more capitalist, pro-business policies because of that. Their corporate tax rate was significantly lower than the USA prior to the recent tax cuts, so if you want to use Nordic socialism as an ideal for the USA, then you must be in favor of the lower corporate tax cuts, but you weren't.

Nordic countries also have a greater work ethic among the populace, contributed I believe to a strong national identity, something sorely lacking in the USA. That is shown quite clear when you see that Nordic immigrants in the USA have a significantly better standard of living than the average American. And they have a significantly better standard of living compared to the people of their homeland. If socialism is such a boom, why then are they so much better under capitalism? The real thing that America needs to import is the Nordic countries' work ethic and unified identity, not their stagnant economic policies.
First the US had one of the lowest corporate tax rate in the world long before the Trump tax cuts.

You need a good combination of both capitalism and socialism, Nordic countries are good at this, the concept of knowing what should and shouldn't be for profit if very important. People in those countries are the happiest in world because they don't have to stress about how a sickness might bankrupt them or on not being able to put food on the table or a roof over their head. They have good work ethic because they are treated well, they have strong unions providing them good working conditions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasmaHam View Post
In general when comparing European nations to the USA, there are obvious differences. European countries are overall small, densely populated ethnic states with a unified national identity. America is a vast nation with a much larger and diverse population in terms of ethnic and religious identity. That affects many things, for instance elections. When you have a uniformly populated and geographically small electoral region, direct elections work fine. That's why state elections are direct, and why European countries have them. When you have a large and sporadically populated and diverse nation, especially Federated nations (nations with a strong sharing of power between a centralized government and state governments) like the USA and unlike most of Europe, direct elections are often unfair in that geographically small but heavily populated regions can elect the president all by themselves, despite being less than 10% of the nation in terms of geography. European nations do not have that problem to such an extent, again because of being more densely and evenly populated.
New Zealand who have the best and fairest electoral system out there (Mixed-member proportional) they have a lower population density than the US and it works great there. Here in Canada we are the 2nd largest country in the world and less population then California, but there is no question that MMP would work great here, and we would get the evidence for that next year if a certain PM would have kept his promise. So tell me why wouldn't it work in the US.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasmaHam View Post
The USA is the leader in medical development and breakthroughs, and would be even better if the FDA adopted the policies of it's European counterparts, but of course that would never work here . About work as well as Europe's much more conservative abortion laws and corporate tax rates. It's really amazing how people preach about how we should adopt Europe's healthcare, economic, and military spending policies, but then can't list any major European healthcare or business achievements of the last 50 years that even come close to comparing to the USA's. And next time they want to preach about US militarism, don't come begging to the US's door begging for help the next time Putin decides to carve another chunk out of you.
For the health care thing, fuck Europe you should adopt our system.

Quote:
Originally Posted by West Coast Sheriff View Post
Guns come to my mind since I just recently saw a girl in a hoodie that read "black guns matter".
Thats kinda offensive

Quote:
Originally Posted by West Coast Sheriff View Post
It got me thinking of the guns in America, the demand for guns here, the communities with gun interests, and the individuals with gun interests. Just like the cannabis industry, now being regulated and controlled it's changed the country and the way people think. It boosts the economy.
With guns, there would be a big black market. Many Americans are culturally tied to guns.
Getting a gun should be harder than buying medicinal weed or buying a computer, but should be easier than buying/financing a house or financing a car.
Prostitution is regulated in many parts of the world and is operated quite efficiently. In United States, the demand, the nature of sex trafficking, and all that shows why regulated prostitution has worked in places of the world but not the states. Could the US regulate and control a paid-sex industry properly?
Personally I think that with prostitution should be decriminalize instead of fully legalized and regulated. That being said I can't think of any reason why prostitution couldn't be legalized and regulated in the US.

