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View Full Version : Trump makes it legal to kill hibernating bears in Alaska


Periphery
April 12th, 2017, 02:57 PM
Source (https://www.google.be/amp/www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/donald-trump-hibernating-bears-legal-repeal-obama-ban-hunting-alaska-ronald-young-environmental-a7673686.html%3Famp)

This shows how sad things really are getting. Being against abortion because you're killing defenceless fetuses but yet somehow killing sleeping animals is alright.

Amethyst Rose
April 12th, 2017, 04:12 PM
That's outrageous. I want my bears to be safe. :( :cry:

Dmaxd123
April 12th, 2017, 04:12 PM
actually isn't what it looks like: those that may possibly be allowed to shoot a hibernating bear are a very select few people (I believe natives) in a very select areas of the state (overpopulated)

overall this just gives the state of Alaska the ability to manage the wildlife within the whole state

PlasmaHam
April 12th, 2017, 04:46 PM
This bill only applies to Federal lands, it is not a general hunting bill like you may think. And the vast majority of bears would be killed for subsistence, not much morally different than eating a hamburger.

It's a sad thing when people compare the senseless killing of a defenseless human baby to killing an aggressive animal for food.

mattsmith48
April 12th, 2017, 05:32 PM
They already made steps to accelerate the destruction of the polar bear's habitat, now they are legalizing the killing of polar bears while they are sleeping, what other reasons does he have to pass this other then just feeling like being an asshole?

Dmaxd123
April 12th, 2017, 06:36 PM
well matt it's legal to hunt polar bears in canada... however in Alaska it's illegal... whose the assholes now?

i will say possibly legal for inuits but even then I can't buy a license, I could buy a hunt in canada though....

PlasmaHam
April 12th, 2017, 07:48 PM
They already made steps to accelerate the destruction of the polar bear's habitat, now they are legalizing the killing of polar bears while they are sleeping, what other reasons does he have to pass this other then just feeling like being an asshole?
This law doesn't even apply to polar bears, I suggest you check your "alternative facts." #FakeNews

The_bug2000
April 13th, 2017, 12:51 AM
Sjws getting triggered by everything he does , there's bigger problems right now

Periphery
April 13th, 2017, 12:54 AM
This bill only applies to Federal lands, it is not a general hunting bill like you may think. And the vast majority of bears would be killed for subsistence, not much morally different than eating a hamburger.

It's a sad thing when people compare the senseless killing of a defenseless human baby to killing an aggressive animal for food.

Agressive. I'm not sure if you're aware of this but bisons kill more than bears. My problem with this is is that you don't have to hunt for animals hibernating. There are plenty of alternatives. Who says all of these bears will get killed for food though? You don't know this. They are just as helpless as the baby. Yes of course it's a different situation, but aren't they both alive? Is the fact an animal is seen as "agressive" a reason to kill them while they're sleeping?
The_bug2000 Well that's funny because I am not an sjw. Not at all. This has nothing to do with social justice. Sjw's are the guys screaming at you for misgendering someone. I care about animals. You should really check your definitions on social justice.

mattsmith48
April 13th, 2017, 01:29 AM
PlasmaHam I misread thanks for letting me know. :)

well matt it's legal to hunt polar bears in canada... however in Alaska it's illegal... whose the assholes now?

i will say possibly legal for inuits but even then I can't buy a license, I could buy a hunt in canada though....

It doesn't make it right or gives the right to someone else to start hunting them.

This is what Alaskan hunters are now allowed to do.

Under the previous law, hunters were prohibited from aggressive tactics such shooting or trapping wolves while at their dens with cubs, spotting grizzly bears from aircraft, killing hibernating bears, trapping bears with wire snares and luring bears with food to get a point-blank kill.

So for what other reason than just feeling like being an asshole would someone repeal wildlife protection laws and let hunters do shit like that?

Dmaxd123
April 13th, 2017, 02:21 PM
PlasmaHam I misread thanks for letting me know. :)



It doesn't make it right or gives the right to someone else to start hunting them.

This is what Alaskan hunters are now allowed to do.



