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Old February 19th, 2018, 08:26 PM   #1
SurpremeLeader
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Default Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

A post less about the event and more about the morality and the true reason this event occurred. What should we as a nation proceed to do?

A look at the ongoing debate between gun control and no gun control. What is the root cause of the shootings. Why is it only an epedmic n the United States? What are the morals?

Notes-
The source is mental health?
Why is the United States in a mental health crisis?
What is being done to halt mental illness?
Will stricter gun laws work?
Is it not our right to own one?
Why was this right given?
Should we abandon this?
What is even being done to circumvent this?

(Video Opinions/Version) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omW73uPjhSA

Emos to Jocks to Psycopaths in a deranged highschool experiment- https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLa...Urq0npOOwS5hRw

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Old February 19th, 2018, 08:49 PM   #2
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Default Re: Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

We have to understand that it takes a mixture of causes to cause events like this. Mental health DOES play a factor but there are thousands out there with depression/anxiety/schizophrenia etc and they manage to not shoot up their schools and workplaces no problem. Gun control is also a factor: if there are tighter regulations on ownership and sales, it may reduce access to guns for those with murderous intent. But that isn't a universal solution, with black market sales and people just stealing from other family members. An ideal response to this tragedy would indeed be common sense regulation of gun sales in lieu with specific standards gun storage (with potentially making law that ammunition and guns must be stored separately in case of people attempting to steal the firearms) as well as increased funding for mental health services but for a variety of reasons not all of those may be a reality.
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Old February 20th, 2018, 02:03 AM   #3
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Default Re: Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

Quote:
Originally Posted by SurpremeLeader View Post
A post less about the event and more about the morality and the true reason this event occurred. What should we as a nation proceed to do?

A look at the ongoing debate between gun control and no gun control. What is the root cause of the shootings. Why is it only an epedmic n the United States? What are the morals?

Notes-
The source is mental health?
Why is the United States in a mental health crisis?
What is being done to halt mental illness?
Will stricter gun laws work?
Is it not our right to own one?
Why was this right given?
Should we abandon this?
What is even being done to circumvent this?

(Video Opinions) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omW73uPjhSA
Well the root stems from individualistic culture and how the country defines self-worth being closely tied to materialism.


That's the other side of the subject that's not talked about because it would call I to question the darkside of capitalism which is like a taboo to criticize....cuz the only other option humanity came up with was socialism.


Dichotomies....
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Old February 20th, 2018, 05:24 AM   #4
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Default Re: Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

replies to your notes,
The source is mental health?mostly
Why is the United States in a mental health crisis?liberalism(sue me)
What is being done to halt mental illness?not enough
Will stricter gun laws work?no.
Is it not our right to own one? it's a right
Why was this right given?to secure and keep the security of a free state
Should we abandon this?no.
What is even being done to circumvent this to circumvent what?

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Old February 20th, 2018, 03:25 PM   #5
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Default Re: Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShineintheDark View Post
We have to understand that it takes a mixture of causes to cause events like this. Mental health DOES play a factor but there are thousands out there with depression/anxiety/schizophrenia etc and they manage to not shoot up their schools and workplaces no problem. Gun control is also a factor: if there are tighter regulations on ownership and sales, it may reduce access to guns for those with murderous intent. But that isn't a universal solution, with black market sales and people just stealing from other family members. An ideal response to this tragedy would indeed be common sense regulation of gun sales in lieu with specific standards gun storage (with potentially making law that ammunition and guns must be stored separately in case of people attempting to steal the firearms) as well as increased funding for mental health services but for a variety of reasons not all of those may be a reality.
Before the 21st century, guns were very much around but what wasn't around was school shootings. Also as the trends say, the increase of antidepressants and such medicines has increased with the 21st century. What we are seeing is the buildup a mental health crisis the United States keeps underneath the carpet. Yes, gun regulations in some states are absolutely nonexistant but that is not the core issue. May I remind everyone this is a recent problem

Emos to Jocks to Psycopaths in a deranged highschool experiment- https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLa...Urq0npOOwS5hRw
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Old February 20th, 2018, 08:07 PM   #6
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Default Re: Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

Quote:
Originally Posted by swedeam View Post
Why is the United States in a mental health crisis?liberalism(sue me)
I'll see you in court.