Quote:
Originally Posted by West Coast Sheriff View Post
I think it would be extremely difficult and near impossible to change the way this works. The United States hasn't done it well and would have no experience trying to start that. Here is an example of something that should stay illegal until maybe a proposed plan makes sense that could eliminate the dangers and increase safety for a high risk industry. I just don't see that happening. Abortions are not something I like. But should someone make the choice to terminate a pregnancy, I hope there are safe and legal options as opposed to back alley ops. Certain drugs are on the schedule I list that I don't agree with (but many are illegal for a reason an should stay that way) , yet in other countries there is even legalization I believe and decriminalization in other countries. But USA has a drug problem, there are a lot of consumers.
Decriminalizing all drugs and by treating drug addiction as a mental health issue instead of a criminal one, you help eliminating the stigma which as for effect favourise a setting where it becomes easier for addicts to ask for help and for professional to give them treatment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by West Coast Sheriff View Post
Pharma wants to keep people on painkillers and other meds. This creates a lot of jobs for Americans (and other international high level doctors that come here) in the psychiatry field, pharmaceutical field, sales opportunities, medical research. The country would rather make money selling drugs than allow Mexico to make money selling drugs. The demand is so big that both markets exist and people often go from buying American drugs to buying Mexican drugs to save money (and as their addictions degress). People here want drugs. People here want guns. Black market sales of drugs and guns are interconnected so it's a much deeper problem. It boils down to poverty, those suffering from poverty and coping with it and those desperately taking the shortcuts to escape it. Who wants to make money? Yeah, a lot of citizens and civilians are fine making money the conventional way. Not everyone does. Rich people. Poor people with cash who want more. They want to make money and there is a lot of money in guns and drugs.
Drugs and guns are two different things, it is easy to make the drugs illegally yourself, guns a lot harder, they need to come from somewhere, in the US a great majority of the guns on the blackmarket are either stolen or bought legally.

Quote:
Originally Posted by West Coast Sheriff View Post
Healthcare? All I know is it is expensive unless you are poor then you might get lucky. Obama helped people this way for a short time but hurt them in the long run by giving a hand out and not taking people out of their comfort zone for growth and development. Trump, idk what he's done, but I think he will try to do kinda what Clinton did in the 90's to yes help people but motivate them to work for themselves. Granted this is nearly 2 decades later so they have to take different factors into account. But still we can't pay for all this. Especially with the amount of people that come here. Our nation reached wealth and greatness, and like all great kingdoms, comfort,wealth and living near paradise made the people's slow down and not think about their future or well being. So now we need to bring or let in people here to do shit that people don't want to do. But There just isn't enough money to take care of our own people. People need to wake up in the 20's. I've thought people will wake up again in the 20's like the 60's. but instead with the afffect Americans, see what's happening in this nation, get hungry and get going but then idk what to do about the people here. There is a population crisis in this country and in the world. The only places that aren't overcrowded are the places that are undercrowded from lack of people making enough babies. Wouldn't it be great to provide around health care here in the states. I think it could be lit. But would we provide it in cities, rural areas, would States be responsible? There are so many holes.
Just would like to point out this is the richest country ever we're talking about. There is no reason they couldn't afford to give health care to everyone. The federal government should be creating the bases of a new health care system, and work with the states to have both to fund it.

Yes there is a overpopulation problem but in some parts of the world its fixing it self with better access to birth control and education.

Quote:
Originally Posted by West Coast Sheriff View Post
Look at how Europe brought in so many people who didn't match the culture of Europe. Multiculturalism failed. But in the United States, things aren't perfect but we manage to do it better than anywhere else in the world.
We do it much better then the US.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dmaxd123 View Post
now I know some people especially you Matt HATE the electoral college.
Sorry that I like when every vote count the same, instead of some being worthless and some being worth more based on where you live. Also electoral college is only the tip of the giant undemocratic iceberg that is FPTP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dmaxd123 View Post
2016 Election Stats which show some of the reason that the electoral college works for the US when electing the president since our country is so vast/diverse:
3141 Counties in the USA
Trump Won 2626
Clinton Won 487
NY has 62 Counties
Trump Won 46
Hillary 16

in the 5 counties that make up NYC, Clinton won 4 of them.

in the whole election Clinton did have 1.5million more popular votes than trump, in the 5 counties that make NYC she had over 2 million more popular votes so those 5 counties can sway the WHOLE nation's vote if we went 100% popular vote in a national election!
First you realize you are complaining about big cities being worth too much, but you support a system where (using your numbers) the candidate who won all of New York's 29 electoral votes, won 30 less counties then her opponent? At least if you were giving the number of electoral votes proportionally instead of a winner take all system, it wouldn't be as bad. Still would be terrible way to do things, but better.