So for what other reason than just feeling like being an asshole would someone repeal wildlife protection laws and let hunters do shit like that?

what this repeal does is says "hey alaska, you are doing a good job managing the wildlife within your state, you may go back to managing the wildlife on the national refuges too"

right now in alaska with a few exceptions you have to wait until the day after you fly to start hunting, so you can fly around see a herd of caribou and land but you have to wait a certain time period before you can actually go harvest an animal. YES there are exceptions to that rule but then it's within very specific boundaries, specific people, and only in cases of extreme overpopulation (probably under national control during Obama so not enough hunting, wildlife imbalance so now alaska will go to the other extreme to get the wildlife balanced back to a healthy population of predators and prey)

think about it in canadian terms: who knows wildlife management better in the yukon? the local hunting/conservation people or the hunting/conservation people living in newfoundland.... Alaska & washington DC are completely different areas and the representatives from NY don't have much of a clue about the bush in Alaska

mattsmith48
April 13th, 2017, 03:45 PM
what this repeal does is says "hey alaska, you are doing a good job managing the wildlife within your state, you may go back to managing the wildlife on the national refuges too"

right now in alaska with a few exceptions you have to wait until the day after you fly to start hunting, so you can fly around see a herd of caribou and land but you have to wait a certain time period before you can actually go harvest an animal. YES there are exceptions to that rule but then it's within very specific boundaries, specific people, and only in cases of extreme overpopulation (probably under national control during Obama so not enough hunting, wildlife imbalance so now alaska will go to the other extreme to get the wildlife balanced back to a healthy population of predators and prey)


How does managing the wildlife justify letting hunters use aggressive tactics such shooting or trapping wolves while at their dens with cubs, spotting grizzly bears from aircraft, killing hibernating bears, trapping bears with wire snares and luring bears with food to get a point-blank kill?


think about it in canadian terms: who knows wildlife management better in the yukon? the local hunting/conservation people or the hunting/conservation people living in newfoundland.... Alaska & washington DC are completely different areas and the representatives from NY don't have much of a clue about the bush in Alaska

In this case you get specialists on the subject and work together to create a law that works for everyone.

Dmaxd123
April 13th, 2017, 06:13 PM
the justification is in the facts that pretty much the only ones that are allowed to do some of the tactics are the inuit, so giving them back their substance options that the national government took away.

funny thing with bear baiting in some areas it's the only way to actually keep the population in check as there are more bear than the ecosystem can sustain but the terrain is so rugged that there isn't a good way to cull an appropriate number of bears. heck I know of one outfit that has LESS success with the baiting than they do with the fall hunt of bears because in the fall the bears congregate in a few spots (salmon streams and berry patches) so baiting is NOT a guarantee

the specialists are employed by the state, actually get more done that way and can use more logic for what works in your area

Beauregard
April 13th, 2017, 10:05 PM
I really don't think this is on the top priority list of decisions from Trump we have to worry about.
I find the North Korea, Syria and MOAB dropping in Afghanistan now way more concerning than the killing of a few bears.

Responsible hunters won't extinct a species and those trophy hunters who just kill animals to show off( or compensate for their small dicks) will always have the means - and money to kill whatever they want to.

So honestly I don't see such a pressing problem here.

Periphery
April 14th, 2017, 12:30 AM
I really don't think this is on the top priority list of decisions from Trump we have to worry about.
I find the North Korea, Syria and MOAB dropping in Afghanistan now way more concerning than the killing of a few bears.

Responsible hunters won't extinct a species and those trophy hunters who just kill animals to show off( or compensate for their small dicks) will always have the means - and money to kill whatever they want to.

So honestly I don't see such a pressing problem here.

So? Does it mean that just because it's not top priority we should completely ignore it? According to that logic we should only be allowed to talk about the ongoing conflicts right? The pressing problem here is that Trump doesn't care about wildlife and the enviroment.

Beauregard
April 14th, 2017, 04:10 AM
So? Does it mean that just because it's not top priority we should completely ignore it? According to that logic we should only be allowed to talk about the ongoing conflicts right? The pressing problem here is that Trump doesn't care about wildlife and the enviroment.

Trump doesn't care about anything in the whole wide world besides himself. I never said you aren't allowed to talk about your precious bears. I just said there are more pressing issues imo- I was stating a personal opinion - free speech, free thinking, free opinion - huh? Does this ring a bell in a liberal mind?

So if you wanna help the wildlife and environment go vegan, stop using cars planes whatever, stop using electricity, stop draining our resources and convince as many people as possible to do the same...in the end this helps your bears, too no matter what Trump allows or not.

