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View Poll Results: How long should be given to read each book?
30 Days 7 46.67%
45 Days 5 33.33%
60 Days 2 13.33%
Other (Please Specify) 1 6.67%
Voters: 15. You may not vote on this poll

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Old December 13th, 2015, 12:20 PM   #1
Vlerchan
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Default VT Reading Group

I mean for this to focus around non-fiction works. If this gets support at all I'm hoping we'll decide on a list together.

The hope is that we would choose works that are available as PDFs online because I most people here don't have a regular income. The aim then is that each month there would be work selected and we'd then have 30 days to read it. I would hope that these works would be short - i.e. <200 pp. Then there'd be discussion and perhaps that would occur in a separate ROTW thread.

I'm still considering as to whether the selection mechanism would be on rotation or democratic - or a mixture thereof.

Sound OK?

---

I'm tagging people that I think might be interested:

@Paraxiom @JudeanZealot @phuckphace @Uniquemind @Porpoise101 @Microcosm @Salad_Baby @Reise @Atom

Edit: For reference I'll be looking to start a thread and not a subforum.

".... the result of a consistent and total substitution of lies for factual truth is not that the lie will now be accepted as truth, and truth be defamed as lie, but that the sense by which we take our bearings in the real world - and the category of truth versus falsehood is among the mental means to this end - is being destroyed ... [H.A.]"
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Old December 13th, 2015, 12:37 PM   #2
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I like the concept it's just I don't know about the page requirement in addition to 30 days. Is say argue for 60-62 days (those 31 month days: aka: 2 months) just because some months are busier than others or people go on vacation etc.

I say we have a tiered process: Pick a bunch of non-fiction works (books, magazines, internet articles (time), scientific journal publications). The last suggestion tends to be within the page length you're looking for so I assume we'll be doing lots of those, but it requires ability to comprehend academic jargon-terminology, statistics and statistic notation, and the scientific method obviously.

All works read should be in English or at least accurately English translated, I thought that went without saying but for the record I said it.

Then select a theme, and from that theme that matches the general compiled list of works we can read, we go with that.

Process should take 7 days to decide, giving 23 days to read and deliberate-debate in ROTW.

Individuals have permission and should bow out in the beginning if their forecasted 2 months schedules don't allow for this fun activity.

Last edited by Uniquemind; December 13th, 2015 at 12:42 PM.
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Old December 13th, 2015, 12:41 PM   #3
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Default Re: VT Reading Group

I'm in.

Also, to tag me, make sure to write my username as 2 words.

I think 30 days is a reasonable time frame. 60 days is really long. And I would back a rotation system, just to keep things diverse.

"Absolute tolerance is altogether impossible; the allegedly absolute tolerance turns into ferocious hatred of those who have stated clearly and most forcefully that there are unchangeable standards founded in the nature of man and the nature of things."
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Old December 13th, 2015, 01:08 PM   #4
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Default Re: VT Reading Group

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unqiuemind
I don't know about the page requirement in addition to 30 days. Is say argue for 60-62 days (those 31 month days: aka: 2 months) just because some months are busier than others or people go on vacation etc.
I'm good to let other participants work out the number of days to finish each work. I spend three to four hours a day commuting on a bus - and get through reading quite quick as a result - so I don't have the best judgement about what's a reasonable pace for people. However I so long as we keep it pleasant and open for people that can't do one sessions reading I don't have a problem with a time-limit being at the lower-end.

I also think suggestions of other resources is a good idea. I feel journal articles should be vetted first though because some of these demand an understanding of mathematics and statistics I don't feel it's fair to expect. Here's a random example of what I'm referring to. That also doesn't mean I disapprove of maths in all its guises but I'd rather highly-mathematical texts where avoided.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Judean Zealot
And I would back a rotation system, just to keep things diverse.
This is what I would prefer too. Looking at the people I cited we seem to have a broad set of interests.

---

For those curious. If I didn't cite you it's because I don't see you enough in ROTW.

Others can feel free to flag interest.