Now let me tell you why this system is terrible. (Warning a lot of math is involved)

In 2016, a total of 7,721,453 votes were cast in the state of New York, Hillary Clinton won the state with 4,556,124, thats 3,165,329 votes against her, now because this is first-past-the-post or winner take all, those 3,165,329 become worthless, but thats not all, Donald Trump finished 2nd with 2,819,534 votes meaning that Hillary Clinton only needed 2,819,535 votes to win, 4,556,124-2,819,535=1,736,589 people who if the had stayed home wouldn't have made a difference except for very stressful TV on election night. So you add the two totals 3,165,329+1,736,589=4,901,918 or 63.48% worthless votes, btw she won the state with 59.01% of the votes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dmaxd123 View Post
when the nation is almost 4 million square miles and NYC is 319 square miles it shows how the current system actually does work.

on a national level one gets a bit more of a voice, on a state level here in NY we are still ruled by NYC, Albany, Binghamton, Rochester, & Buffalo because the states are a 1 vote = 1 vote so higher population dictates what happens in rural America on the state level
So you are saying it is wrong that 1 vote = 1 vote?

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Old May 24th, 2018, 12:02 AM   #6
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Default Re: That Would Never Work Here

I will contribute my statement here shortly, but for the time being, I'd just like to say: I really want a "black guns matter" hoodie now.


I'll be back.

I'll answer anything, and I'm up for a chat. pm me
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Originally Posted by The United States of America, Constitution: Second Amendment, to the Bill Of Rights:
A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
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ALL TYRANNY NEEDS TO GAIN A FOOTHOLD, IS FOR PEOPLE OF GOOD CONSCIENCE TO REMAIN SILENT.
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Old May 24th, 2018, 06:22 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by mattsmith48 View Post



So you are saying it is wrong that 1 vote = 1 vote?
i'm saying any perceived injustice of the electoral college for ONE person in ONE branch of government is greatly offset

on a day to day basis the president has a much smaller affect on a citizens life than the governor of a state who is elected by gaining the most votes

therefore the current system isn't terrible as it really balances itself out a bit better when the president is elected by electoral, the legislative branch of the US govt is elected by popular votes, the governor of the state, our representatives in state level, representatives in county & school levels are all elected by popular votes too so it's only one small branch that has been elected by the electoral college
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Old May 24th, 2018, 08:49 AM   #8
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Default Re: That Would Never Work Here

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Originally Posted by mattsmith48 View Post
tell me why something that works everywhere else would never work in the US?

Imo, US citizens, like most citizens of other states in the Western hemisphere, are too wealthy even on the lowest level as they really think about making changes. So it simply lacks a majority will to do so, even they are aware of all the flaws their sytem has.



But as said, they not alone having this prob.
And more words aren't really needed for an explanation.


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Old May 24th, 2018, 12:17 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasmaHam View Post
Where does socialism really work? The Nordic countries? Just compare their growth prior to embracing socialism in the 1970s versus after. The Nordic countries got rich off capitalism, and their "successful socialism" is really just them riding on the coattails of their capitalist past. You will notice that the Nordic countries are slowly reverting back to more capitalist, pro-business policies because of that. Their corporate tax rate was significantly lower than the USA prior to the recent tax cuts, so if you want to use Nordic socialism as an ideal for the USA, then you must be in favor of the lower corporate tax cuts, but you weren't.

Nordic countries also have a greater work ethic among the populace, contributed I believe to a strong national identity, something sorely lacking in the USA. That is shown quite clear when you see that Nordic immigrants in the USA have a significantly better standard of living than the average American. And they have a significantly better standard of living compared to the people of their homeland. If socialism is such a boom, why then are they so much better under capitalism? The real thing that America needs to import is the Nordic countries' work ethic and unified identity, not their stagnant economic policies.