Quote:
Originally Posted by swedeam View Post
replies to your notes,
The source is mental health?mostly
Why is the United States in a mental health crisis?liberalism(sue me)
What is being done to halt mental illness?not enough
Will stricter gun laws work?no.
Is it not our right to own one? it's a right
Why was this right given?to secure and keep the security of a free state
Should we abandon this?no.
What is even being done to circumvent this to circumvent what?
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Originally Posted by SurpremeLeader View Post
Before the 21st century, guns were very much around but what wasn't around was school shootings. Also as the trends say, the increase of antidepressants and such medicines has increased with the 21st century. What we are seeing is the buildup a mental health crisis the United States keeps underneath the carpet. Yes, gun regulations in some states are absolutely nonexistant but that is not the core issue. May I remind everyone this is a recent problem
Do you have any data and sources to support your claims?

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There is no such thing as liberal or conservative media, the only thing the media cares about is either money or the truth.
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Old February 20th, 2018, 09:06 PM   #7
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Default Re: Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

There isn’t anything wrong with liberalism, and especially not historical liberalism.


What we have is a society that has a sub-set if individuals who mentally gravitate toward violence, they might not even know much of a difference between reality and fiction, for those people the line blurs.

So the problem is not having restrictions and smart filters like background checks adequate enough for the modern era.

If the government was really in danger of becoming tyrannical you’d see signs before hand and they for sure would cut off supply chains to gun manufacturers....in the modern era we aren’t in danger of a tyrannical government, that harm is all hypothetical, the school and public gun violence issue has been made manifest in reality.

Reality is what we should be shaping policy on, and on the gun laws issue, the compromise is any law promoting forced confiscation of guns from mentally balanced and sane people.


But laws bumping up the age limit of when you can get one, the accessories you can buy, the fortifications of school architecture (doors and windows) to resist bullets, enhanced background checks, and taking specific models of guns off the market, are all reasonable steps to discuss here.

Also certainly taxes should be raised on guns too with those guns helping offset the cost of those most affected by gun violence and to promote safety.

None of those violate the absolute right of ownership of a gun.

Is there a black market yeah, but then step two would legitimately allow law enforcement to focus their efforts on that, instead of this messy flood of leaky facets this issue has become.
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Old February 24th, 2018, 11:16 AM   #8
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Default Re: Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

Quote:
Originally Posted by swedeam View Post
replies to your notes,
The source is mental health?mostly
Why is the United States in a mental health crisis?liberalism(sue me)
What is being done to halt mental illness?not enough
Will stricter gun laws work?no.
Is it not our right to own one? it's a right
Why was this right given?to secure and keep the security of a free state
Should we abandon this?no.
What is even being done to circumvent this to circumvent what?
To circumvent shootings

Emos to Jocks to Psycopaths in a deranged highschool experiment- https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLa...Urq0npOOwS5hRw
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Old February 25th, 2018, 12:17 AM   #9
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Default Re: Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

Most recently? There was failure all around. The fbi didn't act, the police didn't act, the school didn't act, possibly 3 officers on scene didn't act, and the regulations that were placed to stop this thing from happening either wasn't good enough or someone at the store didn't act.

But to quickly answer your notes

The source is mental health? One of the sources
Why is the United States in a mental health crisis? There's not much officials can do about it
What is being done to halt mental illness? Right now? I have no idea
Will stricter gun laws work? Probably not
Is it not our right to own one? It is our right
Why was this right given? To prevent government takeover, tyranny, and to form militias to secure a free state
Should we abandon this? No
What is even being done to circumvent this? Well everything that could've been done to circumvent this wasn't. It really varies case-by-case

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Old February 25th, 2018, 01:52 AM   #10
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Default Re: Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

Quote:
Originally Posted by SurpremeLeader View Post
Before the 21st century, guns were very much around but what wasn't around was school shootings. Also as the trends say, the increase of antidepressants and such medicines has increased with the 21st century. What we are seeing is the buildup a mental health crisis the United States keeps underneath the carpet. Yes, gun regulations in some states are absolutely nonexistant but that is not the core issue. May I remind everyone this is a recent problem
Not one of you have considered one important factor when it comes to guns.
Pricetag. Back in old days anyone could buy fullautomatic machinegun and register it and have fun. But guns generally and especially full autos were expensive. So expensive that people who really wanted them had to save for years to get their guns. Revolvers and pistols and rifles were more on normal pricetag.
Nowadays cheap AR 15 is about 700 USD (where I live cheapest ones are like 2500 euros) and minimum wage is 7.25 so you do the math and see how gun prices have been going downwards compared to past.

