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Old October 20th, 2006, 12:43 PM   #1
Phantom
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Default Iraq

Well since the last Iraq thread got ruined by flames I have decided to create a new one.

Discuss

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature, and has no chance of being free unless made or kept so by the exertions of better men than himself John Stuart Mill
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Old October 20th, 2006, 04:43 PM   #2
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Bush admits Iraq war not going well:

Bush to Consult on Changing Iraq Tactics
By KEVIN FREKING, Associated Press Writer
4 hours ago

WASHINGTON - President Bush acknowledged Friday that "it's tough" in Iraq and said he would consult with American generals to see if a change in tactics is necessary to combat the escalating violence.

Seventy-four American troops have died in Iraq in October, likely to become the deadliest month for U.S. forces in nearly two years.

"One of the reasons you're seeing more casualties is the enemy is active and so are our troops, along with Iraqis," Bush said in a brief interview with The Associated Press.

He said he planned consultations within the next few days with Gen. John Abizaid, the top U.S. commander in the Middle East, and Gen. George Casey, who leads the U.S.-led Multinational Forces in Iraq.

"We are constantly adjusting our tactics so we can achieve the objectives and right now, it's tough," the president said. "It's tough on the families who've lost a loved one. It's tough for our citizens who look at it on TV. It's hard on the Iraqis. They've lost a lot of life."

He declined to say, though, whether he thought a change in tactics was necessary.

The president has often said that U.S. goals in Iraq remain the same: to have a country that can sustain itself, govern itself and help in the war on terror.

"It's important for the country and the security of this country that the enemy be defeated in Iraq," he said. At the same time, Bush said the Iraqis had to step up their efforts to quell the violence.

"There's a criminal element that is taking advantage of the situation in Baghdad and Iraq, and the Iraqi government is going to have to deal firmly with them," he said.

The White House said that while Bush might change tactics in Iraq, he would not change his overall strategy despite growing opposition and Republican anxiety that his policy could cost the GOP control of the House or the Senate _ or both.

"He's not somebody who gets jumpy at polls," presidential spokesman Tony Snow said.

"The president is not going to alter his approach based on political considerations, but instead on the business of trying and moving toward having an Iraq that can sustain, govern and defend itself," Bush's spokesman said.

With the war in its fourth year and the U.S. death toll above 2,780, Bush faces intense political pressure to change what critics say is a failed Iraq policy. An independent commission led by former secretary of State James A. Baker III and former Democratic Rep. Lee Hamilton of Indiana is exploring options for a new Iraq strategy.

On another contentious foreign policy issue, Bush said he would not comment on a report that North Korea had apologized for conducting a nuclear test until he had a chance to consult with Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice, who is in Beijing for talks with Chinese officials on the nuclear standoff.

The mass-circulation Chosun Ilbo reported that North Korean leader Kim Jong Il had told the Chinese that "he is sorry about the nuclear test." The North Korean leader also raised the possibility the country would return to arms talks.

Bush said Rice would report back to him later Friday. "I will then react, but we'll wait to hear confirmation on whether the leader of North Korea has stated that," he said.

Bush took questions for about 10 minutes after a round-table with senior citizens on the Medicare drug program.

He said Republicans were missing an opportunity if they were not talking about the drug plan and how it's working on the campaign trail.

"My own view is our candidates and the people who voted for this ought to be out there traveling to senior centers all over their districts and their state saying, 'look what we did.' I don't know if they're doing that or not," Bush said.

He brushed off changes proposed by Democrats, including having the government negotiate drug prices rather than individual insurance plans.

"We will resist any changes to weaken this program," Bush said.

Afterward, Bush stopped at a local CVS drug store, posing behind the pharmacy counter for pictures and examining the literature the Medicare pharmacists hand out to customers.

"Millions of seniors are benefiting," the president said. "Our seniors are saving money. They're getting better coverage. It's a plan that I'm real proud of. ... Our compassionate approach to health care is working for America's seniors."

HHS Secretary Mike Leavitt, standing at Bush's side, pledged continued improvements in the program.

"We're going to get better at it," he said. "We're getting better at it every year. It'll be better this year than it was the last."

Later, at a fundraiser in Washington for the National Republican Senatorial Committee, Bush said his party has the best ideas for fostering U.S. economic progress and winning the war on terror and the war in Iraq. He urged Congress to extend his tax cuts and said if Democrats win the elections, they will raise taxes.

He also railed against Democrats who criticize the war in Iraq. Calling the Democrats the party of "cut and run," Bush said: "The voters out there need to ask the question, `Which political party will support the brave men and women who wear our uniform when they do their job of protecting America? Which political party is willing to give our professionals the tools necessary to protect the American people? Which political party has a strategy for victory in this war on terror?' "