".... the result of a consistent and total substitution of lies for factual truth is not that the lie will now be accepted as truth, and truth be defamed as lie, but that the sense by which we take our bearings in the real world - and the category of truth versus falsehood is among the mental means to this end - is being destroyed ... [H.A.]"
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Old December 13th, 2015, 01:15 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Vlerchan View Post
I'm good to let other participants work out the number of days to finish each work. I spend three to four hours a day commuting on a bus - and get through reading quite quick as a result - so I don't have the best judgement about what's a reasonable pace for people. However I so long as we keep it pleasant and open for people that can't do one sessions reading I don't have a problem with a time-limit being at the lower-end.
I'm an even worse judge, I literally spend 4 hours daily doing extracurricular reading. I finish most books in a day or two.

"Absolute tolerance is altogether impossible; the allegedly absolute tolerance turns into ferocious hatred of those who have stated clearly and most forcefully that there are unchangeable standards founded in the nature of man and the nature of things."
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Old December 13th, 2015, 01:18 PM   #6
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Default Re: VT Reading Group

I'd be in, definitely.


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Old December 13th, 2015, 01:31 PM   #7
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Not tagged but it sounds like something I'd enjoy.


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Old December 13th, 2015, 01:54 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aEON View Post
I'd be in, definitely.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abhorrence View Post
Not tagged but it sounds like something I'd enjoy.
What sort of time-frame would yous find preferable?

Oh and like I said: don't worry about not getting tagged. It was always going to be the case I'd miss out on most of the people interested.

".... the result of a consistent and total substitution of lies for factual truth is not that the lie will now be accepted as truth, and truth be defamed as lie, but that the sense by which we take our bearings in the real world - and the category of truth versus falsehood is among the mental means to this end - is being destroyed ... [H.A.]"
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Old December 13th, 2015, 02:24 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Vlerchan View Post
What sort of time-frame would yous find preferable?

Oh and like I said: don't worry about not getting tagged. It was always going to be the case I'd miss out on most of the people interested.
The 30 day thing you said works for me, as for discussion stuff...

I'm available most of the time, except for the few hours I'm asleep, I'm always lurking here.


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Old December 13th, 2015, 02:31 PM   #10
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Default Re: VT Reading Group

I'm interested but right now I will just prefer to observe how it goes. I'll join the next session probably.



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Old December 13th, 2015, 03:50 PM   #11
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I will participate.
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Old December 13th, 2015, 04:32 PM   #12
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Default Re: VT Reading Group

Sounds like a cool idea, I don't know if I really have time to participate all of the time but I'd be interested, and you have the stamp of approval

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Old December 13th, 2015, 09:26 PM   #13
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I have to go by a 60-62, day time table, whatever you guys decide that's just how I have to operate due to my life's schedule.

(HW, extracurriculars, tutoring/babysitting job, and chores).

You can go by 30 days turnover, it just means I'm going to be late to the party discussion. I'm okay with that if you are.

I also favor a rotation.
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Old December 13th, 2015, 11:14 PM   #14
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Oooh. I'd love to be apart of this!

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Old December 14th, 2015, 05:55 AM   #15
Judean Zealot
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@Vlerchan.

Where would this project be based? A diary? The Open Book?

"Absolute tolerance is altogether impossible; the allegedly absolute tolerance turns into ferocious hatred of those who have stated clearly and most forcefully that there are unchangeable standards founded in the nature of man and the nature of things."
-Leo Strauss, Liberalism: Ancient and Modern
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Old December 14th, 2015, 07:22 AM   #16
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Yes this is a good idea I believe. Good timing as I just finished my book about Vikings.

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Old December 14th, 2015, 10:59 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uniquemind
I have to go by a 60-62, day time table, whatever you guys decide that's just how I have to operate due to my life's schedule.
I guess we can wait and see what other people prefer. I have ideas depending on what sort of divisions we get.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Judean Zealot
Where would this project be based? A diary? The Open Book?
I'm going to go with Open Book and then have the discussion threads in ROTW. That'll also result in it getting the most publicity.