Cheap guns are the ones that are used in criminal activity. Thats especially true in europe. sawn of shotgun and dirt cheap Margolins are top choises for criminals.
Simply raising prices of some guns like AR15 would solve much of problems.
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Old February 25th, 2018, 02:34 AM   #11
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Default Re: Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

Quote:
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Not one of you have considered one important factor when it comes to guns.
Pricetag. Back in old days anyone could buy fullautomatic machinegun and register it and have fun. But guns generally and especially full autos were expensive. So expensive that people who really wanted them had to save for years to get their guns. Revolvers and pistols and rifles were more on normal pricetag.
Nowadays cheap AR 15 is about 700 USD (where I live cheapest ones are like 2500 euros) and minimum wage is 7.25 so you do the math and see how gun prices have been going downwards compared to past.

Cheap guns are the ones that are used in criminal activity. Thats especially true in europe. sawn of shotgun and dirt cheap Margolins are top choises for criminals.
Simply raising prices of some guns like AR15 would solve much of problems.
But the people raising the prices of those guns would affect the most are the ones who gets those for ''sports'' and hunting, by raising the prices you would just prevent those people from getting those military weapons for doing the exact reason you want to keep those weapons legal. For the people who wants to use those guns to hurt people, since those guns are still in circulation they could just steal one if they know someone who has one or buy it for cheaper on the black market.

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There is no such thing as liberal or conservative media, the only thing the media cares about is either money or the truth.
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Old February 25th, 2018, 10:19 AM   #12
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Default Re: Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

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But the people raising the prices of those guns would affect the most are the ones who gets those for ''sports'' and hunting, by raising the prices you would just prevent those people from getting those military weapons for doing the exact reason you want to keep those weapons legal. For the people who wants to use those guns to hurt people, since those guns are still in circulation they could just steal one if they know someone who has one or buy it for cheaper on the black market.
completelly opposite.
When someone takes part of any hobby let it be shooting they are allready putting lots of money to it. Simply price of gun is not so relevant to shooting sport enthusiast than price of ammo.
Example for you. Price of AR15 where I live starts somewhere 2500 euros. All accessories put 2000 euros more to it. ammo prices are like 0,5 euros a pop.
Every time person goes to range they pay farily nominal range fee lets say 10 euros and they fire lets say 300 rounds every time once a week. That is fairly low but lets stick to it. so 150 euros a week for ammo makes 7800 euros for ammo annually so price tag of gun is totally peanuts compared to pricetag of sport at general.

ANd when it comes to to hunting with AR or AK.... There are better hunting rifles out there. Even in semiauto
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Old February 25th, 2018, 11:31 PM   #13
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Default Re: Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

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Originally Posted by Snowfox View Post
completelly opposite.
When someone takes part of any hobby let it be shooting they are allready putting lots of money to it. Simply price of gun is not so relevant to shooting sport enthusiast than price of ammo.
Example for you. Price of AR15 where I live starts somewhere 2500 euros. All accessories put 2000 euros more to it. ammo prices are like 0,5 euros a pop.
Every time person goes to range they pay farily nominal range fee lets say 10 euros and they fire lets say 300 rounds every time once a week. That is fairly low but lets stick to it. so 150 euros a week for ammo makes 7800 euros for ammo annually so price tag of gun is totally peanuts compared to pricetag of sport at general.
First you complain the price is too high and if you really want to get some weapons you need to save money for years. Now you say it is not so expensive, can you make up your mind please?

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ANd when it comes to to hunting with AR or AK.... There are better hunting rifles out there. Even in semiauto
Alright so we agree they are not absolutely necessary for hunting and hunting will continue to happen even without military weapons, no problem to ban them then.

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Old February 26th, 2018, 01:31 PM   #14
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Default Re: Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

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Originally Posted by mattsmith48 View Post
First you complain the price is too high and if you really want to get some weapons you need to save money for years. Now you say it is not so expensive, can you make up your mind please?



Alright so we agree they are not absolutely necessary for hunting and hunting will continue to happen even without military weapons, no problem to ban them then.
Hunting is not only good reason to have guns. Sport shooting is another. So some guns are good for sport shooting like AK or AR or FN-FAL while others are especially designed for hunting like SAKO 85 just to name one.
For hunter price of ammo is not so relevant since they shoot around 10 rounds a year (depending what game you hunt).

But for sport shooter who happens to shoot a lot price of ammo is more relevant issue. Sport shooters shoot lots like I said.
Their incentive is to not to buy cheapest AR15 out there since it will burn up fast. They invest to more higher end product that will last longer. And they are ready to pay more.
Overly cheap AR or AK for that matter is typical junk. It goes bang when you pull trigger but you get what you pay for.