Josh

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Old October 20th, 2006, 05:09 PM   #3
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Iraq is a day at the spa compared to what my grandpa went through.
We lost 295,000 in ww2. We lost 50,000 in the Korean war. We lost 50,000 in Vietnam. We fought capable smart enemy's in all those wars. They had planes tanks artillery. What are we fighting now? Some fucktard that can't shoot an ak worth a shit. How many have we lost 3000. Are we in horrific bloody jungle fights with the stench of death around. No. Are we fighting against a Superior enemy with better tech swarming a beach getting cut down with machine guns? No.
Not to make it seem like our soldiers aren't making sacrifices THEY DEFINATLY ARE, but I am just so sick and tired of these little pussy democrats and complete idiots outside the white house protesting waaa waa bush fascist waaaaaaa.
I am watching a program about Vietnam right now.
That war was horrible but our men prevailed in the most horrible of situations that NOBODY should ever see or be in.
When they cam back from Vietnam with all the things they seen friends blown apart people screaming for help alot of them wounded missing limbs, I seen on the show about a misguided bomb that wiped out so many men they were tore apart all screaming for help the stench of burnt flesh all around.
How did the liberals and protesting hippy's treat them when they came back?!
They would fucking spit on them and encourage the enemy call them baby killers!
John Kerry (god I hate that man) actually BETRAYED his men and gave info to the enemy. His men endured horrible torture to keep that info safe and john kerry just gives it to them for free. Guess what he did when he came back. Called our troops baby killers saying we were slaughtering kids.
Sorry if I go off topic but ^this is why I despise weak moralled democrats and hippy's.
Now for the Iraq war.
I have mixed feeling on Iraq, but I think we should definitely prevail and not cut and run like little wussy democrats want to.
I think Iraq is blown WAY out of proportion.
We are fighting rag heads with aks
WE ARE THE STRONGEST MILITARY IN THE WORLD!!!
and according to the anti American media we are getting our ass handed to us which is such a blatant lie.
And I will say again we are not killing kids and whatnot in Iraq we are doing ALOT of good. Just watch the videos in my sig.

http://www.youtube.com/p.swf?video_i...srO3&autoplay=

Well this ends my rant/post
I will type more later.

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature, and has no chance of being free unless made or kept so by the exertions of better men than himself John Stuart Mill
http://img187.imageshack.us/img187/4...rtarianlq5.png

Last edited by Phantom; October 20th, 2006 at 08:09 PM.
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Old October 20th, 2006, 05:59 PM   #4
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Default Re: Iraq

I simply pointed out what Bush said. Not my fault he doesn't know what he's doing.

Josh

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Old October 20th, 2006, 06:09 PM   #5
Phantom
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Nice shot at bush. I think he knows much more than you think.
Ok well I think just about everyone rep and dem alike disagrees on how the Iraq war was executed. You know secure the borders so on.
Now I could spend an hour typing what I like and don't like about Iraq and about why we went and how bush isnt an evil fascist wanting oil.
I am just going to leave you with some videos.

http://www.youtube.com/v/ct21jlGd4sA&autoplay=

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wPgl...elated&search=

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OHAeKGsNXKg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgQJEYnD0n4

This one seems irelevant but it shows liberal ignorance and this guy makes some good points
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PEixq...elated&search=

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature, and has no chance of being free unless made or kept so by the exertions of better men than himself John Stuart Mill
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Last edited by Phantom; October 21st, 2006 at 01:32 AM.
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Old October 21st, 2006, 01:40 AM   #6
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mmm./..propanda

Josh

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Old October 21st, 2006, 07:56 AM   #7
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Default Re: Iraq

Indeed.. And same in Iraq there is murder of innocents done directly by a small group of sick minded soldiers.

I'm tough, rough, ready and able
To pick myself up from under this table
Don't stick no sign on me, I got no label
I'm a little sick, unsure, unsound and unstable

But I'm fighting my way back
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Old October 21st, 2006, 10:45 AM   #8
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Default Re: Iraq

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyper View Post
Indeed.. And same in Iraq there is murder of innocents done directly by a small group of sick minded soldiers.
Yes I am sure we walk around slaughtering kids.
Provide evidence or go away.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWizard View Post
mmm./..propanda
If you clearly can't see or understand history events than you are in denial.

Quote:
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: Denial is a defense mechanism in which a person is faced with a fact that is painful to accept rejects it instead, insisting that it is not true despite what may be overwhelming evidence. The subject may deny the reality of the unpleasant fact altogether (simple denial), The theory of denial was first researched seriously by Anna Freud. She classified denial as a mechanism of the immature mind, because it conflicts with the ability to learn from and cope with reality.

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature, and has no chance of being free unless made or kept so by the exertions of better men than himself John Stuart Mill
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Old October 22nd, 2006, 08:15 PM   #9
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Quote:
That war was horrible but our men prevailed in the most horrible of situations that NOBODY should ever see or be in.
We lost that war, Phantom. Vietnam is still communist

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Old October 22nd, 2006, 08:25 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by *Dissident* View Post
We lost that war, Phantom. Vietnam is still communist
If you would have taken the time to read a book you would see that most of the bloody battles we won, we held out and killed them 10 to 1.

We lost because of people like you (no offense) but liberals lost the war. Same with hippy's and uneducated anti war idiots.
By pulling out of Vietnam southvietnam had more people slaughtered than we EVER would have lost if we stayed.
I felt so sad when I learned that the southvietnamse got rounded up and slaughtered when we left, they also wanted to leave the country so bad they would swarm our planes as we left grab the wheels of the plane and some would die getting run over or falling from 1000 feet.

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature, and has no chance of being free unless made or kept so by the exertions of better men than himself John Stuart Mill
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