Trump can ignore environmental issues all he wants...the problem here isn't he as a single person but every single one of us who simply doesn't do enough to protect our environment no matter what laws there are. Just because a law allows you to kill an animal or pollute your environment you don't have to, right?

Periphery
April 14th, 2017, 08:52 AM
Trump doesn't care about anything in the whole wide world besides himself. I never said you aren't allowed to talk about your precious bears. I just said there are more pressing issues imo- I was stating a personal opinion - free speech, free thinking, free opinion - huh? Does this ring a bell in a liberal mind?

So if you wanna help the wildlife and environment go vegan, stop using cars planes whatever, stop using electricity, stop draining our resources and convince as many people as possible to do the same...in the end this helps your bears, too no matter what Trump allows or not.

Trump can ignore environmental issues all he wants...the problem here isn't he as a single person but every single one of us who simply doesn't do enough to protect our environment no matter what laws there are. Just because a law allows you to kill an animal or pollute your environment you don't have to, right?

The problem is that this "single person" has a lot of influence on a lot of people. He's not just a single person not caring, he's a single person allowing milions of others to not care.

And please, just because I disagree with the right doesn't make me a liberal. I support free speech 100%, and all those idiots getting offended by everything and in the proces cencoring others are stupid.

Is it wrong to you that I show care towards nature? Because that is the impression I am getting here

Beauregard
April 14th, 2017, 10:04 PM
The problem is that this "single person" has a lot of influence on a lot of people. He's not just a single person not caring, he's a single person allowing milions of others to not care.

And please, just because I disagree with the right doesn't make me a liberal. I support free speech 100%, and all those idiots getting offended by everything and in the proces cencoring others are stupid.

Is it wrong to you that I show care towards nature? Because that is the impression I am getting here

Did you even bother to read what I wrote?
That's why my opinion in a nutshell is that instead of being butthurt about this single person do want you can to change the world and with your example show others that your ways are better than that oh those single person. Once you reform the followers the leader has to step down right?

Periphery
April 15th, 2017, 12:28 AM
Did you even bother to read what I wrote?
That's why my opinion in a nutshell is that instead of being butthurt about this single person do want you can to change the world and with your example show others that your ways are better than that oh those single person. Once you reform the followers the leader has to step down right?

The thing is that here the followers won't change and we all know it since half of his followers don't even believe in climate change.

Jordanchill
April 15th, 2017, 07:59 AM
From my understanding, Alaska has a lot of bears including polar, grizzly, and black bears. Although I don't quite think it to be right to shoot the animal while it is hibernating, they do need some kind of management, which from a quick skim of the article, is what this law will allow alaska to do. Im sure, like seal hunting, this law will probably apply to the native people first and probabky only. Nature preserves will probably be left alone and for sure, all of the parts of the harvested bears will be used as sustenance. Hunting and targetting for airplanes should be a no no though. Im sure that interferes with the no hunting same day fly in law.

Dmaxd123
April 17th, 2017, 08:47 AM
for those confused how trophy hunting can actually help:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YUA8i5S0YMU&feature=youtu.be

i'm not a trophy hunter but i understand the needs for hunting and understand how when you get too many of one animal in a space you end up with unintended problems, so sometimes even when poaching isn't an issue, doing nothing is worse than managing the numbers

PlasmaHam
April 17th, 2017, 09:42 AM
^ While I am against pure trophy hunting (don't waste perfectly good meat) there is a very good point here. Man, for good or for bad, has become part of the food chain in many parts of the world. When man stops hunting, animal populations can explode, and that may cause deteriorous affects upon the environment.

mattsmith48
April 17th, 2017, 01:55 PM
When man stops hunting, animal populations can explode, and that may cause deteriorous affects upon the environment.

That is some bullshit there, life began on earth about 3.5 million years ago, the homo sapiens only appeared on earth around 200 thousand years ago. That's a long time where nature did a pretty good job. There is a maximum a certain habitat can sustain base on multiple factors like food and water, if for whatever reason it becomes overpopulated a portion will either just die due to lack of food and water or they will migrate where there is enough food and water for them. The populations of animals have and will always regulate it self naturally without human intervention, there is only one species we have a right to prevent overpopulation and its humans.