But I dont expect you to understand since you are so influenced by your commie mindset that you ignore all facts that do not fit to your ideology.
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Old February 27th, 2018, 01:11 PM   #15
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Default Re: Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

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Hunting is not only good reason to have guns. Sport shooting is another. So some guns are good for sport shooting like AK or AR or FN-FAL while others are especially designed for hunting like SAKO 85 just to name one.
For hunter price of ammo is not so relevant since they shoot around 10 rounds a year (depending what game you hunt).

But for sport shooter who happens to shoot a lot price of ammo is more relevant issue. Sport shooters shoot lots like I said.
Their incentive is to not to buy cheapest AR15 out there since it will burn up fast. They invest to more higher end product that will last longer. And they are ready to pay more.
Overly cheap AR or AK for that matter is typical junk. It goes bang when you pull trigger but you get what you pay for.

But I dont expect you to understand since you are so influenced by your commie mindset that you ignore all facts that do not fit to your ideology.
But raising the price to prevent shootings like you suggested earlier would still hurt them, I don't know what you are trying to fight here

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Old February 27th, 2018, 01:55 PM   #16
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Default Re: Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

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But raising the price to prevent shootings like you suggested earlier would still hurt them, I don't know what you are trying to fight here
Criminals here like everywhere choose cheapest available option to commit crime. That why in robberies we see MORA knifes and sawn of shotguns not AK47.
Same goes with murders and school shootings. And yes we have had schoolshootings. Jokela and Kauhajoki school shootings. In both cases shooter used pistol with 22 lr. in case you dont know 22.r is smallest wimpy caliber you can imagine. And by far margin guns they choose were cheapest crap available.
Cheapest crap gun is able to kill just as knife.
Hard part of killing another human being is not pulling trigger. Hardest part is to cross that line. That line that you know you are gonna kill. When someone has crossed that line it doesnt matter what weapon he/she uses. He/she is gonna kill. We have examples of mass stabbings as well.

Tool to kill is your mind. not physical tool that you use.
To kill you have to kill your own feelings when you have done that rest is easy.
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Old February 27th, 2018, 03:58 PM   #17
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Default Re: Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowfox View Post
Criminals here like everywhere choose cheapest available option to commit crime. That why in robberies we see MORA knifes and sawn of shotguns not AK47.
Same goes with murders and school shootings. And yes we have had schoolshootings. Jokela and Kauhajoki school shootings. In both cases shooter used pistol with 22 lr. in case you dont know 22.r is smallest wimpy caliber you can imagine. And by far margin guns they choose were cheapest crap available.
Cheapest crap gun is able to kill just as knife.
Hard part of killing another human being is not pulling trigger. Hardest part is to cross that line. That line that you know you are gonna kill. When someone has crossed that line it doesnt matter what weapon he/she uses. He/she is gonna kill. We have examples of mass stabbings as well.
No matter the gun used or the quality of it, it is still easier to defend against a knife.

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Tool to kill is your mind. not physical tool that you use.
To kill you have to kill your own feelings when you have done that rest is easy.
The tool to kill is what caused the cause of death in other words the weapon e.g. gun, knife etc.

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There is no such thing as liberal or conservative media, the only thing the media cares about is either money or the truth.
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Old March 2nd, 2018, 08:42 PM   #18
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Default Re: Morality/Source of Florida School Shooting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowfox View Post
Not one of you have considered one important factor when it comes to guns.
Pricetag. Back in old days anyone could buy fullautomatic machinegun and register it and have fun. But guns generally and especially full autos were expensive. So expensive that people who really wanted them had to save for years to get their guns. Revolvers and pistols and rifles were more on normal pricetag.
Nowadays cheap AR 15 is about 700 USD (where I live cheapest ones are like 2500 euros) and minimum wage is 7.25 so you do the math and see how gun prices have been going downwards compared to past.

Cheap guns are the ones that are used in criminal activity. Thats especially true in europe. sawn of shotgun and dirt cheap Margolins are top choises for criminals.
Simply raising prices of some guns like AR15 would solve much of problems.

Thats an interesting new perspective that I never thought of. I don't believe we should artificially raise gun prices as the real reason guns are allowed is to keep the government in check more or less. Yes I know the government could utterly crush us however would you rather defend yourself with a butter knife?

Emos to Jocks to Psycopaths in a deranged highschool experiment- https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLa...Urq0npOOwS5hRw
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