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Old October 15th, 2017, 09:54 PM   #21
Stronk Serb
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of the EU

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Originally Posted by Living For Love View Post
As far as Kosovo is concerned, from what I gathered, the declaration of independence of Kosovo did not breach any international law. On the other hand, the separatists in Kosovo (KLA) were always supported by NATO.
Yes, but Kosovo breached Serbian law. The National Assembly did not approve the refferendum and does not approve the refferendum results.

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her right?
Yes.

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Originally Posted by ShineintheDark View Post
In terms of the EU's intervention in Kosovo and not Catalonia, we do have to respect that the referendum WAS illegal in Spain, whether we actually support their independence or not whereas I very much doubt it was as clear in Kosovo. That's the entire point in fact (and I've read up on this so my knowledge isn't perfect). Catalonia's independence declaration was directly in violation with Spain's constitution so the EU had no basis to step in and stop Spain from crushing it. However, Kosovo's legality is still disputed to this day with no clear answer as there is no precedent or law that directly calls it illegal. Therefore, it's only fair the EU steps in to prevent any sort of backlash by Serbia in case it ends up being unjustified and therefore sparks conflict between the 2 potential nations.
The referendum is illegal in Serbia too. I mean I cannot understand the EU's decision. The KLA is a criminal organisation by the definition. Organ trade, drug smuggling, arms smuggling, ethnic cleansing. The EU supports a state built on war crimes but disapprove of Catalonia which caused no problem, except the referendum thing. That is the hypocrisy I want to point out.

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Old October 16th, 2017, 10:53 AM   #22
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of the EU

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Originally Posted by Living For Love View Post
Not sure what you mean. 39% is hardly a majority.
The important part is not the turnout or the percentage of the overall population, but the result of the referendum.

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Originally Posted by Living For Love View Post
Because Scotland wanted to remain in the EU after getting independence, and no one was against that. The referendum was legal and didn't cause social or economic turmoil. None of this is happening in Spain.
Well it wasn't really legal because there is no official legal way for a country to leave the UK it's more a matter of they don't give a shit, they were fine with Scotland trying.

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Old October 16th, 2017, 12:10 PM   #23
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of the EU

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Originally Posted by Stronk Serb View Post
The referendum is illegal in Serbia too. I mean I cannot understand the EU's decision. The KLA was a criminal organisation by the definition. Organ trade, drug smuggling, arms smuggling, ethnic cleansing. The EU supports a state built on war crimes but disapprove of Catalonia which caused no problem, except the referendum thing. That is the hypocrisy I want to point out.
Well first the KLA haven't actually existed as a group since 1999 so it's like disparaging the IRA for modern attacks in Ireland.
As for supporting a nation founded on war crimes, well most states we now look up to today for their liberties and power were once founded on wars and war crimes. Of course, the KLA carried out many attacks and actions that no one can be proud of and whilst Serbia may still have a right to claim Kosovo as her own, the Assembly of Kosovo exists currently as a separate entity that even Serbia herself is negotiating with as opposed to fighting with.
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Old October 19th, 2017, 04:22 PM   #24
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of the EU

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Well first the KLA haven't actually existed as a group since 1999 so it's like disparaging the IRA for modern attacks in Ireland.
As for supporting a nation founded on war crimes, well most states we now look up to today for their liberties and power were once founded on wars and war crimes. Of course, the KLA carried out many attacks and actions that no one can be proud of and whilst Serbia may still have a right to claim Kosovo as her own, the Assembly of Kosovo exists currently as a separate entity that even Serbia herself is negotiating with as opposed to fighting with.
We shouldn't. We shouldn't negotiate with criminals, while attrocities do ocurr in every war, here it was done for profit. Kosovo is now the hub for drug, arms, organs and people smuggling between Europe and Asia. According to the UN Security Council Resolution No. 1244, Kosovo is considered a part of Serbia and Serbia has a right to station a limited number of security forces on Kosovo. I would remilitarize Kosovo as soon as possiible before they build an army and get more international recognition.

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Old October 20th, 2017, 09:32 AM   #25
ShineintheDark
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of the EU

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We shouldn't. We shouldn't negotiate with criminals, while attrocities do ocurr in every war, here it was done for profit. Kosovo is now the hub for drug, arms, organs and people smuggling between Europe and Asia.
If this is indeed true then it's something that the UN and the Kosovo Assembly will have to directly deal with if they wish to have good relations with other nations as well as apply for any sort of legitimate recognition. Either way, this point is more an attack on Kosovo itself rather than an argument on its right of dissolution.

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According to the UN Security Council Resolution No. 1244, Kosovo is considered a part of Serbia and Serbia has a right to station a limited number of security forces on Kosovo. I would remilitarize Kosovo as soon as possiible before they build an army and get more international recognition.
Like I said, I'm not going to be an expert on these matters. However, I'd argue back that the very same resolution also called for Serbian presence to be reduced to purely key border sites and patrimonial zones, in respect with a steady process of determining Kosovo's independence. The very same resolution demands that Serbia NOT remilitarize in Kosovo as that would directly harm the discussion process. Therefore, I don't think that particular resolution is very helpful for your case as it acts more as a help to Kosovo's independence and freedom than it really does for Serbia.
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Old October 20th, 2017, 04:05 PM   #26
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of the EU

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Originally Posted by ShineintheDark View Post
Like I said, I'm not going to be an expert on these matters. However, I'd argue back that the very same resolution also called for Serbian presence to be reduced to purely key border sites and patrimonial zones, in respect with a steady process of determining Kosovo's independence. The very same resolution demands that Serbia NOT remilitarize in Kosovo as that would directly harm the discussion process. Therefore, I don't think that particular resolution is very helpful for your case as it acts more as a help to Kosovo's independence and freedom than it really does for Serbia.
Yes, it demilitarizes most of Kosovo, but says that Serbia remains sovereign over Kosovo. That resolution is international law. It is violated now.

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Old October 21st, 2017, 07:37 AM   #27
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of the EU

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Yes, it demilitarizes most of Kosovo, but says that Serbia remains sovereign over Kosovo. That resolution is international law. It is violated now.
In the context that circumstances have changed. When Kosovo declared independence in 2008, the International Court of Justice DID declare it as legal, even if Serbia feels differently. According to the Constitution, independence is not currently illegal under this stage as long as Kosovo law does not intercept Serbian law. Otherwise, the autonomy given by the UN Resolution is perfectly legal under international law.
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