In general when comparing European nations to the USA, there are obvious differences. European countries are overall small, densely populated ethnic states with a unified national identity. America is a vast nation with a much larger and diverse population in terms of ethnic and religious identity. That affects many things, for instance elections. When you have a uniformly populated and geographically small electoral region, direct elections work fine. That's why state elections are direct, and why European countries have them. When you have a large and sporadically populated and diverse nation, especially Federated nations (nations with a strong sharing of power between a centralized government and state governments) like the USA and unlike most of Europe, direct elections are often unfair in that geographically small but heavily populated regions can elect the president all by themselves, despite being less than 10% of the nation in terms of geography. European nations do not have that problem to such an extent, again because of being more densely and evenly populated.

The USA is the leader in medical development and breakthroughs, and would be even better if the FDA adopted the policies of it's European counterparts, but of course that would never work here . About work as well as Europe's much more conservative abortion laws and corporate tax rates. It's really amazing how people preach about how we should adopt Europe's healthcare, economic, and military spending policies, but then can't list any major European healthcare or business achievements of the last 50 years that even come close to comparing to the USA's. And next time they want to preach about US militarism, don't come begging to the US's door begging for help the next time Putin decides to carve another chunk out of you.
I must say few things about nordic countries. Finland and Norway and Denmark and Sweden we have more or less mandatory military service. Finland and Norway calling more men to duty than rest. We also have strong gun culture while its way different than in USA we have lots of firearms in hands of ordinary people. Most of ordinary folks here deeply hate socialism and especially state interfering every aspect of life. We like anyway social security and generally speaking we are ready to pay for it in form of higher taxes. While at same time we hate bureacratic system how its done and how it passivates people.
We have as nations this paneuropean cancer called EU and socialism.
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Old Yesterday, 03:40 AM   #10
Stronk Serb
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Default Re: That Would Never Work Here

Well, regarding guns, it is about mentality. I mean, Serbia has had disarmament campaigns by the government. Kinda no point in opposing the tyrranical government when they violate your rights, no matter if you are armed or disarmed. Sure, a bunch of you with your fancy AR-15s are gonna wreak havoc, but when the National Guard gets called in, you are screwed. The whole idea of using guns to defend against tyrranical government makes zero sense to me.
Also Germany, Serbia, Slovakia and Switzerland have pretty okay gun laws, Switzerland has pretty lax ones too, but becauss of the Swiss mentality, they do not go around shooting schools and stuff, but all these countries have one thing in common: to own a machine which can send death down range more rounds per minute than you can count is not your right, it is a privilege which must be earned.
About healthcare, please don't, Serbia is a European country and as it turns out, some people pay more in healthcare tax to the state than they would be paying for private insurance. It would be dandy if the system actually worked, but it is broken. Last time I went to the doctor because of a flu, I came back even sicker because I had to wait in the waiting room stuffed with sick patients for 6 hours! Also not to mention that time when I was refused to be even examined "because my appointed doctor works the opposite shift". Now, when I went to private clinics, which cost pretty much the same, I got examined/treated in like 15 minutes since I came in.
The thing I like about Serbia that the US doesn't have is more affordable and in some cases free third and fourth level education. For example, st the University I will go to in June, I will take an admission exam and if I am above a determined threshold, I will study there at the state's expense.
Also for you guys across the pond, keep in mind that Europe is more diverse than all of the US. I mean, the Balkan countries which combined are shy of 70 million people have 9 different languages, 8-12 different peoples (depending who you ask) and a ton of national minorities. I mean, before WWII ethnic Germans were like 10-15% of the Serbian population.

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Old Yesterday, 05:24 AM   #11
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Default Re: That Would Never Work Here

Concerning guns, I found this very interesting map on Reddit (source):



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Old Yesterday, 06:07 AM   #12
lliam
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Default Re: That Would Never Work Here

at least, even Vancouver Island is near by, but mass shooting free





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