---

I'm also considering modified rotation whereas there's two people chosen and then we vote on the book. That means we'll all get a turn at least suggesting something inside a 12 month run. That - and it means we get varied works whilst keeping the most amount of people interested.Thoughts?

I'm also going to put up a poll to so we can get ideas for timeframes. I decided after putting the poll up that it'd be clear to read: 1 month - 1.5 months - 2 months - so please cast votes with that in mind.

".... the result of a consistent and total substitution of lies for factual truth is not that the lie will now be accepted as truth, and truth be defamed as lie, but that the sense by which we take our bearings in the real world - and the category of truth versus falsehood is among the mental means to this end - is being destroyed ... [H.A.]"

Last edited by Vlerchan; December 14th, 2015 at 11:31 AM. Reason: I used 'also' three times in succession
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Old December 14th, 2015, 11:31 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlerchan View Post
I'm also considering modified rotation whereas there's two people chosen and then we vote on the book. That also means we'll all get a turn at least suggesting something inside a 12 month run. It also means we get varied works whilst keeping the most amount of people interested.Thoughts?
I suppose I can get on board with this. I was thinking that we should perhaps base the two members off of a more random method of selection than a strict rotation- if it's going to be suggestion against suggestion I think we should create a more random pool of combinations.

"Absolute tolerance is altogether impossible; the allegedly absolute tolerance turns into ferocious hatred of those who have stated clearly and most forcefully that there are unchangeable standards founded in the nature of man and the nature of things."
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Old December 14th, 2015, 01:08 PM   #19
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Default Re: VT Reading Group

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlerchan View Post
I'm also considering modified rotation whereas there's two people chosen and then we vote on the book. That means we'll all get a turn at least suggesting something inside a 12 month run. That - and it means we get varied works whilst keeping the most amount of people interested. Thoughts?
I'm in favor of the modified rotation.

Will there be a list of criteria which each recommended work will be required to meet?
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Old December 14th, 2015, 06:10 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Judean Zealot
I was thinking that we should perhaps base the two members off of a more random method of selection than a strict rotation- if it's going to be suggestion against suggestion I think we should create a more random pool of combinations.
Is there a method in mind? I considered three:
  • Each participant is assigned a number on a die and then I roll the die until all the participants are allocated a place and then book selection occurs from that point. Let's call that simple rotation.
  • Each participant is assigned a number on a die and then I roll twice to choose two participants. From there a book is chosen. The 'loser' is then placed back into the pot and I repeat the process until some round n whereas each person has a turn choosing the book. Let's call that non-simple rotation.
  • Each participant is assigned a number and then I roll twice to choose two participants. From there a book is chosen. I then place both participants back into the post and we repeat to process. Let's call this non-rotation.
One is what I had in mind in the previous post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oakheart
Will there be a list of criteria which each recommended work will be required to meet?
I was hoping we'd construct something like this as part of a group effort. So far I have in mind:
  • The work - or sum of works - consist of less than 200 pages. I want to see if we can all get through a 200 page piece before increasing that.
  • I would prefer we excluded pop-material.
  • It's written in or translated to English.
  • Books that excessive use of allegorical or esoteric techniques are avoided because the average participant isn't going to have a clue what's happening.
So for the most part I would prefer academic-orientated pieces that a person of median intelligence - that's us - would be able to handle with perhaps a little work. That's up for discussion here though and I have no problem renegotiating that standard.

Then we've to consider genres.
  • The Humanities. I'm thinking this would entail philosophy, political-philosophy, jurisprudence, classical studies, international relations, history, anthropology.
  • The Social Sciences. Economics, Politics (political-science, political-sociology, political-psychology, [current affairs]), sociology, psychology.
  • Natural Sciences. Literally not a clue about accessible sub-disciplines here. I'll let someone else advise.
That's also biased towards interests of mine. Really I don't think we need a strict guide on what genres we can choose from. The above should be considered as more of a guideline.

".... the result of a consistent and total substitution of lies for factual truth is not that the lie will now be accepted as truth, and truth be defamed as lie, but that the sense by which we take our bearings in the real world - and the category of truth versus falsehood is among the mental means to this end - is being destroyed ... [H.A.]"
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